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The "Official" Pioneer VSX-1020-K Owner's Thread - Page 146

post #4351 of 4530
Does anyone know if this amp has discrete amplification? I currently have an orb audio mod 2 system (with uber 10) paired with the 1020, and I am deciding whether or not to upgrade to improve the sound even further. My system already sounds good; I guess I am just getting an upgrade itch and have been looking at discrete amplification receivers like the Onkyo 525 or even though they are expensive, one of the pioneer receivers with class D discrete amps. With such a small sub/sat system though, I don't know if I would see any difference. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
post #4352 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by pip11 View Post

I fixed the "AMP OVERHEAT" error!!!

I've had the "AMP OVERHEAT" problem for years, starting about a year after I got my 1020. I found lots of things that seemed to help temporarily: plug it into a different wall socket, keep turning it on until it stayed on, but the problem would always recur eventually.

The root of the problem: the temperature sensor ("posistor" as it's called in the service manual) went bad and presented a lower resistance, making the receiver think the amp heatsink was overheating. Luckily the posistor is easy to test and replace!
Repair Instructions! (Click to show)

To get to the posistor: first remove the 10 screws (6 on sides, 4 on back) that hold the top cover on. The posistor itself is screwed to the amp heatsink, but the connector snakes through a hole in the amp board and then connects to the main/bottom board.



I was able to reach my hands in to push the end of the tab and pull up to disconnect it.

Warning: be careful around the amp board, it has lots of parts sticking up that could easily be broken off!

Using an ordinary multimeter, you can check the resistance of the posistor (to make sure it's the problem)!

Working posistor: 306 ohm
Bad posistor: 280 ohm

Now that you know your posistor is bad and causing the AMP OVERHEAT error, there's two options:
- either replace the posistor with a good one
- or, cut the wires and solder a 306 ohm resistor to them (I didn't try this, but I assume it would work cool.gif)

Assuming you want to replace it:
The posistor's part # is F320121021240-IL, and Pioneer will sell you a new one for $19.25

Removing the posistor without removing the amp board is tricky, you will need a right angle phillips bit/driver and don't have much room to work with.
There's a hole in the amp board so you can unscrew the posistor, but there's a bracket right behind the hole that makes it very hard to get a driver in! Luckily, by undoing 3 screws you can move the bracket back slightly.
Again, be careful not to damage any components on the amp board!



I put my bit through the hole and onto the screw, and then had barely enough room to fit my right-angle ratchet loosely on the bit and loosen the screw.



I used needle-nose pliers to grab the screw once it was loose, since it could be hard to grab if it fell down. WIth the screw out, thread the wire and connector through the hole, and pull the posistor free.

Reverse the steps, and enjoy your working VSX-1020-K!

So after a week of waiting for the posistor, I finally got it and prepared myself for the task of putting it back in.
This requires the patience level of a professional.
Fortunately I have 2 small children and they have prepared me for this skill level.
After having the screw for the posistor fall half a dozen times, I resorted to some glue because a magnetic bit would not hold it steady, (or it wasn't strong enough) I finally managed to get it in place.
Surprisingly this only took 15 minutes... seemed like an hour.

I plugged it in and... voila... nothing!
Now the display is flashing random blips and dashes... not cool.. so I resign, I'm going to have to bring it in to a service center.
So sad! frown.gif
post #4353 of 4530
So Anyone have some input? Specifically, would an onkyo 525 with discrete amps be a step up in sound quality from the 1020? I have orb mod2 speakers with an Uber 10.
post #4354 of 4530
Well, my Pioneer VSX-1020-K has developed what (from my internet research) appears to be a common problem. It shuts down frequently. Sometimes it'll run for an hour, other times only a few seconds and every other time interval in between. I've tried every combination of speakers and new wires I can think of without success. BTW, it give no sort of ERROR MESSAGE or Warning. It just shuts off and will start right back up (most times). Now my question is, "IS IT WORTH REPAIRING?"

Thanks,

Richard.

Update: After reading the thread above, I tried to get a reading of the Posistor. I got a reading of 13 ohms. I plugged it in with the posistor unplugged and got the "AMP OVERHEAT" message and a shut down. That makes sense with the Posistor unplugged. Unplugged the power, plugged the Posistor back in, restored power and ...NOTHING. Now I get a flashing blue light on the front and it won't even turn on.

Fabulous....
Edited by SinistrV6 - 5/8/13 at 11:14am
post #4355 of 4530
I have no idea if it's worth repairing... with no messages it's hard to say what is going on.. if it's going into thermal shutdown then I think you can replace that one little sensor... might be worth it then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post

From much earlier in this thread, something I've used in the past:
"Dialog enhancement is described on p. 68 of the user manual, 4th setting down from the top of the page."

I tried this out - and it basically puts the center channel dialog into the front left and right speakers also... or at least that's how it sounded to me. it doesn't sound like 5.1 or 7.1 any more, more like stereo with rear surround. I am not a fan of the way it sounds. but YMMV

I tried running in pure direct mode also when a friend if mine said my center seemed "muted"... I have it at +8 and all the other speakers at 0 or less. it did make a good difference. it was easier to hear dialog.
post #4356 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmanyon View Post

So Anyone have some input? Specifically, would an onkyo 525 with discrete amps be a step up in sound quality from the 1020? I have orb mod2 speakers with an Uber 10.

I can't answer your specific question and as a disclaimer, I will say that I'm far from audiophile-level discrimination capabilities. But I just upgraded my trusty 1020 to the Onkyo TX-NR818, for lots of reasons (but mainly because it was an impulse buy). I was a bit surprised that I did not notice a night-and-day difference in sound quality between the two. Most of the differences was attributable to different processing methods (e.g. EQ of sub frequencies by Audyssey, Audyssey DynamicEQ which is a dynamic "loudness" mode, etc.).

Caveat: I haven't tested the Onkyo at high volumes (i.e. close to reference) yet though. Also, the Onkyo certainly didn't sound worse or anything; it's just that I was surprised that Audyssey MultEQ XT32 finally provided an EQ quite similar to that obtained by Advanced MCACC (save for the sub freqs). I had assumed that MCACC with only a 7-band EQ to tweak, would be at a disadvantage.
post #4357 of 4530
Thanks for the reply! So just wondering, are you using small satellites or bigger speakers? I couldn't find any description of discrete amplifiers on the Onkyo 818, so i'm not sure if it is comparable to the Onkyo 525. For that matter, I couldn't find anything about discrete amps on the 1020 either, so I'm not even sure if I already have that feature. I do think the sound is pretty good, but I wouldn't mind upgrading if I could get a little bump in sound quality with the 525. I also like the ability to add a second sub and a 120hz crossover option. I'm still not sure if I want to do it though.
post #4358 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmanyon View Post

Thanks for the reply! So just wondering, are you using small satellites or bigger speakers? I couldn't find any description of discrete amplifiers on the Onkyo 818, so i'm not sure if it is comparable to the Onkyo 525. For that matter, I couldn't find anything about discrete amps on the 1020 either, so I'm not even sure if I already have that feature. I do think the sound is pretty good, but I wouldn't mind upgrading if I could get a little bump in sound quality with the 525. I also like the ability to add a second sub and a 120hz crossover option. I'm still not sure if I want to do it though.

I'm using Energy RC speakers: RC-70s (3-way towers) in the front, RC-LCR (3-way center) and RC-10s (2-way bookshelves) as surrounds. So no sats. I really don't know about discrete components in either the Onkyo or Pioneer AVRs and frankly I'd be a bit surprised if they were used.

I can't comment much between the 1020 and the 525 but I don't think it would really be an upgrade. First you'd lose two amps as the 525 has 5.2 outputs. Second, you'd have a bit less power per channel. The two subwoofer pre outs, as with the 818, are simply linked internally by a splitter. You can achieve the same with the 1020 with a $1 RCA splitter (this is what I do even with the 818 as I split the output after external sub EQing). Also, I would think room correction on the 1020 (Advanced MCACC) should be a bit above the vanilla Audyssey MultEQ present in the 525 (although MultEQ will EQ the sub frequencies, which the 1020 does not). The 525 will have superior networking but I don't think it will have an edge sound-quality-wise. I think the 626, which is 7.2 channels, is more directly comparable with the Pioneer 102x line. Audyssey has more flexible crossover options than MCACC (you can chose per-channel, including LFE), but it turns out, considering I love my subs, I simply set all channels to 100 Hz so I don't even use that capability.
post #4359 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by meowky View Post

So after a week of waiting for the posistor, I finally got it and prepared myself for the task of putting it back in.
This requires the patience level of a professional.
Fortunately I have 2 small children and they have prepared me for this skill level.
After having the screw for the posistor fall half a dozen times, I resorted to some glue because a magnetic bit would not hold it steady, (or it wasn't strong enough) I finally managed to get it in place.
Surprisingly this only took 15 minutes... seemed like an hour.

I plugged it in and... voila... nothing!
Now the display is flashing random blips and dashes... not cool.. so I resign, I'm going to have to bring it in to a service center.
So sad! frown.gif

Anyone have a ballpark on what the repair will cost? I hate to throw away an almost new receiver just because it is out of warrant. However my new Yami 673 is working just fine! smile.gif
post #4360 of 4530
I'm also interested in getting mine repaired but I won't take it to the shop on Pioneer's website (bad reputation). Can any of you recommend a repair shop? Southeast U.S. preferably but not required.
post #4361 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by r3v3nant View Post

I have no idea if it's worth repairing... with no messages it's hard to say what is going on.. if it's going into thermal shutdown then I think you can replace that one little sensor... might be worth it then.
I tried this out - and it basically puts the center channel dialog into the front left and right speakers also... or at least that's how it sounded to me. it doesn't sound like 5.1 or 7.1 any more, more like stereo with rear surround. I am not a fan of the way it sounds. but YMMV

I tried running in pure direct mode also when a friend if mine said my center seemed "muted"... I have it at +8 and all the other speakers at 0 or less. it did make a good difference. it was easier to hear dialog.

My question is also about dialogue -
many of the HD shows we watch have music etc and dialogue is hard to make out (Hawaii 5-O)
Louder helps somewaht
What is the BEST setting for voices?
I try Drama setting & bump the center but still not what I would expect
TIA
post #4362 of 4530

Broken record (ie, this has come up before):

 

From much earlier in this thread, something I've used in the past:

"Dialog enhancement is described on p. 68 of the user manual, 4th setting down from the top of the page."

 

post #4363 of 4530
The more I think about it, the more I am convinced dialog intelligibility is a problem inherent in the surround mixes from the studios. They are just not always mixed well for home use, in many cases. Especially true with the high resolution, lossless formats like DTS-HD MA and Dolby TruHD, I have found.

Try the center channel emphasis on the iControlAV app if you have a smartphone. Works wonders. I'm a big fan.
post #4364 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by treyrhodes View Post

The more I think about it, the more I am convinced dialog intelligibility is a problem inherent in the surround mixes from the studios. They are just not always mixed well for home use, in many cases. Especially true with the high resolution, lossless formats like DTS-HD MA and Dolby TruHD, I have found.

Try the center channel emphasis on the iControlAV app if you have a smartphone. Works wonders. I'm a big fan.

I have no idea what that is and yes I have an iphone??
The dialogue enhancement feature is either off or flat - I have mine on flat but still not all that great
Yes this seems to manifest itself more on the HD channels.
post #4365 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by treyrhodes View Post

The more I think about it, the more I am convinced dialog intelligibility is a problem inherent in the surround mixes from the studios. They are just not always mixed well for home use, in many cases. Especially true with the high resolution, lossless formats like DTS-HD MA and Dolby TruHD, I have found.

Try the center channel emphasis on the iControlAV app if you have a smartphone. Works wonders. I'm a big fan.

I never tried that before but it works well! the whole tilt the phone to increase and decrease volume is a little weird, but works. smile.gif
post #4366 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by SinistrV6 View Post

Well, my Pioneer VSX-1020-K has developed what (from my internet research) appears to be a common problem. It shuts down frequently. Sometimes it'll run for an hour, other times only a few seconds and every other time interval in between. I've tried every combination of speakers and new wires I can think of without success. BTW, it give no sort of ERROR MESSAGE or Warning. It just shuts off and will start right back up (most times). Now my question is, "IS IT WORTH REPAIRING?"

Thanks,

Richard.

Update: After reading the thread above, I tried to get a reading of the Posistor. I got a reading of 13 ohms. I plugged it in with the posistor unplugged and got the "AMP OVERHEAT" message and a shut down. That makes sense with the Posistor unplugged. Unplugged the power, plugged the Posistor back in, restored power and ...NOTHING. Now I get a flashing blue light on the front and it won't even turn on.

Fabulous....

Wait until you get the random gibberish on the display... my guess is the power supply is faulty.
I haven't had time to bring it to be repaired yet.
post #4367 of 4530
You can reset the 1021-k by holding the standby and enter button together for 5 secs, I have also read somewhere on the web you can hold MULTIZONE and TUNER - which will also reset the 1021-K

Post back if this works smile.gif
post #4368 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huskers2012 View Post

You can reset the 1021-k by holding the standby and enter button together for 5 secs, I have also read somewhere on the web you can hold MULTIZONE and TUNER - which will also reset the 1021-K

Post back if this works smile.gif
Good to know - mines still strong
I did hook up a Vizio that has internet.
Found that I had to hook up an optical cable from the Vizio to the VSX 1020 in order to get the internet audio
(everything else is HDMI)
I thought that if I went to the internet while still on TV mode (cable off) I would get audio since the 1020 is supposed to auto select the audio in order > HDMI, digital, analog
but this does not work
had to switch over to CD which I assigned to the digital input
Am I doing something wrong???/
Does this make sense??
post #4369 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huskers2012 View Post

You can reset the 1021-k by holding the standby and enter button together for 5 secs, I have also read somewhere on the web you can hold MULTIZONE and TUNER - which will also reset the 1021-K

Post back if this works smile.gif
Good to know - mines still strong
I did hook up a Vizio that has internet.
Found that I had to hook up an optical cable from the Vizio to the VSX 1020 in order to get the internet audio
(everything else is HDMI)
I thought that if I went to the internet while still on TV mode (cable off) I would get audio since the 1020 is supposed to auto select the audio in order > HDMI, digital, analog
but this does not work
had to switch over to CD which I assigned to the digital input
Am I doing something wrong???/
Does this make sense??
post #4370 of 4530
I have a VSX 1020K and am looking for a soundbar to connect to it.

I don't want to run the soundbar off the TV, but since the VSX1020K only has a single HDMI output, I'm kind of at a loss as to which soundbar I can purchase which has 5.1/7.1 analog inputs. There are a number of soundbars with 3.5mm inputs. However, the problem I'm seeing with my current 2.0 set up is that the middle channel isn't getting a strong enough signal and many times dialogue is drowned out.

I really need a soundbar as I'm unable to run wires around the room (no carpeting or other ways to hide the wires).

Are there any recommendations for *reasonably priced* (less than $300) soundbars (with or without subwoofer) that have 5.1 or 7.1 analog inputs?

Any suggestions would be appreciated!


Thanks,
Pippi
post #4371 of 4530
I know next to nothing about soundbars, but surely there are models with HDMI passthrough? I.e. you would connect the 1020's HDMI output to the soundbar's input, and passthrough the signal to the soundbar's output to the TV. The soundbar would then play whatever the receveir is set to output, with no need for 6-8 analog wires.
post #4372 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

I know next to nothing about soundbars, but surely there are models with HDMI passthrough? I.e. you would connect the 1020's HDMI output to the soundbar's input, and passthrough the signal to the soundbar's output to the TV. The soundbar would then play whatever the receveir is set to output, with no need for 6-8 analog wires.

HDMI passthrough would do the trick, but I haven't found any soundbars which support it. Any suggestions?
post #4373 of 4530
I have a stand alone surround bar speaker by polk, all 5 speakers are in one enclosure, you put it under your tv. It does a decent job, I use it in my living room, The tv is in the corner and there is no good location for surround speakers. Paired with a sub, it worked pretty well. All the wires were in a trunk.

http://www.polkaudio.com/images/products/medium/747192112004.jpg

http://www.polkaudio.com/images/products/gallery/47192112004_2.jpg

You can probably find one used.

Five Channels. One Speaker. Zero Clutter.
This is the original SurroundBar, the one that raised the bar on “sound bar” speakers using exclusive, patented Polk Audio technologies. It uses a carefully engineered array of seven 3-inch Dynamic Balance® drivers, and three 3/4-inch high performance dome tweeters, to deliver clear, natural midrange, blended realistically with detailed highs. The addition of Polk’s SDA Digital Surround Technology allows this speakers to work well in any room setup, with no complex calibrations, unlike most other sound bar speakers. Only SurroundBar delivers this kind of spacious, enveloping surround-sound, with lifelike imaging.
post #4374 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by PLongstocking View Post

HDMI passthrough would do the trick, but I haven't found any soundbars which support it. Any suggestions?

Nah, as I said, I never used a soundbar and never looked at them in any details (though I'm interested -- as Gregory above, my parents would really benefit from one).

In fact, I *thought* that most soundbars would be passthrough capable. A soundbar basically acts as a receiver, right? Say a soundbar has 3 HDMI inputs and one output. You plug your sources on the soundbar, and the TV on the output. The soundbar grabs the A/V signal from the source, plays the sound, and pass through the rest to the TV. So in that scenario, if you simply use one HDMI input on such a soundbar, and simply put it between your 1020 and the TV, shouldn't it do the trick?
post #4375 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Nah, as I said, I never used a soundbar and never looked at them in any details (though I'm interested -- as Gregory above, my parents would really benefit from one).

In fact, I *thought* that most soundbars would be passthrough capable. A soundbar basically acts as a receiver, right? Say a soundbar has 3 HDMI inputs and one output. You plug your sources on the soundbar, and the TV on the output. The soundbar grabs the A/V signal from the source, plays the sound, and pass through the rest to the TV. So in that scenario, if you simply use one HDMI input on such a soundbar, and simply put it between your 1020 and the TV, shouldn't it do the trick?

Yup. That would be perfect!. The problem is that I've yet to find a soundbar with an HDMI *Output*
post #4376 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregoryperkins View Post

I have a stand alone surround bar speaker by polk, all 5 speakers are in one enclosure, you put it under your tv. It does a decent job, I use it in my living room, The tv is in the corner and there is no good location for surround speakers. Paired with a sub, it worked pretty well. All the wires were in a trunk.

http://www.polkaudio.com/images/products/medium/747192112004.jpg

http://www.polkaudio.com/images/products/gallery/47192112004_2.jpg

You can probably find one used.

Five Channels. One Speaker. Zero Clutter.
This is the original SurroundBar, the one that raised the bar on “sound bar” speakers using exclusive, patented Polk Audio technologies. It uses a carefully engineered array of seven 3-inch Dynamic Balance® drivers, and three 3/4-inch high performance dome tweeters, to deliver clear, natural midrange, blended realistically with detailed highs. The addition of Polk’s SDA Digital Surround Technology allows this speakers to work well in any room setup, with no complex calibrations, unlike most other sound bar speakers. Only SurroundBar delivers this kind of spacious, enveloping surround-sound, with lifelike imaging.

Do you have a model number on this? I don't really buy used or refurbished equipment as I've had way too many negative experiences with same. Thanks for the suggestion. Maybe I can find a new one somewhere.
post #4377 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by PLongstocking View Post

Yup. That would be perfect!. The problem is that I've yet to find a soundbar with an HDMI *Output*

Just looking at various models on Amazon... It seems to me that most models that have HDMI inputs have at least one output. For example this Sony model (I really don't know if it's a good sound bar or not though!) specifically mentions the connection setup I was describing:
Quote:
HDMI Repeater with Pass-Through and Audio Return Channel

Connect multiple devices via HDMI to your surround sound system, easily switch between them, and then connect everything to your HDTV with just one HDMI cable. Standby pass-through of audio and video conveniently access all your HDMI connected devices without having to power on the receiver.

Audio Return Channel eliminates the need for extra cables connected to your TV. This feature allows audio to be sent from your compatible TV to your receiver through the same HDMI cable already being used to send audio and video to your TV.

It looks basically the same with this Samsung model.

Again, not vouching for any particular sound bar. But I guess if you specifically search for sound bars that can provide ARC (audio return channel feature of HDMI connexion), then you'll necessarily have models that work the way you want (regardless of you needing ARC in particular).
post #4378 of 4530
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Just looking at various models on Amazon... It seems to me that most models that have HDMI inputs have at least one output. For example this Sony model (I really don't know if it's a good sound bar or not though!) specifically mentions the connection setup I was describing:
It looks basically the same with this Samsung model.

Again, not vouching for any particular sound bar. But I guess if you specifically search for sound bars that can provide ARC (audio return channel feature of HDMI connexion), then you'll necessarily have models that work the way you want (regardless of you needing ARC in particular).

Thanks! I was looking around too, saw some of the same devices, but you beat me to it here.

There are several Samsung models as well as Panasonic and Sony models.

I guess I should have pointed out that my current TV is not HDMI capable. The HDMI passthrough will be useful when I buy a new TV, given the 1020K's single HDMI output. I'm going to do a little research to see if I can output A/V signals from multiple ports on the 1020K. The video quality of my current TV is fine for my needs, but the audio is not.

I'm not trying to make things difficult, but buying a new TV would require that I buy new furniture to house my components. I'm expecting to move in the next year or so and don't want to waste money on furniture or equipment that won't work with the new space (whatever that will look like). That was the reason for the original request re: analog inputs on a soundbar.

In any case, I really appreciate the suggestions. Perhaps I will break down and just buy a new TV, although I wasn't looking to spend that kind of money (TV plus new cabinet for my components) until I moved.
post #4379 of 4530
Well if you plan on using the 1020 with a new TV in the short to medium term, the HDMI input/output feature will be a must. But necessarily, the 1020 will then act as a switch (and possibly a video upconverter) more than anything else. If you pass the bitstream to the sound bar, the 1020 won't decode it at all. So make sure to buy a soundbar that can decode the formats you want (for example, the Sony model above does *not* decode Dolby True HD or DTS Master Audio), but this model does.
post #4380 of 4530
It seems that I'm in kind a of pickle with this since I want to get a 5.1 soundbar. to address the center channel issues I've been having. However, if I can make the "Dialog Enhancement" feature of the 1020K help with those issues, I may just go with a lower end 2.1 soundbar with analog input.

That way I'll be more comfortable getting rid of it once I move and can install a real 7.1 system.

I'll keep posting as I figure this out so other folks with similar issues can (hopefully) benefit from my experience.
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