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Lion King Blu-ray Discussion Thread for Audio and Video - Page 3

post #61 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmcube View Post

That change in the reflection shot, couldn't that be to accommodate the darkening that happens after wearing the 3D glasses? They want to make sure you can still see Mufasa. Just a guess.

The increased saturation, sure. What caught my eye was the pixellation.

Quote:


Edit: can someone point out the redrawn elements for me? having trouble spotting them.

The bottom few layers of flamingos and a lot of the smoke in the Scar shot, though I assume those were obvious. The grass in the zebra shot appears to be redone, for some reason. The grass behind those birds in the water, whatever they are. Also the edges of the rocks on the left in the Pride Rock fly-in.
post #62 of 170
At least they've restored the scrolling credits. The one thing that really nagged me about the old DVD were those tacky-looking static credits (which presumably was purely to save on bitrate to use elsewhere in the film). Call me a nit-picker, but I enjoy sitting through the credits of films and enjoying the music. To me, having such TV-esque credits just takes you out of the moment somehow.
post #63 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by chirpie View Post

Time to eat crow from my initial look.

Well I've been flipping through the art book and watching the clips... Some color shifts really don't bother me much but there are a few things that are hard to ignore. Nala in particular is WAAAAY off. She practically looks the same as Simba in the BR. Her feminine desaturated color is basically gone.

Like some others said, it looked like the trailer had been cooked a little on the edges of lines, but overall, for color, I think just about all of it is way more accurate. And the cropping, why?

Really, it's not like it's a poor release, but I have a really fond connection to this film and I can't help but be just a tiny bit disappointed.

Her coat in the french br is a bit brighter than the dvd but still not nearly as bright as Simba's.
post #64 of 170
Well, since it'll be another 10 years before we see it again (probably in a lesser-quality PPV format from the internet) I guess I'll have to buy it now even with the changes.

2D for me.

Did they remix it to 7.1?
post #65 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ Mike TJG View Post

At least they've restored the scrolling credits. The one thing that really nagged me about the old DVD were those tacky-looking static credits (which presumably was purely to save on bitrate to use elsewhere in the film). Call me a nit-picker, but I enjoy sitting through the credits of films and enjoying the music. To me, having such TV-esque credits just takes you out of the moment somehow.

Agreed. I enjoy reliving that "first theater experience" many times by sitting through the credits of a really enjoyable film... especially when the closing theme-song seals the deal.
post #66 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post

Did they remix it to 7.1?

Yeah, it's a giant 5.6Mbps 24-bit track.
post #67 of 170
i restored the original 1994 theatrical trailer using the trailer from cav collecters edition laserdisc as a blueprint. this is a 100% replication of the trailer. enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWZ4yRb0xGo
post #68 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenDERmac View Post

i restored the original 1994 theatrical trailer using the trailer from cav collecters edition laserdisc as a blueprint. this is a 100% replication of the trailer. enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWZ4yRb0xGo

Cool concept!
post #69 of 170
Ok, so, just came back from seeing this in the theater in 3d (got stuck in traffic & so missed some of the fantastic opening number! )

Anyway, my impressions:

In general, very well done. The one thing I went in concerned about with the conversion was indeed an issue... with the cell animation, much of the content that consisted of large patches of identical, unbroken color tended to "flatten out". In other words, if there was a good deal of shading or gradient, your eyes have a point of reference and objects seem round and fleshed out. Unfortunately, with traditional animation like this, there is quite a bit of solid color content, and most of it is in the foreground characters (moving figures tend to get less shading than static objects, as it makes for more fluid motion). In this sense, background elements and scenery worked better in many instances.

Things that also worked well included jungle scenes, scenes with expanses of grass in the foreground... basically anything with multiple layer elements moving across each other. Stylized scenes (such as the musical numbers) were also very effective.

I don't know much about how they approached the conversion process, but seeing as how the elements were originally loaded into the digital realm for coloring, it's possible (seemed probable from what I saw) that they had different layer elements already separated, and this could have accommodated the work done on creating depth (meaning they wouldn't have to generate content that wasn't there for the second eye view). There were many scenes with movement & panning, and at no point did I spot any artifacts that seemed related to 2d-3d conversion.

I specifically watched for the color timing, since there has been talk on these boards about tinting or recoloring. First off, the zebra stripes in the "Can't Wait to be King" number lean toward green, as in the screen shots posted, rather than blue/gray. In that sense I think this is good, since the blu-ray seems to match the theatrical release, or at least this latest master. Now, whether it matches what went to print in '94, I don't know, but at least we're getting something consistent with what's on the big screen now. Keep in mind that the number is very stylized, though, and I can tell you the zebras fit right in. Stripes elsewhere in the film were definitely black/charcoal gray, so definitely an artistic choice.

The water in that same scene was turquoise. Simba & Nala's coats were discernably different from each other, but not drastically so; certainly closer to each other than the screen shots from the dvd.

Aspect ratio looked to be abut 1:78, but honestly I don't know if I could have spotted the difference between that and 1:85. I won't comment on sound (let's just say it was not fantastic)... but the theater I went to was an older, art deco affair, so it was probably the venue.

In any case, I did enjoy the evening, and I will be picking up the blu. YMMV, but I hope these comments were helpful.
post #70 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebard View Post

I won't comment on sound (let's just say it was not fantastic)... but the theater I went to was an older, art deco affair, so it was probably the venue.

I thought there was something wrong with my theater (which usually has good sound), but I've heard several reports of bad sound here and on blu-ray.com. The mix was really flat and weak. I really hope that's not what's on the bluray.
post #71 of 170
Hang on.. so which version has better PQ? The 2D release or the 3D release?

Is it just me or does the 3D version have some depth-of-field effect added even when viewed in 2D? The backgrounds look blurred.
post #72 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebard View Post

I don't know much about how they approached the conversion process, but seeing as how the elements were originally loaded into the digital realm for coloring, it's possible (seemed probable from what I saw) that they had different layer elements already separated, and this could have accommodated the work done on creating depth (meaning they wouldn't have to generate content that wasn't there for the second eye view).

Right, conversion is easier with modern animated films, since individual elements can be shifted to create perspectives for each eye.

Thanx for the detailed review. Worth catching again on the big screen one last time.
post #73 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by 42041 View Post

I thought there was something wrong with my theater (which usually has good sound), but I've heard several reports of bad sound here and on blu-ray.com. The mix was really flat and weak. I really hope that's not what's on the bluray.

I noticed the same thing with my theaters print. The sound never really seem to have a centre channel working. Voices seem to be coming mainly from the left and right front speakers. My theater just had all the speakers replaced but yeah i agree on the issue. The 3D though really worked well for the film. Playing the 5.1 mix (don't have 7.1 setup) I'm sure the blu-ray will be fine though as we were playing it in Dolby(like all digital prints) and not the DTS-HDMA track the blu-ray will have.
post #74 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebard View Post

Ok, so, just came back from seeing this in the theater in 3d (got stuck in traffic & so missed some of the fantastic opening number! )

Anyway, my impressions:

In general, very well done. The one thing I went in concerned about with the conversion was indeed an issue... with the cell animation, much of the content that consisted of large patches of identical, unbroken color tended to "flatten out". In other words, if there was a good deal of shading or gradient, your eyes have a point of reference and objects seem round and fleshed out. Unfortunately, with traditional animation like this, there is quite a bit of solid color content, and most of it is in the foreground characters (moving figures tend to get less shading than static objects, as it makes for more fluid motion). In this sense, background elements and scenery worked better in many instances.

Things that also worked well included jungle scenes, scenes with expanses of grass in the foreground... basically anything with multiple layer elements moving across each other. Stylized scenes (such as the musical numbers) were also very effective.

I don't know much about how they approached the conversion process, but seeing as how the elements were originally loaded into the digital realm for coloring, it's possible (seemed probable from what I saw) that they had different layer elements already separated, and this could have accommodated the work done on creating depth (meaning they wouldn't have to generate content that wasn't there for the second eye view). There were many scenes with movement & panning, and at no point did I spot any artifacts that seemed related to 2d-3d conversion.

I specifically watched for the color timing, since there has been talk on these boards about tinting or recoloring. First off, the zebra stripes in the "Can't Wait to be King" number lean toward green, as in the screen shots posted, rather than blue/gray. In that sense I think this is good, since the blu-ray seems to match the theatrical release, or at least this latest master. Now, whether it matches what went to print in '94, I don't know, but at least we're getting something consistent with what's on the big screen now. Keep in mind that the number is very stylized, though, and I can tell you the zebras fit right in. Stripes elsewhere in the film were definitely black/charcoal gray, so definitely an artistic choice.

The water in that same scene was turquoise. Simba & Nala's coats were discernably different from each other, but not drastically so; certainly closer to each other than the screen shots from the dvd.

Aspect ratio looked to be abut 1:78, but honestly I don't know if I could have spotted the difference between that and 1:85. I won't comment on sound (let's just say it was not fantastic)... but the theater I went to was an older, art deco affair, so it was probably the venue.

In any case, I did enjoy the evening, and I will be picking up the blu. YMMV, but I hope these comments were helpful.

Regarding the 3D conversion,

did the characters feel "round" or "flat"? I'm hoping that the effect isn't like flat card-board pop-up images, but rather more like naturally dimensioned characters, in real space, but I can't imagine how they'd create "round" characters out of the flat cel paintings.
post #75 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaViD Boulet View Post

Regarding the 3D conversion,

did the characters feel "round" or "flat"? I'm hoping that the effect isn't like flat card-board pop-up images, but rather more like naturally dimensioned characters, in real space, but I can't imagine how they'd create "round" characters out of the flat cel paintings.

Anything with a good amount of shading or detail looked good... scenery, background elements, static or panned mattes (trees, branches, etc.). Characters were just ok at best; if they had patterns (spots, stripes) that the eye could use as a point of reference they fared well, otherwise they suffered from the "diorama effect". Thus giraffes & zebras did ok, while rhinos (& unfortunately lions) looked flat.

The problem, I think, is that the shadow gradients give your eyes the cues they need to infer depth beyond the parallax offset. Once you get past the object's edge, if there is just an expanse of solid color you have no reference, and your brain flattens it out.
post #76 of 170
For some reason, I brain-farted and thought that I was in the Transformers 3 thread. When I was reading thebard's impressions, it took me four paragraphs to realize he was talking about The Lion King lol! I scratched my head over some of the things he was talking about, but suddenly all of it makes sense haha.
post #77 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by muffinmcfluffin View Post

For some reason, I brain-farted and thought that I was in the Transformers 3 thread. When I was reading thebard's impressions, it took me four paragraphs to realize he was talking about The Lion King lol! I scratched my head over some of the things he was talking about, but suddenly all of it makes sense haha.

lol!

"Look into the sky, Simba. The kings of our past are up there, watching us... searching for the all spark..."
post #78 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebard View Post

lol!

"Look into the sky, Simba. The kings of our past are up there, watching us... searching for the all spark..."

Haha!

Even when you spoke about zebras, I was thinking of the scene where they run away from Megatron in the desert. Then I saw "Can't Wait to be King," and was like... what the ****? LOL
post #79 of 170
Anybody know whether Lion King 1 1/2 will ever be released separately from the box set? I'm only interested in Lion King (not even the 3D-ized version) and Lion King 1 1/2 and trying not to buy the $80 boxset just for two movies.
post #80 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

Anybody know whether Lion King 1 1/2 will ever be released separately from the box set? I'm only interested in Lion King (not even the 3D-ized version) and Lion King 1 1/2 and trying not to buy the $80 boxset just for two movies.

You should be able to pick this set up for far less than $80... just be patient and do a little shopping around. Even at $50 it would be about the same price as buying 2 separate Disney Blu-ray titles.
post #81 of 170
really? The best price so far I can find (that ships to Canada) is $70 before shipping.
post #82 of 170
Highdefdigest posted a review that basically says Lion King blu-ray in 3D is awesome and one of the best...
post #83 of 170
I saw a commercial for the Blu-ray and realized that I hadn't seen this movie in probably close to 15 years. I'll probably buy it since I remember liking it (not to mention I had a blast seeing it in theaters for my sixth birthday.

I always thought that a better title for the second film would be The Lion King II: Simba's Pissed. Seriously, I think that describes about 80% of the movie.
post #84 of 170
What's really a big deal-breaker is, that the blu-ray (2D and 3D) is missing the retreating clouds after the "remember who you are" scene. dvd and BD. Taken from the German Lion King Forum.

I own the French 3D Blu-Ray (which includes the 2D Version as well) and both versions, 2D and 3D, are missing the clouds - one of the most emotional scenes in the film for me. Can't believe how Disney could screw this up...
post #85 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siran View Post

What's really a big deal-breaker is, that the blu-ray (2D and 3D) is missing the retreating clouds after the "remember who you are" scene. dvd and BD. Taken from the German Lion King Forum.

I own the French 3D Blu-Ray (which includes the 2D Version as well) and both versions, 2D and 3D, are missing the clouds - one of the most emotional scenes in the film for me. Can't believe how Disney could screw this up...

What in the world? That's such an obvious foul up that I have a hard time believing it. Good grief.
post #86 of 170
Hm - almost like it's been deliberately removed.... why would they do that
post #87 of 170
From what I could gather, the clouds weren't in the IMAX version that was running in 2003 as well Link. So if they took the IMAX-version as master, maybe thats why the clouds didn't make it onto the blu-ray. But then again, this does'nt speak for Disney's quality assurance department...
post #88 of 170
Maybe it made people think of the 9/11 smoke?

Seriously, why an edit like that was made to the original artwork, I have no idea...
post #89 of 170
so no movie should have anymore cloud and smoke ever because of 9/11?
post #90 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

so no movie should have anymore cloud and smoke ever because of 9/11?

I didn't want to include this image the first time around, but now I suppose it's necessary...

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