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The "Official" xtz Room Analyzer Thread - Page 11

post #301 of 437
My XTZ Room analyser Pro arrived today
Very impressed with the kit, apart from the microphone stand which is way too small considering the recommend a listening height of 700mm, but nice aluminium case to hold everything

waiting for delivery of a boom mic stand as suggested by Kal

One of the biggest hurdles is lugging Subwoofers around the room
I considered making a couple of DIY camera dollies but came up with the idea of using these

http://www.amazon.co.uk/EZ-Furniture-Moving-System-furniture/dp/B0079IFWUY

Now on order should save the back and hopefully be able to move them into a rough position while monitoring the RTA chart on my projector

Connected everything up but there is a lot of interference from the Centre Speaker, any ideas why?

Did a quick sweep and appear to have a null at 50hz using the Left hand Sub on its own
The Right hand Sub sweep looks good , to my untrained eye
That's with the Subs done individually

To check both I connected the XTZ to the PC Phono inputs on my Onkyo and there is a deep null at 31.5hz and 63hz using both Subs together

Room size
Front wall 19'7" into an alcove
As in comes out of the alcove the room narrows to 17'1"
Room Length 19'7"
Ceiling Height 7'11"

Cheers Andy
post #302 of 437
Did you order a threaded adapter to go with the mic stand? Probably need one, makes things much easier.

I don't know what a "PC phono input" is, but a phono input will be equalized, so not good. Most AVRs have an auxiliary input on the front panel, I almost forgot about mine.
post #303 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjames View Post

Did you order a threaded adapter to go with the mic stand? Probably need one, makes things much easier.

I don't know what a "PC phono input" is, but a phono input will be equalized, so not good. Most AVRs have an auxiliary input on the front panel, I almost forgot about mine.

Thanks for the post

I didn't order a threaded adapter as I had already asked if I needed mic clip which I was told came with the XTZ so hopefully I don't need said adapter when the stand arrives?

The PC Analog audio (RCA) connections are what I used so that I can use the projector to view the XTZ
post #304 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesmor View Post

Thanks for the post

I didn't order a threaded adapter as I had already asked if I needed mic clip which I was told came with the XTZ so hopefully I don't need said adapter when the stand arrives?

The PC Analog audio (RCA) connections are what I used so that I can use the projector to view the XTZ

The adapter (I've got the one from amazon that's linked all over the Audyssey thread - 5 bucks) is a ball swivel mount, so you can easily get the mic positioned just so. The clip would work, just seems more cumbersome to me. But maybe you're onto something - I'm gonna try it with just the clip next time smile.gif
post #305 of 437
Has anyone done Near field Measurements with the XTZ Analyzer?
post #306 of 437
Hi Guys
My microphone stand and boom arrived today so made a start to carrying out some measurements

I have encountered a problem, things seem to be working fine until I try a Full Range Measurement then XTZ Pro stops responding and Windows decides to Shut down XTZ

This has happened every time I start to use the Full Range Measurement ( X3 ) and I am lost as to why

I am running Windows 8 Pro on a Acer Aspire 5720 laptop 2.2 Ghz 2GB RAM

Any suggestions would be appreciated
post #307 of 437
Can't help you with W8 - does it have Event Viewer? Check there ...

Run it in XP from Virtual PC? I have a usb device I have to do that with on W7.

Does xtz have a forum? Check there on W8 issues, or email them - maybe need a driver or whatever.
post #308 of 437
If you are on software version 2.32 it should work though it does not look like that has been publicly released yet. I would email info AT xtz.se with your issue and see if they have 2.32 available.
post #309 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjames View Post

Can't help you with W8 - does it have Event Viewer? Check there ...

Run it in XP from Virtual PC? I have a usb device I have to do that with on W7.

Does xtz have a forum? Check there on W8 issues, or email them - maybe need a driver or whatever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyal Mellor View Post

If you are on software version 2.32 it should work though it does not look like that has been publicly released yet. I would email info AT xtz.se with your issue and see if they have 2.32 available.

Thanks for the feedback

I have software version 2.31 installed

As suggested I have emailed XTZ Support so hopefully they will shed some light on the problem

Regards
Andy
post #310 of 437
Given the age of the thread I am surprised that there is no sticky or FAQ's like the excellent Audyssey thread

Unless I missed it ,I did search

Also I contacted XTZ today regarding my problem with the software and as yet no reply, or even a confirmation they received my email

Hopefully this is not representative of their "Customer Service"

Regards
Andy
post #311 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesmor View Post

Given the age of the thread I am surprised that there is no sticky or FAQ's like the excellent Audyssey thread

Unless I missed it ,I did search

Also I contacted XTZ today regarding my problem with the software and as yet no reply, or even a confirmation they received my email

Hopefully this is not representative of their "Customer Service"

Regards
Andy

No they are normally quite responsive.
post #312 of 437
Have you done the uninstall\reboot\reinstall\reboot dance?
post #313 of 437
Can you post a screen shot of the problem.

Now i think about it I had something similar on my Acer though not 8). Mine would do this not on any particular window.

Do you use Registry cleaners?
post #314 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjames View Post

Have you done the uninstall\reboot\reinstall\reboot dance?

No I haven't its a fresh install
If that's what it takes then that's disappointing, you don't buy a car and expect / accept having to remove the engine and reinstall it, you just expect to drive
I'll wait and see what XTZ say but thanks for the suggestion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phillips751 View Post

Can you post a screen shot of the problem.

Now i think about it I had something similar on my Acer though not 8). Mine would do this not on any particular window.

Do you use Registry cleaners?

I do use CC but haven't run it for a while

I don't have any screenshots of when it fails to respond as it did not seem to give any clues as to why it should ,but the next time It happens I will

As you have reminded me I will now to a clean up with CC


Thanks for the feedback guys smile.gif
post #315 of 437
Hi
Been trying XTZ again but as reported it fails to respond in full range mode



I contacted XTZ Support again and they advised that they replied to my initial request and to check spam, unfortunately they didn't add the reply
I had been monitoring spam so no mail was missed
Advised XTZ and requested they resend the reply
The then advised they had just resent it, but there was no info in the email
Now they are requesting an alternative email address and mention newer software for Windows 8
so I am at a loss

As I have already said there is no sticky or FAQ in this thread for XTZ so I apologise for the next questions

Just how do you set up the level to be able to take readings with the Room Analyser?

Is the level setup different for RTA?

I have my ONKYO at 0 Reference, computer volume to 100 and even altering the Output level to green I get low readings in the graphs and the meter
Switching on the Level (dBFS) function pink noise and the volume is excessive

When playing around sometime had a great thud from my subs as the Level was obviously way too high, but the Left hand SPL meter reading was by no means excessive

What SPL reading would you expect on the Left Hand meter
My RS SPL Meter was reading 70db with the Level (dBFS) engaged at -20 the XTZ SPL meter read nothing like that.


I have my subs THX Fixed gain on bypass and the control set at 75db as per Audyssey on my ONKYO the ONKYO main volume at 0
and the highest I get on a RTA chart is 50db
Also the RTA ref is 37db why is that?

Obviously I need an idiots guide but there is nothing in the manual WRT the interaction with your computer volume, your
receiver volume the Output Level the Level (dBFS) function on the Room Analyser screen



There must be a simple step by step method covering computer volume, Receiver volume, output level and the Level (dBFS) function requirements?

Hopefully I'll receive the reply from XTZ at my alternative email address
post #316 of 437
Just an update
Finally managed to get the fix from XTZ
Things looked good but then it failed to respond again
Have advised XTZ
post #317 of 437
I max the xtz slider, and the soundcard's speaker control, and with the AVR at -3 get about 72 db on the xtz meter. I don't really want to turn the AVR up any more than that.

Kal explained in some thread why some places these measuring softwares will show a low level - something about the spl meter just seeing one bit of the sound, while the software is processing it further, seeing more as it were - don't quote me on that smile.gif

Suffice to say it's normal to see what seems to be a low level in some views - trust the spl meter and you'll be fine. My sub used to do that, and it was a bad volume control, but you're obviously having some kind of problem, so no telling what else might be funky in the background. Are you using any kind of usb extension? Try without it. Try changing to another usb socket - the farthest one if such a thing exists. One thing that's commonly recommended is going into your soundcard and turning off everything that you don't need - for me that's everything but the speakers IIRC. With a modern laptop I assume it's onboard sound, but there's still a control panel dingus somewhere.
post #318 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjames View Post

I max the xtz slider, and the soundcard's speaker control, and with the AVR at -3 get about 72 db on the xtz meter. I don't really want to turn the AVR up any more than that.

Kal explained in some thread why some places these measuring softwares will show a low level - something about the spl meter just seeing one bit of the sound, while the software is processing it further, seeing more as it were - don't quote me on that smile.gif

Suffice to say it's normal to see what seems to be a low level in some views - trust the spl meter and you'll be fine. My sub used to do that, and it was a bad volume control, but you're obviously having some kind of problem, so no telling what else might be funky in the background. Are you using any kind of usb extension? Try without it. Try changing to another usb socket - the farthest one if such a thing exists. One thing that's commonly recommended is going into your soundcard and turning off everything that you don't need - for me that's everything but the speakers IIRC. With a modern laptop I assume it's onboard sound, but there's still a control panel dingus somewhere.

Thanks for the feedback
I had already looked for conflict with my computer ,nothing obvious

Over in the REW forum it was suggested that you need 60db above the ambient level for a proper reading, so they recommend 90db which seems excessive

But as you said perhaps low readings take everything into consideration but I wish the scale would reflect this

Anyway with no disrespect intended but this thread falls well short of the REW thread as to how to use the XTZ room analyser and interpret the results
post #319 of 437
You will find the software very useful but first to get it running.

Windows sound can play games.

In Windows in the sound card controls with the XTZ Room Analyzer mic is this set to default, need to connect first?
Do you connect the mic before you open XTZ?

Check your input volume in your settings, actually i don't think your mic is connecting to the laptop properly. Will be interesting to see the "Room Analyzer" graph.

Is there a opportunity to connect to another laptop or PC?. This would check the hardware as well.

Make sure you take notes with your current settings so you can revert back if there isn't any difference.

When you are up and running you can post graphs etc for help. Nyall Mellor (Acoustic Frontiers acoustican) posts on this thread as well as Kal.

Have you run the CCleaner?

Can you post a "Room Analyzer" graph?
Edited by Phillips751 - 6/12/13 at 9:00pm
post #320 of 437
That 60 db above ambient is just for RT60 measurement, which most seem to feel is useless anyway.

Room Analyzer is the most useful window for us, so if that's working for you, there's something to do while you figure it out. For most xtz is plug 'n play like it's supposed to be - REW never is, by design smile.gif It's also more complex software, so it attracts those who want to do room surgery, and they chat it up pretty good on that front. But starting out, getting bass smooth and proper in room is a big step, and xtz does well with that in the RA window.
post #321 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phillips751 View Post

You will find the software very useful but first to get it running.

Windows sound can play games.

In Windows in the sound card controls with the XTZ Room Analyzer mic is this set to default, need to connect first?
Do you connect the mic before you open XTZ?

Check your input volume in your settings, actually i don't think your mic is connecting to the laptop properly. Will be interesting to see the "Room Analyzer" graph.

Is there a opportunity to connect to another laptop or PC?. This would check the hardware as well.

Make sure you take notes with your current settings so you can revert back if there isn't any difference.

When you are up and running you can post graphs etc for help. Nyall Mellor (Acoustic Frontiers acoustican) posts on this thread as well as Kal.

Have you run the CCleaner?

Can you post a "Room Analyzer" graph?

Hi and thanks for replying
I would think that Windows sound might be an issue as you have suggested, but had checked the interface and also disabled items I thought were irrelevant, one which was speaker (DUH)
Due to my ignorance XTZ would not then work, It was easy to disable but not so easy to re-enable the sound but thanks to Google found how to get things back

I am still getting "Noise" through my front speakers with XTZ sitting idle in Room analyser mode, It was suggested as a ground loop and to run my Laptop on battery only, but the sound still persisted doing that

When XTZ is connected the mic shows and is indeed default, all other mics showing have been disabled
Speakers show and are enabled
There is a High Definition Audio device in the display Digital Audio (S/PDIF) and that is disabled
Line In is disabled
So as far as I can tell things are good in the Windows Sound setup

I will, as recommended, pay special attention to connect the XTZ unit before starting the program

I have now uninstalled XTZ and reinstalled the latest version, and run CCleaner inc registry

Will have another go this evening, as requested here is a screenshot




Thanks again Andy
post #322 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjames View Post

That 60 db above ambient is just for RT60 measurement, which most seem to feel is useless anyway.

Room Analyzer is the most useful window for us, so if that's working for you, there's something to do while you figure it out. For most xtz is plug 'n play like it's supposed to be - REW never is, by design smile.gif It's also more complex software, so it attracts those who want to do room surgery, and they chat it up pretty good on that front. But starting out, getting bass smooth and proper in room is a big step, and xtz does well with that in the RA window.

Thanks for replying

I had tried REW but had VISTA on my laptop at the time couldn't be done with the hassle of setting it up, and as you rightly say I don't want to be a martyr to a piece of software.

XTZ for me is the answer and yes it should / and probably is plug and play, I love the interface just need to get it set up without it "Failing to respond" and then hopefully in this thread guidance and interpretation of the results.

Yes I could just run Audyssey but I feel that seating and Speaker positioning is crucial before doing that
Regards
Andy
post #323 of 437
Had another play tonight
XTZ although more stable still "fails to respond" with V2.32
Still having problems with output level
When I press test can't get the bar to go green
Computer volume 100
output level max
If I increase the receiver to get the bar green, then measure both subs thump ( Bottom out?)
Looking at Nyals videos its a no brainer , push test adjust slider till green, good to go
Its not working for me
Anyway I have moved both my subs to opposite corners to give me a baseline


Left Hand Sub Corner Loaded

Right Hand Sub Corner Loaded

Both combined

Tried moving mic position forward and back but the 26-29hz mode persists
Probably need to move subs forward into the room but would welcome experienced users opinions

Front wall is 19'7" Wide into an alcove Subs in opposite corners
Moving forward out of the alcove the room narrows to 17'1"
Room Length 19'7"

regards
Andy
Edited by Lesmor - 6/13/13 at 2:32pm
post #324 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesmor View Post

Had another play tonight
XTZ although more stable still "fails to respond" with V2.32
Still having problems with output level
When I press test can't get the bar to go green
Computer volume 100
output level max
If I increase the receiver to get the bar green, then measure both subs thump ( Bottom out?)
Looking at Nyals videos its a no brainer , push test adjust slider till green, good to go
Its not working for me
Anyway I have moved both my subs to opposite corners to give me a baseline


Left Hand Sub Corner Loaded

Right Hand Sub Corner Loaded

Both combined

Tried moving mic position forward and back but the 26-29hz mode persists
Probably need to move subs forward into the room but would welcome experienced users opinions

Front wall is 19'7" Wide into an alcove Subs in opposite corners
Moving forward out of the alcove the room narrows to 17'1"
Room Length 19'7"

regards
Andy

Change to 12 ppo to give detail.

There seems to be a drop off

Are these with the mains included or subs only?
If so what crossover are you using?

Can you post images/screen shots of your Windows sound settings?

Also can you try on another laptop even PC (although not great because of power interference) at least you can eliminate?
Edited by Phillips751 - 6/14/13 at 12:21am
post #325 of 437
Your slider isn't maxed in those pics? You've basically got a square room it seems, that's the worst they say. Can you put them on opposing side walls, near the middle? Give you a good comparison if nothing else.
post #326 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phillips751 View Post

Change to 12 ppo to give detail

There seems to be a drop off

Are these with the mains included or subs only?
If so what crossover are you using?

Can you post images/screen shots of your Windows sound settings?

Also can you try on another laptop even PC (although not great because of power interference) at least you can eliminate?

Thanks for the reply

So should I be using advanced then, the only place where there is 12ppo
Out of interest why have this screen if it is of no purpose?

Mains and subs

Sub Xovers on bypass ONKYO at 120hz as per Audyssey,and although Audyssey and Dynamic EQ is off



As requested don't know why there are 2 XTZ it is not normally that way

Don't have access to another laptop I'm afraid
Edited by Lesmor - 6/14/13 at 12:17pm
post #327 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjames View Post

Your slider isn't maxed in those pics? You've basically got a square room it seems, that's the worst they say. Can you put them on opposing side walls, near the middle? Give you a good comparison if nothing else.


I reduced the slider after the subs bottomed with it maxed

apart from the right hand alcove the room is 17'1" X 19'7"
Granted and I realise the alcove to me is a problem

Thanks for the suggestions

Cant move subs to mid sidewalls as on right sidewall there is a radiator

Left sidewall there is a small bay window

I can move to mid position on front wall and rear wall which is where I'll end up if I can't get a front of room improvement
Edited by Lesmor - 6/14/13 at 12:16pm
post #328 of 437
Quote:
So should I be using advanced then, the only place where there is 12ppo

Yes
Quote:
Out of interest why have this screen if it is of no purpose?

Some people just like the basics, no real reason just preferential.
Quote:
Mains and subs

Turn the sub up until flat with the rest.
Quote:
Sub Xovers on bypass ONKYO at 120hz as per Audyssey,and although Audyssey and Dynamic EQ is off

If you can adjust manually try different settings e.g. 80hz good starting point and phase. Crossovers over 80hz generally start to get directional.
Quote:
As requested don't know why there are 2 XTZ it is not normally that way

I notice that there is "right sub - 2" how are you connecting the pre-sound card?

Can you post a screen shot of your recording or Input settings with the mic connected and software opened?

Also can you go deeper into the sound devices (not sure of naming), like advanced settings in control panel and take screen shots of these, the more info the better, other people might be able to help as well with this info.?
Quote:
Don't have access to another laptop I'm afraid

That's a real shame
Edited by Phillips751 - 6/14/13 at 4:50pm
post #329 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesmor View Post




I assume those settings are not how they would be when running xtz? The speakers volume should be maxed (at least it has to be for me.)

I'd be reducing the AVR volume for the "bump" so that you're giving the AVR the highest signal level, then control it from the AVR.
post #330 of 437
Hi
Thanks for the feedback

First up I think my problem lies with my Laptop
I have no reason to doubt the XTZ Software

Turn the sub up until flat with the rest.

The Subs and main speakers are all set at 75db if that's what you mean

If you can adjust manually try different settings e.g. 80hz good starting point and phase. Crossovers over 80hz generally start to get directional.

I get your point from now I will set both at 80hz until I next run Audyssey, which wont be until I find better positioning

I notice that there is "right sub - 2" how are you connecting the pre-sound card?

That is the weird thing the "right sub - 2" is actually what I named a screenshot I have no idea why it should show as a volume, the XTZ is into a USB on the laptop?

Can you post a screen shot of your recording or Input settings with the mic connected and software opened?

Also can you go deeper into the sound devices (not sure of naming), like advanced settings in control panel and take screen shots of these, the more info the better, other people might be able to help as well with this info.?

I will look into that

XTZ has replied

Hello,
The programmer said that you might have to do a full disk diagnostics/full disk check on C: (dont know the correct english word) It´s probably a fault on a system file. Then you should uninstall Room Analyzer and then re-install.
Also clear cache memory.


That's all well and good for someone who had the necessary computer expertise
I have tried to achieve what has been requested, and again uninstalled and reinstalled XTZ

I do agree that the Laptop or soundcard is the problem though

Will try more tests today
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