Nvidia GeForce GTX 460(GF104 GPU) supports full audio bitstreaming - Page 49

Thank you renethx..

Does this still allow dts hd ma and tru hd thru?

Yes because there are more listening modes than just "DTS" & "DD", but also "PCM", "Master Audio" & "DTS-HD"

I know threre are many model, those are just the two that are the best and can be a chore to accomplish with a Htpc, that's why I was asking. I assumed all the rest were a given.

In case anyone is interested the 270.61 whql drivers are out. I haven't tried them yet but will give them a go over the weekend.

They're working well for me. No more sync issues and it seems they default to 23 now instead of 24 in the profiles. With that I'm getting good sync during BD playback.

Quand you check in MPC-HC (with CTRL+J) when using 23Hz for a 23.976 movie if the refresh rate of the GC in the top left corner of the osd infos is really 23.976 (and not 23.971 as before) ?

No one to my knowledge has gotten 23.976 on an nVidia card. Nev with his custom profiles is able to get it to like 23.9741. Their default (23) is 23.971.

I've managed to get 23.977 or 23.976 (it variates) using custom res.

But with custom res I also lose 24Hz which is kind of annoying with french br rip who are in 24fps and not 23.976fps.

There is also the 0-255 / 16-235 issue apparently

How do you get 23.977/23.976? Also what is the 0-255/16-235 issue?

Since i never need plain 24fps (and if i would, i would just let ReClock "fix" it), i'm perfectly happy with my 23.976 config.

I also don't have any color issues, everything is going out in Full RGB (0-255), like its meant to be for best quality - unless you have some broken TV or Projector which only likes 16-235 for some weird reason. :d


Just create a custom resolution for 23 Hz, switch it to manual timings, and for the actual refresh rate put 23.978. For me that worked perfectly (getting 23.9763 roughly). Its dependant on your card, your A/V Receiver (if any) and your TV of course, so YMMV.

Note that creating custom resolutions in older drivers sometimes broke the normal resolutions, in that case just create more custom resolutions for those that you use. Me personally, i have a 23.976 entry, a 50Hz entry and a 59.940Hz entry. Given those 3, i have one match for basically every movie i ever encountered.

Thankyou, can I do all of that in the gpu settings? Or should I use a specific program?

You can do this in the default nvidia config panel, yea.

Sorry for disturbing you guys.

Does anyone knows if the nVidia 540 for Notebooks ,is bitstreaming audio out?
I see a lot of new laptops here with this card and in case of upgrading mine, it might be usefull to know.

Thanx to all..

Hi,

Can anyone confirm from their own use of the GTX 560 Ti card, that it does in fact bitstream HD audio? Please do not refer me to a review; I've already googled this a lot. Please tell me from your experience.

I have heard a lot of talk that it canbut that it lacks the proper drivers.

Does the DTS-HD light on your receiver light up?

If you can tell me from experience that both the hardware and software work, I would be very grateful,

thx

I have an Evga FPB 560ti in my htpc. My video cards went like this, 5450>5670>460>560. I have bitstreamed with all of them. I used to use the mpc-hc/ffd show combo. I now use sharks and wmc because I got tired of using an external player.

Like comes on and all that. I am using a beat drive 17x.xx cant remember exactly but it is the driver before the current legit one. I had to use it to get 3d blu ray with TMT. But bitstreaming has always worked.

Ok. I intend to stream to an Onkyo TX-NR 807.

Can I ask two other questions:

1. How do you find the mini-HDMI on that card? This woudl be my first mini-HDMI and, honestly, it looks pretty rickety?

2. Is it a huge tangle with the card's software to do the bitstreaming? From what I have read, it looks tough. I am not a really big techie.

Thank you.

1. Most cards come with a mini hdmi to hdmi adapter although one of my 460's did not. Ints not rickety its fine. Just a smaller version.

2. I do nothing with the cards software to set up bitstreaming. This is done with your media player and or codecs/filters of your choice.

If the video is encoded in 16-235, why is converting to 0-255 before output better?

Video is encoded in YCbCr. Converting YCbCr to RGB results in floating point numbers. Converting RGB floating point numbers to RGB cardinal numbers means that you have to round/dither. The more steps you have for that, the better. So using 0-255 gives you more steps to spread the floating point RGB data to than 16-235. The difference should be minor, though, I think. Besides, Y has the biggest effect on the resulting RGB pixels and Y maps directly to 16-235, too, which is an argument for using RGB 16-235. So I'm not really sure whether to recommend 16-235 or 0-255, based on the above alone.

If you output YCbCr as YCbCr, the situation is a bit different, of course, because your data stays cardinal. There keeping 16-235 is the best solution. But then, outputting YCbCr can be problematic on its own. E.g. if you upscale SD content and output it as YCbCr, the display will think it's native HD content and apply the wrong YCbCr -> RGB conversion matrix (BT.709 instead of BT.601), producing incorrect colors. Furthermore, even if you switch the GPU to YCbCr output mode, it's hard to say if the data will really stay YCbCr all the time. It's quite possible that the data is converted to RGB somewhere on the way and later back to YCbCr, which could result in banding artifacts being introduced once again.

There's one more key aspect to this: You know, computer desktop applications always use 0 as black and 255 as white. Also digital photos are usually stored with 0-255. So if you display a photo in a photo viewer application and the GPU is in 16-235 mode, the GPU will scale the 0-255 photo to 16-235 behind the photo viewer's back, probably without dithering, which will introduce banding artifacts. The same problem applies to games and to my video renderer madVR, too. So if you want to use the same PC for desktop applications/games *and* video playback, then using RGB 0-255 is the best solution because it will bring everything to the same definition of black and white without the GPU having to do violence to the data behind anyone's back.

Im going to try this, are there any other settings you've adjusted. Also after adjustment what is a good program to display your refresh rate and tell you the fps of the movie and see if there matching up and what your display is at if that's possible.

Thanks, make sense.

Setting up your HTPC/display like that might cause issues if the input is shared w/ another device (although you could work around that w/ a splitter if there are enough inputs on the display) or if you use applications that don't provide a way to tell them to use 0-255 over HDMI.

True.


You seem to have the impression that applications react to the GPU 0-255 vs 16-235 setting somehow. That you have to (or even *can*) tell them what to output over HDMI. That's not how it works. Every normal PC software application thinks and renders in 0-255, without knowing where the application windows will be displayed (HDMI, DVI, VGA, terminal server remote session, whatever). In the PC software application world, black is always 0, no exceptions. If the user switches the GPU to 16-235 that's not something any application knows. There's not even a system API available to ask this information. If the user switches the GPU to 16-235 output, the GPU/driver takes the whole Windows desktop and stretches the data from 0-255 to 16-235 behind the back of all applications - even behind the back of Windows itself. Windows itself doesn't whether the GPU is in 16-235 mode or not! Windows itself (desktop, explorer, etc) always draws black as 0.

There's one small exception to what I wrote above: Some media players using system video renderers (overlay, vmr, evr) are aware of that they can't rely on whether the GPU outputs 16-235 or 0-255. And they can ask the GPU/driver to prefer one output mode over the other. Whether the GPU/driver follows their request is another story, though, and the media player doesn't really know that, either.

Or let me write it in other words: If you switch the GPU/driver to 0-255 RGB output, all normal (non-media-player) PC applications will look 100% correct, untouched and without banding artifacts, if your display supports 0-255 input correctly. If you switch the GPU/driver to 16-235 RGB output, all normal (non-media-player) PC applications and even the Windows desktop itself will have their original rendering output stretched from 0-255 to 16-235 behind their back. If the GPU does the stretch in high bitdepth and outputs it that way (only possible with DeepColor compatible GPUs and displays) banding might be mostly avoided. Otherwise there will be banding artifacts. 16-235 RGB output is in most cases a bad option for all non-media-player applications.

This is not possible as of now though, right?

Can anyone explain why the faster/newer nVidia cards do NOT bitstream?

I find that rather frustrating. I have the money to buy a better card, but I really want the bitstreaming. I want a PC on which I can game and watch BDs.

I thought about the Radeon cards, but even the HD 6970, with 2 GB!, doesn't seem to match well the GTX 560 ti when it comes to gaming (specific civilization 5). At least so I have seen in some reviews.

Thoughts and comments would be very appreciated.

Thank you.

The 560 is better than the 470 wich is still better than the 6000 series on that review. Plus it has lower power consumption too.

It is technically possible (if you have a GPU with HDMI 1.3+ output and a display which fully supports DeepColor), but I kinda doubt AMD/NVidia are doing that.

Yeah, that's what I was wondering. AMD and Nvidia have been outputting 10 and 12-bit for a while as you probably know, but I haven't seen anything that takes advantage of it. Banding still looks like 8-bit banding with both.

The GF100 (480/470/465) came out first, and they didn't offer bitstreaming (even though ATI 5000 already did). The first Nvidia cards to offer HD bitstreaming were the GF104 (460) and the ones that came after. The 500 series were "refined" GF10x, so apparently they couldn't add bitstreaming to the 500 series based on the GF100 (the GF110 cards). The GF114 cards (560) and below, still offer bitstreaming.

I think the 10/12 bit output is for the internal VGA LUT, but I'm not sure.