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The "Official" Denon AVR-4311CI/AVR-A100 thread [NO PRICE TALK] - Page 598

post #17911 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by djPerfectTrip View Post

What's a good sirius tuner to use with this receiver?

this is what i use with mine...

[=http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002ZYJB36/ref=asc_df_B002ZYJB362048612?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=asn&creative=395093&creativeASIN=B002ZYJB36&hvpos=1o1&hvexid=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=1234567890&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=]clicky[/]

i've had this for awhile now... i like it, it allows control by the avr... also, it can be used independently in zones (although since i use an atv for airplay purposes, i don't have to worry about the zone limitation anyway)... actually, sirius in the only real reason i'm even using zone 2...

although had an iphone app been available when i first got it, i may have looked in that direction... i dunno how sirius is doing their subscriptions now, doyou need a whole separate subscription for the internet streaming, or is it just an add on cost to an existing one? if it's an add on cost, it would be cheaper to go that way, as the standalone tuner requires a unique subscription...

edit: no, i still haven't figured out how to do links right with the new forum... redface.gif
post #17912 of 23176
^^^I looked at that last night and I don't really want to pay for another subscription. That just seems really lame to me. If I can do the streaming option for cheaper I would consider that tho as it's just my wife that uses it and who knows how much she would since airplay is also available...I'll check out the iphone app I suppose.

As far as links: [ url ]link[ /url ] with no space in between the tags like I have it there.
post #17913 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

Question for those who have dealt with ligtning damage. We had a couple bad storms over the last few days and some of my gear has been acting strange since. Everything powers up, but I had to do a reset for my DVR, and am wondering if I need to do one on my AVR as well. The sound if off, with vocals being very harsh and distorting a bit. Vocals also seem to be at a much higher level than everything else. When I went into the menus to check the settings, they were all different. They were neither factory nor any setting I have used (I was getting -9 for left front, -4.0 for center, -8 for right front, normally these a 0.5, -1.5, 1.0. I was the only one home tis week, so It wasn't somebody goofing with the settings/levels, which makes me wonder if the storms have done something.
I don't notice any smells from the unit, so I don't think any of the hardware was affected. Can I just rerun Audyssey, or should I do a microprocessor reset? Also, are there other signs I should look for?
Thanks in advance.

For me, I couldn't shake the feeling that lightning screwed a bunch of things up. Movie didn't have enough bass---lightning probably damaged something. Dialog not as clear---lightning damaged something. I kept thinking I should hook something up to all 10,000 inputs/outputs on the back of my gear just to see if they were all working. smile.gif

Lightning definitely took out my 3808ci. However, I was so paranoid about the rest of my gear I ended up filing an insurance claim. Once they were convinced lightning was the culprit and I had hit my deductible, I just started adding anything that was acting fishy to the list to be replaced. That is how I ended up with my 4311. smile.gif
post #17914 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by djPerfectTrip View Post

And then it can play thru airplay?

Yup ... at least with the iPhone, not sure about the android app.
post #17915 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post


clicky

edit: no, i still haven't figured out how to do links right with the new forum... redface.gif

Just use the LINK icon as with the old platform. smile.gif

58
post #17916 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Yup ... at least with the iPhone, not sure about the android app.
That'll work, thanks =^)
post #17917 of 23176
Just got a config.dat file save with something in it! Got new 4311 to replace 2308 last Tuesday and love it! tried save twice yesterday and after 45 min wait, red light and "saving" showed, stopped it, using DVR input for HTPC during attemp.t.

Today tried about 5 times.

Switched to unused input and it took < 3min but file was emty and it never shut down.
Grabbed some other straws which I don't remember, Normal in that situation right? rolleyes.gif Same result, took < 3min but file was emty and it never shut down.

Last try switched to TV input, I don't use ARC, turned off TV energy saver, and did Soft reset. Don't have any idea why it finally worked, 12 min, but first guess is soft reset.confused.gif

Thought maybe if we post the last straw grabbed when it works we could find a consistent procedure to this crap shoot. ItI was a major selling point to me. BTW Audyssey xt32 is really great. Very very noticable improvment.
post #17918 of 23176
somewhat off topic, but continuing the sirius conversation for a second...

does anone know if you get live play by play (nfl, mlb, nba, etc.) through the iphone app IF you tie it to an existing subscription?
post #17919 of 23176
BSOKO,

"I thought that I seen a firmware upgrade to XT32 on the Denon site for the 5805ci?"

I wish smile.gif

That's for the 5308CI (Next model that came after the 5805CI but has only 7 amps instead of 10, not as robust, and quite honestly, in a lot of ways, a downgrade).

The upgrade is both a hardware and firmware upgrade, costs $1000, and gets you 3D pass through, XT32, and a few other things.

If I owned the 5308CI (Bought my 5805CI just as it was being discontinued and the 5308CI was being introduced and purposely chose the 5805CI even though it cost more at the time) I would most definitely do this upgrade.

So at this time, I'm looking at the A100 or the new 4520 depending on its specs/price.

As for the A100/volume & input selector knob, do you know if it's also plastic or if it's aluminum or some other higher quality material like most other AVR's??

Thanks,

--J
Edited by jevansoh - 6/9/12 at 2:53pm
post #17920 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jevansoh View Post

I know this may seem like a silly question, but here goes anyway. wink.gif
I currently have the Denon 5805CI and boy is it a wonderful beast at 97lbs and 10 wonderful 170 watt amps.
But.... Its lack of features are starting to, for the first time, become a bit of an issue, and although I have an AS-EQ1, I really want Audyssey XT32.
I went to Best Buy to check out a 4311 a few months ago when I started seeing all these awesome prices as I thought, for less than $1300, I'd be crazy NOT to at least "TRY" it to see how much of an upgrade or downgrade it is from what I have now, but when I got there and saw (and felt) the plastic front and plastic volume/selector knobs, I was so turned off by the cheap feel (no offense to anyone, honest) I just turned away.
Seeing that with the xx13 models they've gone back to an aluminum face (but don't know about the knobs) I take it the plastic didn't go over very well, and yes, I know it's what's on the inside that counts, but....
I was wondering... Since they're not coming out with a 4313 and the 4520 may just be more than I want to pay (or it may be perfect, who knows at this point...still can't find real specs on it) I thought I'd look into this again.
My question is this... For those that have the A100 version, does the A100 have a metal face, or plastic like the 4311? Is the volume/input selector metal or plastic on the A100?
I'm thinking the A100 (found a good deal on one but can't "feel it" first) may just be great for me to give a try, but do want to know this first.
Thanks everybody!
--J


1. You may be aware of this, but XT32 uses 2x more sub filters than does the AS-EQ1.

There was an update (which I applied) to the AS-EQ1 to give it the same resolution (version 3.2 BTW) filters as XT32. FYI.


2. Of the new XX13 models, only the 3313CI has an aluminum face plate.

OIC. Good to know.


3. 4520CI specs should be out later this summer. Look for the same 4311CI specs with the new features of the 3313CI (eg. Denon Link HD, 4K upscaling/pass through, Zone 2 HDMI/Component output, aluminum faceplate) as well as likely a few other new features.

Thanks for this info. I "assume" it will also have Audyssey LFC and do you think it may have more robust amps and possibly be THX certified since it will be the new flagship?? That's what I'm thinking, at least.

4. Yes, A100 has a metal face plate.

But what about the Volume knob and Input Selector knob? Is it also aluminum and better quality than the 4311 or are the knobs exactly the same as the 4311?

Thanks for the info, JD!
post #17921 of 23176
^^^

dunno.... i haven't done a chemical analysis of the knob material... tongue.gif

since it's unlikely you'll touch a "new" a100 at anywhere near the price the 4311 is going for right now (if you can even find one), it really wouldn't be a wise expenditure of funds to buy one over a 4311...

that's coming from an a100 owner... had i not gotten an absolutely smoking deal on the a100 floor model i got, i would have bought the 4311... but for the minimal pricel difference in that instance, i got the a100, simply because i flip equipment pretty regularly, and it will likely be easier to move...

the 4520 intrigues me IF the hdmi matrixing "works right", as i could eliminate a collection of splitters and switches... other than that, "we" collectively have not come up with a feature that it might have that would make it worth waiting for over the 4311 (and even then, it's not overly cost effective to go in that direction)... 4k processing doesn't buy you anything*.... it's possible it might have that trick new audyssey bass containment logic, but that is really only useful if you live in a townhouse/apartment... i would imagine it will have all kinds of floral marketing terms attached to it as well...

* when you do get a 4k display, it will contain the necessary processing...
post #17922 of 23176
With Audyssey who would care if they had THX or not? I used it when I had my SC-57 but THX was not the end all for most movies.
post #17923 of 23176
I find it funny that someone would not purchase this unit simply because of faceplate material.
post #17924 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsoko2 View Post

With Audyssey who would care if they had THX or not? I used it when I had my SC-57 but THX was not the end all for most movies.

I had three Onkyos (805, 885 and 886) with THX Ultra and never used any of the THX settings. My reasoning was if I have DTS-MA or DD TrueHD audio why mess around with it wink.gif.

Quote:
Originally Posted by friendlyviper View Post

I find it funny that someone would not purchase this unit simply because of faceplate material.

When the latest series of Denon AVRs came out I was not too impressed with the plastic faceplate. But after reading numerous positive reviews of the 4311 the looks really did not matter that much any more. I would prefer a metal faceplate like the 3313 but I can live with the lowly plastic one of the 4311. I close my eyes and pretend it is 1/4" thick billet aluminum and the 4311 sounds so much better wink.gif.

Bill
post #17925 of 23176
Had a friend over today to help with my HSU VTF15H sub. When doing the subwoofer sweeps from 10Hz and up we could hear it also from my center speaker at 30Hz. My crossover is at 80Hz for the center speaker KEF Q600. confused.gif
post #17926 of 23176
a bi-amping question:

Since this receiver is 9 channel capable, but I won't have any use for the last 2, I was wondering if bi-amping my Klipsch RF-82 IIs would be of any benefit. I'm assuming by bi-amping, you are sending double the power to the speaker? Would this be too much as the speaker is designed to handle 150 watts RMS? Would I be safe doing this? Would I get any sound benefit? I understand it's not 'true' bi-amping, but I'm guessing that giving the speakers more power would be beneficial. Am I correct in assuming this?
post #17927 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

Question for those who have dealt with ligtning damage. We had a couple bad storms over the last few days and some of my gear has been acting strange since. Everything powers up, but I had to do a reset for my DVR, and am wondering if I need to do one on my AVR as well. The sound if off, with vocals being very harsh and distorting a bit. Vocals also seem to be at a much higher level than everything else. When I went into the menus to check the settings, they were all different. They were neither factory nor any setting I have used (I was getting -9 for left front, -4.0 for center, -8 for right front, normally these a 0.5, -1.5, 1.0. I was the only one home tis week, so It wasn't somebody goofing with the settings/levels, which makes me wonder if the storms have done something.
I don't notice any smells from the unit, so I don't think any of the hardware was affected. Can I just rerun Audyssey, or should I do a microprocessor reset? Also, are there other signs I should look for?
Thanks in advance.

Before resetting anything, have you checked the Audyssey configuration values?You mentioned you checked the settings, but you didn't mention if you were checking the current settings or the actual original Audyssey calibration settings. If the Audyssey configuration parameters are still intact, you can just restore the original calibration settings and see if that fixes things for you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3267L View Post

Help please...
I currently own an A100 and....
I am really wanting to purchase an Oppo player, and will as soon as I can decide which one.I know many in this thread may own an Oppo. I understand the difference between the 93 & 95. My question is, if I was to buy the 95 for its superior analog out and Sabre 32 bit DACs, does this mean that I would be forced to bypass/not use my processors Audyssey Advanced MultEQ XT32 speaker configuration that my A/V receiver has for speaker correction? It seams that not using the superior XT32 Audyssey for speaker setup and having to measure speaker distance manually and set it up on the Oppo is going backwards? Am I wrong? I know that the DAC's in the Oppo 95 are awesome and the only reason to buy the 95 over the 93 is to use the analog out. Just not sure if I have to sacrifice Audyssey XT32 speaker setup to do so. Please advise, and thanks for any insight!
Mike

Yes, if you connect the 95 via the MC external inputs then you will bypass Audyssey. No way around that if you want to use the DACs on the 95. The analog stereo inputs will get Audyssey applied to it, but the 4311/A100 will first convert the analog signal to digital then apply Audyssey so you will lose the benefits of the 95's DACs as you will now using the AVR's DACs in the final stage as there will be an ADC/DAC internal to the AVR.

There may be light at the end of the tunnel though. I have a 4311 and both the 93 and the 95. The 93 is connected via HDMI and running Audyssey and the 95 is connected via analog RCA to the MC external inputs. I have a 18' x 16' x 8' sealed and treated room. My speakers are Revel Performa F52s. For critical listening, it's a marginal difference and I would be perfectly happy with either setup, but I, as well as the other two people (blind testing), preferred the sound of the 95 without Audyssey. It was difficult to do immediate switching between the two units, but we all selected the 95 every time as the sound of choice for music with no sub. I expect things will only get better as I fine tune my system by adding a couple of JL Audio 10W7 drivers as MBM to the F52s with a MiniDSP doing the EQ functions.

No need to do any manual speaker distance measurements either. What I did was to run Audyssey first then copy the speaker measurements over to the Oppo.
post #17928 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by djPerfectTrip View Post

a bi-amping question:
Since this receiver is 9 channel capable, but I won't have any use for the last 2, I was wondering if bi-amping my Klipsch RF-82 IIs would be of any benefit. I'm assuming by bi-amping, you are sending double the power to the speaker? Would this be too much as the speaker is designed to handle 150 watts RMS? Would I be safe doing this? Would I get any sound benefit? I understand it's not 'true' bi-amping, but I'm guessing that giving the speakers more power would be beneficial. Am I correct in assuming this?

Klipsch are very efficient speakers. I highly doubt you will be using more than a few watts to drive them to ear splitting levels unless you are pretty far from them. Speakers draw only as much power as they need to produce the sound levels you set it. Unless you are maxing out the single amp channel (highly unlikely), bi-amping will not make a difference. If you have the extra cable and time, you can give it a try for yourself.
post #17929 of 23176
I planned on trying it, I just didn't want overpower them...Thanks for the input =^)
post #17930 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by friendlyviper View Post

I find it funny that someone would not purchase this unit simply because of faceplate material.
Knowing what I know now I would buy this unit if the fron were made out of balsa wood. Quite frankly, the best prepro/receiver I have ever owned..
post #17931 of 23176
Thanks for the information! I appreciate everyone's time!
Mike
post #17932 of 23176
A couple of questions guys, I'm going to get me a new AVR 4311 in the next few weeks and I have been trying to get through this thread before I buy but it's just taking me to long. I see the blue rain and audio dropouts issues was cleared up about 18 months ago and also some problems with the microphones for audyssey calibrations. What I was wondering was if if the new unit I get has had been in the dealers store for some time and if it didn't have the required firmware updates from ages ago installed would they still be avaliable to download when I enable internet access on the unit. Also if the unit I end up buying has the latest firmware already installed are there anymore hardware/software issues to still be resolved. Sorry if this has been asked before but I haven't been able to find these answers. Regards Wassa.
P.S. Is it safe to presume all the bad mic's are long gone from Denon products too?
Edited by wassa - 6/10/12 at 1:39am
post #17933 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsil View Post

Had a friend over today to help with my HSU VTF15H sub. When doing the subwoofer sweeps from 10Hz and up we could hear it also from my center speaker at 30Hz. My crossover is at 80Hz for the center speaker KEF Q600. confused.gif

I am the friend that jsil had over, let me see if I can explain what we were experiencing.

Running freq response sweeps in order to help us find the best spot for his sub, we noticed that his center channel was putting out a lot of sound when running the really low freq sweeps, 10hz, 20hz and 30hz. We verified that his center was set to small and crossed at 80z. I can understand getting some noise from the center channel at say 50ish hz and above, but at 10 and 20hz???...and not just a little, the sound was more prominent from the center then it was from the sub, and his sub is more then capable of playing the low freq test tones, and yet we got virtually no sound from it until 30hz to 40hz tones.
the 10 and 20hz tones were coming from the center.. we were both confused as to weather this is normal or not. Interestingly though, there was no noticeable sounds coming from the mains until around 50-60hz tones. volume on the avr was set between -10 and -15 for the duration.

I have the same test tone disk as jsil does and when I got home I ran the sweeps through my set up (onkyo 809 and polk montor 70s, 60s, 30s and cs2 and dual psw505's for subs). I noticed a very small amount of content coming from my center when running the really low freq tones. My center is set to small and crossed at 80hz,. What I experienced was nothing like the almost overwhelming sounds coming from jsils center. granted his center is better then mine in just about every way, but the cs2 is no slouch and is a pretty capable for a budget center speaker.

We are both confused as to why so much content is coming from jsil's center when running the ultra low and low frequency test tones. We turned audyssey off and tried the sweeps again and got virtually no sound from any speaker including the sub until around 40hz. If anyone can give some advice or explanation as to what we were experiencing it would be most appreciated.
post #17934 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by djPerfectTrip View Post

a bi-amping question:
Since this receiver is 9 channel capable, but I won't have any use for the last 2, I was wondering if bi-amping my Klipsch RF-82 IIs would be of any benefit. I'm assuming by bi-amping, you are sending double the power to the speaker? Would this be too much as the speaker is designed to handle 150 watts RMS? Would I be safe doing this? Would I get any sound benefit? I understand it's not 'true' bi-amping, but I'm guessing that giving the speakers more power would be beneficial. Am I correct in assuming this?

Nope, no real benefit. And although a misconception is the power is doubled (cause you're connecting 2 amps right?) that is not the case at all as there's only one power supply and tweeters draw far less power than do woofers.
post #17935 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by wassa View Post

A couple of questions guys, I'm going to get me a new AVR 4311 in the next few weeks and I have been trying to get through this thread before I buy but it's just taking me to long. I see the blue rain and audio dropouts issues was cleared up about 18 months ago and also some problems with the microphones for audyssey calibrations. What I was wondering was if if the new unit I get has had been in the dealers store for some time and if it didn't have the required firmware updates from ages ago installed would they still be avaliable to download when I enable internet access on the unit. Also if the unit I end up buying has the latest firmware already installed are there anymore hardware/software issues to still be resolved. Sorry if this has been asked before but I haven't been able to find these answers. Regards Wassa.
P.S. Is it safe to presume all the bad mic's are long gone from Denon products too?

Nope ... haven't been any major issues for well over a year now (nice part about it being out for awhile). Yes, the firmware will still be available for download as soon as you connect the AVR to the internet. And no, not likely to have a bad mic.
post #17936 of 23176
I just bought mine last Thursday and the install was perfect. I have been playing the crap out of it with movies and no issues.
post #17937 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3267L View Post

...I know that the DAC's in the Oppo 95 are awesome and the only reason to buy the 95 over the 93 is to use the analog out. Just not sure if I have to sacrifice Audyssey XT32 speaker setup to do so. Please advise, and thanks for any insight!
Mike

In addition to jd's and ducs's comments, I will point out that you are far more likely to get sonic improvement on music using a DenonLink player than by using an Oppo 95's DACs and foregoing Audyssey. AFAIK a DBP 4010 can be had new for about the same as an Oppo95 and used DenonLink models are available for far less. For $700 Audyssey Pro will improve SQ as well. Depending on what you have now, upgrading speakers or a second sub are also likely areas for HT funds to be better spent IMO.
post #17938 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

In addition to jd's and ducs's comments, I will point out that you are far more likely to get sonic improvement on music using a DenonLink player than by using an Oppo 95's DACs and foregoing Audyssey.

I hear no difference playing CDs from my DenonLink 3 player (3109) compared to my two BluRay players connected to my 4310 over HDMI or digital coax. In all these cases, you are using the AVR's DAC, so there will be no audible difference on CDs. The DenonLink players do have the advantage over the BluRay players when it comes to SACD or DVD-A, since the signal will go to the AVR digitally and can then be Audyssey-processed before conversion to analog. Any of the Oppo players will do the same thing as the DenonLink players because they can send SACD or DVD-A to the AVR over HDMI.
post #17939 of 23176
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

just one comment, then i'll stay out of this... smile.gif
nobody has done a "true" level matched comparison, unless the methodology that was described earlier in this thread has changed...
back under my rock...

Hi Chris. I'm not sure exactly what "methodology" you're referring to, but I hope we are not reopening the "if it's not matched far closer than 0.5 dB the A/B test is completely invalid" debate.

For those of us doing practical in-home audiophile hobbyist A/B comparisons to decide such things as on whether DSD decoded in the AVR sounds better than decoding in the player, or if piece of gear A sounds better than piece of gear B, there are well-established procedures that help reduce the error inherent in doing such tests. Using an SPL to level-match A and B is a crucial step. Others include keeping the switching time as quick as possible and using short familiar repeated segments of high SQ music. For subtle SQ differences, more rigorous controls are desirable, such as blinded (double-blind is really impractical) A/B/x tests, using test disc tones (pink noise) and having the SPL mounted on on a tripod.

As you well know, our gear cannot match to any less than 0.5 dB. Therefore, in deference to the 0.1dB crowd, I have suggested the simple "go 0.5 dB better" technique:
If A sounds better than B, raise B by 0.5 dB and repeat the test. If the SQ improvement in A is significant enough to outweigh what should, per the 0.1 theory, be a significant advantage to B, then I consider the test valid and I have the data I need as a hobbyist.
post #17940 of 23176
^^^

i said i'd only make one comment on that subject, so i will stick to my word...

however, i will make a general comment... just because doing something correctly is difficult, that does not mean that doing it incorrectly then becomes correct...
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