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The Official Panasonic HDC-HS/SD/TM700 Owners thread - Page 3

post #61 of 1624
Is there a setting to display the shutter and iris settings in iA mode? Also when in manual mode is there a shutter or iris priority mode such that I can set the shutter speed and the cam will set the iris for auto exposure? Not at my camera and manual, but I could not find this? Thanks
post #62 of 1624
Thread Starter 
How do you backup your 50/60P movies to the computer? There is alot of folders and the streams are buried in a folder a few levels down. What do you copy to your harddisk from your camera to backup?
post #63 of 1624
I use HDwriter to copy the files to the computer. This is the only way HDwriter will see them an allow you to play them in HDwriter on your computer. Right now that is the only way I've been able to get them to play perfectly smooth on my computer.

When viewed through usb on the camera the video files are burried in the CAM_MEM/AVCHD/BDMV/Stream folder as *.mts files.

Images captured are in the DCIM/1XXXXX/ folder as *.JPG

The name of the file is the date and time the video or image was taken with the .MTS or .JPG extension.

Just drag and drop the files you want to a folder on your machine.

On the HD card the files are the same directory tree, but under the PRIVATE directory then AVCHD and so on.

It is a bit confusing at first but once you get the hang of it it only takes a few minutes to upload a ton of video and images to the folder you want on your computer.

Cheers,
Pete
post #64 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjsmitty View Post

Is there a setting to display the shutter and iris settings in iA mode? Also when in manual mode is there a shutter or iris priority mode such that I can set the shutter speed and the cam will set the iris for auto exposure? Not at my camera and manual, but I could not find this? Thanks

Manual mode. By setting either shutter or aperture, the other setting will be automatically set when leaving the menu.
post #65 of 1624
So I just got mine and I have to bring up the fan noise. This is my first camcorder so I have no idea what's normal ambient fan noise. With the camera on, the fan sounds pretty quiet and I definitely can't hear it from across a room, though when I put it up to my ear there's a definite buzz. However, when I play back footage, it's more noticeable than I thought it'd be. Is this typical of most camcorders, including the "improved" TM700, or did I likely get one of the original flawed TM700's that should be returned immediately?
post #66 of 1624
As this thread is dedicated to owners I thought I would put my observations here.
I own the hard disc version of the700.
Using the standard OIS setting on stationary subjects for videoing I find there is still some jittery movement due to handshake.Using the "mega"setting makes no difference. As more stabilization is being used I would have expected virtually no movement when the maximum wide angle is being used.Surely the more you zoom the more work the OIS has to do.In fact the more you zoom the more effective the stabilization is.Whatever the zoom settings I do not see any improvement to using the "mega" setting for video recording.
Am I expecting too much of the OIS system?Is there a particular way that I should be holding the camcorder to minimise these issues?
On slow pans and zooms the OIS works very smoothly and produces steady video.
My viewing is done on a 46" Samsung TV and a Panasonic Ae4000 projector with a 92" screen.
In Camcorder Info reviews the 700 OIS was only rated 1% behind the Sony 550(which has many rave comments on its OIS) so I was expecting a very steady picture.
Taking stiil pictures the "mega" setting is very effective and produces far sharper pictures compared to the standard OIS setting.
I look forward to other users observations.
Charles
post #67 of 1624
You may be expecting too much Charles. I've mentioned it in other threads, the Mega OIS is for walking and should only be used for walking. It must use a different algorithm for that type of motion.

So use the regular OIS for normal zooming. You should hold the camcorder in TWO HANDS. I see most people holding both small digital still cameras and videocameras in one hand. That's a 'no no'. I usually place my left hand under the camera and have my right hand operating the controls. Keep in mind the smaller and lighter the camera, the more it will shake...that's just physics.

Also, not often discussed, if you use the LCD instead of the viewfinder, you'll generally get shakier videos with any camera. It's a much more awkward ergonomic posture to hold something out in front of you and do it in a steady manner. When you use the viewfinder, you're using your face as a brace. That together with two hands, makes for a steadier video.

Now the degree of 'shake' in people's hands vary considerably too. If you have very shaky hands, no OIS is going to remove 100% of the shake...none.

I've had OIS systems from the 3 major camcorder manufacturers (Sony, Canon & Panasonic) and I find the Panasonic to be at least as good as any I've used previously.
post #68 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by nagudri View Post

So I just got mine and I have to bring up the fan noise. This is my first camcorder so I have no idea what's normal ambient fan noise. With the camera on, the fan sounds pretty quiet and I definitely can't hear it from across a room, though when I put it up to my ear there's a definite buzz. However, when I play back footage, it's more noticeable than I thought it'd be. Is this typical of most camcorders, including the "improved" TM700, or did I likely get one of the original flawed TM700's that should be returned immediately?

If you can hear the fan in your videos in anything other than a very quiet room, your fan is noisier than typical.
post #69 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by charles norwich View Post

Am I expecting too much of the OIS system? Is there a particular way that I should be holding the camcorder to minimise these issues?

Yes

Hold the camera with three fingers and your thumb under the cam with your left hand. I also rarely put my hand through the strap as I find I'm always sliding my hand in and out to work the zoom jerks it around. With my fingers creating a tripod under the cam and my right hand on the side of the cam it sits very nicely.

I found the OIS of this camera to be incredible. I can zoom all the way to 18x hand held and get very usable shots. My main use for the cam is wildlife shots and it works incredibly for that. It definitely doesn't work as well when walking around.

Cheers,
Pete
post #70 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

You may be expecting too much Charles. I've mentioned it in other threads, the Mega OIS is for walking and should only be used for walking. It must use a different algorithm for that type of motion.

So use the regular OIS for normal zooming. You should hold the camcorder in TWO HANDS. I see most people holding both small digital still cameras and videocameras in one hand. That's a 'no no'. I usually place my left hand under the camera and have my right hand operating the controls. Keep in mind the smaller and lighter the camera, the more it will shake...that's just physics.

Also, not often discussed, if you use the LCD instead of the viewfinder, you'll generally get shakier videos with any camera. It's a much more awkward ergonomic posture to hold something out in front of you and do it in a steady manner. When you use the viewfinder, you're using your face as a brace. That together with two hands, makes for a steadier video.

Now the degree of 'shake' in people's hands vary considerably too. If you have very shaky hands, no OIS is going to remove 100% of the shake...none.

I've had OIS systems from the 3 major camcorder manufacturers (Sony, Canon & Panasonic) and I find the Panasonic to be at least as good as any I've used previously.

Thank you for your usefull tips.I have tried using the viewfinder and it certainly makes the videos more steady.
Charles
post #71 of 1624
Thank you for your tips.
Charles
post #72 of 1624
Thread Starter 
If i use HDWriter to copy my 1080/50P files to my computer i get .m2ts files with some extra small files. If i put my memorycard in my computer i find my 1080/50P files to be .mts files. Why the difference in file extensions? And what way should be the best for archiving and backup? With HD Writer (.m2ts) or by copy from internal memory to memorycard and then copy to computer?

I also read somewhere that Panasonic stated that its not possible to put movies back to the camera ones you have transfered them to your computer. Is there any workaround to this?
post #73 of 1624
I think transferring it to a different wrapper makes the software co-operate better when your editing and viewing. It probably could have taken more time developing the software to make it work just as good as M2T but if it's a loss-less transfer, they probably figured why bother. For some editing programs such as Premiere CS5, it doesn't matter. Premiere will eat up just about anything as long as you keep the extensions the same.

On my laptop with Windows Media 11, I have to change the extension to .mp4 in order for the video to playback but I have to have the original extensions if I were to transfer it to Premiere CS4 so I'm assuming CS5 is no different.

I really do need to upgrade to Production Premium CS5. Yes I have an ATI card rather than an Adobe sanctioned NVIDIA card but then again, CS4 was made to be compatible with both 32 and 64 bit systems. Making it fully optimized for a 64 bit environment increases the stability.
post #74 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by rico90 View Post

How do you backup your 50/60P movies to the computer? There is alot of folders and the streams are buried in a folder a few levels down. What do you copy to your harddisk from your camera to backup?

I just drag and drop the STREAM folder from the SDHC card into a new folder on my desktop or laptop HD. Today I just named the new folder "May 17 2010" that is in a folder named " my 1080p60 videos".
post #75 of 1624
That's one thing I didn't answer earlier. What I'll add is that it'll be best to keep the Private folder intact. That will let you transfer 1080 60i files to Final Cut through Log and Transfer and their may be a future patch for the transferring of 1080 60p files without using any third party software. I'm not on a MAC but I have it that way just in case.

I have the same type of naming convention in which I put different private folders inside external folders with dates on it.
post #76 of 1624
U can put HDWriter footage back onto your camcorder, but you have to be careful not to add anything which will change the native avchd format. I've dumped footage back into my Panny HDC-SD9 after a 'divide and delete'. If you add text or transitions, forget it
post #77 of 1624
My manual says "It is impossible to write data to the built-in memory or HDD on the unit from a PC"
post #78 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by HTPCfreddy View Post

Sorry, but if Canon and Sony can place DC access ports beside the battery and not behind the battery on their newest/current models (Vixia HF S21, Vixia S10, CX500, CX550), I believe Panasonic could have done so too.

No one's saying they couldn't have done so. My suggestion is that they had their reasons to so do, and here's what I think they were. The primary reason is simple: they don't need to include a charge with roughly twice the output needed, since you're only either charging the camera or charging the battery. It also makes the camera interface simpler... it only has to work from a battery. No need to include charging circuitry, power switching circuity, etc. I've designed such circuitry myself (most recently, on the Nomadio "React" R/C controller)... it's not crazy difficult, but it's kind of annoying, and potentially a slight efficiency drag.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HTPCfreddy View Post

Canon and Sony have to fight putting circuitry into a small chassis as well.
Canon goes one feature better by placing the USB/HDMI port on the bottom right side but the hand strap.

It's not at all about size... we're talking about very small parts, and at least for an Li-ion battery these days, it's a single power management chip that can do the battery/wall-wart switching and charging. But it's a minor loss of efficiency in the camera (power always has to be routed through the chip, probably a pair of P-Channel MOSFETS), and it's a more expensive power supply.

And, personally anyway, I'm always going to need an off-camera charger... I don't have any desire to charge on-camera, even when I can. So for me, this was the superior solution anyway. My first digital camcorder, from JVC, worked the same way, while both Sonys and the Canon I've had before this had the on-camera charging option. It's a design trade-off, that's all... more complexity and a bit more expense in the camera, plus a larger power supply, and you don't need to include an off-camera charger. Include the off-camera charger, and the camera itself can be simpler.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HTPCfreddy View Post

That is a good idea about concatenating multiple 4GB files with the binary append switch of "copy /b".

Yup... works, and you get your larger files. In theory, if you ever get your hands on an SDXC card, the TM700 will format it to exFAT (64-bit FAT) and never have to worry about 4GB limits. I do say in-theory, in that the official file system for SDXC is exFAT... that's virtually the only reason for SDXC being something different than SDHC.

So I just messed with this... you CAN format an SDHC card as exFAT, at least from Windows 7 and perhaps other more recent OSs... just put it on a spare 32GB card. And if you do this, the TM700 will recognize and use it. So, I only though of this a minute ago, I haven't had a chance to play around, but it's quite possible this will let you store >4GB files, as that's the whole point of exFAT. Obviously, this has a negative impact on the interoperability of that SDHC card with other devices, but assuming the TM700 does as expected, it'll save that catenation step.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HTPCfreddy View Post

That said, the TM700 isn't perfect either in features I thought were not worth rejecting it for - like the DC/USB/HDMI port access.

I don't have much of a problem with the USB access... USB is useless while the camera's in operation, so there's no conflict here, far as I'm concerned. It's technically possible to record from HDMI, and assuming the TM700 leaves HDMI hot during shooting (it may not... many consumer models make it an either/or thing), it would be an advantage to have access to HDMI without being blocked by the LCD. I agree with that.
post #79 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by pingisik View Post

My manual says "It is impossible to write data to the built-in memory or HDD on the unit from a PC"

Panasonic always maps the SD or HDD as a read-only device when mounted on a PC. This helps prevent you from formatting the unit yourself (which probably doesn't matter, but manufacturers only assume responsibility for their own format routines), and of course, prevents any accidental or malware-induced deletions. Downsize is that, if you want to put video back on the camcorder, you need an alternate SDHC drive.
post #80 of 1624
Thread Starter 
But putting them back on the SDHC card is always an option. Anyone have tried this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hazydave View Post

Panasonic always maps the SD or HDD as a read-only device when mounted on a PC. This helps prevent you from formatting the unit yourself (which probably doesn't matter, but manufacturers only assume responsibility for their own format routines), and of course, prevents any accidental or malware-induced deletions. Downsize is that, if you want to put video back on the camcorder, you need an alternate SDHC drive.
post #81 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by hazydave View Post

No one's saying they couldn't have done so. My suggestion is that they had their reasons to so do, and here's what I think they were.

My original post was not implying that Panasonic could not design the product differently - I hope that was clear . I believe they made the DC charger design decisions for certain reasons (for which you have your own explaination-thanks). I won't debate your reasons for Panasonic's design decisions - however the fact remains that if Sony and Canon can design and release real products for sale with DC ports unobstructed by batteries - they must understand why a customer would want this, independant of what other engineers/mftr's may think about circuit cost/complexity/implementation of charger design (Yes, I am an EE who designs real products as well and understand about cost/parts limit/physical volume/environmental considerations). I am glad about the decision to include the gorgeous 1080p60 mode though

Formatting an SDHC card with exFAT sounds like a fun idea to try. Thanks for that idea - I'll be sure to try that out . I have not recorded any footage longer then 20 minutes (~4GB), but will be sure to try that soon.
post #82 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Manual mode. By setting either shutter or aperture, the other setting will be automatically set when leaving the menu.

hmm, When I check the iris after increasing the shutter speed I see the iris is changing, however the lcd screen exposure is getting darker? To check the camera iA shutter and iris settings do I just toggle to manual mode to check the settings, or is there a way the settings can be displayed on screen in iA mode? Lastly, is there a way to view the iris and shutter settings when in sports scene mode. Thanks,
jjsmitty
post #83 of 1624
Guys, I'm the newest victim of cheapness.

I bought a knock off battery for my TM700 and after 2-3 seconds I got the "you're screwed" message. It won't take it. Any tricks to get the camera to accept it?
post #84 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjsmitty View Post

hmm, When I check the iris after increasing the shutter speed I see the iris is changing, however the lcd screen exposure is getting darker? To check the camera iA shutter and iris settings do I just toggle to manual mode to check the settings, or is there a way the settings can be displayed on screen in iA mode? Lastly, is there a way to view the iris and shutter settings when in sports scene mode. Thanks,
jjsmitty

I don't believe you can get the iris/shutter speed values while in IA mode. You'd have to be in manual mode to get them.
post #85 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miami Guy View Post

Guys, I'm the newest victim of cheapness.

I bought a knock off battery for my TM700 and after 2-3 seconds I got the "you're screwed" message. It won't take it. Any tricks to get the camera to accept it?

This is why I've warned in several posts to only buy Panasonic batteries. Your best bet is to try to return the battery for the real deal.
post #86 of 1624
Has anyone had success with third-party batteries for the TM700?

If so, make/model and link?
post #87 of 1624
Thread Starter 
What would be the correct choice to backup 1080/60(50)P to your computer to make them future proof?

Option 1:

Use HDWriter to copy files to your computer

Option 2:

Copy the "Private"-folder from internal memory or memorycard.

The problem i see with option 2 is that if you have filmed like 2 hours and you want to split that up in lets say: "Spain 2010", "Fotball game", "Graduation 2010" when copying to your computer you have to pick out the corresponding .mts-files from the streamfolder. That might cause a problem if you want to keep the filestructure intact for future use.

I'm just looking for the best and the most correct way to archive/backup my films.
post #88 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by nagudri View Post

Has anyone had success with third-party batteries for the TM700?

If so, make/model and link?

Nope. I'm interested in picking up another VW-VBG260 for it, but these are crazy-expensive... nearly as expensive as the VW-VBG6 (for the HMC40/150), which has twice the capacity. What IS the deal?

Curiously, there's a third party replacement for the VW-VBG6 from IDX (SSL-VBG50, it's at B&H) which is only slightly cheaper, but has the on-battery LEDs I miss from my HVR-A1. I don't have the VW-VBG6 adapter cable for the TM700, so I haven't been able to see if this works on the TM700 or not. But it definitely works on the HMC40, though weirdly, you get the battery remaining symbol, but not the percentage readout with it.

I always bought the Sony cells for the HVR-A1... the NP-QM71D. That's a 2760mAh cell for $70, versus the 2500mAh VW-VBG260 for $120-$150. And the Sony cell has the LEDs! If there wasn't so much gouging on the battery prices, I doubt there'd be much call for 3rd party cells. Thus, no need for the "chipped" battery.

The IDX cell also works with normal Panasonic chargers. The first thing I noticed with most of these 3rd party batteries for the consumer Pannys -- they don't work with the Panasonic chargers, or at least that's the claim. That should be a clear warning, right there.

I first looked into this when I bought an SD9 for my daughter over a year ago. All the best wisdom was that the 3rd party cells worked for some of these, but not for the SD9.
post #89 of 1624
I just got my TM700 from B&H and It is very quite then I had thought. Can any one please advice on SDHC cards like what brand and what speed should I use. Is Transcend 16GB Class 6 SDHC good ?
post #90 of 1624
Quote:
Originally Posted by sony-pany View Post

I just got my TM700 from B&H and It is very quite then I had thought. Can any one please advice on SDHC cards like what brand and what speed should I use. Is Transcend 16GB Class 6 SDHC good ?

I have the Transcend and it works. I've heard that the SanDisk has faster transfer, but of course, is more expensive.
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