The "Official" Denon AVR-4311CI/AVR-A100 thread [NO PRICE TALK] - Page 95

Yes, I just set up my A100 last night, and experienced the "Blue Rain" effect that you mentioned. I only got on satelite (DirecTv), BluRay played perfectly. I noticed the same results - turning off Video Convert made the problem go away. Haven't had much time to play with this issue, as I was still too busy setting things up.

I would split up Left / Center / Right between the two amps since those are the most demanding channels.

Something like this would balance out the work load between the two amps.

AMP 1: Surround left / Wide Left / Left / Right / Wide Right / Surround Right

AMP 2: Height Left / Back Left / Center / Back right / Height Right

Well, I got my AVR-A100 and DBP-A100 set up last night, and aside from the "Blue Rain" issue, things have been going pretty. I've had a few issues with audio not happening when switching sources, but haven't had any drop outs once a source was functioning. I also don't have the network connection established yet, so I haven't been able to pull down any firmware updates, so that might solved the minor issues I've encountered.

First impressions are the sound is definitely improved over my previous set up (AVR-4308CI). Two channel music sounded amazing - I'm very happy with the results there (not sure how much of this is the AVR versus the DBP, but I'm happy regardless). When watching movies, the overall soundstage is great, though the voices in the center channel sounded a little "disconnected" to me. It might just be the movie I was watching - I will try again tonight with a source I'm more familiar with.

Aside from the blue rain which is easily avoidable, the video all looked fantastic.

Didn't have a lot of time to play around last night, so I'm looking forward to the weekend when I can really put this new set up to the test.

For what this is worth, I would like to relay my experiences from getting specific information and price quotes from dealers (authorized) that I talked to today regarding the prices on the 4311CI/A100 and especially a comparison between the 4311CI and the A100. I have been mulling over a purchase of one of these receivers for some weeks now.

I had no intention of spending a grand more for the A100 versus the 4311 as the differences between the two receivers in my opinion is minuscule (iron feet, front face, etc.). I have NEVER gained anything by buying a "limited edition" item. I am an old fart (68), so I do have some experience in item purchase. I the days of my youth I was a stereo buff and I had a listening room full of McIntosh equipment from speakers to amplifier, and I had White equalizers set up professionally in my room. The total sum of the parts I had did sound significantly better than anything that I had had before (late 70's to early 80's).

That being said, here is my experience today. I called several dealers today, all listed by Denon as authorized dealers:

As everybody knows, the prices varied widely:

1. Generally dealers without stock said they cannot discount dealer price.
2. A couple dealers WOULD discount even they had no stock.
3. Some dealers would not budge from retail.
4. Some negotiated, especially if I had better price quotes from other dealers.

One dealer said that if a dealer discounted the price, he could not be a Denon authorized dealer. Not so, as I called only dealers listed by DENON as authorized dealers. Thank the Lord for sites like AVSforum with knowledgeable people from whom to get advice.

Now comes the best part. I asked about the benefits of the A100 over the 4311CI. Several dealers said "not much," but one dealer went into sales mode. He told me that the A100 was markedly better than the 4311CI. He waxed on the beauty of the receiver, the benefit of the receiver being a "limited edition" receiver, and best of all, the wonderfully better audio that the A100 has. He said the A100 sounds much "richer" "smoother" "fuller" and generally much better "fidelity" than the counterpart 4311.

I did not point out that the specs are identical (at least that I can see) between the two receivers. I did not point out that many people on AVSForum agree with me that as far as I can tell, there is little difference between the two receivers. He said that the people at the dealership ran extensive testing and all agreed that there are major differences between the two receivers, re sound quality.

I then asked him his opinion on purchasing either receiver for XT32. I told him that I have a 3808CI and a 4308CI in two small rooms using a 5.1 system, with no intention right now of dual subwoofers. He said that there is a vast improvement with the new XT32 implementation. I told him that I have the professional kit for Audyssey now, and that I really like the present Audyssey setup that I have right now with the 3808/4308. Again he said that I should have the A100. I did not tell him that I sent the graphs that I had done for both my present receivers to Audyssey, and a technician that I talked to said that my present settings "looked pretty good," and I WOULD see SOME (but not massive) improvement in my settings with XT32. I did have to hold my breath when the dealer kept saying that XT32 is vastly better than previousl Audyssey implementations.

In conclusion I conclude that perhaps this dealer is CORRECT in his advice. I have NO WAY TO DISPUTE WHAT HE IS SAYING, because I have not done any A/B testing with the receivers. Furthermore, I have not seen much on AVSforum threads because the receivers have not been on the market very long!

Now, believe it or not, I am still trying to decide between the two receivers, but I am leaning toward the A100! But not for the "reasons" above. I *am of the opinion* that the A100 receiver *might* be of better build quality. I do like the five year warranty. Is it worth that much more? For me that is a tough call.

I am certain that the 4311 is a fine receiver; I am Denon all the way. I have seen postings of video dropouts, etc., and that does worry me. I would post my actual theater equipment for my two rooms, and ask for advice about upping from a 3808/4311 and 4308/4311 and comparison between standard Audyssey vs. the new XT32 (which is my main reason for considering the 4311/A100), but again not much experience is available and that is a topic for the Audyssey threads.

I am a retired physician, and I learned in the psychiatry clinics that when one cannot make up his/her mind about something, the best choice is DO NOTHING. This is called "the capacity for delay." We shall see.....

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I noticed this too. I've been using this unit for about a week and overall I'm happy specially 2 channel and bass response is better than Z7 i had. In movies .. I find the effects not as impactful as Z7 specially from centre. Sound is totally different from yamaha. I noticed this on many movies, the centre seems to be disconnected. Keep in mind ... all this is without audessey.

Sometimes just tweaking the distance setting can firm up the soundstage. If auto set up sets L/C/R at 12.1 /11.8 / 12.2 . If you change them ALL to 12.0 that just may clear up any blurring / echo you may hear, try it
Try it with the sub too, Let your ears be the judge.

FYI, for those waiting for the Electronics Expo shipment, they got them in and shipped out at least some yesterday.

Please make the Pre/Pro your first question and the transport the second!

aside from balanced outputs wouldnt you consider the 4311/A100 as close to pre-pro(ish) as denon could get without actually calling it a pre-pro? Myself I find it comforting to know that if something were to happen to one of my amps, I could still be in the game with the denon internal amp while deciding on a new one? All about flexibility, No.

Yep... I ordered one from them yesterday and it is supposed to ship out today. When I ordered, he said they had 3 left.

Hi merk54, yes I think there are some of us that expreience this issue, I found a post by jmb295 eralier in the thread that described something that sounded very similar, a matrix-like effect of blue pixelation or something like that. While it is easy to avoid by skipping the volume display, I suppose it pretty much makes the scaler unusable in the reciever, so hopefully we can figure out if it is bad harware or some software/cable issue. I have since my last post tried another brand of HDMI cable, but no difference.

What TV/display are you using? Mine is a panasonic plasma.

Yikes, the blue rain issue is pretty embarrassing on teh special anniversary edition.

I'd find totally unacceptable - one of the reasons I went with a higher end receiver is to have UI overlay since my unit sits out of sight.

Not to scare you, but "blue rain" may be more of a hardware issue rather than a firmware bug (the audio dropouts and completely disappearing UI I am experiencing are more likely to be firmware bugs).

Yeah, I suppose the video part is the same on 4311 and A100 so same problems. I have to say that I'm supsecting a hardware problem as well, since I get it with multiple sources and cables. I have no other HDMI capable display so cannot control for that unfortunately.

Problem here is that dealers have barely even recieved the product and no display items, I must have put my paws on one of the first in Sweden.

This is what I get when it at its worst, like I said varies a lot with what is happening in the image (artefact is in the TV transmission behind the reciever overlay) :

Attachment 190293

I also have a Panasonic Plasma.

Is the "Blue Rain" issue only happening when the OSD is up or is it happening when you are watching the program material as well?

Ok, there's some consistency between you and me at least, but i think jmb295 was running a projector, so there must be something else going on as well


Brent:
Unfortunately it's present without the overlay as well, it was just up because I was messing with the settings.

Darn, if it was only during the OSD, it would probably be something that I could live with.

For those who may not have noticed on the A 100, the front painted surface has a sparkle in the paint. You need the sun or strong light to see it. Question - when we get airplay will there be a logo or decal to be added to the front of the receiver?

Sure. Look for a direct ship from Apple.

Ok, now apparantly HDMI out 1 is dead, well now I don't need to think about if I should return it or not
I was really careful to unplug the power etc. when I was swapping cabling on my new baby, so it's not by my doing at least

Is there anything I should try that might resurrect it? I have unplugged it for half an hour and reset the processor when I powered it back on? The HDMI settings are set to auto (dual) as per default, but it doesn't matter if I try to set HDMI1 only. I don't get the grey denon logo backgrount on hdmi1, but as soon as I switch to HDMI 2 it shows up...

What a complete mess this has been, I sure hope the replacement improves on this experience. LOL I went with the denon in part since I thought they were more reliable than the opposition, oh well all brands go bad sometimes.

If I wind up having to pay 50 for the airplay update for the 4311, why would I not just buy a new Apple TV for a 100? Don't I get video streaming with the apple TV added to the airplay function .... or am I missing something?

It's not clear in the manual but, yes, that's how it works.

Yes, assuming you have a free HDMI input, $50 for audio only (along with any attendent difficulties getting the new firmware working) makes $99 for audio and iTunes video seem like a bargain. I won't be installing the Airplay upgrade unless it's part of a general update.

Thank-you very much. I was hoping thats how it worked.

Bad advice.

Audyssey can measure latency (both physical distance & electronic delay) far more accurately than you can. If you "tweak" the auto distance settings, you potentially knock the channels out of time alignment.

AJ

googlegod kind of does his own thing sometimes

he will admit that his personal "tweaks" are not compliant with the orthodoxy

I would also recommend that nobody actually follow that advice...

The blue rain issue now has me worried. When I watched a couple scenes from Watchmen (HD) recorded on my Dish 722 about a week ago, I thought I saw a couple scenes with more blue than expected, but I chocked it up to being tired and I had a bunch of other things going on at the same time. I never gave it another thought as I did not see this in anything else. I'm going to check when I get home tonight, but my return window ended last night... Hope I'm being paranoid, but on the other hand, I wonder if it has anything to do with the source material...

p.s. I have a Samsung HLT67A750

Hopefully it was something else, but you are right that the amount of artifacts and/or how easy it is to see them varies a lot (for me at least).
It's really wierd how there sometimes is almost nothing and then in a fade to black it pops up in a certain region.


I talked to support where I bought it, and they had some idea that it could be related to "whiter than white" so related to the mapping of color values. The only setting I can find that is related is the rgb range setting for normal or enhanced, but that made no difference. Another guy in the local store talked about setting the HDMI signal to component instead of RGB, but I cannot find anything like that in the receiver HDMI menu.
Also the reciever reports 8 bits in and 8 bits out, the support guy was talking about deep colour as well, but I think this is supported by the panasonic v10 anyway.

The anchor bay products have a good reputation so I would kind of expect it to swallow most stuff and spit out something well defined anyway, but who knows.

It sounds like the staff at your local store are uninformed.

Luckily we all have AVSForum to fall back on.

The RGB Range setting of Normal/Enhanced only applies when you have an HDMI-DVI cable connected to the HDTV.