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*Official* Denon AVR-1911/791 & AVR-2311CI/891 Owner's Thread - Page 127

post #3781 of 5023
I've got my 1911 driving a KEF T305 5.1 surround setup. When listening to 2 channel audio (radio or Ipod), is it better to use the "Fade" function to send music to the read channels, or is there an alternate method? This will only affect the input active at the time, right? So, if I increase the fade for HD radio, it wont impact my iPod, CD or HDMI?

Thanks
post #3782 of 5023
Thanks. Slightly unclear what the re offset does. For movies I expect leaving it at -5 is best.
post #3783 of 5023
Also wondering, I want to turn my true hd into 7.1. Should o use pl or neo?
post #3784 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by spindoctor View Post

I've got my 1911 driving a KEF T305 5.1 surround setup. When listening to 2 channel audio (radio or Ipod), is it better to use the "Fade" function to send music to the read channels, or is there an alternate method? This will only affect the input active at the time, right? So, if I increase the fade for HD radio, it wont impact my iPod, CD or HDMI?

Thanks

I'm not clear on what you are trying to do -- are you trying to simply send audio to the surrounds (e.g. matrix 2-channel audio into surround audio) or are you trying to make the surrounds relatively louder for one input vs. other inputs?
post #3785 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesP1701 View Post

Thanks. Slightly unclear what the re offset does. For movies I expect leaving it at -5 is best.

what Dynamic EQ does is raise the bass and surround levels as the volume drops in order to maintain the tonal balance that you would get at "reference volume". When the volume is at 0 (which is calibrated by MultEQ as "reference") then Dynamic EQ does nothing.... as the volume drops further, Dynamic EQ starts boosting the bass and surrounds more and more.

put on some music and turn the volume down fairly low and turn Dyn EQ on and off, and you can hear what it does. It prevents audio from having that "thin" sound when the volume is soft, and also keeps the "surround bubble" (because our ears tend to hear the fronts better than the surrounds when the volume drops). If you do the same experiment (turning the volume low and turning Dyn EQ on/off) for a movie scene with a lot of action, you will hear how the soundfield "collapses" to the front when Dyn EQ is turned off because we lose the sense of the surrounds.

now, the issue is that Dyn EQ is calibrated to "reference", but this reference is only consistently applied to film soundtracks, because all movies (DVD, blu-ray, etc) are mixed to a defined set of standards. Other content (music, cable TV, video games) does not have a standardized level like the movie industry, and often are mixed "hot" compared to film soundtracks, so sometimes Dynamic EQ will be boosting too much (making the bass and surrounds overinflated).

so when you are watching a TV program, it can make dialogue difficult to understand because the surrounds and bass levels are being overboosted and causing the center channel to get drowned out. What the Ref Offset setting does is tone down how strongly Dyn EQ does its boosting. For example, let's say you watch TV at volume of -25.... normally, Dyn EQ would boost as though you were 25dB below reference. If you set the Offset to 10, then Dyn EQ will only boost as though you were 15dB below reference, so you won't get as much boost applied to the bass/surrounds.

This is why JD suggested trying this if your dialogue issues are with Cable TV. It will change the relative balance of the front soundtage (including the center channel) compared to the surrounds.

For cable TV, it is generally recommended to set the offset at 10 or 15. Same thing with music, especially contemporary music (pop, rock, rap, etc) which is mixed "hot" and compressed.

For movies, theoretically the Ref Offset should be left at 0. However, in some rooms or for your preferences you may prefer to tone down the bass and surrounds a bit, so you can set it to 5 to take a little of the edge off.

Make sense?

Quote:


Also wondering, I want to turn my true hd into 7.1. Should o use pl or neo?

In general PLIIx Cinema mode is the recommended setting for converting a 5.1 movie track into 7.1 (matrixing the two surrounds into four by "steering" sounds into the two back channels). DTS Neo will do a similar process but it is only a 6ch technology, so the two surr.back channels will play the same mono signal instead of independent stereo signals. The same is true for "EX" or "Matrix" modes, which are from the 6.1 days, and create a mono rear channel.
post #3786 of 5023
Excellent explanation Batpig!
post #3787 of 5023
Batpig and the rest,

this thread is excellent. based on the recommendations and review I just acquired a 1712.

I am running a 5.1 setup with orb speakers, and a samsung tv. The question I have is that everytime I switch to DVD/Game, the receiver switches to 2Ch Stereo. Is it is possible to make the default audio mutli ch. stereo?

I am also using a harmony one remote (btw, which doesnt have codes for the 1712, so I am using the codes for 1612)

appreciate the help

thanks
post #3788 of 5023
^^
You're actually in the wrong thread for the 1712. Better to repost in the 1712 Owner's thread linked in my sig.

Bottom line is yes you can ... simply press the MOVIE button and select DD PLII - Cinema when you get that stereo signal.
post #3789 of 5023
So I'm about 1 step form pulling the trigger on my AVR. Last minute cold feet has me wondering what the better buy is. So I'm coming to you guys for your expertise.

Denon 891 or Pioneer 1020k?

I will be getting the Jamo S606HCS3 w/ Bic F12 and this will be mostly for movies and games. Components that i will be using are a PS3, Panasonic 210, Xbox 360, and digital cable. Thanks in advance.
post #3790 of 5023
891 w/Parts Express Sub120 is what you want. The F12 is over priced crap in comparison.
post #3791 of 5023
Quick question I hope I'm not duplicating, ref avr-2311ci

Is there any way of leaving the speakers alone and have Audyssey just operate on the sub?

If I do the copy function from Audyssey and use manual, the subwoofer doesn't show. Does that mean it hasn't copied or just you can't manually adjust it. Obviously that would be a work around if I could copy and adjust all the speakers back to zero and the sub is in fact still using audyssey results.
post #3792 of 5023
No you can not.
post #3793 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

I'm not clear on what you are trying to do -- are you trying to simply send audio to the surrounds (e.g. matrix 2-channel audio into surround audio) or are you trying to make the surrounds relatively louder for one input vs. other inputs?

"Send audio to the surrounds" seems right, as if I they were the front speakers in a second room....Sorry I'm a little behind on terminology. My goal is to distribute music from Radio or iPod (2 channel) around the room, but not disturb my 5.1 setting for Sat/Cable or BD.

Thanks for your help, I wish there was a "Audio terms for dummies" section of the manual......

I do have a question about Audyssey...I've been reading a lot about it recently, but have had no success (the results typically sound flat, dead and lifeless, with over-amped bass from the sub) I'm still trying to understand all the nuances and terminologies. My question is this: Audessey claims to correct room acoustics, but does it compensate for speaker issues as well? I guess this is a esoteric math and algorithm question, but I see the response curves posted in many of the review magazines, when testing loudspeakers. Has there been a professional review of Audyssey before and after, maybe using both a high-end loudspeaker, and comparing to a "deeply flawed" speaker? (where the original frequency response is significantly different than the source). I'm still not too clear on Audyssey's intended results, but at this point, to my ears, It's better left off.

Thanks!!
post #3794 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by spindoctor View Post


I do have a question about Audyssey...I've been reading a lot about it recently, but have had no success (the results typically sound flat, dead and lifeless, with over-amped bass from the sub) I'm still trying to understand all the nuances and terminologies. My question is this: Audessey claims to correct room acoustics, but does it compensate for speaker issues as well? I guess this is a esoteric math and algorithm question, but I see the response curves posted in many of the review magazines, when testing loudspeakers.

I think I answered my own question: The resulting curve is applied to the audio output, regardless the source of any needed correction. I'll have to keep playing with it, to determine why my results are so unsatisfactory. (to my ears)
post #3795 of 5023
I just recently set up my Denon 891 and I'm having an issue with HDMI Control (ARC).
I have a new Samsung UN55D6050 that I'm wanting to run audio from into my 891 only when running apps from the TV like Netflix.

I am able to configure this by Turning on HDMI Control on my 891. when i access Samsung applictions like Netflix i'm able to get audio from the TV into my 891 using the ARC HDMI.
This works fine.

But when I turn my system off and back on again, the TV turns on to my cable box for about 30 seconds and then jumps to TV input as if i was running audio from my TV back into the Reciever.

If i disable HDMI Control. Everything works fine when i turn my system on and off.

DENON 891
Samsung UN55D6050
Harmony One

Any ideas how to control the behavior so that when HDMI control is turned on, it will not jump to TV input when my system powers on.

Thanks,
Kevin
post #3796 of 5023
^^
The issue you are experiencing is an unwanted side effect of HDMI-CEC. Your choices are (a) Only turn HDMI-CEC/ARC to ON on the TV when you want to pass audio from it, (b) Don't use ARC, rather connect an optical cable from the TV to the AVR, or (c) Program the Harmony to change the source back to whatever you want to use when the AVR switches to the TV source.
post #3797 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by spindoctor View Post

"Send audio to the surrounds" seems right, as if I they were the front speakers in a second room....Sorry I'm a little behind on terminology. My goal is to distribute music from Radio or iPod (2 channel) around the room, but not disturb my 5.1 setting for Sat/Cable or BD.

OK, then you don't want the "fader". The point of the fader is to temporarily adjust the front/back balance. What you want to do is "matrix" stereo sound (2 channels) into surround sound (5.1 channels).

You have a few options, and note that none of them will "disturb" your settings for other sources because these auto surround defaults are memorized separately for each input. Although note that if you use the "quick select" buttons to select a source, you will need to re-memorize it (hold down for a few seconds like memorizing a radio station in the car) or else it will revert to defaults.

Option 1: Use the STANDARD button on the remote to toggle between Dolby Pro Logic and DTS Neo, which are alternate methods of creating a surround signal out of stereo. Note that each has a MUSIC and a CINEMA mode, which can be changed by going into the OSD and then changing the mode in Audio Adjust > Surround Parameter.

Option 2: Use the SIMULATION button to toggle among the "denon original surround modes". MultiCh Stereo will broadcast the same audio to all speakers, and the other modes (like "Jazz Hall") are synthesized DSP modes for "fake" surround sound.
post #3798 of 5023
can anyone tell me if denon 791 support ipod touch 4g thru usb ??
post #3799 of 5023
^^
Yes, it should. It just won't support the Shuffle or Ipad 2.
post #3800 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Option 1: Use the STANDARD button on the remote to toggle between Dolby Pro Logic and DTS Neo, which are alternate methods of creating a surround signal out of stereo. Note that each has a MUSIC and a CINEMA mode, which can be changed by going into the OSD and then changing the mode in Audio Adjust > Surround Parameter.

Option 2: Use the SIMULATION button to toggle among the "denon original surround modes". MultiCh Stereo will broadcast the same audio to all speakers, and the other modes (like "Jazz Hall") are synthesized DSP modes for "fake" surround sound.

Thanks!
post #3801 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by markymiles View Post

...Is there any way of leaving the speakers alone and have Audyssey just operate on the sub?...

AFAIK Audyssey "Bypass Front" applies Audyssey filters to only the sub for 2.1 listening in Stereo mode.

In setting up manual EQ, Copy Base EQ can only use the basic internal graphic EQ to crudely approximate some portion of what the Audyssey filters are doing. I've never noticed if it EQ'd the sub. IMO manual mode is only useful to hear how much Audyssey improves the SQ. Why would you not want Audyssey on? Are you having a problem or just insanely curious?
post #3802 of 5023
I recently switched from a 2802 to 1911 for HDMI support. Now, when I play DVDs on my Samsung 46C630 using my LG BD550, there is a noticeable delay in the video relative to the sound. It only happens when playing DVDs. I am curious why I have this new problem and the best way to fix it. Is it best to adjust the sound delay or change video processing options?

Any help appreciated. Thanks!
post #3803 of 5023
Hi all.

Been rocking a 1911 for a few months now. I have it in a 2 channel configuration.

When I first got it, I played around with Audyssey and the auto setup stuff. At the end of the day, I did not like how things sounded using its settings.

So, I turned it off and setup my own EQ curves. That works well. Except the stupid receiver will not leave itself in manual mode. If I turn it off and back on, or I switch sources it puts itself back into Audyssey settings.

Is there any way I can force it to use manual and only manual forever and ever?
post #3804 of 5023
^^
You're likely using a Quick Select to turn the AVR ON so then you need to rememorize that Quick Select with the MultEQ turned OFF by pressing and holding the QS button for a few seconds.
post #3805 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbfactor View Post
I recently switched from a 2802 to 1911 for HDMI support. Now, when I play DVDs on my Samsung 46C630 using my LG BD550, there is a noticeable delay in the video relative to the sound. It only happens when playing DVDs. I am curious why I have this new problem and the best way to fix it. Is it best to adjust the sound delay or change video processing options?

Any help appreciated. Thanks!
Adjusting the Audio Delay setting is a good place to start.
post #3806 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
^^
You're likely using a Quick Select to turn the AVR ON so then you need to rememorize that Quick Select with the MultEQ turned OFF by pressing and holding the QS button for a few seconds.
No, I turn the AVR on with the power on and off buttons. Will this still work?
post #3807 of 5023
But are you using the Quick Selects at all? If yes, rememorize them.
post #3808 of 5023
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbfactor View Post

I recently switched from a 2802 to 1911 for HDMI support. Now, when I play DVDs on my Samsung 46C630 using my LG BD550, there is a noticeable delay in the video relative to the sound. It only happens when playing DVDs. I am curious why I have this new problem and the best way to fix it. Is it best to adjust the sound delay or change video processing options?

Any help appreciated. Thanks!

I need to look into the audio delay as well, as sound from my WDTV and DVD (both using HDMI) is ahead of the picture. My receiver is on the default settings so though it would be ok.

However I think it could be the TV at fault, as the audio sync was out when using another receiver before this one). Pretty annoying. Samsung LA46C650.

Just checked the manual:
Quote:


Audio Delay:
This item can be set within the range of 0 to 100 ms when Auto Lip Sync is set to ON and when
a TV compatible with Auto Lip Sync is connected.

How do you know if the TV is compatible with Auto Lip Sync? Is it better to turn auto lipsync off?

This is the main reason I upgraded my receiver too.
post #3809 of 5023
Further to the above, what is the best method of setting the audio delay? It's a bit hard to pick it by eye and was wondering if there is a dvd/video that has timing material to make it easier?

Thanks,
post #3810 of 5023
It's not really that tough to do it by sight alone ... once you no longer notice a delay, you're good to go.

I had this issue with a DirecTV box from time to time which I was able to correct by changing channels and then back to the original channel again. Try various settings and see what works best for you as the issue is generally inherent to particular sources.
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