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Philips 55pfl5505 need some feedback - Page 8

post #211 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrew321 View Post

Oh, another thing. How much do these sets suffer from flashlighting and clouding of the backlight?

If you are saying, do these sets exhibit anything like this:

http://myhdtvchoice.com/2008/03/29/w...ouding-effect/

I haven't personally noticed it on the two I have. I'll let others who own it comment on it.
post #212 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickrohan View Post

If you are saying, do these sets exhibit anything like this:

http://myhdtvchoice.com/2008/03/29/w...ouding-effect/

I haven't personally noticed it on the two I have. I'll let others who own it comment on it.

Yeah, that's what I mean. That can drive me nuts. Also, I've had some issues with some 120hz and 240hz tv's having weird stuttering motion or other motion problems on some sources, especially abc primetime. This is with the processing set to off. I had a samsung lnb750 and an lg ld550 do stuff like this, but a samsung unc6000 and unc7000 not do this. I've also seen someone else's philips from last year (I think a 6704 or something like that) that seemed to have some motion problems even with the digital motion thing turned off. Does this philips have any problems like that? And one other thing, I'm concerned about not having a separate backlight control. Usually I would have the backlight set to about half or less but the contrast set to 90 or so.
post #213 of 675
Sorry, another thing. What about the 2:3 pulldown that other tv's have for film sources? And does it display 24p correctly? I don't like using frame interpolation, but I really want a 120hz tv to play blu rays at 24p.
post #214 of 675
Ok .. The clouding effects you see in the images in the link above have absolutely nothing to do with local dimming or any TV being 120Hz.

That is a problem which occurs in panels due to poor calibration of fusing equipment. It is the equipment which fuses together the various layers of a panel (i.e. the diffuser, filters, LCD, filters, more filters)

I have not noticed any stuttering (judder) on any source because of interpolation. Interpolation is implemented to remove judder.

Also, the TV has a pure 24p mode. If you set your BDP to output at 24p ... the TV will display 1080p @ 24Hz
post #215 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrew321 View Post

Oh, another thing. How much do these sets suffer from flashlighting and clouding of the backlight?

I have the 55PFL5505 - zero clouding/flashlight issues

Wazy
post #216 of 675
Maverickrohan
I have recently purchased the older 47pfl5704 model. PQ is outstanding once adjusted, but one cannot control the backlight. Only way to turn down the backlight and upping the black level is by using active control with light sensor on. Using this or dynamic contrast does increase black level, but it also has a tendancy of clipping the brighter portion of the screen...such as the peoples foreheads in daylight scenes. Their foreheads are flashed out. I have software version 1.12 Is this a software issue, a service issue, or just the nature of this model?
post #217 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosros View Post

Maverickrohan
I have recently purchased the older 47pfl5704 model. PQ is outstanding once adjusted, but one cannot control the backlight. Only way to turn down the backlight and upping the black level is by using active control with light sensor on. Using this or dynamic contrast does increase black level, but it also has a tendancy of clipping the brighter portion of the screen...such as the peoples foreheads in daylight scenes. Their foreheads are flashed out. I have software version 1.12 Is this a software issue, a service issue, or just the nature of this model?

Just the nature of the TV ...
post #218 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickrohan View Post

Just the nature of the TV ...

Kind of figured...probably need the horsepower of the pixel perfect engine
post #219 of 675
So does changing the contrast affect the LCD display the way contrast works on other tv's as well as affecting the backlight? Is it possible to get the settings looking right this way? And are the blacks better than the 6704 from last year?
post #220 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrew321 View Post

So does changing the contrast affect the LCD display the way contrast works on other tv's as well as affecting the backlight? Is it possible to get the settings looking right this way? And are the blacks better than the 6704 from last year?

The blacks are better in 2010 5 series because of the 1D dimming scanning backlight.

But the 6x04 & 7x04 from 2009 are also really good TVs. The slim edge LG panels in those TVs were pretty expensive.
post #221 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickrohan View Post

The S/PDIF Coaxial jack on the TV outputs two channel PCM audio.

Depending on your sources (Cable/Satellite/IPTV Box or Blu-ray Player, you can directly output sound from those devices using a decoder to you 5.1 channel computer speakers. For audio sources from the TV's tuner, you can use surround modes such as Creative CMSS or Dolby ProLogic etc. ... not sure if you are connecting vis your computer or your speakers have a digital in or what kind of decoder are you using?

so is there any way to get native 5.1 surround sound directly from the tv?
since my last post i've already purchased the tv and also a media streaming box. unfortunately, the media box's optical jack only supports compressed stereo but can output multichannel audio via hdmi. so now my plan is to plug that into the tv via hdmi then connecting a hts to the tv.

i am really satisfy with the pq of this tv set out of the box but i always get weird stutter motion and shadow when i watch hd movies with high speed action. i thought the 240hz refresh rate was suppose to eliminate the shadowing. when a character is running, it is almost like he is bringing the background with him. do you know what i mean?

sorry about all these question but i really like this tv and i would hate to return it just because i can't figure these out.
sorry im not very good at explaining/ describing stuff. trouble with communicating for short.

thanks for all the help, really appreciate it. (part of the reason i went for this model is because of this really great thread and maverickrohan!!)
post #222 of 675
I just bought a 46PFL5505 last week and I am very satisfied with it.

Maverick,

One question though, I am getting black bars on the side when watching tv. I understand its a problem with scaling and I have tried different picture formats (Auto, super zoom, movie expand, 4:3, wide screen, unscaled) but I still can't get rid of the black bars completely. Anybody has similar issue?

Also, when using HDMI as a source, the available picture formats is fewer than using Component as a source (ie. only Auto, 4:3, wide screen, and unscaled available for choosing in HDMI). Why is that?
post #223 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by KimCheeZZ View Post

so is there any way to get native 5.1 surround sound directly from the tv?
since my last post i've already purchased the tv and also a media streaming box. unfortunately, the media box's optical jack only supports compressed stereo but can output multichannel audio via hdmi. so now my plan is to plug that into the tv via hdmi then connecting a hts to the tv.

i am really satisfy with the pq of this tv set out of the box but i always get weird stutter motion and shadow when i watch hd movies with high speed action. i thought the 240hz refresh rate was suppose to eliminate the shadowing. when a character is running, it is almost like he is bringing the background with him. do you know what i mean?

sorry about all these question but i really like this tv and i would hate to return it just because i can't figure these out.
sorry im not very good at explaining/ describing stuff. trouble with communicating for short.

thanks for all the help, really appreciate it. (part of the reason i went for this model is because of this really great thread and maverickrohan!!)

@Kim
The same way the optical output on your box cannot output 5.1 but your HDMI can, the TV also outputs only stereo on the Digital Coax SPIDIF output.

To be honest with you and everyone else here ... its not that the S/PDIF out cannot output 5.1, it can, but due to copyright & HDCP restrictions TV companies only output 2.0 PCM on S/PDIF.

The only solution is to buy the cheapest HDMI AVR and make an HTS to enjoy multi channel audio from all your sources.

About your fast motion blurring issue, please read this:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post19172165
post #224 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeChung View Post

I just bought a 46PFL5505 last week and I am very satisfied with it.

Maverick,

One question though, I am getting black bars on the side when watching tv. I understand its a problem with scaling and I have tried different picture formats (Auto, super zoom, movie expand, 4:3, wide screen, unscaled) but I still can't get rid of the black bars completely. Anybody has similar issue?

Also, when using HDMI as a source, the available picture formats is fewer than using Component as a source (ie. only Auto, 4:3, wide screen, and unscaled available for choosing in HDMI). Why is that?

What is your source?

If it is a cable/satellite box, you box should be set to output 16:9 and not 4:3. See if the resolution is a wide-screen res like 720p or 1080i/p ... the try the format button on the TV.

If you are watching letter-boxed 4:3 content in a 16:9 video signal, you will not be able to get rid of the black bars at HD resolutions.

And yes, you have less format options on 720p / 1080i/p ... just the way the TV was made.
post #225 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickrohan View Post

@Kim
The same way the optical output on your box cannot output 5.1 but your HDMI can, the TV also outputs only stereo on the Digital Coax SPIDIF output.

To be honest with you and everyone else here ... its not that the S/PDIF out cannot output 5.1, it can, but due to copyright & HDCP restrictions TV companies only output 2.0 PCM on S/PDIF.

The only solution is to buy the cheapest HDMI AVR and make an HTS to enjoy multi channel audio from all your sources.

About your fast motion blurring issue, please read this:

Thanks maverickrohan! Your explanation makes a lot of sense to me.

I just got a Sony CT-150 sound bar, and it comes with an receiver built in.

Everything else works fine, but when I connect the coax audio to the the sound bar, I only got sound from the sound bar itself (nothing from the sub woofer). Do you happen to have any idea why this is happening? I understand that you mentioned the coax output only supported stereo due to legal issues. But when I connect my ipod to the sound bar (which uses 3.5mm-RCA), the sub woofer works just fine. Considering they are both stereo sources, how come the sub only works in the other one?

Thanks a lot!
post #226 of 675
Can you tell me the model number of your Sony SB?

I probably know why but will tell you what it is after validating my reason. I can also probably help you get the Sub to work.
post #227 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickrohan View Post

Can you tell me the model number of your Sony SB?

I probably know why but will tell you what it is after validating my reason. I can also probably help you get the Sub to work.

Absolutely, the model of sub is: SA-WCT150. Thanks a lot!
post #228 of 675
I am assuming the actual soundbar you have is the HT-CT150

Well the reason why your sub-woofer is not working is simple:
The TV is sending 2.0 channel PCM audio
Since it is not sending the 0.1 LFE channel, your soundbar is just doing a direct I/O mapping to the speakers.

i.e. It is receiving L + R channels -> It is outputting L + R channels.
The sub-woofer is the LFE channel, which is not present in the input stream, hence you have no audio on the sub-woofer.

Now you might ask, when I connect my iPod to the 3.5mm stereo jack, why does the subwoofer work. Well, that is because it knows it is always going to get 2 channel on that jack.

So the circuit inside does a low pass filter on the input signal and sends the low frequencies to the subwoofer.

This is exactly how most AVRs work.

And it is exactly how my Onkyo TX SR-608 works on the SPDIF jack as well.

But then I use Dolby ProLogic II or dts NEO:6 to upcovert 2.0 channel PCM to 5.1 channel audio.

Your soundbar does have DPII, so it should have some way to do that conversion but when I skimmed through the Sony User Manual, I could not find a setting which does it directly.

You might want to tinker with the settings and the menu to see if there is some way to enable DPII or any other surround mode which enables your subwoofer.
post #229 of 675
Hey maverickrohan,
Any newer firmware updates besides the PHL-0BA_521_0 for the 5705 series.
Thanks.
post #230 of 675
There actually is ... we'll post it on the Philips website in a week's time.
post #231 of 675
I bought the 40PFL5505 at the start of September, and although it's great, I've noticed one problem. When watching cartoon shows like Family Guy or The Simpsons, there are distinct changes in the brightness of the screen at different points. What happens is that the scene in the show changes, the brightness stays normal for a moment, then clearly drops a bit. It then seems to gradually return to normal, and may drop again if the scene hasn't changed. I notice this problem several times during one episode, so it's pretty annoying.

A few points:
- All special picture settings (Active Control, Dynamic Contrast, etc. are OFF, except for Noise Reduction and MPEG Artifact Reduction).
- If I replay a scene where I noticed a drop in brightness, it will drop again in the same place. This suggests its not a random issue, and not related to inconsistent power or something like that.
- I don't think the problem occurs only on cartoon shows, it's just really noticeable.

Any ideas?
post #232 of 675
Hi,
I'm entertaining the possibility of buying this TV... mainly because of this thread

So I had a couple of questions:
  • What HDMI version that is? I mean, is it 1.4 with return sound?
  • Does it use 5:5 pulldown for 24p? 4:4 for 30p? 2:2 for 60p?
  • Is the remote backlit?
  • Can the local backlight dimming be disabled? I am not comfortable with this feature as it inevitably will dim bright spots that happen to be on dark backgrounds (similar to LED backlight, but worse since it's only 1d array of light tubes)

Thanks!!!
post #233 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by michael.baranov View Post

Hi,
I'm entertaining the possibility of buying this TV... mainly because of this thread

So I had a couple of questions:
  • What HDMI version that is? I mean, is it 1.4 with return sound?
  • Does it use 5:5 pulldown for 24p? 4:4 for 30p? 2:2 for 60p?
  • Is the remote backlit?
  • Can the local backlight dimming be disabled? I am not comfortable with this feature as it inevitably will dim bright spots that happen to be on dark backgrounds (similar to LED backlight, but worse since it's only 1d array of light tubes)

Thanks!!!

HDMI v1.3 (No ARC)
Yes for all with DNM = Off (Remember you need to feed the TV 24p, 30p & 60p)
Remote is not backlit
Yes - Enabling "PC Mode" disables 1D Dimming
post #234 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by k2theman View Post

I bought the 40PFL5505 at the start of September, and although it's great, I've noticed one problem. When watching cartoon shows like Family Guy or The Simpsons, there are distinct changes in the brightness of the screen at different points. What happens is that the scene in the show changes, the brightness stays normal for a moment, then clearly drops a bit. It then seems to gradually return to normal, and may drop again if the scene hasn't changed. I notice this problem several times during one episode, so it's pretty annoying.

A few points:
- All special picture settings (Active Control, Dynamic Contrast, etc. are OFF, except for Noise Reduction and MPEG Artifact Reduction).
- If I replay a scene where I noticed a drop in brightness, it will drop again in the same place. This suggests its not a random issue, and not related to inconsistent power or something like that.
- I don't think the problem occurs only on cartoon shows, it's just really noticeable.

Any ideas?

That happens when Luma thresholds change in the input video along the Y axis -> which leads to the CCFL back-light adjusting. I have noticed it at sometimes, usually turning off Active Control solves the issue. I have never noticed it with AC off, but I will investigate further and let you know.
post #235 of 675
@maverickrohan: Thanks for your reply! I really appreciate it! Maybe you also know the answers to the following:
  1. Is the screen glossy? Is the bezel glossy?
  2. You say that backlight dimming is disabled in "PC mode". I assume that disables *all* in-TV processing... Is there a way to disable just the dimming and leave, say, frame interpolation on?
  3. Does it pass 5.1 or 7.1 sound from HDMI source to digital audio out unchanged? Or does it always downmix to stereo? You mentioned something along those lines before...
  4. Does it allow per HDMI-in settings? Does it allow per HDMI device (by ID) settings? For ex. PS3 on HDMI1 has "PC mode" and bluray on HDMI2 has "all ON"? Will that work via external HDMI repeater and single HDMI cable (say via AVR)?

Thanks!
post #236 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickrohan View Post

There actually is ... we'll post it on the Philips website in a week's time.

Is the PHL-0BA_524_0.upg off of the Phillips site the newest update?
Thanks, again.
post #237 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghstbstr View Post

Is the PHL-0BA_524_0.upg off of the Phillips site the newest update?
Thanks, again.

Yes it is!
post #238 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by michael.baranov View Post

@maverickrohan: Thanks for your reply! I really appreciate it! Maybe you also know the answers to the following:
  1. Is the screen glossy? Is the bezel glossy?
  2. You say that backlight dimming is disabled in "PC mode". I assume that disables *all* in-TV processing... Is there a way to disable just the dimming and leave, say, frame interpolation on?
  3. Does it pass 5.1 or 7.1 sound from HDMI source to digital audio out unchanged? Or does it always downmix to stereo? You mentioned something along those lines before...
  4. Does it allow per HDMI-in settings? Does it allow per HDMI device (by ID) settings? For ex. PS3 on HDMI1 has "PC mode" and bluray on HDMI2 has "all ON"? Will that work via external HDMI repeater and single HDMI cable (say via AVR)?

Thanks!

Screen - Not Glossy; Bezel - Glossy
Unfortunately No, I don't think so.
It downmixes but if you are receiving 5.1 on ATSC, it will pass through 5.1 with the latest s/w update. I'm still trying to see if I can get a s/w upgrade for HDMI sources as well.
Yes - Each source can have diff. PQ settings.
post #239 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by k2theman View Post

I bought the 40PFL5505 at the start of September, and although it's great, I've noticed one problem. When watching cartoon shows like Family Guy or The Simpsons, there are distinct changes in the brightness of the screen at different points. What happens is that the scene in the show changes, the brightness stays normal for a moment, then clearly drops a bit. It then seems to gradually return to normal, and may drop again if the scene hasn't changed. I notice this problem several times during one episode, so it's pretty annoying.

A few points:
- All special picture settings (Active Control, Dynamic Contrast, etc. are OFF, except for Noise Reduction and MPEG Artifact Reduction).
- If I replay a scene where I noticed a drop in brightness, it will drop again in the same place. This suggests its not a random issue, and not related to inconsistent power or something like that.
- I don't think the problem occurs only on cartoon shows, it's just really noticeable.

Any ideas?

So, I did a firmware update (I hadn't updated it since I got the TV, so it went from 113 to 119). The issue seems to be gone. I noticed in the firmware release notes that the 114 update fixed "dynamic contrast issues"...I wonder if this was actually the issue, and not the brightness. Of course DC was actually set to off.... oh well, at least it works.
post #240 of 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickrohan View Post

@ Wazy

The 55PFL5505D panel has a Static CR of 7000:1 compared to the 40PFL5505Ds (what I have at home) 5000:1. So they both have different white point settings (i.e. the RGB cut offs & drives)

I'll give you what we have in our lab for the 55 in a while.

@panther
I really cannot answer that ... I'll leave it to the others ...

Maverickrohan - Can you post your lab settings for the 55PFL5505? I have now found myself turning off most of the tv's processing capabilities - Im finding the picture looks a little soft sometimes and by turning these features off it improves it somewhat. Id be interested to see what you have at least as a starting point as i do understand that room characteristics plat a big role in calibration settings.

Thanks wazy
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