Panasonic VT series - is panning an issue ?

I posted a similar thread in the PS3 gaming forum but got only one reply thus far... so I thought I would ask in a more general form here, outside the Official Panasonic TC-PxxVT20/25 Owners Thread so that my question does not get buried in all the posts in there.

My questioning started when, while reading Chad B 65VT25 review, a few comments he made caught my attention:


I then started to search a bit on how the VTs handle motion. In Europe, I found the Panasonic VT20 blur or multiply on a pan shot thread which I read from beginning to end. I've also found a few posts here on AVS about panning issues that some owners seem to have.

So, today I decided to go see by myself how VT models handle motion in a store nearby where they had the 50VT20 on display. Planet earth was playing on all TV sets. Panning scenes (and all other camera movements) at different speeds were noticeably more choppy on the VT20 than what could be seen on all TVs right beside it (Sharp, Sony, LG and Samsung LED and plasma TVs)... to a point where I began to have second thoughts on my 65VT25 order.

So I'm wondering what you guys (owners and others) feel about panning on the VTs? Do you see the jerkiness? Is there a way to make panning smoother? By tweaking options? Or maybe a firmware update?

P.S.: the VT20 was set to 60Hz. I tried THX mode with 96Hz and blur reduction on/off... 96Hz helped to smooth out pannings but with a bit of flicker...

I liked everything else about the VT: Really nice colors, black level, shadow details, sharpness. etc...

I'll go see that 65VT25 again in the store from where I ordered the 65, with some blu-ray discs to see how it feels in a bit more controled environment....

Thanks for the comment TwoPlusTwo

I'm interrested in reading comments about 2D gaming on the VTs as I was not able to test that. How's fluidity?

The funny thing is that when I ordered the 65VT25, the salesman sowed me how it handled motion using a video sequence from the panasonic demo disc. The fluidity of that video was buttery smooth!... which makes me wonder why Planet Earth pans were that choppy while beeing super smooth on other TV sets in that other store? Colors were much better on the VT20 tho..

The choppy motion I saw was on a VT20. I will go take a look at some VT25s today and see if the chopiness is still obvious on those models...

I know from that panasonic "optimized" demo I saw that the VT25 motion can be reeeally smooth, but, can it be as smooth with actual blu-ray, game or cable content?

I just realized that the feed in that store where I saw the jerky motion was probably 24 fps because I was able to select the 48Hz and 96Hz modes on the VT20 and I know that the smooth panasonic demo I saw was feed at 60Hz. So I guess that the VT20 has somes issues dealing with a 24 fps input and display it at 60Hz?

I wonder if Chad B tested the 65VT25 with a 60 fps input or just 24 fps input displayed at 60 hz...

This I understand, but every other set had better motion with the same feed. Given the price I'm paying for the 65VT25 I expect more not less.

Or make that: less not more (judder)!

Hi!

The first store had LOTR playing on a 58VT25 with nothing beside it to compare. Feed was 60 fps and everything looked ok but there was next to no panning scenes. I watched for 15 min or so.

Second one had a 50VT25 setup with the all panasonic 3D demos rolling. One cartoon demo was choppy as hell while others were silky smooth and especially the one where that guy does bungi jumping of a cliff. All I can tell is that in 3D the VT25 can be Reeeeally smooth. I wonder if that demo content was recorded in video mode?

The 3th one was the one with the 50VT20 playing planet earth. Pans were not as bad as what I had seen a few days before. I then realized the TV was set to 96Hz playing 24p content. I switched the set back to 60Hz and choppiness despite subtle was back and noticeable. 96Hz with a 24p feed ran smoother IMO and flicker was there but minimal.

The 4th store was the one which I ordered my 65VT25. In that store pannys were fed with 1080i signal. Golf was playing on those sets with all sets running at 60Hz (50G20, 50VT25, 54Z1 and 65VT25). On a side note, there I realized that, even at 60Hz, I could easily see the screen flicker on both the 50G20 and 50VT25 while I saw no flicker on the 54Z1 and 65VT25. The flickering was worse when not directly looking at the TVs, something which I rarely do when watching movies... but still it was there to be seen. Other than this, movements pannings and the such seemed normal to me. Blur reduction was turned on on the 65VT25. I played with it (on/off) but could not see the difference.

In the 5th store the 58VT25 was set up right next to 151FD and playing the same 1080i content in a dim environment. I'd say that camera movement on the 58 seemed on par with the one on the Kuro, being maybe a tad smoother on the Kuro... but it didn't bothered me at all. What was a bit more annoying was that the 58 had a more noise in the image, especially during pans and other camera movements. I was able to attenuate that somehow by reducing the sharpness to 0 and engaging the noise reducer to max. Other than that, colors saturation, black level, shadow detail were all a tad better on the Kuro for an overall more natural look. Also there was posterisation on the 58 especially in surrounding threes which caused a slight lost in detail. But I was still able to set the 58 for ot to be a close match to the Kuro to a point where my wife probably wouldn't have noticed the little PQ differences . Again movement, pannings and such where not an issue for me under those (not ideal) conditions.

So, it seems that panning issues are more apparent with 24p displayed at 60Hz (or 50 at 60Hz in Europe) when the VTs handle framerate changes internally. It was in 3D that saw the best (buttery smooth) pans. It seems 60fps displayed at 60Hz is the better deal, followed by 24 fps displayed a 96Hz, and then 24 fps displayed a 60Hz... 48hz beeing unwatchable for me.

I still have not seen games running on the VTs.

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Thanks for the info!