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Star Trek TNG Seasons Remastered on Blu-Ray - Page 75

post #2221 of 2373
12/5/12 at 8:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post

Perhaps more worrisome, what about season 5 and maybe 7?
5 and 7 aren't worrisome, because we already know CBS Digital will be handling them completely in-house. It's seasons 4 and 6 that will be farmed out for VFX.
Edited by SpHeRe31459 - 12/5/12 at 8:37pm
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post #2222 of 2373
12/5/12 at 8:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Would that be the fault of the compositing, or the original model photography?

HTV's work definitely isn't that great, but you're right at least some of the shots are almost certainly from the model photography. The 2ft Enterprise model that was used in the 1st and 2nd seasons lacks detailing and has far less internal lighting due to the small size of the model, and it's pretty clear the 2-footer was used a bunch in Season 2. It is used in a lot of the Borg cube confrontation shots of Q Who? to help with the scaling issues between the Enterprise and Cube's actual physical model sizes (which in real life weren't that different from one another) and it is also used in most of the vortex shots in Time Squared.

The poor detail and internal lighting of the 2-foot model and the unwieldy to shoot 6 foot model is exactly why they scratch built a new in-between 4 foot size for Season 3.
Edited by SpHeRe31459 - 12/5/12 at 8:40pm
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post #2223 of 2373
12/5/12 at 9:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpHeRe31459 View Post

HTV's work definitely isn't that great, but you're right at least some of the shots are almost certainly from the model photography. The 2ft Enterprise model that was used in the 1st and 2nd seasons lacks detailing and has far less internal lighting due to the small size of the model, and it's pretty clear the 2-footer was used a bunch in Season 2. It is used in a lot of the Borg cube confrontation shots of Q Who? to help with the scaling issues between the Enterprise and Cube's actual physical model sizes (which in real life weren't that different from one another) and it is also used in most of the vortex shots in Time Squared.
The poor detail and internal lighting of the 2-foot model and the unwieldy to shoot 6 foot model is exactly why they scratch built a new in-between 4 foot size for Season 3.

The 2-footer had almost no lighting: the windows were actually coated in the reflective paint they used in highway signs!

The 6-footer was only unwieldy for Image-G which had a small crew and stage. ILM had no problems at all using it and it's superior.
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post #2224 of 2373
12/5/12 at 10:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

S3 is already looking much, much better. But what about 4 & 6? Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
]

Doesn't some of the bridge lighting seem overly bright/yellowish in some of that footage? confused.gif

That Picard stunt double is *really* obvious in that shot where he tackles Finn in that shot from The High Ground.

PS: Seth, it was the summer of 1990 that we waited for The Best of Both Worlds, Part II. biggrin.gif
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post #2225 of 2373
12/6/12 at 5:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterTHX View Post

Doesn't some of the bridge lighting seem overly bright/yellowish in some of that footage? confused.gif

No more than I remember it being from previous iterations, but that's wholly subjective. You could double check it on Netflix or the DVD if you have it.

I will say that is probably then best-looking YouTube video I've seen in a while - the detail in some of those closeups is incredible. I can only hope that the Blu-ray makes it to my door looking that good. (By that I mean that I hope no DNR is applied.)

Also, THANK GOD for the pipeless uniforms! biggrin.gif
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post #2226 of 2373
12/6/12 at 4:25pm
in season 3 the bridge did get much brighter lit/look.

but these live action shots in the trailer are definitely too close or blown out, I suspect
they have not yet been color corrected to proper viewing luminance levels.
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post #2227 of 2373
12/6/12 at 6:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpHeRe31459 View Post

HTV's work definitely isn't that great, but you're right at least some of the shots are almost certainly from the model photography. The 2ft Enterprise model that was used in the 1st and 2nd seasons lacks detailing and has far less internal lighting due to the small size of the model, and it's pretty clear the 2-footer was used a bunch in Season 2. It is used in a lot of the Borg cube confrontation shots of Q Who? to help with the scaling issues between the Enterprise and Cube's actual physical model sizes (which in real life weren't that different from one another) and it is also used in most of the vortex shots in Time Squared.
The poor detail and internal lighting of the 2-foot model and the unwieldy to shoot 6 foot model is exactly why they scratch built a new in-between 4 foot size for Season 3.

CBSD didn't have any trouble making it look fine in Season 1....
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterTHX View Post

Doesn't some of the bridge lighting seem overly bright/yellowish in some of that footage? confused.gif
That Picard stunt double is *really* obvious in that shot where he tackles Finn in that shot from The High Ground.
PS: Seth, it was the summer of 1990 that we waited for The Best of Both Worlds, Part II. biggrin.gif

Season 3+ went with much different lighting and cinematography, along with the change of uniforms and much better filmstock. Expect the Hotel bridge to really pop (and the lighting on the Enterprise to be much less moody)
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post #2228 of 2373
12/7/12 at 10:10am
So I bit the bullet and bought Season 2 yesterday and watched a couple episodes last night (2 with minimal Pulaski involvement, lol!). IMO, there's a noticeable drop in image quality between what I've seen so far and season 1.

"Q Who?" frankly looked almost like an upscale in many live action scenes although every now and then, a close-up of one of the characters would reveal remarkable detail and sharpness compared to the previous dvd release. I did notice some of the glowing red and blue effects on the model shots of the Enterprise (especially the last shot) kind of mismatching or fluctuating in shape like a badly cut matte. I can imagine cramming so many episodes onto a single disc doesn't help the quality either.
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post #2229 of 2373
12/7/12 at 5:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post

I can imagine cramming so many episodes onto a single disc doesn't help the quality either.
That's kind of weird thing to say, Season 1 had the same number of episodes per disc (in fact Season 2 has fewer episodes due to the 1988 writer's strike)... It was the poor handling of the content during the remastering process plain and simple.
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post #2230 of 2373
12/7/12 at 8:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpHeRe31459 View Post

That's kind of weird thing to say, Season 1 had the same number of episodes per disc (in fact Season 2 has fewer episodes due to the 1988 writer's strike)... It was the poor handling of the content during the remastering process plain and simple.

As far as I know they cut some of the lesser audio, and have a bit more extra features, plus the extended and hybrid cuts of Measure of a Man. Either way, 5 discs was pushing it last season...

There's a noticeable difference between EAFP from the sampler and season 1. In fact, so much so that season 1 is the reference cut of it for those who were thinking of getting rid of the sampler.
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post #2231 of 2373
12/7/12 at 9:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Either way, 5 discs was pushing it last season...
There's a noticeable difference between EAFP from the sampler and season 1. In fact, so much so that season 1 is the reference cut of it for those who were thinking of getting rid of the sampler.

Season 1 was 6 discs. Counting EAF as two episodes, the discs were split 4/5/5/5/5/2.

Season 2 is 5 discs, and split 5/4(+extended episode)/5/5/3.
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post #2232 of 2373
12/8/12 at 10:47am
Never have I been so interested in watching special features on a disc, usually they just put me to sleep but in TNG they are so interesting that I wish they have more of these special features! I love knowing how they use all the low tech special effects and less of the CGI that are mostly used nowadays.

Now every time I put a disc in, I watched the special features first before the actual shows haha!
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post #2233 of 2373
12/8/12 at 11:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbotron View Post

Season 1 was 6 discs. Counting EAF as two episodes, the discs were split 4/5/5/5/5/2.
Season 2 is 5 discs, and split 5/4(+extended episode)/5/5/3.

Yup, excuse me for having a bit too many winter IPA's last night. You're right.

But I do believe while disc 1 had only 4 episodes, it also had some of the extras which ate into the bitrates. I'm still wish they'd throw in an extra disc and up the bitrate a tad.
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post #2234 of 2373
12/8/12 at 5:05pm
Two completely unrelated things:

1. I have a local used store holding a set of season one on Blu-ray for me. I confirmed (saw the discs and packaging) that it is the original release and the discs are the original discs, not the exchanged/corrected ones. The question is... Are they still offering corrected/replacement discs if you contact them? And is the method for proof unique to the discs or generic? I ask because of the concern that perhaps someone bought this set, called and got replacement discs, then sold the originals for some reason and that IF I purchased this set and attempted to get the discs replaced for myself that I might get denied.

The price (tax included) is $48... so I am hoping the answers are that I'll be able to get this set and get corrected discs without a problem. I can't call the exchange phone number on the weekend, and the store is only holding the set for me until the end of day tomorrow (Sunday) so I will have to make a decision by then. I am obviously hoping for good answers at this price.

2. Regarding Season two problems... I'm not saying it is the end of the world... but I remember some who said people were over-panicking about Season one problems... some saying CBS cared more and wouldn't let anything like that happen again... and yet from what I'm reading it sure sounds like more problems to me. I would have liked to think there were lessons-learned from season one and replacing discs... but putting out another set with problems... and some very obvious ones at that... really speaks to the lack of quality control many of us were expecting with a project like this.
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post #2235 of 2373
12/8/12 at 6:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDMe2 View Post

Two completely unrelated things:
1. I have a local used store holding a set of season one on Blu-ray for me. I confirmed (saw the discs and packaging) that it is the original release and the discs are the original discs, not the exchanged/corrected ones. The question is... Are they still offering corrected/replacement discs if you contact them? And is the method for proof unique to the discs or generic? I ask because of the concern that perhaps someone bought this set, called and got replacement discs, then sold the originals for some reason and that IF I purchased this set and attempted to get the discs replaced for myself that I might get denied.
The price (tax included) is $48... so I am hoping the answers are that I'll be able to get this set and get corrected discs without a problem. I can't call the exchange phone number on the weekend, and the store is only holding the set for me until the end of day tomorrow (Sunday) so I will have to make a decision by then. I am obviously hoping for good answers at this price.
2. Regarding Season two problems... I'm not saying it is the end of the world... but I remember some who said people were over-panicking about Season one problems... some saying CBS cared more and wouldn't let anything like that happen again... and yet from what I'm reading it sure sounds like more problems to me. I would have liked to think there were lessons-learned from season one and replacing discs... but putting out another set with problems... and some very obvious ones at that... really speaks to the lack of quality control many of us were expecting with a project like this.

I can only maybe answer number 1. When people called in to get replacement discs they had to read off some numbers from the discs themselves. Whether these are generic numbers or unique disc ID's I dont know for sure. Perhaps the guy holding them can get you the numbers to find out?
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post #2236 of 2373
12/8/12 at 7:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoogerBomb View Post

I can only maybe answer number 1. When people called in to get replacement discs they had to read off some numbers from the discs themselves. Whether these are generic numbers or unique disc ID's I dont know for sure. Perhaps the guy holding them can get you the numbers to find out?

The numbers are lot or run numbers of each disc. Each disc in every set did not have a unique individual number so in that respect, the person asking shouldn't have a problem. I would assume CBS basically has a database of name/phone/address info for every one that called in to get replacement discs to not only avoid scammers who'd call in for multiple sets of fixed discs, but as future customer survey and advertising info.
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post #2237 of 2373
12/8/12 at 8:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoogerBomb View Post

I can only maybe answer number 1. When people called in to get replacement discs they had to read off some numbers from the discs themselves. Whether these are generic numbers or unique disc ID's I dont know for sure. Perhaps the guy holding them can get you the numbers to find out?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post

The numbers are lot or run numbers of each disc. Each disc in every set did not have a unique individual number so in that respect, the person asking shouldn't have a problem. I would assume CBS basically has a database of name/phone/address info for every one that called in to get replacement discs to not only avoid scammers who'd call in for multiple sets of fixed discs, but as future customer survey and advertising info.

Thanks to both of you... I was kind of thinking that they might be "lot" numbers or something like that, so CBS would know they were part of the defective initial run... and also I was thinking surely they keep track of people who called/emailed to ask for them so since I've never done that I was hoping I would be ok.

It's hard to pass up $48 total for this, still with the slipcover and everything... and logically, I couldn't think of why someone even would "scam" by buying the set, getting discs 1,3,4,5 and then selling the set... That would seem quite weird... so I was kind of thinking that probably whomever sold this to the store was someone who wasn't a huge fan, and just watched them once and didn't even know about the replacement program.

I explained all this to the guy at the store, and I'm in there a lot... so he offered to hold it for me until end of business tomorrow (Sunday)... and the soonest I could actually get a live person at the replacement # would be Monday morning... so I don't feel comfortable asking any more of the store than I already have.

I think I feel comfortable enough that I should be able to get the replacement discs, so I'll go ahead and pick this up tomorrow. The more I think about it, the less I'm concerned about possible problems, since I'll be a legitimate customer and I am betting probably the original owner here just wasn't even aware of the disc replacements.

I have seen before where people just don't know there is such a thing... the guy at the store, for instance, hadn't heard of it until I was explaining it to him.
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post #2238 of 2373
12/9/12 at 6:51pm
I went back and picked up the set earlier this evening... Man, people weren't lying... those numbers on the discs are impossibly small (well, I guess not impossibly since they are in fact there)... I'll have to get a magnifier handy for when I call in tomorrow.
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post #2239 of 2373
12/10/12 at 11:17am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post


The numbers are lot or run numbers of each disc. Each disc in every set did not have a unique individual number so in that respect, the person asking shouldn't have a problem. I would assume CBS basically has a database of name/phone/address info for every one that called in to get replacement discs to not only avoid scammers who'd call in for multiple sets of fixed discs, but as future customer survey and advertising info.

 

Actually the discs do have a unique number on each of them, at least all my discs had a different number.  They were similar so there might be a lot number embedded in the actual disc number, but the numbers on all the discs in the set were not the same.

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post #2240 of 2373
12/10/12 at 3:36pm
Yeah, each disc had a different number on it... but I'm not sure that any given set wouldn't have the same set of numbers on their discs.

In any event... I called this afternoon, only had to wait a minute or so... struggled with a magnifying glass and gave the number to the nice lady on the phone, and I should be getting replacements at some point.

I went ahead and watched the stuff on disc 6 (final 2 episodes + bonus content) since I've seen all these before, watching out of order wasn't an issue... and I wanted to see how they looked.

The high-definition is one thing... but what really jumps out at you are how much deeper and brighter all the colors are now.
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post #2241 of 2373
12/10/12 at 4:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morac View Post

Actually the discs do have a unique number on each of them, at least all my discs had a different number.  They were similar so there might be a lot number embedded in the actual disc number, but the numbers on all the discs in the set were not the same.

I guess I should have been more specific - what I meant was that each disc had lot numbers specific to their batch runs. So yeah, each of the 6 discs on season 1 have different numbers but I'm sure you'll find that say, many people who purchased their sets on the street date will have matching numbers as most of those discs came from the same initial production runs. For instance, on my S1 set, disc 1's number is:

SL109551B1RO
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post #2242 of 2373
12/25/12 at 11:40pm
I came to see what others thought. I'm watching season two and feeling like there is to much compression artifacts. The background in certain scenes can be a real mess at times. Wish they would've spread it out over more disks really..
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post #2243 of 2373
12/27/12 at 2:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtv00 View Post

I came to see what others thought. I'm watching season two and feeling like there is to much compression artifacts. The background in certain scenes can be a real mess at times. Wish they would've spread it out over more disks really..

compression artifacts? Do you mean grain?

The encoding for both seasons has been stellar.
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post #2244 of 2373
12/27/12 at 3:51pm
I've only seen season one thus far. Some scenes, particularly darkly-lit ones, have a lot of colourful noise in them, but I wouldn't say any were compressed badly - rather the opposite, I'm impressed at the distinct lack of excessive DNR, which leads to a much more natural-looking picture, albeit one that is all the more tricky for the compression to handle.
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post #2245 of 2373
12/28/12 at 3:02pm
Well... to wrap up my storyline...

I bought the used set for $48 on 12/9... called on 12/10... wondered about where my discs were until 12/27 when I called and found out they had been mailed on 12/24... and today, 12/28, I have my replacements in hand... just need to swap them out in my case and I can get to watching.

Long story short... it worked out well, and I saved money by waiting a bit and picking these up at the used store. Win-win!
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post #2246 of 2373
12/28/12 at 8:19pm
I've watched the first two discs from season 2, and it's a mixed bag. In general, the non-effects shots look better than the non-effects shots from season 1, mostly because of what I perceive to be better film stock and more consistent lighting. The detail really shines through.

Unfortunately, what others have said about the effects sequences is correct. Pretty much every time a CGI effect is present, the entire scene looks smoothed over with DNR. It sticks out a lot because it changes from shot to shot. Unlike the effects from season 1, which sometimes appear to have artificial grain (tastefully) added to make the effects blend with the film elements, it looks like they took the opposite approach and smoothed out the film grain to match the new CG.

While I'm still enjoying the presentation overall, I hope CBS does the remaining seasons in-house, because season 2 looks amateurish compared to season 1.
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post #2247 of 2373
12/29/12 at 11:51pm
On a completely random note... as I am now a couple of discs into watching season one on Blu-ray... Am I the only one who didn't remember just how often Tasha talks about "rape gangs" in season one? I really didn't remember that coming up as much as it does.
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post #2248 of 2373
12/30/12 at 3:09pm
Well she had to show what a tough female she was, She was the security chief after all. I never really liked her character and thought the sister episode was cheesy as well. I did like the Sela episodes though and she did an OK job in "Yesterdays Enterprise" and "All Good Things". Still, not a great loss once she left the show. Same with Dr. Pulaski.
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post #2249 of 2373
12/31/12 at 10:37am
I've got the blu ray 3 episode sampler and just watched it.
In the menu I checked the audio and it said DTS-HR HD 7.1, I've never heard that codec before, mistake or?
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post #2250 of 2373
12/31/12 at 12:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

I've got the blu ray 3 episode sampler and just watched it.
In the menu I checked the audio and it said DTS-HR HD 7.1, I've never heard that codec before, mistake or?

I saw that HR audio as well, but it was on the Imported 5th Element Blu.....interesting.
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