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The "Official" Denon AVR-4311CI/AVR-A100 thread [NO PRICE TALK] - Page 496

post #14851 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeattleHTGuy View Post

I wake up everyday and pray what you just typed never happens...........Please never suggest this again, manufacturers may be reading and then we are all damned to tech hell.

I hear you SeattleHTGuy. Wired is king. But I never have any stuttering with my Cat5 gigabit cable at all.
I had major problems with my router until I installed Tomato USB on my e3000 router, and did a little network management cramming /studying. Spatial Division Multiplexing (SDM) will be the way of the future for high bandwidth wifi. But long story short, I ALWAYS fish a wired connector for my HT because I believe Wifi should be reserved for portable devices. I also had lots of problems with my wifi when I was shopping for baby monitors which did not like all my wifi signals at all. It was actually a serious pain in the butt, just to find a monitor that didnt sound like the girl from the Grudge was going to climb out of the monitor in my house. The whole wifi system needs a good kick in the ass; lets hope 802.11zz or whatever it is called resolves this.

Wifi aside, I found the real problem is that the dominant ISP's (Cox, Comcast, Verizon ( <- non-DC area) in USA have such shoddy infrastructure to support true broadband. The Cox DNS lookup system is a scam. The cynic is me thinks they deliberately make it crappy because they are scared to death of customers being able to get all their TV content over the web AND ONLY PAY FOR THE CHANNELS THEY ACTUALLY WATCH! The Day HBO lets me pay and stream their content over the web without having to get 1000 garbage channels from DirectTV, is the day when I will experience the true joy of living for once.

But hope is on the horizon, a very close friend of mine in hi-tech construction just got poached by Google and without divulging too much company secrets, lets just say BIG things are coming our way in terms of ISP / Broadband / fiber optic. Maybe, just maybe in 10 years we'll be lucky to be where Japan & South Korea were 15 years ago in terms of end-user broadband. Sigh.

Sorry to be so off topic, gsr. But my AVR is working fine and every possible conceivable question/answer to the AVR-4311ci has been bludgeoned to death in the past 494 pages. Allow us a little shop talk. This stuff is interesting, and more importantly, hard to find people with similar interests at the office to talk about it with....
post #14852 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by mo0sic View Post


Something is wrong with your setup. I can stream with no issues from my windows home server to my HTPC. TMT5's latest version fixed all issues for me. The network hardware isn't the issue.

I know there is some kind of conflict, that is my point. I have over 40 ip devices on my home network, pretty much linked and on at all times. The issues comes up with HD content while streaming Sonos zones, archiving Cable content from the WMC HTPC to the server and then streaming a BD.iso from the server back to the HTPC. I am not overtasking the CPU, I just get stutter due to some type of network packet conflict issues or something. My point is and remains that a simple direct connection still is the most stable way to go. BTW I am a deep koolaid drinker on in home networking but it is not that easy to integrate everything. I too use my primary HTPC for a source for most material but the new Oppo 93 works a lot better and is practically glitch free. That's all. And as to the somewhere buried in here is comment about the 4311, yes this was kind of a hi-jack but we are in the thousands of comments on this thread and frankly, there isn't much left to cover other than future stuff. The 4311 works, it worked last year and it will most likely work next year. Other than the first few pages, I challenge anyone to find a comment about someone returning it. It's so good it is boring. It does have a few quirks though and could use improvement. Thus the comments.
post #14853 of 23181
Here's a question - is there a way to put your own messages in the OSD?
I'd like to have my VOIP system mute the volume and put the caller-id up on the tv screen. I'm pretty sure muting is easy, but what about putting a message in the OSD?
post #14854 of 23181
^^
AFAIK, the only other message available is "Honey, turn the volume down."
post #14855 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

^^
AFAIK, the only other message available is "Honey, turn the volume down."

+1,000
Usually it is "turn down the bass, it is vibrating my bones" (Yeah, that is the whole point, Hon!), then turn down the overall system volume!
post #14856 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcd4959 View Post

Thanks gents - sometimes I fall prey to the "ooh that sounds cool" factor when deep down I do know better...

Appreciate the responses!

*sigh* apparently my retraction and apology got deleted as well after being asked to retract my statement regarding bi-amping and using VERY expensive inter-connects, power cords, and speaker wires. I guess you can not use satire as a sense of humor and get reported for doing so. Well at least I didnt get the ban hammer thrown down on me

So again MCD and everyone else I made a joke regarding bi-amping and it was satirical in nature. None of what I wrote was truth. It was a joke.

And to the people that were offended by it I apologize but you seriously need to lighten up and get a sense of humor.
post #14857 of 23181
I was not offended in any way and completely "got" your humor. We ought to be able to rib each other a bit and still talk about the primary topic.

No problems here!
post #14858 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcd4959 View Post

I was not offended in any way and completely "got" your humor. We ought to be able to rib each other a bit and still talk about the primary topic.

No problems here!

Speaking of performance issues, I, as you know have enjoyed and am enjoying the 4311. I use a lot of external amplifiers and am deep in the Denon, not the Onkyo camp....... But, my external Amps do not connect well with RCA unbalanced in inputs (proving too fragile). In fact, the Emotiva's have loosened or partially broke while using good quality but not esoteric priced Blue Jean Belden Cables. So, I am trying a RCA to XLR converter tonight for the left and right channels. Has anyone ever used this solution? So far just experimenting but if it works and does not add any noise it will be a lot less damaging to my Amps. I guess Onkyo has the 4311 beat with balanced out on some of their units.
post #14859 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post

One would only guess that the 4311 being the status quo for the masses, there willing to turn a deaf ear..

And and well deserved, 4311 is a fine unit, but not prefect...
Can't beat it for the street price..

I'm saying this as a current groupie rather than an owner, so to speak, but right now, if you've got a) at least $1300 to spend on an authorized dealer willing to price match, b) you care about Airplay and sub EQ, and c) want a well-understood and/or minimally buggy AVR, there's literally no reason to buy anything other than a 4311, period.

If you're willing to pay extra for the core unit depending on channel to get the mfr. warranty and/or are willing to shop for external sub EQ, and then the Pioneer Elite SC-55/57 is an option without compromising the other features of the 4311 (plus you get the Marvell Qdeo video processing). From reading AVS, I'd rule out other major manufacturers because:

a) Onkyo/Integra 3009/5009, 80.2/3- Has historic quality issues, need funky things like external fans to cool hot HDMI boards, problematic Audyssey firmware updating that can hurt functionality, and an unknown status for adding Audyssey Pro capability (from reading the forums, it's debatable whether it's even going to happen); no Airplay, not 11.2
b) Yamaha A3010 - doesn't EQ below 31 Hz with YPAO, no Wifi, no Neo X. Not 11.2; No Airplay? I'm not familiar with Yamaha personally, got any others? Actually, I wonder why there's so few apparent users on AVS
c) Sony - no room correction AFAIK
d) Anthem, Outlaw etc. - not as many channels, no Airplay (I think), no networking, etc.
e) Sherwood - extremely buggy and not updated since 2010

The only conceivable downside to the 4311 would seem to be paying for Audyssey Pro vs. the external sub EQ you'd need on the Pioneer units. If you want that tweakability, that brings the SC-55/7 closer to 4311 + Audyssey Pro. But when you factor in the tierbreaker of Denon's support for firmware upgrades (even if paid) and Audyssey tweaking its product.....

Am I missing anything?
post #14860 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeattleHTGuy View Post

Speaking of performance issues, I, as you know have enjoyed and am enjoying the 4311. I use a lot of external amplifiers and am deep in the Denon, not the Onkyo camp....... But, my external Amps do not connect well with RCA unbalanced in inputs (proving too fragile). In fact, the Emotiva's have loosened or partially broke while using good quality but not esoteric priced Blue Jean Belden Cables. So, I am trying a RCA to XLR converter tonight for the left and right channels. Has anyone ever used this solution? So far just experimenting but if it works and does not add any noise it will be a lot less damaging to my Amps. I guess Onkyo has the 4311 beat with balanced out on some of their units.

I've been reading of a few people having that problem with the XLR and the RCA's on the Emotiva amp's. Hopefully its only in a certain batch of amps and their QC hasnt gone downhill. I have a 3 year old UPA-2 and have moved it quite a bit and the RCA's havent loosened up at all.

But back OT, is there going to be a successor to the 4311 released this year since its been a year and a half since this was introduced? Or is that wishful thinking? Been waiting to see if Marantz releases a new AV700X but have not heard anything.
post #14861 of 23181
^^
Yes, the 4311CI successor will be announced later this summer, with a fall release.
post #14862 of 23181
GSD I also knew it was in jest....wonder who reported
post #14863 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post

Or they all just given-up ??
What about the phase flipping when switching between full range and 40hz Xovers ? This is not a problem for most, but for those who like to setup there mains for stereo music and then switch bach to a 5.1 plus with Xover for HD movies, it was a pain.

And what about this post asking ANYONE who gives a crap about double bass to do even a little more testing to determine IF there is actually such a bug?
post #14864 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

^^
Yes, the 4311CI successor will be announced later this summer, with a fall release.

Sweet, Im still debating with myself whether to go with the Denon or a Marantz AV7005 (or successor) with external amplification. Missed out on a good deal for the new Marantz MM7055 used . But then I got to thinking thats $2700 MSRP for the Marantz (AV7005 + MM7055) or a Denon 4311 for $1250. Its time to upgrade everything later on this year so still time to decide. Unless I come across some good deals .
post #14865 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Browninggold View Post

GSD I also knew it was in jest....wonder who reported

Ehhh water under the bridge at this point but it got someones panties bunched up
post #14866 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeattleHTGuy View Post

Speaking of performance issues, I, as you know have enjoyed and am enjoying the 4311. I use a lot of external amplifiers and am deep in the Denon, not the Onkyo camp....... But, my external Amps do not connect well with RCA unbalanced in inputs (proving too fragile). In fact, the Emotiva's have loosened or partially broke while using good quality but not esoteric priced Blue Jean Belden Cables. So, I am trying a RCA to XLR converter tonight for the left and right channels. Has anyone ever used this solution? So far just experimenting but if it works and does not add any noise it will be a lot less damaging to my Amps. I guess Onkyo has the 4311 beat with balanced out on some of their units.

I have my 4311 connected to my XPA-2 via an RCA-XLR cable with no issues. You just have to rerun Audyssey again as the XLR has a noticeably higher gain than the RCA connections. I'm assuming you can also try turning down the channel trims if you have a SPL meter to measure it. I haven't noticed any additional noise going from the 4311's internal amp to the RCA-RCA then finally to the RCA-XLR connections.
post #14867 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdrucker View Post


I'm saying this as a current groupie rather than an owner, so to speak, but right now, if you've got a) at least $1300 to spend on an authorized dealer willing to price match, b) you care about Airplay and sub EQ, and c) want a well-understood and/or minimally buggy AVR, there's literally no reason to buy anything other than a 4311, period.

If you're willing to pay extra for the core unit depending on channel to get the mfr. warranty and/or are willing to shop for external sub EQ, and then the Pioneer Elite SC-55/57 is an option without compromising the other features of the 4311 (plus you get the Marvell Qdeo video processing). From reading AVS, I'd rule out other major manufacturers because:

a) Onkyo/Integra 3009/5009, 80.2/3- Has historic quality issues, need funky things like external fans to cool hot HDMI boards, problematic Audyssey firmware updating that can hurt functionality, and an unknown status for adding Audyssey Pro capability (from reading the forums, it's debatable whether it's even going to happen); no Airplay, not 11.2
b) Yamaha A3010 - doesn't EQ below 31 Hz with YPAO, no Wifi, no Neo X. Not 11.2; No Airplay? I'm not familiar with Yamaha personally, got any others? Actually, I wonder why there's so few apparent users on AVS
c) Sony - no room correction AFAIK
d) Anthem, Outlaw etc. - not as many channels, no Airplay (I think), no networking, etc.
e) Sherwood - extremely buggy and not updated since 2010

The only conceivable downside to the 4311 would seem to be paying for Audyssey Pro vs. the external sub EQ you'd need on the Pioneer units. If you want that tweakability, that brings the SC-55/7 closer to 4311 + Audyssey Pro. But when you factor in the tierbreaker of Denon's support for firmware upgrades (even if paid) and Audyssey tweaking its product.....

Am I missing anything?

Hey SDRUCKER,

Your post was very helpful. I am looking at getting either the 4311 or the 3009 but I have recently eliminated the 3009 due to reliability. I haven't researched the SC-57 at all. If money was no issue which would you recommend the 4311 or the pioneer SC-57 and why?
post #14868 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by dancolt View Post


Hey SDRUCKER,

Your post was very helpful. I am looking at getting either the 4311 or the 3009 but I have recently eliminated the 3009 due to reliability. I haven't researched the SC-57 at all. If money was no issue which would you recommend the 4311 or the pioneer SC-57 and why?

This is the 4311 forum, and I'm an SC-57 owner because I was upgrading my SC-27, before I spent several months reading Denon threads and listening to the collective wisdom of several ex-Pioneer owners I respect.

Here's my $0.02:
If money is no object I'd buy the 4311 and get an Audyssey Pro license. You get almost all the advantages of the SC-57 except for possibly better upscaling of SD and streaming content with the Marvell chip, PQLS (for TVs that support it), and maybe Wifi.

Are any of those important to you? If you believe many, video upconverting is overrated, especially if you favor HD and BluRay content. And if you have the latest Oppo BluRay player, you get the Marvell chip anyway for DVD and BluRay, as well as for Internet streaming from that source.

But, with the 4311 you get sub EQ integrated with high resolution room correction, and Audyssey has periodically tweaked its software and offers firmware upgrades, where Pioneer's MCACC hasn't, and has been 'take it or leave it'. In my book SQ trumps PQ.

Why would I buy an SC-57 right now:
If I already liked the 'Pioneer sound' from ICE (or their 'ICE-like' amps)
If I had an external sub EQ already
If I liked tweaking my sound, and didn't want to take the time to license and learn Audyssey Pro
You wanted to use Neo: X right now
A deal too good to refuse
After reviewing the features, I had no expectation that new features would be added - the product is 'as is'

Otherwise I'd go with the 4311.
post #14869 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by GSDTrainer View Post

Sweet, Im still debating with myself whether to go with the Denon or a Marantz AV7005 (or successor) with external amplification. Missed out on a good deal for the new Marantz MM7055 used . But then I got to thinking thats $2700 MSRP for the Marantz (AV7005 + MM7055) or a Denon 4311 for $1250. Its time to upgrade everything later on this year so still time to decide. Unless I come across some good deals .

as a data point, i was an early adopter of the av7005 and it is a very fine piece...

i currently have an a100, and would under no circumstances trade it for a 7005+amp...

better dsp... robust internal amplification... etc.

to be honest, this really isn't a hard decision...
post #14870 of 23181
The Pio has 11.1 preamp outs - but can only process 9.1 channels max?

(Is it still only the 4311//A100 and 4810, in terms of newest 3D capable receivers that can do 11.x channels?)
post #14871 of 23181
^^
Just the 4311CI and A100 as the 4810CI is HDMI 1.3.
post #14872 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

as a data point, i was an early adopter of the av7005 and it is a very fine piece...

i currently have an a100, and would under no circumstances trade it for a 7005+amp...

better dsp... robust internal amplification... etc.

to be honest, this really isn't a hard decision...

Yeah I kinda figured that would be the response. Cheaper and one less piece of equipment to mess with. Also the Marantz amp is 140 WPC while the Denon is listed as the same. I dont know if thats all channels driven with the Denon but the Denon wasnt even on my radar until I clicked on this thread by accident, I had tunnel vision on the Marantz
post #14873 of 23181
^^^

no idea on the acd rating...

i know that it drives my "not real easy to drive" speakers as loud as i need them to go in my room...

i made sure that it would do so BEFORE i sold my bryston...
post #14874 of 23181
Evening all

Just bought a 4311 and joined the revolution... but have noticed a small anomoly already... ? Could you gurus see if I'm doing it wrong

I have ran audyssey etc and everything is set up perfectly... Movies sound great, no coml,ants what so ever, speakers are set all ok, sounds great and very happy with the results, smooth deep bass for movies...

My issue is when I select my ps3 (game) or my Xbox (video1) or my tv (tv) or the net radio or AirPlay etc... I change the speaker Channel levels by upping the subs a few db as with those sources the subs need a little boost (for movies they are fine but music/tv and gaming they need a small boost)

However, when I do this, and then return to my bluray/movies/htpc etc it remembers the channel levels I used in the "Game" mode or on the "net radio" mode etc etc ..

So this means every time I listen to music on net radio, I must change all channel levels, then when I am finished listening, I switch back to my bluray movies and must change the channel leves again to watch a movie, after a movie if I switch to "game" I must change the channel levels again (rinse and repeat)

Is there a way to set channel levels independently for each hdmi source?

Any work arounds?
Or ways that you guys go about this issue? It seems like a real silly thing I'm probably missing as surly this would be a standard feature on most avrs?

Ciao,
post #14875 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdrucker View Post

I'm saying this as a current groupie rather than an owner, so to speak, but right now, if you've got a) at least $1300 to spend on an authorized dealer willing to price match, b) you care about Airplay and sub EQ, and c) want a well-understood and/or minimally buggy AVR, there's literally no reason to buy anything other than a 4311, period.

If you're willing to pay extra for the core unit depending on channel to get the mfr. warranty and/or are willing to shop for external sub EQ, and then the Pioneer Elite SC-55/57 is an option without compromising the other features of the 4311 (plus you get the Marvell Qdeo video processing). From reading AVS, I'd rule out other major manufacturers because:

a) Onkyo/Integra 3009/5009, 80.2/3- Has historic quality issues, need funky things like external fans to cool hot HDMI boards, problematic Audyssey firmware updating that can hurt functionality, and an unknown status for adding Audyssey Pro capability (from reading the forums, it's debatable whether it's even going to happen); no Airplay, not 11.2
b) Yamaha A3010 - doesn't EQ below 31 Hz with YPAO, no Wifi, no Neo X. Not 11.2; No Airplay? I'm not familiar with Yamaha personally, got any others? Actually, I wonder why there's so few apparent users on AVS
c) Sony - no room correction AFAIK
d) Anthem, Outlaw etc. - not as many channels, no Airplay (I think), no networking, etc.
e) Sherwood - extremely buggy and not updated since 2010

The only conceivable downside to the 4311 would seem to be paying for Audyssey Pro vs. the external sub EQ you'd need on the Pioneer units. If you want that tweakability, that brings the SC-55/7 closer to 4311 + Audyssey Pro. But when you factor in the tierbreaker of Denon's support for firmware upgrades (even if paid) and Audyssey tweaking its product.....

Am I missing anything?

Now that onkyo dropped the BLT amps in there flagships, I also see no good reason to spend alot more for a onkyo, unless you just got to have 32 bit DACs in your AVR..
post #14876 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian Beale View Post

Evening all

Just bought a 4311 and joined the revolution... but have noticed a small anomoly already... ? Could you gurus see if I'm doing it wrong

I have ran audyssey etc and everything is set up perfectly... Movies sound great, no coml,ants what so ever, speakers are set all ok, sounds great and very happy with the results, smooth deep bass for movies...

My issue is when I select my ps3 (game) or my Xbox (video1) or my tv (tv) or the net radio or AirPlay etc... I change the speaker Channel levels by upping the subs a few db as with those sources the subs need a little boost (for movies they are fine but music/tv and gaming they need a small boost)

However, when I do this, and then return to my bluray/movies/htpc etc it remembers the channel levels I used in the "Game" mode or on the "net radio" mode etc etc ..

So this means every time I listen to music on net radio, I must change all channel levels, then when I am finished listening, I switch back to my bluray movies and must change the channel leves again to watch a movie, after a movie if I switch to "game" I must change the channel levels again (rinse and repeat)

Is there a way to set channel levels independently for each hdmi source?

Any work arounds?
Or ways that you guys go about this issue? It seems like a real silly thing I'm probably missing as surly this would be a standard feature on most avrs?

Ciao,

Assuming that you use the quick select HDMI buttons 1,2, and 3, pick the appropriate input, pull up menu, change whatever you want, exit the menu, and then push whatever button is associated with that input (PS3?) and hold it down for three seconds - you should see confirmation on the GUI screen. Those settings should then be memorized for that input button. This has to be done for each button separately, otherwise it will revert to the Audyssey XT32 calibration settings.
post #14877 of 23181
^^^ @ Ian Beale -

The Denon doesn't remember channel levels by input, channel levels are "global". You can however have separate levels for 2ch playback by using the "2CH DIRECT/STEREO" custom menu.
post #14878 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by fookoo_2010 View Post

Assuming that you use the quick select HDMI buttons 1,2, and 3, pick the appropriate input, pull up menu, change whatever you want, exit the menu, and then push whatever button is associated with that input (PS3?) and hold it down for three seconds - you should see confirmation on the GUI screen. Those settings should then be memorized for that input button. This has to be done for each button separately, otherwise it will revert to the Audyssey XT32 calibration settings.

Thanks for the Replys...

batpigs post would suggest I can't do what I asked (dam you denon) and this post would suggest I can do what I asked?

Who's right

Also, can I actually change the quick select buttons to be whatever I want? I thought they were preset to BD/sat/dock I'd love to chage them to be my game etc, how can't his be done also?

Sorry for all my silly questions but I'm fresh out the wrapper with this 4311

Ciao,
post #14879 of 23181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian Beale View Post

...batpigs post would suggest I can't do what I asked (dam you denon) and this post would suggest I can do what I asked?
Who's right

Hmmm...batpig is the world expert on Denon and his statement exactly explains your experience...tough call...
post #14880 of 23181
I do know that I am right if you limit the scope to non-QuickSelect usage. I am not 100% sure if you can indeed memorize channel levels to a QuickSelect.

For sure, 100%, a Denon will not just memorize channel levels to an input by default. On older Denon models (through xx09 I believe) channel levels could be customized per surround mode (e.g. Dolby Digital vs. Multich Stereo) but they dropped that feature a few years back.

I don't use QuickSelects so I don't really know if they do memorize channel levels.
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