PlayStation Plus - Page 16

FTFY. Sorry, couldn't help myself.

I'm not a fan boy by any means. Bought both on launch day. I'm just saying, do we really need to sign that agreement every time when the one you sign initially probably states that the firmware is subject to change?

Xbox has it's issues too, no doubt. But the interface looks like something I paid for rather than something put together by some Linux guys in their mom's basement(and yes I use Linux too).

Or let me just agree without scrolling through the junk (like Apple does with their ToS updates).

PS+ would definitely have me secured if this feature was part of it.

Technically.. it wasn't much of a choice. Either you choose to stay pre3.21 to use OtherOS and lose out access to PSN AND not be able to play newer games which required newer FW (i.e. GT5 and on) OR you accept losing the OtherOS feature to access PSN and newer games. It wasn't just accessing PSN, it very well was being able to play newer games. Not sure about newer BD movies though.

No fixing needed to my opinion, you can cast your own opinion if you like, just don't change mine.

And thats the key, This is all literally opinion based. Like I mentioned earlier, I don't like the 360's interface (which to me reeks of a "fast and the furious car" motif with all the contrasted out colors and ads) and prefer the ps3 interface ( which reeks of class like a black with some chrome accents luxury series Mercedes or BMW). I like the later, some like the former. A tuner kid from the valley might think that "understand" Mercedes looks like shite but I beg to differ. Different strokes. But neither are "wrong".

No accounting for taste.

To me, the 360's UI is like an overpriced entertainment magazine full of so many ads that I can never find what I'm actually looking for. It's pretty in the way that a billboard might be "pretty," and it's as easy to navigate as a Vegas casino.

In contrast, the PS3's UI is like a trade magazine you get for free when you join a retail merchant's organization. The table of contents is on the first page, and the only ads are all in the last few pages. Content is all up front. It might feel cheap and it may not be pretty, but it's clean and efficient, and I can always find what I'm looking for right away.

EDIT: Here's an idea for Sony: give PS+ users a new fancied up UI to beta test for the next gen. Make it fully customizable. Integrate installs, downloads, trophy syncs, cloud saves, and title/firmware updates so that they all happen invisibly in the background. How about it, Sony? That would definitely get me on board for a subscription.

"It might feel cheap and it may not be pretty, but it's clean and efficient, and I can always find what I'm looking for right away."

Yup, that sure sounds "fantastic" and "really great", to use your own words.

Future - That Mercedes you keep talking about is from the 1970's though. While it might look a little classy, it's downright bizarre to operate compared to anything even reasonably modern, full of usability issues, and with a complete lack of modern features.

Again, your opinion. That's it, your not stating fact, you don't like it, and that's a "you problem".

We get it. To you it feels old so it sucks (which means "quotes" must really suck being that the are over three hundred years old, should stop using those )

I'm sorry the whole world of avs is not agreeing with you. This must suck when living in non-opinion-land, just doesn't sting much in the "real world" ( damn you quotes!!!).

It's in no way bizzare for me to operate, simple in fact, not sure what our are doing, must be because you like to scroll vertically then horizontally with cartoon colors as opposed to horizontally then vertically with non cartoon colors ........ I know thats tough, must be killer for you. Sorry for that burden. I feel for you.

So DLJ, this whole argument boils down to how many prompted steps the UI takes to do something vs. what it does automatically ("clunky" and "smooth"). Laying aside an obvious dislike for the visual presentation (and the font selection? really?) this seems to be the real beef with the XMB. Bit of a nitpicking argument and subject to personal preference really. Some of the stuff you complain about is there for a reason or can be changed.

The UI asks you how you want to update because it has the option to update from portable memory. Having the option to update without being connected to the internet is worth a couple extra button presses, and I used it myself during a chunk of 2008.

XMB does allow you to reorganize content under each tab a few different ways, including grouping different items into a folder (entering folder names yourself can be time consuming but it pays off later). I can organize my stuff better than Sony can. (Edit- can't move the apps, only the content so I missed you there)

Not sure how Hulu's buffering problems are the UI's fault when Netflix always runs without a hitch. Maybe Hulu should fix their app.

Oh yea, to get back to cloud saves! Making it optional, as in you have to choose what and when you back up your stuff, is hardly "half implemented". Cloud backup storage for PS+ is fully implemented and optional, and it works on all save game types including copy protected saves. With the exception of having to press a button there is no downside here.

Ultimately, that is what makes or breaks a UI, no matter how pretty it is or isn't.

On the XMB, the menu navigation is straightforward and doesn't get in the way of where you need to go. No need to scroll through much unnecessary garbage. But you do have to press some extra buttons for updates and installs.

On the NXE, menu navigation always forces you to begin from a series of ads before you get to where you really want to go (and always squeezes a few more ads between each menu bar). But you don't have to press extra buttons for installs and updates.

Pick your poison.


Maybe it's just me, but I'll take a plain, simple, efficient interface over a pretty, complex, long-winded one any day. When it comes to UI design, "fancy" is not a priority.

To continue with the car metaphors, a good UI should be like a weekday car, not a weekend car.

Since the topic is about UI... I like both XMB and 360s version. Both are easy to use. Both have their pros and cons. Both are functional and work. Both can be clunky just as they can be smooth, depending on what you are doing.

With XMB, when I turn on the PS3 I have to select the account I want to use, scroll few times to games column and down to the game in drive option to play. This is easy.
With NXE/360, I turn on the 360 and can either hit the xbox button to select the game (kind of like when you hit the PS button) or simply press up once to get the game in drive option to play. This is also easy.
If you want to make adjustments to sound, network, data, etc, both are fairly easy to do.
Both systems have ads, and both handle them differently. I'd like it if PSN+ and LIVE GOLD gave you the option to disable the ads, but keep the ads if you're a normal PSN or LIVE Silver user.
My only gripe really is how PS3 does updates for system/games. On xbox, it does it automatically and I like that. I also like that my 360 updates system/games less frequently and faster, but the speed could be due to location.
It all comes down to preference really.

I would say that the XMB along with its prompts is more geared towards mature, educated consumers rather than the just-do-it-for-me! crowd. I might not want it to automatically run the software update if it's going to cause me to lose a feature I enjoy (...see, they're letting me keep the feature, but only if I don't press X).

I'm also using the PS3 to play games, BDs, and watch some Neflix. I don't need a visual orgasm from the MENU. I need it to work. I think it works so well that I can navigate it without looking. It's deceptively simple.

Are there some things I don't like about it? Yes. The one that perturbs me the most is a result of the latest update- I can no longer have my online friends' list sorted alphabetically. Don't know what happened, but I'll live.

As others have mentioned, there are quite a few tweaks you can implement by navigating the various settings under the Tools box. You can change the font, background color, turn off the ad-ticker, allow for automatic updating to occur when you're away from the machine, etc.

I turn on the PS3 to be entertained by the media to which it grants me access...not to be mesmerized by the futuristic-ness of the UI.

To each his own, just find it a tad bit silly to get all hot and bothered by a freakin' menu.

Speed seems to be related to PSN itself, not location. My download speeds and sync times dropped dramatically when I got my new Slim, but my network settings and home network environment are identical to my old 60gig. I hate doing title updates, looking at my trophies, comparing trophies with friends, or downloading demos on PSN for that reason alone. I wouldn't care in the slightest about having to push an extra button if I knew those things would happen as fast as they used to (or as fast as they are currently on my 360). I used to scoff at people who complained about how slow PSN was... until it started happening to me.

I'm hoping that the recently announced formation of "SNEA" (what an awful name!) will mean that Sony is now thinking much more seriously about their network services. If they're now going through the process of unifying all of their various products' online service, they're going to have to think seriously about improving speed and ease-of-use across the board. We'll see what happens...


Now that you mention it, that might be a nice thing to be greeted by each time I, uh, "turn on" my PS3.

It's strange because I use both xbox and ps3 for streaming netflix (xbox connected is hardline in office, ps3 via wifi) and don't have issues. Speeds seem pretty much comparable to one another. It's updates itself that takes a bit of time. I only look at it from file size point of view and I know that day 1 patches will get slammed but in general I've noticed MS's network is faster than Sony's, at least from my side. I have COD:BO for both systems and the last patch too longer on PSN than on LIVE. But I think generally both are fast enough. It's those system updates when they get slammed by everyone that takes forever.

Ugh. Here we go again.

I don't think you quite understand just how slow trophy syncs, downloads, and updates are for some of us. Online gaming is just fine. Netflix streaming is just fine. Speed tests are just fine (including Sony's own). Every other device in my house is just fine. This is all on Sony's end, and only relates to things stored on their servers (trophies, downloads, and updates). I've put far too much time and energy into looking for a solution. Put otherwise, just because you aren't experiencing these issues, that doesn't mean you can make "a blanket statement" either.

The other people who've had these problems know exactly what I'm talking about. This has been reported and discussed at length across the internet (and this forum) for years now. We're not all a bunch of incompetent idiots or crackpots.

If you have a solution, I'm all ears.

I feel you. I have the same issues. If I sync my trophies, I usually hit X, get up, go to the kitchen, grab a glass, some ice, pour a drink, and head back, if it's not done syncing by then, I'll take a quick squirt to pass the time. Other stuff like MP gaming, netflix, hulu ,etc are all fine. Oddly enough, it does seem like it's getting faster (albeit slowly) over time, when I replaced my OG 60gb (which before it's sale synced trophies super fast) the slim was uber slow, every sync or some seems to get a little faster. but still not fast enough.

I would also say that my PSN downloads are slower than a comparable download (in size) from my PC. My trophy syncing can also take a while...no longer than 2 minutes, but I find that to be significant just for showing me a list of my trophies while it adds the 5 I just got. Perhaps it's only a problem for those of us with a veritable treasure trove of trophies (say that 5 times really fast)...

Could be. I've got around 1400 trophies. And it could be that in transferring my account to my new PS3, something in how that syncing process works got messed with. Many games need to install trophy data (separate from the trophies themselves), so in transferring units, the trophies themselves transferred, but not the game data. And unless I go through the process of putting every single game in my unit that I've ever gotten trophies for, that won't ever get fixed.

Again, just a hypothesis, but it could be that now because I'm "missing" some game data (and there's no way to know which or how much), the syncing process takes longer because some random bit of game data isn't stored locally on my HDD. Now any time I do a trophy sync, it may have to get that specific game's trophy data remotely rather than locally. That's only one possibility, but based on how Sony does their (screwy) trophy system, it would make sense.

But that still wouldn't explain the slow updates and downloads. Though, admittedly, updates and downloads are only slightly slower than on my 360 (say, roughly 1.5-2 times as long). It's really the trophy syncs that are more notably sluggish.

Anyhow, it's really not a big deal. But it is an annoyance, and it keeps me from bothering with browsing my trophy collection or comparing trophy sets with others. Auto-syncing trophies as you get them (like MS does) and storing that data all on your harddrive would fix this, though. And I can't imagine that would be very hard to manage. Perfect feature to roll out as part of their PS+ service.

Well, imagine that. Sounds like you didn't read my posts before responding to them. I didn't say "everything feels screwy." I said trophy syncs were particularly bad, and that downloads and updates were slower than on my other console. I also said everything else on PSN was just fine (Netflix, online gaming, etc). So I'm not sure why you continue to insist this is a "personal problem" for me, especially since it now sounds like you're experiencing the exact same problem!

There's seriously too much hate going around in this thread for no good reason. I think we're all on the same page here.

As another data point: I have just over 900 trophies, and for me syncing usually takes about ten seconds. It's surprising to hear about people having such radically differing experiences.

Like confidenceman, said i'm not complaining about Multi-player, streaming speeds, speed tests via ps3, or even downloads so much as I am data syncing and community information sharing.

Updates can drag for me but syncing, checking other trophies opening messages can, at most times, be a chore.

I have been in 3.5 DSL, 5mbs and 10mbs cable, straight connected to the modem, straight connected to the router, over wifi, auto set-up, in DMZ, portforwarded, etc.... and not much has changed on that aspect.

FYI: I have a shade under 1,100 trophies for comparing inthe "lots-o-trophies" theory.

Have you tried using a different primary/secondary DNS? I switched away from Comcast's DNS a few months ago and I've noticed better PS3/PSN performance. The rep at Comcast recommended it after I complained about download speeds and such. I'm using Google's but I can't remember the numbers for them.

Again, you clearly didn't read my posts since I never said that. You continue to reply with blinders firmly rooted in place. But whatever. You're our resident Sony Apologist, so I should expect that from you by now.

I was using those briefly when AT&T was having some issues (there's a thread around here somewhere about the issue). Those issues were resolved on AT&T's end. No longer any need for Google's DNS, but it's easy enough to remember (8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4).

I suppose since folks seem to be jumping to wild conclusions, maybe I should be even more specific about the issues I'm having (and since I don't think we need to start a separate thread just yet).

Trophy syncs
After I boot up my PS3 and I do an initial trophy sync (or after I've been playing a game and unlock a new trophy), it takes 30-60secs for a full trophy sync where it used to take only 10secs or so. After that initial sync (and if I don't unlock any new trophies), it's almost instantaneous. And to be honest, even that original 10sec sync was too long for my taste.

Trophy comparisons
Even when everything was running well on my old 60gig, comparisons took a long time. I think this has to do with how Sony manages trophy info. Unlike 360, none of your friend info is stored locally, so comparisons take a while. These haven't gotten any worse since they were first introduced, but they haven't gotten any better. Depending on the person (and how many trophies they have), this usually takes around 30-60 secs.

Firmware updates
I have no point of comparison here. Sizes change. Servers get slammed when updates go live. The other consoles don't have identical updates. So this can only be judged based on "feeling." I'll leave it be.

Demo and game downloads
These used to be super speedy. Comparable to the speeds I get on my 360 for the same titles, if not faster. But speeds have dropped a bit. Not sure if this coincides with getting the new PS3, or if this is related to the issues I had with AT&T, or if this is something else altogether. But now, compared to like-for-like demos on 360, my PSN downloads take 1.5 to 2 times as long. Again, not a big deal, especially since unlike trophy syncs, these can be done in the background and only need to be done once.

Online play
No problem or issues whatsoever. Hell, I rarely even get drops.

Netflix streaming
Again, no problems whatsoever. I get high quality without hitches, hangs, or interruption.

Hope that's clear enough this time. Anyhow, the only "big" issue (they're all relatively minor, really) is the trophy syncs and comparisons. I don't mind the slower download speeds; it's only the obsessive need to fiddle and fuddle with connection speeds that nags me a bit.

Dude, really, don't turn into one of these other fools that pop up on the forum from time to time just to pick a fight. You're better than that. Now you're taking my words out of context, and you're doing so only to make the point that you're "right."

I never insisted any problem exists for everyone, and the quote you cited above was in reference to a totally separate discussion. And even in that quote, you can see that I'm singling out a few key issues. So, no, there's nothing "obvious" about what you're saying.

Anyhow, I'll go ahead and leave this thread since now I've gotten into stupid, pointless arguments with both you and darklordjames.

You all seem to be completely missing the point that in a competently designed system, Trophies would never even need to "sync" in the first place. It should all happen invisibly, in the background, with no user intervention or knowledge. Or do one of you now want to invent a reason as to why "Trophy syncing is for mature users!!1"?

You're a funny guy.