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The "Official" TX-NR708 Owners Thread - Page 10

post #271 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by boulosmg View Post

Hi,

Just got a new the NR-708 today and was super excited. First time getting a stand alone receiver, previously owned a HTIB..nothing fancy.

In any event, tried setting everything up as best i could but overall i am not as blown away with regards to some of the video and i was wondering if i was doing something wrong.

Here is my set up: TV is Samsung 3D Plasma 8000, I use FIOS DVR box and have both a PS3 and Samsung 3D player. So far i have connected both the Fios and PS3 to the receiver, not the 3D bluray (for particular reasons). Everything hooked up using HDMI cables.


so here are my questions:

When i change channels on cable it take a few seconds before the picture is displayed on the TV...something like 3-5 seconds. Previously with Fios hooked directly to TV this was seamless. Is this normal?

Upconversion: I big reason for me to buy this receiver was that i hated how SD TV looked in comparison to HD channels. I had hoped that this receiver would help, but honestly it is not that much different. I tried to read the manual to check to make sure that i was doing everything right: Went to Resolution settings and changed to 1080p and then also confirmed that receiver is upconverting by hitting Display on remote and it does say that output is 1080p from 480p. is there something else i should be doing?

Plugged in ethernet wire to back of receiver and was able to get internet radio. Is their anyway to get wireless network capabilities? Do i need a Lan wireless stick or something like that?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Unfortunately, up-conversion is a garbage-in, garbage-out scenario, any way you slice it. Taking an interlaced NTSC signal and up-converting it to any HD resolution looks horrible. The Faroudja DCDi scaler in all the mid-range Onkyo AVRs is a strictly "average". When DCDi came out, it used some new technology, but as anything with technology goes, it gets out of date quickly. There's a cool page that talks about the advantages of DCDi here:

http://www.av-outlet.com/en-us/dept_335.html

Having said that, and depending upon how old your TV is, the scaler in your television probably does a pretty decent job as well. Fortunately, you can pretty easily bypass the video processing altogether. You will lose all on-screen overlays if you do this, but you won't get any delay, and you might actually see a picture improvement. Page 22 of the manual tells you how to disable all video processing:

Quote:


To by-pass video upconversion in the AV receiver, simultaneously press the VCR/DVR and RETURN on the AV
receiver. While continuing to hold down the VCR/DVR, press RETURN to toggle until “Skip” appears on the
display. Release both buttons.

I found this procedure to be a bit tricky. I'm not sure why, but it would only work if I put the receiver in VCR/DVR mode first. I think the key is that the receiver's video processor shouldn't be in use when you try to disable it. I also ran in to an issue where my TV wouldn't sync over HDMI with it disabled. I resolved both pretty simply using these steps:
  • Set receiver to VCR/DVD mode
  • Simultaneously press the VCR/DVR and RETURN on the AV (NOT THE REMOTE)
  • Tap return until it says skip
  • Switch back to CBL/SAT (where my Comcast DVR is connected)
  • Unplug and re-plug my TV's HDMI cable
  • Change the volume to verify that the overlay is gone

Hope that helps!
post #272 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxman48 View Post

FYI, here's what I did:

1) Per bradleyland's recommendation I made NO change to the router's config. In fact the DHCP range was not listed in the router config screen but rather in the Netgear's setup guide for the router.

2) On the 708 I disabled Network Control (default is "disable" but I had set it to "enable" as a workaround previously)

3) On the 708 when I disabled DHCP, I did not need to make any changes to the IP info. I left Onkyo's suggested IP address of 192.168.0.100 alone and the Gateway and DNS addresses matched my router's (192.168.0.1).

4) Saved and exited.

I'll let you know tonight if it still works.

Well, I tried it that way and still nothing. The "Now Initializing" message does not go away at all.

I'm so ready to drop this thing and try the Pioneer 1120.
post #273 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post


Page 43 in the manual covers this portion of the setup.

* Setup
* 1. Input/Output Assign
* 1. Monitor Out
* Resolution

You can set it to whatever your TV supports. I wouldn't recommend 1080i though. Set it to the native resolution of your television (either 720p or 1080p). Sending an interlaced signal will just result in your receiver scaling to an interlaced resolution, then your TV de-interlacing. That's double processing, and will degrade your picture quality significantly when compared to the native resolution.

Depending upon your television, you might be better off letting the television handle upconversion altogether. What's the make model of your TV?

I recommend downloading the PDF manual from the Onkyo website. It makes it very simple to search for solutions by keyword, rather than trying to scan the manual by hand.

Thanks for the info. So if I do this it affects all sources then right? I can't have say my pc source up convert and then have dvr in through mode?

To answer your question I have a 768p pioneer plasma tv.
post #274 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bfocussvt View Post

Well, I tried it that way and still nothing. The "Now Initializing" message does not go away at all.

I'm so ready to drop this thing and try the Pioneer 1120.

Hi Barry. I know I sound like a broken record, but networking can break at many levels. The "Now Initializing" message is terribly vague, and can mean a lot of things. There are two places that I think these networking failures could be occurring at, but I need some details to tell you for sure.

What I'm trying to figure out is whether or not the Onkyo has a valid IP address when the network failure occurs. In order to determine this, we need two pieces of information:

* Your network details when the receiver is working
* Your network details when the receiver is not working

If your receiver is still not working, that's actually a good thing, because we'll be able to see the details from item #2 above. Can you run through these steps:
  • Setup
  • 7. Hardware Setup
  • 5. Network
  • Now write down the values for IP Address, Subnet Mask, Gateway, and DNS
  • Press setup again and "Cancel" when given the opportunity to save

Post the details here.
post #275 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

Hi Barry. I know I sound like a broken record, but networking can break at many levels. The "Now Initializing" message is terribly vague, and can mean a lot of things. There are two places that I think these networking failures could be occurring at, but I need some details to tell you for sure.

What I'm trying to figure out is whether or not the Onkyo has a valid IP address when the network failure occurs. In order to determine this, we need two pieces of information:

* Your network details when the receiver is working
* Your network details when the receiver is not working

If your receiver is still not working, that's actually a good thing, because we'll be able to see the details from item #2 above. Can you run through these steps:
  • Setup
  • 7. Hardware Setup
  • 5. Network
  • Now write down the values for IP Address, Subnet Mask, Gateway, and DNS
  • Press setup again and "Cancel" when given the opportunity to save

Post the details here.

I used the generic figures in Network: DHCP Disabled, IP Address 192.168.0.100, Subnet Mask 255.255.255.0, Gateway and DNS is 192.168.0.1. If i disconnect the ethernet cord for 10 seconds it connects as it should, until I power down.

I can check the setting in my router and whenever the Onkyo is restarted and does the infinite "Now Initializing" loop, the router does not show the AVR as connected. It does still show the IP address as reserved, but not connected.
post #276 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bfocussvt View Post

I used the generic figures in Network: DHCP Disabled, IP Address 192.168.0.100, Subnet Mask 255.255.255.0, Gateway and DNS is 192.168.0.1. If i disconnect the ethernet cord for 10 seconds it connects as it should, until I power down.

I can check the setting in my router and whenever the Onkyo is restarted and does the infinite "Now Initializing" loop, the router does not show the AVR as connected. It does still show the IP address as reserved, but not connected.

Ok, so you've statically assigned the 192.168.0.100 IP to your AVR. Are you certain that this address isn't in your router's DHCP range?

Your switch maps IP addresses to physical ports based on the MAC address. Networking is a whole pile of references, to references, to references... and so on. So here's what could be happening:

* Two devices on your network have the IP address 192.168.0.100
* When you plug your AVR in to the network, the switch maps 192.168.0.100 to the physical port where your AVR is located
* This works while you're using your AVR
* Later, you move on and power-up the other device that is using 192.168.0.100
* Your switch re-maps 192.168.0.100 to point to that physical port
* When you go back to use your Onkyo, the network link was never dropped, so there's no link-layer re-negotiation, thus traffic goes out, but never comes back

This is just speculation, but it's important to make sure that the static IP you've given your AVR isn't in the DHCP range.
post #277 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by TripleFun View Post

Also on programming my Logitech Harmony remote I used the NR808 in preference to the SR708 [sic]. There are a number of codes missing which I had to manually capture. I also had to reprogam several entries. You can set up 'iRadio' and preselect channels.

I've had my Onkyo SR-708 for almost a week today and am very pleased with it.

I have a question about programming an activity for my harmony. I was wondering if anyone has successfully programmed an activity on the harmony for a specific Internet streaming radio channel?

I'd like to setup a few of these for my wife can only get as far as toggling over to NET/USB. Once there if it was previously playing pandora, I'd have to Return + Return to get to the main menu and then go to a selection.

Suggestions?
post #278 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

Ok, so you've statically assigned the 192.168.0.100 IP to your AVR. Are you certain that this address isn't in your router's DHCP range?

Your switch maps IP addresses to physical ports based on the MAC address. Networking is a whole pile of references, to references, to references... and so on. So here's what could be happening:

* Two devices on your network have the IP address 192.168.0.100
* When you plug your AVR in to the network, the switch maps 192.168.0.100 to the physical port where your AVR is located
* This works while you're using your AVR
* Later, you move on and power-up the other device that is using 192.168.0.100
* Your switch re-maps 192.168.0.100 to point to that physical port
* When you go back to use your Onkyo, the network link was never dropped, so there's no link-layer re-negotiation, thus traffic goes out, but never comes back

This is just speculation, but it's important to make sure that the static IP you've given your AVR isn't in the DHCP range.

I thought about it and I think .100 is in my DHCP range, but I kept that as it seems to be the standard setting.

That may be something that's going on as I believe my router normally sets my computer at 192.168.0.100.
post #279 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bfocussvt View Post

I thought about it and I think .100 is in my DHCP range, but I kept that as it seems to be the standard setting.

That may be something that's going on as I believe my router normally sets my computer at 192.168.0.100.

Yeah, when it comes to IP addresses, there isn't really a standard. There's common, but not standard

Try setting your receiver's static IP to 192.168.0.200. Most consumer routers only distribute 50-99 IP addresses, and they usually do so contiguously, so it would be very unlikely that anything in the 200 range is used. All the other settings can remain the same.
post #280 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

So far so good, but what happens when his DHCP server tries to issue 192.168.0.11 to another device on his network? Then he has two devices that won't work. If you're going to use static IP addresses, you need to use an address that is not in the range that your DHCP server will issue.

Shouldn't he be able to assign an static IP address that is high enough to where the DHCP doesn't assign that same number to another piece of hardware? I thought DHCP assigns IP #'s in an ascending fashion. Always starting at the bottom of the call stack and working upward. As long as you assign a number that is (much) HIGHer than the others already assigned, it should be okay. For example, if you have 3 pieces of hardware already attached, try a number +10 higher than the highest number being (currently) assigned by DHCP. Just look at your router to determine the range already being assigned. I think the IP #'s you see would be assigned on a constant basis, jumping the number up a little for the receiver should be fine, until you start adding more equipment that use DHCP. Hope that makes sense. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
post #281 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by litew8 View Post

Shouldn't he be able to assign an static IP address that is high enough to where the DHCP doesn't assign that same number to another piece of hardware? I thought DHCP assigns IP #'s in an ascending fashion. Always starting at the bottom of the call stack and working upward. As long as you assign a number that is (much) HIGHer than the others already assigned, it should be okay. For example, if you have 3 pieces of hardware already attached, try a number +10 higher than the highest number being (currently) assigned by DHCP. Just look at your router to determine the range already being assigned. I think the IP #'s you see would be assigned on a constant basis, jumping the number up a little for the receiver should be fine, until you start adding more equipment that use DHCP. Hope that makes sense. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Usually, yes. The call stack is a low-level programming concept though. It's relevance to the allocation of IPs would require knowledge of how IP addresses are stored and loaded in to memory. It's a fair guess that they'd be loaded in to an array, so yeah, they'd end up on the stack at some point, but there are no implicit guarantees that they'd end up on the stack in order. That's up to the implementation. But I digress

The allocation of IPs is most frequently contiguous, but I've seen consumer routers that distribute IPs in a seemingly random order. Some start at the top and go down. The only truly safe way to do it is to identify the DHCP IP range and go outside it. That's splitting hairs though. If the lowest IP on your network is 100, picking something in the 200 range is going to be safe in 99% of the cases.
post #282 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

Usually, yes. The call stack is a low-level programming concept though. It's relevance to the allocation of IPs would require knowledge of how IP addresses are stored and loaded in to memory. It's a fair guess that they'd be loaded in to an array, so yeah, they'd end up on the stack at some point, but there are no implicit guarantees that they'd end up on the stack in order. That's up to the implementation. But I digress

The allocation of IPs is most frequently contiguous, but I've seen consumer routers that distribute IPs in a seemingly random order. Some start at the top and go down. The only truly safe way to do it is to identify the DHCP IP range and go outside it. That's splitting hairs though. If the lowest IP on your network is 100, picking something in the 200 range is going to be safe in 99% of the cases.

I see. Sounds logical.
post #283 of 1620
When the receiver gets stuck on the initialzation screen , the receiver is connected to the network fine. I know this because as its stuck on the initialzation screen, I can go to a computer on the network and type the IP address of the receiver in my web browser and get the onkyo screen to show. I don't know where the problem lies but the receiver has no problem getting an IP address and holding it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

Hi Barry. I know I sound like a broken record, but networking can break at many levels. The "Now Initializing" message is terribly vague, and can mean a lot of things. There are two places that I think these networking failures could be occurring at, but I need some details to tell you for sure.

What I'm trying to figure out is whether or not the Onkyo has a valid IP address when the network failure occurs. In order to determine this, we need two pieces of information:

* Your network details when the receiver is working
* Your network details when the receiver is not working

If your receiver is still not working, that's actually a good thing, because we'll be able to see the details from item #2 above. Can you run through these steps:
  • Setup
  • 7. Hardware Setup
  • 5. Network
  • Now write down the values for IP Address, Subnet Mask, Gateway, and DNS
  • Press setup again and "Cancel" when given the opportunity to save

Post the details here.
post #284 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by ilkevinli View Post

When the receiver gets stuck on the initialzation screen , the receiver is connected to the network fine. I know this because as its stuck on the initialzation screen, I can go to a computer on the network and type the IP address of the receiver in my web browser and get the onkyo screen to show. I don't know where the problem lies but the receiver has no problem getting an IP address and holding it.

Cool. That's good to know.

However, it's a single point of data. Not trivializing your feedback, but I suspect that some are experiencing a problem with the receiver, and some are experiencing problems that are related to their network.
post #285 of 1620
I don't see how if those of us that have the problem have the EXACT same problem.




Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

Not trivializing your feedback, but I suspect that some are experiencing a problem with the receiver, and some are experiencing problems that are related to their network.
post #286 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by ilkevinli View Post

I don't see how if those of us that have the problem have the EXACT same problem.

I want to say up front that I'm not claiming that there is no problem. What I'm saying is that "Now initializing..." is a terribly vague error message.

Networking is complex and can fail at many different points. "Exact" as described by "I see the Now initializing..." message on my AVR doesn't mean I can't provide some help. I saw that same message, and the problem turned out to be that my wireless bridge wasn't passing data.

Being able to reach the AVR on the network doesn't prove there isn't a DNS or network routing issue either. Again, I'm not trying to call you out on being wrong. I'm just trying to offer help. I have a lot of background with networking, and I'm willing to share advice for those who are interested. That's all
post #287 of 1620
If I am able to pull up the receivers "config" page through the network it shows that the receiver has the correct IP range and is networked properly and it is still causing the initializing hang. Thats all I'm stating.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

I want to say up front that I'm not claiming that there is no problem. What I'm saying is that "Now initializing..." is a terribly vague error message.

Networking is complex and can fail at many different points. "Exact" as described by "I see the Now initializing..." message on my AVR doesn't mean I can't provide some help. I saw that same message, and the problem turned out to be that my wireless bridge wasn't passing data.

Being able to reach the AVR on the network doesn't prove there isn't a DNS or network routing issue either. Again, I'm not trying to call you out on being wrong. I'm just trying to offer help. I have a lot of background with networking, and I'm willing to share advice for those who are interested. That's all
post #288 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by ilkevinli View Post

If I am able to pull up the receivers "config" page through the network it shows that the receiver has the correct IP range and is networked properly and it is still causing the initializing hang. Thats all I'm stating.

That's what I was concluding (in my case), it being software based.
I've updated my firmware and am just waiting to see if there is an improvement.
My "Initializing" issue wasn't that the message would hang on screen, rather it wouldn't connect.
On the receiver it would say "cannot play" or "no server".
Once it acted like it didn't connect but actually did when I navigated to the menu and reselected.
Once it wouldn't connect at all.

I was thinking it has something to do with Onkyo servers not acknowledging me attempting to connect via Net. There's a diagram out there somewhere that depicts the topography of Onkyo / vTuner / Pandora ect... servers. If I remember correctly - the receiver connects to Onkyo servers first, then to whichever one you've chosen.

These were all observed after powering the unit on.

Out of box setup
I use DHCP, not a static IP - Network Control disabled.
post #289 of 1620
Yes thats what I meant when I said hang.

Quote:
Originally Posted by litew8 View Post

My "Initializing" issue wasn't that the message would hang on screen, rather it wouldn't connect.
post #290 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

Yeah, when it comes to IP addresses, there isn't really a standard. There's common, but not standard

Try setting your receiver's static IP to 192.168.0.200. Most consumer routers only distribute 50-99 IP addresses, and they usually do so contiguously, so it would be very unlikely that anything in the 200 range is used. All the other settings can remain the same.

After setting it to an IP outside of my DHCP range .150 and disabling Network Control it still doesn't work properly.

Also like ilkevinli, I am able to connect to the receiver via my PC even while the receiver is stuck on the "Now Initializing" screen.
post #291 of 1620
A

Day 2 of using the NR708. Feeling a little better. Changed video output to through instead of 1080p and much happier. Also read a lot on this forum and the 808, and learned that allowing audio out to tv directly is not worth it. Everything is then PCM. Okay so last question, I assume the answer is no, but with all the networking questions and posts, can this be done wireless. Sorry if this sounds silly, but I thought I saw a pioneer that could. Do I need a wireless LAN adaptor like the samsung plasma has? Thanks for any help. I just got this. No network issues. First standalone receiver.
post #292 of 1620
In theory a network bridge should work fine. I say theory because I haven't tried it myself by that is what the device is made for.



Quote:
Originally Posted by boulosmg View Post

A

Day 2 of using the NR708. Feeling a little better. Changed video output to through instead of 1080p and much happier. Also read a lot on this forum and the 808, and learned that allowing audio out to tv directly is not worth it. Everything is then PCM. Okay so last question, I assume the answer is no, but with all the networking questions and posts, can this be done wireless. Sorry if this sounds silly, but I thought I saw a pioneer that could. Do I need a wireless LAN adaptor like the samsung plasma has? Thanks for any help. I just got this. No network issues. First standalone receiver.
post #293 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffsandquist View Post

I've had my Onkyo SR-708 for almost a week today and am very pleased with it.

I have a question about programming an activity for my harmony. I was wondering if anyone has successfully programmed an activity on the harmony for a specific Internet streaming radio channel?

I'd like to setup a few of these for my wife can only get as far as toggling over to NET/USB. Once there if it was previously playing pandora, I'd have to Return + Return to get to the main menu and then go to a selection.

Suggestions?

There's a discrete code for internet radio called (InputInternetRadio) in the Harmony software that you can use to program it. Just setup that activity and have your Harmony hit the Guide/Top Menu (Top Menu (Net Tune)) button to get to the list of internet radio services.
post #294 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by boulosmg View Post

A

Day 2 of using the NR708. Feeling a little better. Changed video output to through instead of 1080p and much happier. Also read a lot on this forum and the 808, and learned that allowing audio out to tv directly is not worth it. Everything is then PCM. Okay so last question, I assume the answer is no, but with all the networking questions and posts, can this be done wireless. Sorry if this sounds silly, but I thought I saw a pioneer that could. Do I need a wireless LAN adaptor like the samsung plasma has? Thanks for any help. I just got this. No network issues. First standalone receiver.

Pioneer and Samsung offer wireless adapters that plug directly in to the AVR/TV. This adds a wireless network card directly to the device itself, which adds menu items for connecting to the wireless network.

Onkyo doesn't offer a wireless option that I'm aware of, so the solution is to use something called a wireless bridge. A wireless bridge connects to a wireless network and provides a wired ethernet interface that you can plug your TX-NR708 in to. The trouble with wireless bridges is that most manufacturers (Linksys, Belkin, Netgear, etc) only make equipment that works with their own kind. Linksys to Linksys. Netgear to Netgear, etc. That's not true in all cases, but your safest bet is to stick with one manufacturer. IMO, the most reliable and easiest to set up wireless equipment is sold by Apple. Their AirPort Extreme and AirPort Express are trivially easy to set up in any mode, and they work together 100% of the time. I've replaced countless wireless networks with Apple gear and never had to go back out to re-configure. I can't say the same for Linksys, Netgear, or Belkin.

If you're a DIY'er type, you can also buy a specific Linksys router that will accept third-party firmware. I run a Linksys WRT54GL and Tomato firmware. Tomato lets you connect to any wireless network, regardless of manufacturer. My primary wireless network is an Apple Airport Extreme and Airport Express, but the Express isn't close enough to my receiver to act as a bridge, and I had the WRT54GL lying around. It's been pretty reliable, but the Linksys requires an occasional reboot.
post #295 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by litew8 View Post

How will CLEARING ALL SETTINGS help a piece of hardware perform its PRIMARY job?? And if erasing your settings doesn't help, pay to have it repaired? These are brand new units and shouldn't be so faulty.

This is exact the Onkyo answer why i returned two 708 units and got a full refund.
Clearing the memory has nothing to do with not connecting, thats a hardware problem i think.
Guess some units are ok, others are not and have problems.
This is the "Onkyo way" to get units out in this price range with a truckload of options, high powered and nice to work with.
But thats for a 100% working unit !
For other units its returning it or hope for a firmware fix.............

Think its all in quality versus price.
Onkyo is putting out a lot of unints per month and hope when they are on the market all mistakes can be fixed by FW updates, if not the (hardware) mistakes will get fixed in the next serie of that model number.

Its someting like:
Spent no time on checking units when they leave the factory, put them fast together and see what happens when the customers start to use them.
This must be the basic problem of Onkyo today, they can not affort to test units the full 100% as they allways have the FW update options.
In the past a unit had to leave the factory in 100% working condition or units would be repaired under waranty, and that is costing a lot if this would happen.
Now a "cheap" FW update fix and all is well ()

I use now a 5 year old Marantz SR-7500 and its working great.
Have a 12 year old JVC surround and its working great.
Had a Onkyo 876 and it was working great.
(no network or usb update possible on these 3 units by the customer)

Had a 3007 and it had various problems (first 6 month 2x at Onkyo repair and still not 100%).
Now two 708 with (network) problems.

I do hope this will not be a trend for the audio world, if so we as customers will be in trouble.......

I do want a new Onkyo as i do miss the nice setup, the GUI, and all the other (audio and video) stuff.
So i will wait until this Network problem realy gets fixed.
Maybe i should buy a Integra instade of a Onkyo.
The + $300 Integra's compared to the same model Onkyo must be better checked then the cheaper Onkyo range, i read no (major) problems in the Integra forums.
post #296 of 1620
I doubt it's a hardware problem. The more information that comes out, the more it seems software. There are a few guys here who can reach their receiver on the LAN, but the receiver is unable to connect to any streaming source. This means the hardware is working. Everything above that is software and cam be fixed.
post #297 of 1620
I'm hoping to find some time this weekend to do some lab work with the Onkyo. I want to isolate the Onkyo on my network and so some Wireshark captures. Using that information, I should be able to map out exactly what communication is occurring and when. I can't stress enough that I don't think this is hardware related. The hardware only handles the physical and link-layer communications. Once we move past that, it's all software, and no one (so far) is reporting a completely unreachable receiver when they experience the problem. If you can ping the receiver while the problem is occurring, it is very, very unlikely that it's a hardware issue.

Once we get in to software, there are a ton of factors that can affect the issue. The question is, where is it breaking down. If you can connect to the receiver's internal web server and load the information page, then the NIC is working and LAN communication works, which pushes the problem up even higher in to the software stack. If the receiver can talk over the LAN, it's really odd that it can't reach Onkyo's servers. The question is, what type of communication is it trying to pass? Depending upon whether it's something standard like HTTP, or if it's something low level like a proprietary IP communication, it may be easier to debug.

I don't know how to get you guys to trust me on this, but I want you to know that I do this for a living. I do work for Fortune 1000 companies specializing in diagnosing and resolving voice & data issues. I've rolled out networks that deliver bundled VoIP and data networks over carrier ethernet solutions spanning the entire US. I've connected VoIP to 35 year old PBX equipment using IP gateways and diagnosed issues that the PBX vendors themselves couldn't figure out. I've developed my instincts over years of doing this in the field. When I approach these problems, I look for the root cause first, then start pointing the finger. Not the other way around.
post #298 of 1620
I figured you were some sort of network genius bradleyland I'm in IT/MIS too for a very large company that has a large global footprint, troubleshooting daily. So far, after the firmware revision install, I have not had any connecting issues.
post #299 of 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradleyland View Post

I don't know how to get you guys to trust me on this, but I want you to know that I do this for a living. I do work for Fortune 1000 companies specializing in diagnosing and resolving voice & data issues. I've rolled out networks that deliver bundled VoIP and data networks over carrier ethernet solutions spanning the entire US. I've connected VoIP to 35 year old PBX equipment using IP gateways and diagnosed issues that the PBX vendors themselves couldn't figure out. I've developed my instincts over years of doing this in the field. When I approach these problems, I look for the root cause first, then start pointing the finger. Not the other way around.

Sure i have more trust in a user then Onkyo itself

But if it is software, why did'nt the FW update fix the problem ?
I do hope you can find a working solution (and thats for me not leaving the Onkyo on Network Control 24/7) and i will be the first to buy the 708 for the 3rd time

PS. the most strange thing i find on the connection problem is that from standby the Onkyo will not connect and when i pull the cable after 10-15 seconds it will.
Its not only NET thats not activate, also REMOTE CONTROL is not active.
After the pull, both will become active and connecting is not problem.
But then the next day
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post #300 of 1620
My goal is to arrive at a set of user executable test criteria. At this point, I'm not certain that everyone is experiencing the same problem. For example, I've seen two sets of failure criteria:

Set 1
Display hangs on "Now Initializing"
Receiver responds to ping and can server web interface

Set 2
Display hangs on "Now Initializing"
Receiver does not respond to ping or web interface requests


It's not enough to simply say, I cannot connect to net radio, therefore networking is "broken". That's like saying, "my car stopped running while I was driving down the road". Yes, but why? From a simplistic viewpoint, you might observe that the battery is dead, then assume that replacing the battery will fix the problem. However, more often than not, this issue is caused by a failed alternator. The battery is dead only because requisite to the alternator failure, the car ran from battery power until the battery could provide no more. Networking is similarly complex. Observing a high-level failure doesn't necessarily provide all the information needed to diagnose specifically what has failed.

So, what we do is, we build a set of test criteria that assert very minimalist truths. In order for the receiver to serve the web interface, many (or just one) underlying failures must occur. In troubleshooting, we start from the bottom and work our way up. What will be cool is that any trouble shooting tools we arrive at here should be applicable to any network enabled receiver Now that will be cool.
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