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Official Vizio VHT210 Soundbar Owners Thread - Page 2

post #31 of 141
I'm not 100% sure but I believe that Vizio would need to pay a licensing fee per unit to be able to offer DTS decoding. This would entail either a) making the sb more expensive to cover the additional cost or b) decreasing their profit per unit.

-P.
post #32 of 141
So davyo, what's the bottom line, here? Is this a game-breaker for this sound bar? I guess what I mean is: is it really going to make a difference? For instance, will certain discs simply not play at all, or what? [I assume that the older Vizio also did not decode this format.]
post #33 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by CSonntag View Post

This is a great thread you guys. I have been waiting on release and some reviews of this baby for a long time. Looks like we have a winner. Here is my question:

I have a Sony 52Z5100 tv which, according to the manual, outputs full 5.1 from its optical output. If I run this optical output to the Vizio, will it actually decode the 5.1 DD signal just as if the optical were coming straight from the source? If so, will there by any audio lag introduced? This way, I can keep everything hooked up as is: BD and Sat DVR via HDMI to the tv, then optical to the Vizio regardless of what source I'm using.

Your Sony does output 5.1 from optical, but this is only for OTA broadcasts. The 5.1 from your other sources will output as stereo only. This is a digital rights management issue. I believe that all TV manufacturers have to include this restriction to prevent anyone from copying the HQ sound output. It is truly amazing to me what the recording industry can mandate.
post #34 of 141
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corribus View Post

So davyo, what's the bottom line, here? Is this a game-breaker for this sound bar? I guess what I mean is: is it really going to make a difference? For instance, will certain discs simply not play at all, or what? [I assume that the older Vizio also did not decode this format.]

Well here's the deal Corribus and everyone else.

The lack of DTS with the new Vizio is going to have to be a deal breaker for me.

I had the JVC boxed up and re-packed and all ready to return until I put on my new "War Of the Worlds" DTS BluRay,,,, I didnt know there was any issue with the new Vizio before that, as none of the other BluRays I used for testing were DTS and I had both bars hooked directly to the BD player via optical when I was doing my testing.
I would have discovered this issue with my first Vizio VSB210WS bar except I always had it hooked up to my Vizio panel and never directly to my BD player.

I spent all last night and part of today going back and forth between the Vizio VHT210 and the JVC TH-BA1, playing different BluRays and tring different audio settings on my BluRay and different connections with both soundbars.

I have not changed my opinion of how much I like the Vizio but with all the back and forth testing I have grown to like the JVC even more than I did in the first place,,, as in Im going to do a flip flop and call the JVC the better of the two bars,,,, and not just because of the DTS issue,, but because I honestly changed my mind and think the JVC has the better overall sound now.

After doing many hours of side by side playback here's my revised opinions.
I used a bunch of BluRays but for the last few hours used the "Dark Night" as my main test disc.

The Vizio puts out more surround sound and effects while the JVC puts out a tad bit less surround while at the same time Im finding a more realistic surround effect.

The JVC having the center channel level setting is better for boosting dialog while keeping a very nice room filling sound,,, the Vizio while very good with dialog is not as good as the JVC.

The more time I spent with the Vizio the more I started to notice that the effects were at time's almost over powering the dialog but at the same time the Vizio has a bigger sound,,,, but it is bordering on being exagerated,,, if that makes sense.

The JVC sounds more natural and the blend between dialog and the surround effects are more balanced than with the Vizio.

If you have the Vizio hooked up to a display and your taking the optical from the display to the Vizio bar the lack of DTS decoding is a mute point as your display will not be sending the Vizio a DTS feed via optical,,,, but if you want to run the optical directly from a BD player to the Vizio all is fine unless you want to watch a DTS encoded BD,,,, thats a big deal breaker for me right there.

If I get a projector I will have no choice but to run an optical from a BD player to a soundbar and since the Vizio wont take DTS and the JVC will, it makes that choice kinda simple.

But here is another problem,, when running optical from my BD player and playing a non-DTS BluRay the sound was better with the Vizio than taking the optical from my displays optical output,, in other words, the Vizio sounded much better with the optical feed coming from my BD player than it did coming from my panels optical feed.
But since you cant run the Vizio with a direct optical feed from a BD player and get DTS you have to use your display, which de-grades the sound in my opinion.

Is this post long enough yet,,,,, I can go on longer

Anyhow,,, I thought it best to explain that I now consider the JVC TH-BA1 to be the better overall soundbar when up against the Vizio VHT210,,, and like I said,,, its just not the DTS issue,,,, but it was the DTS issue that caused me to un-box the JVC and re-test both soundbars again.

And I do apologize for any pain or suffering I caused anyone by changing my opinion.

Cheers
Davyo
post #35 of 141
Interesting. So let me see if I understand:

If you go from the BR player to the TV and then the TV to the sound-bar (i.e., route your sound through your TV), then the DTS issues isn't an issue. (why is that, exactly?)

If you go straight from the BR player to the bar, then you won't be able to hear sound from any BR disc that only has a DTS track. (Don't the BR discs have options of what kind of sound track to use? Or do they have one option?)
post #36 of 141
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corribus View Post

Interesting. So let me see if I understand:

If you go from the BR player to the TV and then the TV to the sound-bar (i.e., route your sound through your TV), then the DTS issues isn't an issue. (why is that, exactly?)

If you go straight from the BR player to the bar, then you won't be able to hear sound from any BR disc that only has a DTS track. (Don't the BR discs have options of what kind of sound track to use? Or do they have one option?)

First question/answer,,,, correct, DTS is not an issue if your passing thru your display to the Vizio soundbar,,, but the reason is that the DTS signal is converted down to a 2.1 signal when it pass's thru your displays optical.

Second question/answer,,,,, correct, you will not be able to hear a BR disc that only has DTS if your putting that feed from your BD player to the Vizio directly.
My 'War Of The Worlds" BR disc does not allow the selection of another track to use other than DTS and my Panasonic BD player would not let me change it either,, I went thru all the disc menus and my BD player menus to try and change it from DTS and was not able to.

Im not sure if other BD players can do this (change a BR disc from DTS to Dolby Digital for example) because I have never had this issue before or the need to do that.

If anyone has an answer for that I would love to hear it.

Cheers
Davyo
post #37 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by davyo View Post

Second question/answer,,,,, correct, you will not be able to hear a BR disc that only has DTS if your putting that feed from your BD player to the Vizio directly.
My 'War Of The Worlds" BR disc does not allow the selection of another track to use other than DTS and my Panasonic BD player would not let me change it either,, I went thru all the disc menus and my BD player menus to try and change it from DTS and was not able to.

Im not sure if other BD players can do this (change a BR disc from DTS to Dolby Digital for example) because I have never had this issue before or the need to do that.

If anyone has an answer for that I would love to hear it.

Cheers
Davyo

Did you try setting the BD player to PCM output? I have a Panny (DMP-BD60) and according to the OM, when using digital out (optical or coax), everything gets downconverted to 2 ch. PCM when you set output to PCM. So you'd have the same result as if you connected the BD player to the TV and output over its optical to the bar.
post #38 of 141
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Possumgirl View Post

Did you try setting the BD player to PCM output? I have a Panny (DMP-BD60) and according to the OM, when using digital out (optical or coax), everything gets downconverted to 2 ch. PCM when you set output to PCM. So you'd have the same result as if you connected the BD player to the TV and output over its optical to the bar.

Hey Possumgirl,,,,,,, yep, I tried every setting on my Panny BD60 (I also have that BD player).
With the BD60 player, PCM sends raw audio out,,,, PCM downmixed is when it sends the 2.1 signal and also choosing the surround format will affect the PCM feed.

Cheers
Davyo
post #39 of 141
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Possumgirl View Post

Did you try setting the BD player to PCM output? I have a Panny (DMP-BD60) and according to the OM, when using digital out (optical or coax), everything gets downconverted to 2 ch. PCM when you set output to PCM. So you'd have the same result as if you connected the BD player to the TV and output over its optical to the bar.

Ok,,,, a correction for Possum and everyone else,,,, and also some time for me to eat some crow.

You CAN connect the Vizio directly to a BD player and get it to accept a DTS feed,,,, after Possums post and a few others I dug out my BD player manual and found I had missed the setting option in my BD player for DTS to PCM.

Perhaps we could re-name this thread "Davyo is a dumb-ass".

With the Vizio now getting a DTS PCM feed it works and plays fine,,,, no longer any issues with DTS and the Vizio VHT210,,,,, before anyone rags on me for posting incorrect information, dont bother,,,, I already feel bad enough.

As a soundbar junkie I always try to give the most honest, best, opinions of any bar I am posting about and in this case I screwed up,,,, my personal apology to the Vizio VHT210,,, I hope I didnt hurt it's feelers.

In light of my screw-up has my opinions of the Vizio vs the JVC changed ?,,, a little,,, with the DTS to PCM feed the dialog did get much better with the Vizio so the dialog is not overpowered by the surround effects as they were in my other shoot-out.

As far as which bar I think is better,,,, at this point Im going to say they are both completly equal.
As far as which bar am I going to keep and which one gets returned,,, I dont know that one either,,, if I had to pick between one bar or the other I guess I would say I would keep the JVC,,,, aside from my DTS issue being resolved I still think the JVC has the slight edge in overall sound quality.

Im thinkin I might just keep both soundbars and change them up every so often when I get bored.

Ok,,,, Im going to go crawl in a hole now because of my screw-up

Cheers
Davyo
post #40 of 141
Has anybody seen one of these at any store besides Target? I had heard that Costco and perhaps Sam's Club would carry them as well.
post #41 of 141
Does anyone know where to buy any soundbars in Canada?
The only one I can find is the Samsung 450.
I"m looking for the vizio, or JVC...
post #42 of 141
Davyo, since I started reading the soundbar forum some months ago, I've learned sooo much from your posts (and from others) that it's nice to be able to contribute something useful in return.
post #43 of 141
Just went to my local Target...no sign of one of these...not even a display unit or a shelf tag. Of course, the person at the electronics counter had no clue what I was talking about. They did have the Samsung though, for $299, but it also was not on display...just one sitting on the shelf in a box.
post #44 of 141
Ok I am thinking of getting one of these bad boys, but I am very new to soundbars so I am wondering if someone can answer some quick questions I have.

1. There is no need for a AVR?
2. I have a DVDO Edge so I am wondering if I can still use this. Can I run all my sound to the Edge and then to the soundbar?
post #45 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by factorz View Post

Ok I am thinking of getting one of these bad boys, but I am very new to soundbars so I am wondering if someone can answer some quick questions I have.

1. There is no need for a AVR?
2. I have a DVDO Edge so I am wondering if I can still use this. Can I run all my sound to the Edge and then to the soundbar?

1. Correct. No need for an AVR.
2. Not sure. Does the Edge over either analog or digital outputs. The Vizio has one of each. Digital would be better for most of your components.
post #46 of 141
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Possumgirl View Post

Davyo, since I started reading the soundbar forum some months ago, I've learned sooo much from your posts (and from others) that it's nice to be able to contribute something useful in return.

Thank you for the kind words, and thank you for your help as well Possum.

Cheers
Davyo
post #47 of 141
I just bought the Vizio VHT210 and I was wondering if anyone knows what the SRS TruSurround HD does. I am not sure if I should turn it on or off.

So far I like what I hear but I am comparing it to the speakers from my LCD TV. Haha. Thanks for all of your information regarding soundbars everyone. It really helped me pick this product with very little knowledge of audio equipment.

One more thing, I am going to connect my soundbar to my Airport Express so I can play music from my computer through my soundbar. I was wondering if I should use the optical for the TV or the Airport Express. Anyways, any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
post #48 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by drfreeman60 View Post

1. Correct. No need for an AVR.
2. Not sure. Does the Edge over either analog or digital outputs. The Vizio has one of each. Digital would be better for most of your components.

Well right now I run all my components via HDMI to the Edge and then the Edge to the TV. Since my AVR is older I have to do a separate optical from my cable box to the Edge>AVR.
post #49 of 141
Thread Starter 
Well, it's offical, as much as I like the Vizio VHT210 I am retruning it today and keeping the JVC TH-BA1 soundbar.

After spending the last week comparing the two side by side the JVC in the end was the winner.

A few notes: After I did figure out what a dumbass I was in not setting my BD player to properly send a DTS signal to the Vizio and resolved the DTS issue I did find that dialog on the Vizio was not as good with the DTS sent as PCM to the Vizio.

Being able to send the JVC a bitstream signal really makes it excell over the Vizio as the JVC will decode DTS and Dolby Digital, the DTS dialog was way better then that of the Vizio.

The JVC's two optical connections are also a nice plus over the Vizio's one optical connection.

As far as the surround effect, the Vizio does have a "slightly" more pronounced effect but the dialog suffers a tiny bit, while the JVC has better dialog with just a hair less surround effect, but you would be hard pressed to tell the difference in the amount of surround effect unless you had both bars sitting side by side.

Anyhow, it's important to say many of my opinions are just splitting hairs, they are both great soundbars but in the end, for me, the JVC TH-BA1 is the keeper.

Cheers
Davyo
post #50 of 141
I did some fooling around with my system and after much learning on the forum, I will be changing my setup for a more wonderful configuration. I have 4 -8 1/2" surround sound speakers in my ceiling so I must have an AVR for optimal use of those speakers. I had run everything through my TV with optical out to the AVR and optical out from the AVR to the sound bar and it sounded fine. Once I learned that my TV optical out wasn't allowing for even 5.1 I knew I must change this up.

One thing that disappoints me is that my AVR is a Sony 7.1 str-dg800 purchased in 6/06. I liked the unit at the time because it allowed for 2 HDMI in's and one out. However, I forgot, for some reason that the HDMI is only a pass through for video and audio and the audio passed through will only be audible in the component that it is passed through to. Not sure why the heck it was made like this but I am going to have to run HDMI and opticals to to the receiver for the ultimate experience. I set this up using my PS3 and put in the new Star Trek BR and the overall sound and picture was amazing. Much better response and clarity that with the previous setup. I can't wait to go home tonight and set up the entire system.
post #51 of 141
so biglurp are you saying sound out from the sound bar and the 4 ceilings at same time? what is your center speaker? sorry i am confused about your set up. i have 5.1 but all of my speakers are in the ceiling except the sub. dialogue from the center is problematic.
post #52 of 141
davyo: How do you have your JVC or Vizio connected? I do not have a BluRay player at my townhouse so the only thing that would be needed to be plugged in is my Xbox 360 and my cable box. The 360 would be plugged in using HDMI. Would I simply route these into the tv and then route the sound out from the tv to the sound bar?

I want to make sure either option will work as I'm going to be purchasing a new tv in the next 2 weeks and I will be picking up a soundbar at the time as well.
post #53 of 141
I hooked this up and started to watch Iron Man in HD from my apple TV and I can say it is not bad. It is much better then my TV speakers on my Viera but I cannot say that is surround sound it does sound like the sound is coming from the sides of the room. The room is 14' x 12' so it is a good shape for surround sound. I bought this a few days ago and was looking at other after I bought it and came across a great deal for a Yamaha YSP-4100 for $1,225 at abes of main with a 3 year warranty the store ended up being a few mile from my new place so I bought it and should be able to test the difference in the next 2 to 3 days and tell you what I think.
post #54 of 141
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyr135 View Post

I hooked this up and started to watch Iron Man in HD from my apple TV and I can say it is not bad. It is much better then my TV speakers on my Viera but I cannot say that is surround sound it does sound like the sound is coming from the sides of the room. The room is 14' x 12' so it is a good shape for surround sound. I bought this a few days ago and was looking at other after I bought it and came across a great deal for a Yamaha YSP-4100 for $1,225 at abes of main with a 3 year warranty the store ended up being a few mile from my new place so I bought it and should be able to test the difference in the next 2 to 3 days and tell you what I think.

When you say "I hooked this up" Im guessing the "this" is the Vizio bar ??,,, not sure as the JVC bar is also being talked about as well.

Anyhow,,,, what kind of audio feed do you have from your Apple TV and how did you have it hooked up to the Vizio,,,, just asking because having had the Vizio VHT210 I can say the surround effect was pretty darn good with more than enough sound coming from the sides of the room.

What you feed the Vizio and where you have it placed can make or break it, same goes for any other soundbar as well.

Cheers
Davyo
post #55 of 141
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon Gekko View Post

davyo: How do you have your JVC or Vizio connected? I do not have a BluRay player at my townhouse so the only thing that would be needed to be plugged in is my Xbox 360 and my cable box. The 360 would be plugged in using HDMI. Would I simply route these into the tv and then route the sound out from the tv to the sound bar?

I want to make sure either option will work as I'm going to be purchasing a new tv in the next 2 weeks and I will be picking up a soundbar at the time as well.

Yes,, you would be fine running everything into your TV and then run optical out from the TV to the Vizio.

I stuck with my JVC and returned the Vizio,,, the way I have my JVC hooked up is both opticals on the JVC bar are being fed the opticals from my BluRay and HD DVD player's,, for HD cable I used the RCA's from my display to the JVC bar,,,,, thats how I have everything hooked up at the moment.

Cheers
Davyo
post #56 of 141
davyo i am probably dumb but does the new vizio or the jvc have 3 separate channels plus sub? reason i ask is if not what good does it do that it accepts dts and dolby signal if you are only getting make believe. some soundbars advertise they have 3 channels and some even say 5 plus out to sub.
post #57 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by vhi View Post

davyo i am probably dumb but does the new vizio or the jvc have 3 separate channels plus sub? reason i ask is if not what good does it do that it accepts dts and dolby signal if you are only getting make believe. some soundbars advertise they have 3 channels and some even say 5 plus out to sub.

The JVC is a 4.1 system using usin four channels of amplification to simulate R/L/C/S. The new Vizio appear to be exactly the same with the addition of two tweeters to enhance the high frequencies.

There are a few soundbars that actually have three front channels plus simulated surround. However, most synthesize their channels, other than L/R from the input whether 2, 5 or more channels.

The only soundbars I have read about (have not heard) that do true 5 channel sound are the units from KEF, B&W, and several other high end manufacturers. These units cost quite a bit more money than the powered soundbars which are the greatest part of the discussion on these forums. The high end units are unpowered and would require a five channel amplifier or receiver and appropriate five channel source material. From most of the reviews, you do hear all five channels, but all five channels come mainly from the front and slightly beyond the sides of the speakers and do not constitue surround. With a receiver or preamp with appropriate controls for sound delay and phase shift, these could probably be made to give a very realistic presentation of surround.

Even Yamaha's Sound Projectors costing from 1k to 2k only do simulated surround. They can do a good simulation, but not true 5.1.
post #58 of 141
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by drfreeman60 View Post

The JVC is a 4.1 system using usin four channels of amplification to simulate R/L/C/S. The new Vizio appear to be exactly the same with the addition of two tweeters to enhance the high frequencies.

As far as my understanding is, the JVC is using 4 discrete channels,,, Left, Right, Left Surround, Right Surround,,, with the Center channel being sent to both the front Left/Right speakers.

The Vizio is using 2 discrete channels into the bar, stereo, and then turning that into a surround sound.

Im fairly certain thats how each bar is working,, but not 100% sure,,,, only 92% sure .

Cheers
Davyo
post #59 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Big 'O' View Post

Does anyone know where to buy any soundbars in Canada?
The only one I can find is the Samsung 450.
I"m looking for the vizio, or JVC...

good question
i am also interest know the answer
post #60 of 141
got it. thanks for clearing me up.
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