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Star Trek TNG Seasons Remastered on Blu-Ray - Page 18

post #511 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by teiresias View Post

I'm assuming the shot of the Enterprise is CGI?

Looks like the original model to me.

The models were so detailed that it would be a shame if they were completely replaced by CG. Hopefully we'll get more news on how the SFX are being handled.
post #512 of 2431
Yeah, but the warp effect in the trailer doesn't show any of the tell-tale signs of using the slit-scan process used to originally get the stretching warp effect. Although I suppose they could just be CGI-ing the window lights into the ship - the major noticeable side effect of the slit scan effect being that all of the lights from the windows go off during it.
post #513 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdkind View Post

Looks like the original model to me.

The models were so detailed that it would be a shame if they were completely replaced by CG. Hopefully we'll get more news on how the SFX are being handled.

Looked CGI to me when it went into warp, I could be wrong.
post #514 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post


Pretty much what we've been talking about, but that the general public has no clue about.

The original masters were on sub HD tape, and they need to go back to the original daily reels and edited new masters together from scratch before they can scan them at 4K.

Lot more work than your typical transfer.

Yeah but that's exactly how Any modern tv show shot on film is done. They scan the 35mm and make the edit. I don't see how they "created" any process
post #515 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by teiresias View Post

I'm assuming the shot of the Enterprise is CGI?

It's interesting how they preserve the "look" of the warp effect as it was able to be realized at the time using the slit scan technique. It's always had a specific look - much different from the warp effect used with the CGI Enterprise-D in ST:Generations.

The CGI effect in Generations stretches the ship more and, I believe, "squishes" it more vertically, whereas the slit scan warp "stretch" was never as pronounced I think. I can't find a shot of a Generations warp shot on Youtube to look at to compare though (and I'm too lazy to pull out my Blu-Ray to look. )

I am so sold on these already though. Even having every episode available on Netflix won't keep me from buying these (please don't DNR them to death though!!!)

Looks like a CGI star field and the original six foot model / film to me.
post #516 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Mack View Post

Yeah but that's exactly how Any modern tv show shot on film is done. They scan the 35mm and make the edit. I don't see how they "created" any process

No. They essentially have to re-edit every episode from the 35mm dailies,and re-composite all effects.
They basiclly have to redo post-production on all 7 seasons as if they never existed before now.
post #517 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fanboyz View Post


No. They essentially have to re-edit every episode from the 35mm dailies,and re-composite all effects.
They basiclly have to redo post-production on all 7 seasons as if they never existed before now.

Right. That's exactly how any new show shooting today on 35mm film would do it.
post #518 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Mack View Post

Right. That's exactly how any new show shooting today on 35mm film would do it.

Mincing words.

What they're doing hasn't ever been attempted on a series that's 24 years old and for all intents doesn't have workable masters. Luckily they seem to think they have all the proper reels and time codes, ect to do it; but it's no small feat.

I'd say editing from scratch new, and trying to put back together a classic (without altering it) is a little bit different a project.
post #519 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Everett View Post

I think there's very little chance of that. You're talking about a business model that worked for Paramount Home Video in the early 2000s but would be suicidal today. CBS will probably stick to what worked for them with TOS Remastered and offer the seasons at around $55 on release day.

Sure hope so. Right now the TOS seasons are about $90 each up here in Canada. I can't imagine they are selling very well at that price. I don't know what they were at launch here in Canada but I don't think they have ever been much lower than $80. If TNG is $60 or less on launch day per season, I'll be in line to buy them!
post #520 of 2431
Folks, I think that's the original model shot from '87. If I understand the press release correctly, it looks like they went back to the original 35mm FX elements and recomposited them (as the original FX scenes would've been composited to tape). The detail on the ship is stunning (until the ship goes to warp and they switch to the 1ft model)!

There's already a page with comparisons http://tng.trekcore.com/bluray/ Looks like the 16:9 FX shot was cropped vertically, but there's more picture to the sides. I'm fine with 4:3 all the way, rather than switching back and forth.

Edited to add: This is far beyond my expectations for this project, and I'm totally sold on it. I'm not sure it'll make me buy Season 1, but I'm saving for the rest starting now!
post #521 of 2431
Three cheers for OAR- thanks, CBS!
post #522 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osirus23 View Post

Looked CGI to me when it went into warp, I could be wrong.

Nah man, that's the model, I'm certain of it.

Forget Star Wars. This is how you bring back a classic.
post #523 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostface1701 View Post

It looks like they went back to the original 35mm FX elements and recomposited them ... The detail on the ship is stunning ... Looks like the 16:9 FX shot was cropped vertically, but there's more picture to the sides.

Yep. That's because, on the pilot only, ILM used 35mm 8-perf VistaVision cameras for the VFX shots. 8-perf is just like the size of an exposure in 35mm still photography and has an aspect ratio of 1.47:1. It's roughly double the size of standard 4-perf motion picture film because the negative is run through the camera gate horizontally -- again, just like a 35mm still camera. This is why a few of these "Encounter at Farpoint" shots were deemed usable in Star Trek Generations.
post #524 of 2431
Hmm well looks like I was wrong about the 16:9... oh well. Will still be buying all the seasons.

I just wonder why there was all this rumor talk about 16:9 and twitter hints about it, if it was never going to happen?

But I was right about the DTS MA 7.1
post #525 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Everett View Post

Yep. That's because, on the pilot only, ILM used 35mm 8-perf VistaVision cameras for the VFX shots. 8-perf is just like the size of an exposure in 35mm still photography and has an aspect ratio of 1.47:1. It's roughly double the size of standard 4-perf motion picture film because the negative is run through the camera gate horizontally -- again, just like a 35mm still camera. This is why a few of these "Encounter at Farpoint" shots were deemed usable in Star Trek Generations.

So I'd take that to mean not to expect that level of detail enhancement on every effects shot in the series, then. Obviously, that level of film quality use isn't to expected for the entire run of the series, but still it's astounding what detail has been sitting in these elements waiting to be seen properly since the 80s. It's really quite awe inspiring.

Do you have any idea what kind of quality we can expect from the regular weekly effects?
post #526 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by teiresias View Post

So I'd take that to mean not to expect that level of detail enhancement on every effects shot in the series, then. Obviously, that level of film quality use isn't to expected for the entire run of the series, but still it's astounding what detail has been sitting in these elements waiting to be seen properly since the 80s. It's really quite awe inspiring.

Do you have any idea what kind of quality we can expect from the regular weekly effects?

They were all shot on film, but then edited and created on tape. Any and all effects and rotoscoping needs to be done from scratch with the original negatives and new CGI or old school effects will be done to create them from scratch yet again. The original work from ILM for the pilot was done on film, then scanned to tape.

and now for the Big D:

DVD:


Flash Trailer:


: Drools :

Really goes to show how bad the DVD tape masters were.
post #527 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

They were all shot on film, but then edited and created on tape.

I know this, but judging by Maxwell's statement above I'd assume after ILM got done with their shots no more were done on the 8-perf 35mm stock, so you're not going to quite get the same level of detail (though it will probably all still be more than we've ever seen before).

Personally, however, regardless of my views of revisionist history, I'd like to see Armus in "The Skin of Evil" replaced with Tim Curry as the clown from "It". That would be an improvement.
post #528 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by teiresias View Post

So I'd take that to mean not to expect that level of detail enhancement on every effects shot in the series, then. Obviously, that level of film quality use isn't to expected for the entire run of the series, but still it's astounding what detail has been sitting in these elements waiting to be seen properly since the 80s. It's really quite awe inspiring.

Do you have any idea what kind of quality we can expect from the regular weekly effects?

After the pilot they started using standard 4-perf 35mm for the motion control miniature photography over at Image G in Hollywood. So we'll see about the same level of detail as in the principal photography with the actors.
post #529 of 2431
You know, I just wasn't going to believe it unless it was official. I wanted this so bad that I didn't want to get excited for something that possibly wasn't coming. But damn...it's really coming. TNG is what I proudly grew up with as a child. It made me interested in Sci-Fi and the character of Picard actually got me to read Shakespeare at the age of 10.

The season sets are easily my most anticipated BD releases now (Besides the Indy films) What fantastic news.
post #530 of 2431
From Amazon Germany:
Contains 4 episodes from Star Trek - The Next Generation Season 1:
- The Mighty / Encounter at Farpoint (pilot episodes), two-hour version
- The Mighty / Encounter at Farpoint (pilot episodes)
- The second life
- The sins of the father
post #531 of 2431
Thread Starter 
Wow, that looks awesome! It going to be like watching the show for the first time all over again.
I was really hoping to get that demo disc before the holidays, it would have made a good stocking stuffer.

Like what someone posted above, I am a little nervous about what Paramount is going to (over) price these sets. I remember when the DVD first season set came out. It was one of the first shows to release season sets as I recall, other than maybe X-Files.

I don't know how long they have been working on these sets(probably over a year by now), but its really got to be time consuming to reconstruct every episode. I am really surprised that they are doing the entire seasons. When all the speculation was going around about how much work had to be done, I thought we would just get select episodes.

I think (hope) we can expect 2 seasons a year release timetable.
post #532 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerJau View Post

From Amazon Germany:
Contains 4 episodes from Star Trek - The Next Generation Season 1:
- The Mighty / Encounter at Farpoint (pilot episodes), two-hour version
- The Mighty / Encounter at Farpoint (pilot episodes)
- The second life
- The sins of the father

I didn't realize that the episode names were changed for international releases, although it makes sense now that I think about it.
post #533 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Mincing words.

What they're doing hasn't ever been attempted on a series that's 24 years old and for all intents doesn't have workable masters. Luckily they seem to think they have all the proper reels and time codes, ect to do it; but it's no small feat.

I'd say editing from scratch new, and trying to put back together a classic (without altering it) is a little bit different a project.

It won't be the same as what we are used to. No matter how hard they try, things will happen slightly different. That alone is going to upset and offend some people.
I would also guess the Okuda's will want stuff deliberately changed.
post #534 of 2431
Really excited to see the series in HD haven't watched them in along time.

Did notice both scenes featured seemed to be a bit bright (enterprise especially), hopefully that's just from the conversion to flv and not what will actually be in the final product.
post #535 of 2431
Well, I feel a bit better about things after seeing that trailer. (And damn if that shot of the Enterprise-D isn't an order of magnitude better than anything else I've seen from the series. Now I really, really wish they'd selected a Borg episode for the sampler.) Still holding on to my DVDs, though: it'll be a few years before the entire series makes it out on BD, one way or the other.
post #536 of 2431
Quote:
Originally Posted by teiresias View Post

The CGI effect in Generations stretches the ship more and, I believe, "squishes" it more vertically, whereas the slit scan warp "stretch" was never as pronounced I think. I can't find a shot of a Generations warp shot on Youtube to look at to compare though (and I'm too lazy to pull out my Blu-Ray to look. )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kj178APgdno @ 0:52

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdkind View Post

4 or 5 episodes per disc is perfectly reasonable when you're dealing with 4:3 content. The TOS Blu-ray releases look exceptional, especially considering their age.

Yes, you could easily fit 5 45 minute episodes per disc with 20 Mbps AVC and high quality 7.1 surround.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Everett View Post

Yep. That's because, on the pilot only, ILM used 35mm 8-perf VistaVision cameras for the VFX shots. 8-perf is just like the size of an exposure in 35mm still photography and has an aspect ratio of 1.47:1. It's roughly double the size of standard 4-perf motion picture film because the negative is run through the camera gate horizontally -- again, just like a 35mm still camera. This is why a few of these "Encounter at Farpoint" shots were deemed usable in Star Trek Generations.

True but the new model shots in Generations look much better than the obviously reused ones. The shot from the TNG HD trailer looks just as good as the film shots, fortunately.
post #537 of 2431
I would like to add this point to the 4/3 vs 16/9 debate.

I've read this page where people claims that TNG shots were "stretched" for reuse in ENT. And this is used as excuse by the "keep it in 4/3" crowd for TNG not to be in 16/9 when remastered.(ie "the image would be stretched out! scandalous!")

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/in...ent_vs_tng.htm

These people don't take into account the ITU pixel aspect, which means in effect that it's the reverse, ie in ENT the TNG reused shots are unalterated, save shaving off a bit top and bottom, while all the original TNG DVDs shows the series squeezed, unless you display the episodes on an old CRT TV.

There are tons of TV series out on DVD that when displayed on a brand new HDTV, actually presents squeezed images (not the proper display). This can only be adjusted by ripping the episodes with handbrake, or similar software, and re-encoding them for proper display of the pixel ratio.

Find the info here.

https://trac.handbrake.fr/wiki/AnamorphicGuide#itu

PS : I'm for TNG in widescreen. I don't see the point in opening up the image, and not adjust to 16/9-1:77. The original masters were not only squeezed for ITU, they were zoomed in (zoomboxed). Opening up top and bottom to full aperture may unbalance the "common top" framing, and this does worse for image composition than just showing off more info from the sides.
post #538 of 2431
To be honest I think I'd prefer it in 16:9 if they can get away with cropping say 10% or less. Would be cool if they released two different sets but that'd be considered too confusing for the average consumer. I'm sure OAR will be fine though.
post #539 of 2431
This may well have already been found, but the sampler and HD news is showing up in the UK as well.

Based on the pic above, I want....

Seggers

http://www.reghardware.com/2011/09/2..._blu_ray_2012/
post #540 of 2431
Would I be right in saying that it was originally shot at 24fps and the 24->30fps (60i) conversion was done as part of the video transfer prior to editing?

So these should be 1080p24 since the (old) video stage no longer exists?
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