It's '3-D' - **NOT** '3D'

Hi Vincent,
Does this mean that you'll be eschewing any 3-D Blu-ray purchases, since the BDA left the hyphen out when they ratified the "Blu-ray 3D" logo?

I disagree completely. The dash is completely unnecessary because it does not have the general acceptable meaning that you imply.

If you ask 10 AVS forum readers and ask them to explain the difference in meaning between 3D and 3-D, I doubt any of them would agree with your definition.

I do agree that the distinction between 3D rendered content like CGI movies and stereoscopic 3D is needed, just not that the dash conveys that.

Makes no difference.

Both are actually correct. I looked at a dictionary from several sources and each have both 3D and 3-D. I have been watching 3D 3-D movies since the 80's and I have seen both used.

I've got a collection of lobby cards, one sheets and other items for 1950's 3-D movies and both 3-D and 3D were used on the various advertising.

That said, I prefer 3-D myself!

i say who cares just give us content

It's "longtime", as an adjective, **NOT** "long-time".

It's . . . S3D!

OMG!!!!

Someone quick tell D* that their channel guide is incorrect. All their advertising is incorrect. They call their 24-7 channel n3D!!!!!!!!!

Yours is a noble quest, My Lord. I shall join thee and this shall be our song:

Hear me now
Oh thou bleak and unbearable world,
Thou art base and debauched as can be;
And a knight with his banners all bravely unfurled
Now hurls down his gauntlet to thee!
I am I, Vincent Shaw-aw,
The Lord of 3-D-eee,
My destiny calls and I go,
And the wild winds of fortune
Will carry me onward,
Oh whithersoever they blow.
Whithersoever they blow,
Onward to glory I go!

There is no difference between 3D, 3-D, "Real""true" 3D (whatever "real" or "true" would mean), because none of the words describe the medium. They are just quick shortcuts used because they are easy understand and to remember for anyone.
Whenever you use the "D" word you just need to remember you speak in a specific context that does not work in other contexts.

You want to be precise with your names ? What 3D is all about is two different 2D pictures, each only shown to the proper eye. The true name for the technology is Stereoscopy : stereoscopic TV, stereoscopic film, stereoscopic video game, and so on...


Yes Ste-re-o-sco-pic is a long and annoying word to use and Yes there is a big problem if you try to shorten this word : stereo is already widely used and accepted as a shortcut for stereophony, so people just prefer "3D"

So what ? have you ever heard about the problems related to the word "convergence" in stereoscopic jargon ?

Or outside of purely "3D" stuff, an other funny one is "interlacing"
(it's even more funny in languages where the word "interleave" does not have any equivalent like my native language)

I'm sure that you are very popular and have many friends in real life.

I'm actually going to chime in as a fellow grammar nazi and someone who uses writing to make a living. I have been confused in the past because of this very issue while researching the nvidia 3dtv play drivers. Many games or drivers will claim to do 3d, but they are of course referring to the rendering engine and not actually stereoscopy.

I join Vincent Shaw in suggesting that professional writing should adopt the convention. I myself will in professional writing. That said, for forum use, I'm sure you'll catch me typing '3D' and not thinking twice.

If others ask, I will explain. I think this is a valid method for clarity and to communicate the distinction.

Carry on, Vincent Shaw.

three-deee....how's that? ;-)

My point of view is that neither 3D, or 3-D or the idea of having "three-dimensions" describe the medium or even the actual effect produced on screen. It's just a marketing term.

A 3D picture doesn't have depth. It's two normal very flat pictures.
A 3D TV or monitor or projector system does not display your picture at a variable depth, it only displays stuff flat on the screen surface just like a normal TV does and yet these new displays are sold as 3DTVs 3D-monitors 3D-projectors. It makes no sense and yet everybody understands (unless you are young enough to learn the distinction between 2D video games vs 3D video games before hearing about the difference between conventional cinema/TV and 3D cinema/TV)

The word "stereoscopy" actually describes something real which is exactly what is happening and is not mistakable with anything else by definition.
James Cameron uses simply the word "stereo" (he mentioned this naming issue in a few interviews)
Most gamers that regularly play games in 3D call it "S3D" short for "stereo 3D", in order to make the difference in this world which already uses the word 3D all the time for describing the picture computer generating method.


This real phenomenon vs marketing naming difference reminds me about holograms, what they really are and what people think when they hear the word hologram (especially in the context of a TV).
We're going to have some real naming fun when Holographic displays (that produce light virtually at the proper depth through light interference coming from a support behind the picture) and true 3D displays (that produce light physically in the air at the proper depth, which people usually call holograms) will be commercially available.

The mention I made about the word convergence as stereoscopic jargon is that this word is an extremely important term that is used to speak about something that ties the amount of separation each object has in a stereo system and which defines the position of the zero parallax point (an object displayed at that point is displayed as at screen depth).
Everybody uses the word convergence when setting up the cameras but nobody agrees on whether you are taking about a camera angle, a distance to the camera centre-line crossing, the position of the zero parallax point as reproduced on the screen or the intended amount of the viewer's eye crossing. They are all very closely tied, they are measured differently, have different values but they are all called "convergence".
You'll find convergence settings in video game drivers that convert 3D games into stereo 3D games (like Nvidia 3D vision drivers, iZ3D drivers and DDD tridef drivers). It is an option that allows the user to modify the amount of depth vs pop-out of the picture being displayed, it's goal is similar in all 3 software but behaves differently in all three of them.

Having different meanings for 3D and 3-D will be a problem when you have to say it because they will both sound the same - unless you pronounce the dash.

So stereoscopic or stereoscopic 3D I think is a lot better because it's more accurate and you can say it out aloud and people can distinguish it (or stereo 3D - like James Cameron says - if that didn't get confused with stereo sound).

This will also help to distinguish it from real (or more real) 3D displays when they become available that are better than stereoscopic.

Vincent,
While I appreciate your passion on the subject, and even more so your respect for historical accuracy, I fear that your quest has little chance of gaining much traction, given that the content providers, the equipment manufacturers, and even the BDA itself, have seemingly all adopted 3D with no hyphen.

I also suspect that topics such as this will cease to occupy our time once we have more actual content to keep us busy, be it 3D or 3-D.
James

The fundamental problem is that the US Consumer Electroincs Association does absolutly nothing to try and establish documentation standards of any kind on their TV manufacturer members.

I'm just thankful that we don't have to deal with "SonyVision" or "MitsuVision" or especially "SamsungVision". (Panavision is already taken)