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3D mode on my Mitsubishi DLP's - Page 5

post #121 of 662
See the glases from the following:

http://www.3dtv.jp/
post #122 of 662
Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

See the glases from the following:

http://www.3dtv.jp/

Their universal emitter has a switch on the back that allows you to reverse the polarity to switch the eyes. I wonder if there is any way to take apart one of the Mits emitters and switch the polarity so that the Mits glasses work in reverse mode so they are compatible with DLP-Link glasses.
post #123 of 662
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmalter0 View Post

But that's the issue--if no other brand is better--maybe it can't look better with today's technology.

pmalter0,

It can and does look better with today's technology.

The problem is not a limitation of technology.
The problem is, Mitsubishi's design causes the picture to flash white between the left and right image for each frame of video, which washes out the picture when using IR shutter glasses.

This is called DLP-LINK and should never be enabled when using IR glasses, as IR glasses are incapable of preventing the eye from seeing the flash. On the pre-2010 mits sets, it is permanently enabled.

The problem is a design flaw and mits corrected it on the new models by having DLP link OFF unless enabled in the 3D menu.


The Panasonic and Samsung LCD and Plasma sets I sampled at Best Buy do not have this problem and do excellent blacks.
post #124 of 662
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyabusha View Post

diamondpilot, how are those Optoma's holding up?

Any new observations, or comment's on how they are the best glasses for Pre-2010 sets?

Just curious, as mine are going to arrive Tues...

The Optomas are holding up quite well.

I do notice the polarization rainbows a little more on the Monsters vs Aliens disc.

To me rainbows are far less of a nuisance than the issues with DLP-Link thru IR glasses. The rainbows are quite faint, only noticable on certain scenes, and I only see them on the left and right extremeties of the screen.

I much prefer the image quality with the Optomas over the IR glasses.

I also concur that rotating the polarization 45 degrees on the glasses would cure this. If I tilt my head 45 degrees the rainbows disappear with no other artifacts.
post #125 of 662
Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondpilot View Post

pmalter0,

It can and does look better with today's technology.

The problem is not a limitation of technology.
The problem is, Mitsubishi's design causes the picture to flash white between the left and right image for each frame of video, which washes out the picture when using IR shutter glasses.

This is called DLP-LINK and should never be enabled when using IR glasses, as IR glasses are incapable of preventing the eye from seeing the flash. On the pre-2010 mits sets, it is permanently enabled.

The problem is a design flaw and mits corrected it on the new models by having DLP link OFF unless enabled in the 3D menu.


The Panasonic and Samsung LCD and Plasma sets I sampled at Best Buy do not have this problem and do excellent blacks.

I did compare my Mits to the Panasonic display at BB on Grande Canyon -- and I liked my colors better. I wasn't focusing on the blacks particularly just the overall picture. At the time I was using the X102s, and I now have the Samsung/Mits glasses, but I sold my Grand Canyon, so I can't check with these glasses. However, I don't see any reason why they wouldn't synch exactly the same -- they would have to in order to avoid ghosts.
post #126 of 662
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmalter0 View Post

However, I don't see any reason why they wouldn't synch exactly the same -- they would have to in order to avoid ghosts.

The DLP -Link glasses turn both eyes off during the DLP-Link flash, eliminating the visible artifacts. The IR shutter glasses do not.

They both turn the left eye off when the TV displays the right image and vice versa.
post #127 of 662
There is no cross talk due to the very short time interval white flash used by DLP-Link since it occcurs in the blankiing interval time between actual video display frames on the screen.
post #128 of 662
Hi can you please tell me what settings I should be using. I have the Optoma 3D glasses Mits 3DA1 and a 73C9 tv. I assume 3D mode should be on in my tv settings but what about the glasses mode standard or reverse mode?

Thanks in advance!

Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondpilot View Post

The DLP -Link glasses turn both eyes off during the DLP-Link flash, eliminating the visible artifacts. The IR shutter glasses do not.

They both turn the left eye off when the TV displays the right image and vice versa.
post #129 of 662
Oh and what about the Emitter output/ input on the emitter box? I have it on Emitter out and to the TV emitter in Is that correct

Quote:
Originally Posted by djr357 View Post

Hi can you please tell me what settings I should be using. I have the Optoma 3D glasses Mits 3DA1 and a 73C9 tv. I assume 3D mode should be on in my tv settings but what about the glasses mode standard or reverse mode?

Thanks in advance!
post #130 of 662
It appears that you should be using Reverse Mode. However, it sholud be obvious that normal or reverse is coreect mode to use otherwise the eye signals would be cross-eyed and thereore unplesant to watch with 3D content.
post #131 of 662
It seems like everything on the screen is cut off?


Quote:
Originally Posted by djr357 View Post

Oh and what about the Emitter output/ input o
n the emitter box? I have it on Emitter out and to the TV emitter in Is that correct
post #132 of 662
And when I watch the PGA tour in 3D it just looks like split screen?

Quote:
Originally Posted by djr357 View Post

Oh and what about the Emitter output/ input on the emitter box? I have it on Emitter out and to the TV emitter in Is that correct

Quote:
Originally Posted by djr357 View Post

It seems like everything on the screen is cut off?
post #133 of 662
Quote:
Originally Posted by djr357 View Post

And when I watch the PGA tour in 3D it just looks like split screen?

Check: 1) TV in 3D mode
2) cablebox outputting HD (not 480)
3) adapter 3D on
post #134 of 662
djr357:

You need the tv 3d mode on, the glasses sync set to reverse on the tv menu.

You do not need to connect the emitter cable at all or have an emitter at all if you are using DLP-Link glasses.

On the remote for the 3da-1 there is a button labeled "3D mode"
You need to toggle this button through the 3 supported modes until the mode used by your cable box is selected. (Normal aka frame packing, top/bottom, side-by-side)

This should fix the problem you are describing with the split picture.
post #135 of 662
Thread Starter 
djr357, If correct the problem with your glasses. Please leave your Impressions.
post #136 of 662
Hi All, I first want to say thank you to all in this forum for all your help in getting my 3D experience up and running! Here are my early impressions of the Optoma 3D glasses with my 73C9.

PS3 games:
Motorstorm- by far my favorite. Very clear and cool effects for an early 3D game. Didn't notice any of the polarization rainbows at all.
The other three 3D demos (MLB, Wipeout, and SuperStardust) were all just ok IMO. But didn't notice rainbows in any.

Directv3D:Overall from what saw of the material was very good.Under the Sea was cool.But my Favorite was the Dinosaurs by far. The effects were really cool and had me trying to pet the dinosaurs LOL. BUT I did notice the polarization rainbows quite a bit. Diamondpilot was right on when he said only in the lighter scenes and on both the top right and left sides. It did annoy me but only when I was strictly focusing on them. I am probably more bothered by the rainbows because I never tried the Mits glasses and didn't get to experience how bad they were so I don't appreciate how good the Optomas are compared to them.
I didn't get to try any Blu Ray 3D movies because I only have a PS3 and I'm waiting for the September update.
Overall I'm happy with the Optomas and recommend them...If they could some how elimnate the rainbows they would be perfect IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyabusha View Post

djr357, If correct the problem with your glasses. Please leave your Impressions.
post #137 of 662
Thread Starter 
Thanks djr357, I'm glad you like the Optoma's. Do they feel like well built glasses?

So your seeing nice blacks then?

I'm getting mine on Tuesday. And I'm praying that all my worries will go away when I put these glasses on.
post #138 of 662
Yes they are very solid and comfortable as well. They are not heavy at all.
I think the blacks are great and the color looks very natural IMO. Overall the early 3D experience is much better than I expected!
Maybe one day Mits will fix its issue with 2009 and older sets but until then I am very satisfied (I just wish I had more 3D content!)
Im going to order another pair today. Beach Camera has them on sale for $74.99 with free shipping.
Let me know how you like them when you get them!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyabusha View Post

Thanks djr357, I'm glad you like the Optoma's. Do they feel like well built glasses?

So your seeing nice blacks then?

I'm getting mine on Tuesday. And I'm praying that all my worries will go away when I put these glasses on.
post #139 of 662
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by djr357 View Post

Yes they are very solid and comfortable as well. They are not heavy at all.
I think the blacks are great and the color looks very natural IMO. Overall the early 3D experience is much better than I expected!
Maybe one day Mits will fix its issue with 2009 and older sets but until then I am very satisfied (I just wish I had more 3D content!)
Im going to order another pair today. Beach Camera has them on sale for $74.99 with free shipping.
Let me know how you like them when you get them!

Awesome news!

I'm selling my 3D IR Emitter and all 4 of my Samsung/Mitsubishi 3D glasses on Ebay right now. I also have 4 Optoma's on order!

At this point, If the glasses look great, there Isn't anything wrong with my TV anymore then!

Finally I'll be fully ready for 3D!!
post #140 of 662
Beware of Beach Camera!
I ordered the Optoma glasses through them- or tried to.
The website indicated they were in stock when I ordered them.
They gave a delivery date-which was about a week after order even though I paid extra for 2 day shipping.
When the delivery date came and went, I contacted Beach Camera and was told that the glasses were not in stock and they didn't know when they would be!
So, I cancelled my order and called Optoma. They told me that they had plenty in stock and referred me to ProjectorZone.com. They got me the glasses in two days.
I was unofficially told off the record that dealers who do not pay their bills to Optoma in a timely fashion have drop-shipments withheld.
post #141 of 662
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondpilot View Post

Beware of Beach Camera!
I ordered the Optoma glasses through them- or tried to.
The website indicated they were in stock when I ordered them.
They gave a delivery date-which was about a week after order even though I paid extra for 2 day shipping.
When the delivery date came and went, I contacted Beach Camera and was told that the glasses were not in stock and they didn't know when they would be!
So, I cancelled my order and called Optoma. They told me that they had plenty in stock and referred me to ProjectorZone.com. They got me the glasses in two days.
I was unofficially told off the record that dealers who do not pay their bills to Optoma in a timely fashion have drop-shipments withheld.

That's weird, I just ordered two glasses from their Ebay store, and I just called them to confirm the order went through, processed, and will ship out tomorrow... $74.99 each. Awesome price!! ^_^
post #142 of 662
Those that think that mitsubishi cannot fix the DLP link on/while using the IR emitter, might very well be mistaken. Here is why i think so.

Mitsubishi authorized Nvidia to include a firmware update for the x33,x35 sets via internet download.

Proof: In this zip file:
http://us.download.nvidia.com/Window...n7_English.zip

Proof of concept: Mits can patch various 3d parameters using a standard firmware calls:

Code:
### copy the external bitmap to V39 platform
mkdir "tffs0/UI"
mkdir "/tffs0/UI/BMP"
xcopy "/bd0/UI/BMP","/tffs0/UI/BMP"
### start the 3D patching 
ld 1,0,"/bd0/V39Patch3D.o"
taskDelay(1000);
V39Patch3D();
taskDelay(1000);
< /tffs0/startup1.sh
So here is the million dollar question. Mitsubishi doesnt like to let customers know firmware updates are out there. Other Mfgs like sony, samsung, lg, toshiba etc, offer these on the web for user support.

I think Mitsubishi can control the 3D behavior on these sets,

The question is : Will they,

I guess we all have to complain multiple times to get anything done.

I dont think DLP link is the answer, The future is IR stereoscopic glasses, at least for now, and Mitsubishi like we all know prefers these in their starter kits.

I would like to know just what is included in this file on the firmware update
Code:
V39Patch3D.o
Also the firmware is over 20MB in size, so there is room on the board for these type of enchancements.
post #143 of 662
I guess my big ? I have is IF the Mits TVs received a patch that fixed the problem that allowed you to turn off the DLP link mode and the IR Active Shutter 3D glasses that are bundled with the starter pack worked correctly would they be better than the DLP link glasses such as the Optomas.
And to be more specific, I mean if there were no polarization rainbows on the DLP link, which technology (3D IR Active Shutter vs DLP link) would be better as far as black level, picture quality,clarity, color and 3D effects?
post #144 of 662
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by djr357 View Post

I guess my big ? I have is IF the Mits TVs received a patch that fixed the problem that allowed you to turn off the DLP link mode and the IR Active Shutter 3D glasses that are bundled with the starter pack worked correctly would they be better than the DLP link glasses such as the Optomas.
And to be more specific, I mean if there were no polarization rainbows on the DLP link, which technology (3D IR Active Shutter vs DLP link) would be better as far as black level, picture quality,clarity, color and 3D effects?

I'm not worried. DLP-Link Shutter glasses have been In line with Mits DLP's for years. ("Now that I know") I'm sure when I get my Optoma's on Tues. I won't be looking back to IR glasses anymore. ^_^
post #145 of 662
Quote:
Originally Posted by djr357 View Post

I guess my big ? I have is IF the Mits TVs received a patch that fixed the problem that allowed you to turn off the DLP link mode and the IR Active Shutter 3D glasses that are bundled with the starter pack worked correctly would they be better than the DLP link glasses such as the Optomas.
And to be more specific, I mean if there were no polarization rainbows on the DLP link, which technology (3D IR Active Shutter vs DLP link) would be better as far as black level, picture quality,clarity, color and 3D effects?

Well if a firmware fix is actually possible or available to correct some of these problems and Mitsubishi does not make it available I guess that will speak for itself and will effect my purchases in the future...
post #146 of 662
I ordered two pairs from Projectorzone.com for $81 each and paid for the 2 day shipping and then came on time. Initial impression is they are pretty solid but a little on the heavy side. They came packaged in a sturdy box and came with 3 nose sizes.

As for the comfort level, they feel a little heavy, and for my big head they were tight just above the ears. I tried all three nose pieces and couldn't really get comfortable with any of them. I finally settled on the medium sized one. Hopefully they will break in over time and get looser on my head.
I am using these glasses with a Mits 60C9.

As for the performance of the glasses, all I can say is wow. I was shocked at how well the 3D picture looked on the demo disk for the Panny 300, and Cloudy w a chance of meatballs.

The teal color of 3d mode disappeared, and the blacks were perfect, the colors were bright, and i didn't notice hardly any brightness loss. I think I saw a little bit of rainbows on the brighter grand canyon scene, but it didn't bother me and was only there for a little bit on the screen. So far, I am happy with these glasses other than being a little tight on my head.
post #147 of 662
Thread Starter 
Thanks for your impression ksupilot7! All accounts have leaned towards a great picture. And by far the best glasses to get. I am a little worried now about being tight around the ears cuz I have a large head too. ;-O

Tuesday can't get here fast enough!
post #148 of 662
I've had some time to compare the Mitsuhishi glasses, Xpand X102's, and Optoma BG-ZD101 glasses side by side on my Mitsubishi WD-73837 (2009 model). I used directv content, downloaded movie trailers and PS3 games.

Let me make it clear that the worst picture quality clearly belongs to the Mitsubishi glasses, it's not even close. The blacks are lighter and cyan, some users may not notice it if they aren't viewing in a dark room or have nothing to compare them to but when compared side by side to DLP-Link glasses it is unmistakable. They also dim the picture more than the DLP-Link glasses and the colors are skewed to the blue side. The only positive I can think of is that they are much lighter and more comfortable than the other glasses and do not have the polarization rainbows. A 2010 Mitsubishi owner will likely have better results with these glasses as they can turn off the DLP-Link light flashes that cause the crushed blacks and cyan tint, I however have no firsthand experience with this.

The Xpands and Optomas both have fairly good 3D picture quality however the Optomas are IMHO the better choice for a few reasons. Both of these glasses eliminate the cyan tint of the blacks, the Optomas however have noticeably deeper blacks. The blacks are quite amazing actually with these glasses yet they do not dim the overall picture more than the Xpands. I also like the colors slightly better with the Optomas, the Xpands seem to have a very slight green skew when compared side by side, this is very subtle however and shouldn't be a concern. The Optomas also have use a standard battery as compared to the proprietary one in the Xpands. Both glasses are fairly bulky and heavy. It's kind of a tie when it comes to comfort as the shape of your head will likely determine what fits best.

Both of the DLP link glasses use the reverse mode while the Mitsubishi pair uses normal so they can't be used together. With both DLP link glasses I can see the polarization rainbows (looks like a purple/green streak in the upper corners of the TV). This is not present at all on the Mitsubishi glasses. These are mostly visible in whites and blues, such as a white backdrop or sky scene. They are virtually invisible at all other times. While this is a concern for me, I consider this to be much more tolerable than the problems presented by the Mitsubishi glasses. If the manufacturers of these glasses would rotate the polarization of the lenses about 20 degrees or so the rainbows would be completely gone. I have not gotten a chance to try and contact Xpand and Optoma about this but I will soon.

In my opinion an owner of a pre-2010 Mitsubishi DLP should get the Optoma BG-ZD101 glasses. They have the best picture quality and are the cheapest.
post #149 of 662
If you can get your hands on a copy of the 3D version of Monsters vs. Aliens, the 3D and picture quality is stunning. Notably better than "Cloudy" and anything on the Mits/Disney demo disc.

I bought the Samsung bundle (2 pairs glasses and the disc) just to get the movie, then sold the glasses off on eBay. Effectively paid about $75 for the disc when all was said and done, but they really did the 3D right on this one, and great, vivid colors.
post #150 of 662
So if I was purchasing a 2010 82738 should I just purchase the Optoma's and call it a day?
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