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HDMI over Cat5e problems and solutions, read before posting - Page 8

post #211 of 389
Thread Starter 
Oh my goodness no. I do know it uses breakers that I consider "standard" in today's terms. I just don't know if the bars are staggered or not. Of course with all that's tugging at me, it's most likely that I'll never even go to the trouble to find out.

If it works...

..dane
post #212 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiodane View Post

Tee hee hee, this thread has already been renamed two or three times, as it has evolved to what it is today. Most people find this thread because they are actually having problems with fans, A/C units, etc. So it helps to have that in the title. That said, feel free to recommend something different. It can't be anything longer than it already is ..

cheers,
..dane

I recommend something different. I've been on AVS for years, and saw this thread when it was new. I don't have my HDMI matrix yet, which is what I'm shopping for, and avoided this because of the thread title. It's misleading at best. Sorry to be such a downer!
post #213 of 389
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AI Limited View Post

I recommend something different. I've been on AVS for years, and saw this thread when it was new. I don't have my HDMI matrix yet, which is what I'm shopping for, and avoided this because of the thread title. It's misleading at best. Sorry to be such a downer!

Your input is appreciated, but if I may be frank, fairly useless if you aren't willing to even recommend alternative titles. As Plutarch once said, "To find fault is easy, to do better may be difficult."

I'm also a tad confused on your sentence about your shopping experience. Have you avoided buying an HDMI matrix because of this thread's title, or have you avoided reading this thread because of its title? Either way, good luck!

cheers,
..dane
post #214 of 389
Here is a quick drawing of my setup involving a splitter, switch, and extender so I can still get full HD audio to my non-3D passthrough capable receiver while still being able to send 3D video content from my BD player and PS3.

1. The splitter for the PS3 is so video content can be sent to the projector independent of the receiver while still sending audio content to the receiver.

2. The HDMI 2 output on the Oppo is for audio only (set that way in the player options). HDMI 1 sends the video directly to the projector.

3. The receiver out is for other video capable devices that I don't have in the drawing (Wii, HTPC,etc.)

I have not had any audio-video sync issues with this setup for either PS3 or Oppo.

The splitter is Monoprice product ID 8204.
The switch is Monoprice product ID 8462.
The Base-T Cat6 extender is Monoprice product ID 8122.
Denon 4810CI receiver
Panasonic AE7000U projector
Older style PS3
Oppo BDP-93

I have been using the set up now for close to 3 weeks without a hiccup. I have played PS3 3D games with full 7.1 HD audio on the PS3. Played an XBOX game in 3D with 5.1 audio through HDMI and watched multiple 3D and 2D movies with full bitstreamed HD audio over HDMI. I think a good rule of thumb for these devices is to take Monoprice's advice to use Cat6 cable instead of Cat5e and 24AWG HDMI cable to help ensure you don't run into any bandwidth/RFI/EMI noise issues.

The extender was a must for me because I had a 50' run between my devices and projector. A 50' length of Cat6 patch plus extender is price comparable to 50 ft of 22 AWG HDMI and I'm skeptical that 50' run of HDMI would work without hitch even at 22 AWG not to mention the inflexibility of it. One thing to mention though is I have not checked the audio side of things on the receive end of the extender since it is going to a projector. The video looks great!

post #215 of 389
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by natedogg661 View Post

Here is a quick drawing of my setup involving a splitter, switch, and extender so I can still get full HD audio to my non-3D passthrough capable receiver while still being able to send 3D video content from my BD player and PS3.

1. The splitter for the PS3 is so video content can be sent to the projector independent of the receiver while still sending audio content to the receiver.

2. The HDMI 2 output on the Oppo is for audio only (set that way in the player options). HDMI 1 sends the video directly to the projector.

3. The receiver out is for other video capable devices that I don't have in the drawing (Wii, HTPC,etc.)

I have not had any audio-video sync issues with this setup for either PS3 or Oppo.

The splitter is Monoprice product ID 8204.
The switch is Monoprice product ID 8462.
The Base-T Cat6 extender is Monoprice product ID 8122.
Denon 4810CI receiver
Panasonic AE7000U projector
Older style PS3
Oppo BDP-93

I have been using the set up now for close to 3 weeks without a hiccup. I have played PS3 3D games with full 7.1 HD audio on the PS3. Played an XBOX game in 3D with 5.1 audio through HDMI and watched multiple 3D and 2D movies with full bitstreamed HD audio over HDMI. I think a good rule of thumb for these devices is to take Monoprice's advice to use Cat6 cable instead of Cat5e and 24AWG HDMI cable to help ensure you don't run into any bandwidth/RFI/EMI noise issues.

The extender was a must for me because I had a 50' run between my devices and projector. A 50' length of Cat6 patch plus extender is price comparable to 50 ft of 22 AWG HDMI and I'm skeptical that 50' run of HDMI would work without hitch even at 22 AWG not to mention the inflexibility of it. One thing to mention though is I have not checked the audio side of things on the receive end of the extender since it is going to a projector. The video looks great!

Wow!! Thanks so much for your post. I am so thrilled that a "complicated" setup using a splitter, switch, AND extender, is working so well for you. I've thought about a "complicated" setup like yours before, but ended up taking the "easy" (but pricier) way out and using a DVDO Edge for all my input audio and video switching and audio routing (TV or AVR). While I don't use 3D, it does support 3D pass-through too. But I am very excited that such a setup does in fact work!

I realize it's only been 3 weeks so far, as you've indicated, so please make a note to come back in a few months and update us again over a longer time period.

Congrats!!
..dane

ps.- attaching your image directly to this email for longevity. Sometimes picture hosting sites change and forum image references get lost..
LL
post #216 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiodane View Post

Your input is appreciated, but if I may be frank, fairly useless if you aren't willing to even recommend alternative titles. As Plutarch once said, "To find fault is easy, to do better may be difficult."

I'm also a tad confused on your sentence about your shopping experience. Have you avoided buying an HDMI matrix because of this thread's title, or have you avoided reading this thread because of its title? Either way, good luck!

cheers,
..dane

I avoided reading the thread based on the title.

How about "HDMI over Cat5e Problems (Video blanks when fan/light/motor turns on/off) now 'which extenders/matrix products work best' "? ...too long...

or... "HDMI over Cat5e problems and solutions, read before posting"
post #217 of 389
Thread Starter 
I like the last suggestion- thanks
post #218 of 389
I have been reading this thread for quite sometime. I am trying to work out a video distribution at a reasonable cost. I have tested two HDMI over CatX adaptors with my longest run. Here are my results:

Source-end: Appletv
- CatX Adapter: MonoPrice HDMI extender #6532
- CatX Cables: 117' Dual Cat6 STP Stranded (self terminated)
- Far-end: Olevia HDTV
- Resolution(s) tested: 720P
- Status: Brief Test, no problems

Source-end: SageTV HD-200
- CatX Adapter: MonoPrice HDMI extender #6532
- CatX Cables: 117' Dual Cat6 STP Stranded (self terminated)
- Far-end: same
- Resolution(s) tested: 1080i60
- Status: Did not work

Source-end: AppleTV
- CatX Adapter: Conversions Technology CT60S
- CatX Cables: 117' Cat6 STP Stranded and Cat5e (self terminated)
- Far-end: same
- Resolution(s) tested: 720p
- Status: Worked but the picture had sparkles/noise.

Source-end: Sagetv HD-200
- CatX Adapter: Conversions Technology CT60S
- CatX Cables: 117' Cat6 STP Stranded and Cat5e (self terminated)
- Far-end: same
- Resolution(s) tested: 1080i
- Status: Did not work

I am not sure why the HD-200 won't work. The HD-200 with the monoprice adaptor would not produce a picture when completely booted up. I saw the "Sagetv" logo when it was booting but this is all. The TV either stated "invalid format or "no signal". The appletv had perfect audio and video for the short time I got to test it.
After reading the reviews on Amazon of the "Conversions Technology CT60S", I was pretty excited and thought it would solve my issues with the HD-200. The HD-200 did produce some color on the screen but other than that nothing was ledgible. I am not sure if I need to use the Rapid Run voltage inserter to make the HD-200 work with an extender or what. the HD-200 is HDMI 1.2 so I am not sure if this would affect this type of setup. I was very disappointed with the performance of the "Conversions Technology CT60S" on the appletv. There was white sparkles in the picture. I switched it between Cat6 cables (I had pulled 2 cat6 cables and 1 Cat5e cable). Neither of the cables appeared to make a difference. I switched to the cat5 cable and things just got worse.

Overall the monoprice adaptor was the clear winner in this short experiment.
post #219 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by TVAddikt View Post

I have been reading this thread for quite sometime. I am trying to work out a video distribution at a reasonable cost. I have tested two HDMI over CatX adaptors with my longest run. Here are my results:

Source-end: Appletv
- CatX Adapter: MonoPrice HDMI extender #6532
- CatX Cables: 117' Dual Cat6 STP Stranded (self terminated)
- Far-end: Olevia HDTV
- Resolution(s) tested: 720P
- Status: Brief Test, no problems

Source-end: SageTV HD-200
- CatX Adapter: MonoPrice HDMI extender #6532
- CatX Cables: 117' Dual Cat6 STP Stranded (self terminated)
- Far-end: same
- Resolution(s) tested: 1080i60
- Status: Did not work

Source-end: AppleTV
- CatX Adapter: Conversions Technology CT60S
- CatX Cables: 117' Cat6 STP Stranded and Cat5e (self terminated)
- Far-end: same
- Resolution(s) tested: 720p
- Status: Worked but the picture had sparkles/noise.

Source-end: Sagetv HD-200
- CatX Adapter: Conversions Technology CT60S
- CatX Cables: 117' Cat6 STP Stranded and Cat5e (self terminated)
- Far-end: same
- Resolution(s) tested: 1080i
- Status: Did not work

I am not sure why the HD-200 won't work. The HD-200 with the monoprice adaptor would not produce a picture when completely booted up. I saw the "Sagetv" logo when it was booting but this is all. The TV either stated "invalid format or "no signal". The appletv had perfect audio and video for the short time I got to test it.
After reading the reviews on Amazon of the "Conversions Technology CT60S", I was pretty excited and thought it would solve my issues with the HD-200. The HD-200 did produce some color on the screen but other than that nothing was ledgible. I am not sure if I need to use the Rapid Run voltage inserter to make the HD-200 work with an extender or what. the HD-200 is HDMI 1.2 so I am not sure if this would affect this type of setup. I was very disappointed with the performance of the "Conversions Technology CT60S" on the appletv. There was white sparkles in the picture. I switched it between Cat6 cables (I had pulled 2 cat6 cables and 1 Cat5e cable). Neither of the cables appeared to make a difference. I switched to the cat5 cable and things just got worse.

Overall the monoprice adaptor was the clear winner in this short experiment.

Did you test the HD-200 at a lower resolution (if there is such a setting)? If not, I'm curious if you can test it and see if it works at 720p or even 480p? If so, my bet would be that it requires the voltage inserter or equivalent.
post #220 of 389
Been reading here off and of for a week now. Here is a delima I have. I need to share a bluray player, a dish receiver, and a media center pc w/HDMI out between two locations that are about 100ft in cable distance apart. I have tossed around the idea of trying to run HDMI that far but am really fearful this will not work. Anyone else running a distance like this?

Ive come to my second idea to use a HDMI over ethernet setup like a 4x4 matrix from monoproce (product 8151).
http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2

Will this work? Will i get 1080p@60 with this. I'm sure with a hdmi cable I might get 720p or 1080p@24 if I'm really really lucky.

What will the display look like for bluray playback and dish programming look like at 1080P24. Should this be a concern?

I have an xbox 360 that will connect but will only be 20-25ft from the source to output

Also are there any known issues with HDCP for something of this nature?
post #221 of 389
sorry if this has been asked a thousand times but can i use normal cat5 cable to distribute component HDTV, i've a russound VM ordered as i thought Cat5 was good enough, but now i see sometimes Russound state cat5 then other times they state cat5e?!?!?!

this is my cable
post #222 of 389
Most CAT5 is actually CAT5e as CAT5 is an out of date standard. A picture of your cable doesn't tell us much about what kind it is. What is the gauge of the wire? brand? I can see that its solid conductor not stranded but not much else.
post #223 of 389
...and yes it will likely work.
post #224 of 389
I had 5e with the hdmi converters, never could get them to be consistent, except for consistly dropping the signal when lights or ac woud cut on. Yesterday.I just ran a 45 ft hdmi line thru all kinds of turns, even drilled a hole in my new hardwood floors, but got it done. WOW, I cant believe it, no more drps or flickers. Even my picture is alot clearer. hopes this helps someone trying to decide on tryingmore converter svs runing cable.
post #225 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by fabby View Post

I had 5e with the hdmi converters, never could get them to be consistent, except for consistly dropping the signal when lights or ac woud cut on. Yesterday.I just ran a 45 ft hdmi line thru all kinds of turns, even drilled a hole in my new hardwood floors, but got it done. WOW, I cant believe it, no more drps or flickers. Even my picture is alot clearer. hopes this helps someone trying to decide on tryingmore converter svs runing cable.

I tend to agree with you. Yesterday I ran a hdmi cable to a few locations I could access. I just got through building my house and I could have run hdmi cables everywhere. I was planning on running all of my hdmi over cat5 cat 6. I really didnt plan this out so well. I know it will catch up some day soon. Most of the solutions right now are so expensive to really make it economical to set up a matrix switcher the cat extenders. I guess I tend to try to make solutions too complicated much of the time.
post #226 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by jc8587 View Post

Looks like the Monoprice extenders I am running finally bit the dust. I attribute the failure due to extreme heating of the receiving unit. It is powered, unlike the sending unit, and it was very very hot to the touch. I'll send it back and get another pair. My plan is to either unplug when not in use (it has been plugged in since I posted in this thread originally) or devise a simple fan/heatsink for the device.

I'll post more when I get time to work on it.

Thanks!

-Chris

Looks like my second pair of extenders have bit the dust, this time I have no clue what happened, just didn't work one day. Maybe heat again, elthough this time the receiver wasn't too hot to the touch.

Third time is the charm.
post #227 of 389
Wow. I just read this full thread, hoping that after 1.5 years, there would finally be a cost-efficient and reliable means of running long distance HD video signals. The home I just rebuilt has multiple CAT6 going everywhere, and I thought that would be sufficient for centralized A/V. But it sounds to me like I'm in for a ton of problems.

So sad.
post #228 of 389
Actually, things are much brighter now than when this thread started. HDBaseT has arrived and is capable of full HDMI bandwidth up to 100m over a single Cat 6 cable, more with repeaters.
post #229 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colm View Post

Actually, things are much brighter now than when this thread started. HDBaseT has arrived and is capable of full HDMI bandwidth up to 100m over a single Cat 6 cable, more with repeaters.

Yes, but is it affordable, and is there a particular brand that has consistently favorable reviews? Hearing HDBaseT as a solution is promising, but this area is still unstable without a well received product.

For example, I googled "hdmi 1.4 over cat6" and found this product:
http://www.hdtvsupply.com/hdmi-14-cat5.html

On paper, it looks to be a great solution. But for 280 dollars, there is no way I'm going to take a chance on a brandless product that has no information about quality or reliability.
post #230 of 389
Thread Starter 
I *REALLY* hope HDbaseT is successful. As I recall, HDMI had some pretty HORRIBLE beginnings as well, and although it still has its faults (as this thread is testament to!), it interplays a lot better than it did in its early years. I am hopeful that HDbaseT will continue to improve as well, both in performance and in decreasing cost.

cheers,
..dane
post #231 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by ctgoodman View Post

Been reading here off and of for a week now. Here is a delima I have. I need to share a bluray player, a dish receiver, and a media center pc w/HDMI out between two locations that are about 100ft in cable distance apart. I have tossed around the idea of trying to run HDMI that far but am really fearful this will not work. Anyone else running a distance like this?

Ive come to my second idea to use a HDMI over ethernet setup like a 4x4 matrix from monoproce (product 8151).

Will this work? Will i get 1080p@60 with this. I'm sure with a hdmi cable I might get 720p or 1080p@24 if I'm really really lucky.

What will the display look like for bluray playback and dish programming look like at 1080P24. Should this be a concern?

I have an xbox 360 that will connect but will only be 20-25ft from the source to output

Also are there any known issues with HDCP for something of this nature?

I am about to do something similar and am ready to buy the 8151 from monoprice, it's sitting in my cart. Did this work for you, or anyone else on here? The device has great reviews besides the slight downside of displaying at the lowest common denominator. That's not too bad for me as I'm no video/audiophile and if I want 1080p I'll just tell my wife to turn the TV off. Or I'll upgrade all the TVs to 1080p, only 1, possibly 2 that need it, and both secondary (i.e. not watched much).

I'm going to have 4 sources and 4 TVs and just want to be able to switch to whatever input I'd like. Actually I would have liked 5 or 6, but there was no decently priced 8x8 matrix. If I have to settle for 1080i or 720p then so be it. Though when in my yet unfinished home theater I think I'll want 1080p. I don't expect any other TVs to be on then though.

Also, if this will work, what about distance. It says 131ft. How close can you get to that and still get a 1080p signal? A friend who's helping me wire the house said we could potentially go further than that going from the basement to the 2nd floor (2 story house). If we're close, will it still work? I read some reviews of other extenders that said about 75' was the max for a 1080p signal. Are there any options to extend the signal past 131ft, or make it stronger, while using the matrix switch?

Lastly, could I experience any issues with the handshake if I try to add my HTPC? Right now I have it plugged into a 3 port hdmi switch and I cannot switch to it while it's on, I always have to turn it off, then switch, then turn it on, very annoying. The cable box and 360 work just fine. Not that I think I'll even need the htpc anymore, but just a thought.

I'll make sure to post my results when I get everything set up.

Thanks
post #232 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by RottweilerCP View Post

I am about to do something similar and am ready to buy the 8151 from monoprice, it's sitting in my cart. Did this work for you, or anyone else on here? The device has great reviews besides the slight downside of displaying at the lowest common denominator. That's not too bad for me as I'm no video/audiophile and if I want 1080p I'll just tell my wife to turn the TV off. Or I'll upgrade all the TVs to 1080p, only 1, possibly 2 that need it, and both secondary (i.e. not watched much).

I'm going to have 4 sources and 4 TVs and just want to be able to switch to whatever input I'd like. Actually I would have liked 5 or 6, but there was no decently priced 8x8 matrix. If I have to settle for 1080i or 720p then so be it. Though when in my yet unfinished home theater I think I'll want 1080p. I don't expect any other TVs to be on then though.

Also, if this will work, what about distance. It says 131ft. How close can you get to that and still get a 1080p signal? A friend who's helping me wire the house said we could potentially go further than that going from the basement to the 2nd floor (2 story house). If we're close, will it still work? I read some reviews of other extenders that said about 75' was the max for a 1080p signal. Are there any options to extend the signal past 131ft, or make it stronger, while using the matrix switch?

Lastly, could I experience any issues with the handshake if I try to add my HTPC? Right now I have it plugged into a 3 port hdmi switch and I cannot switch to it while it's on, I always have to turn it off, then switch, then turn it on, very annoying. The cable box and 360 work just fine. Not that I think I'll even need the htpc anymore, but just a thought.

I'll make sure to post my results when I get everything set up.

Thanks

I too am planning a similar system. I don't have real experience, but I have done a lot of research. If all your TVs are not 1080 then you will be limited to the Highest common denominator. You talk about turning off TVs, but I don't believe that will solve your issue. I've read that you may have to reset the source and/or matrix for it to forget about the 720p TV.

If you find your distance is over 131ft and your signal suffers, you could try connecting an hdbase-t extender http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2 to this matrix via HDMI. Thats not the cleanest solution, but it seems like it would work.
post #233 of 389
Well that sounds annoying. I didn't realize the box would cache the lowest signal and only send that. Oh well, I'll have to deal with resetting until I get a couple new TVs.

Ouch, I knew HDbaseT wasn't cheap, and neither am I, but that's a bit pricey for only extending one source. Plus I don't see it working with the 4x4 matrix.
post #234 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by RottweilerCP View Post

Ouch, I knew HDbaseT wasn't cheap, and neither am I, but that's a bit pricey for only extending one source. Plus I don't see it working with the 4x4 matrix.

The matrix can output via 2 Catx cables or HDMI. Just run HDMI from matrix to HDBaseT extender.
post #235 of 389
You know I did see that originally and just thought why would I use it and forgot about it, but now it makes perfect sense. If the switch is near one TV or if I want to use HDbase-T. OK, that could work and I would only need one or two for the runs to the 2nd floor. I guess the only functionality I would lose is the ability to change the input at the TV since I won't be using the receiver. But that's no big deal anyway since my plan is to have a couple URC remotes to control everything from anywhere in the house. That's another whole project, but I know a guy who programs URC remotes and says it can be done.
post #236 of 389
Has anyone tried this one yet? It's coming in the mail soon. It's my last option since the Pace DVR box didn't run over the 60 ft HDMI cable.
http://www.amazon.com/Extender-Adapt...1178223&sr=8-3

I've got a CAT5e run of about 60 feet. Sending video out from Pioneer 521 AVR to a 2 year old LG 60 inch LCD. Pace DVR and LG Bluray player are hooked to the pioneer in the remote location.

Do you have a recommendation if the above doesn't work? I have 2 free CAT5e runs to the TV.
post #237 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by NismoZ View Post

It's my last option since the Pace DVR box didn't run over the 60 ft HDMI cable..

I'm not sure I understand what you mean. The DVR is connected to your AVR but only the DVR fails to work in conjunction with a 60 foot HDMI cable that is connected between your TV and your AVR? The LG player works fine in this same setup?
Are your CAT5e cables stranded or solid core? Are they factory terminated or did you put the plugs on?
Here are the specs per the mfg: http://www.port-ta.com/products/33.html
Regards,
Marz
post #238 of 389
All,

I've had trouble with the monoprice 8151 all month. I am on my third unit, the first was a shipping error, the second would not do ethernet (although HDMI worked flawlessly), and I almost sent the third one back tonight (but that turned out to be user error [wrong wall wart]).

When I realized I had packed up and used the wrong power supply with the sender unit, I unpacked it all and tried again. Now it would turn on, but not do ethernet with my in wall runs. Next I made 100 foot cat 6 cables to test it out of the wall. Still nothing. I had had the last unit working with commercial patch cat5e, and this set also worked with the patch cables.

A closer look revealed a different pin-out on the patch cables. I had been using the diagram on my tool kit, which is from 1-8: w brown, w green, w orange, blue, w blue, orange, green, brown.

The patch cable was: w orange, orange, w green, blue, w blue, green, w brown, brown. Changing my new 100 foot cables to this pin-out worked!

I have not yet tried to change the pins on my in-wall cables. I may get to that on Saturday.



Here is my setup: cox SA8300HD dvr, panasonic bluray, 360, etc. Feeds into the 4x4 with 24 awg monoprice HDMI cables.

Output to: a panasonic vt30 by HDMI (ethernet worked also). Samsung 23" lcd, 32" sony xbr lcd, and an emerson lcd.

The 100 foot cables are cat6 500 mHz solid UTP from monoprice.
post #239 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ward216 View Post

I'm not sure I understand what you mean. The DVR is connected to your AVR but only the DVR fails to work in conjunction with a 60 foot HDMI cable that is connected between your TV and your AVR? The LG player works fine in this same setup?
Are your CAT5e cables stranded or solid core? Are they factory terminated or did you put the plugs on?
Here are the specs per the mfg: http://www.port-ta.com/products/33.html
Regards,
Marz

Yes, you have the first scenario correct. They are terminated by a cable install tech, punched down on jack plates attached to the drywall. Stranded CAT5e.
post #240 of 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by NismoZ View Post

Has anyone tried this one yet? It's coming in the mail soon. It's my last option since the Pace DVR box didn't run over the 60 ft HDMI cable.
http://www.amazon.com/Extender-Adapt...1178223&sr=8-3

I've got a CAT5e run of about 60 feet. Sending video out from Pioneer 521 AVR to a 2 year old LG 60 inch LCD. Pace DVR and LG Bluray player are hooked to the pioneer in the remote location.

Do you have a recommendation if the above doesn't work? I have 2 free CAT5e runs to the TV.

This seems to be doing the trick at the moment. Just wanted to let everyone know that it works well.
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