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Pioneer's Speaker Genius Hits Low Price Point - Page 102

post #3031 of 5316
Any idea how often does does Newegg change its offers? once a week? I was about to order yesterday as I am in a hurry and have a limited window - when I noticed the change in 41s to 149. Even the price of 21s have doubled - thats pretty big changes happenings on a regular basis..wonder what the logic is?
post #3032 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radio81 View Post

Looking at picking up a SC-1222-K…

According to NewEgg, who assure me the cheque is in the post:

Pioneer SC-1222-K 7.2-Channel Network Ready AV Receiver $599.99 With Promo Code: EMCYTZT2251 Free Shipping!

Deals expire at 11:59pm PT on 09/27/2012!
post #3033 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnprasad View Post

Any idea how often does does Newegg change its offers? once a week? I was about to order yesterday as I am in a hurry and have a limited window - when I noticed the change in 41s to 149. Even the price of 21s have doubled - thats pretty big changes happenings on a regular basis..wonder what the logic is?

They change daily, weekly or however often they feel like changing the prices. The easiest thing to do is sign up for the email notices.

I"m sure the BS-41 will be $99 again shortly and the BS-21 will be $49 soon too.
post #3034 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnprasad View Post

Any idea how often does does Newegg change its offers? once a week? I was about to order yesterday as I am in a hurry and have a limited window - when I noticed the change in 41s to 149. Even the price of 21s have doubled - thats pretty big changes happenings on a regular basis..wonder what the logic is?

I keep a saved search handy:

http://www.newegg.com/Store/BrandSubCategory.aspx?Brand=1167&SubCategory=494&name=Home-Audio-Speakers

But, as previously mentioned, you need to sign up for the email updates, since they occasionally bury a coupon in there that is not immediately shown on the individual product pages.

As a heads up, it looks like Tiger Direct again has all of the x2 series available (Tower, Center, Bookshelf).

Brian
post #3035 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post

As a heads up, it looks like Tiger Direct again has all of the x2 series available (Tower, Center, Bookshelf).

Looks like the FS52's are $99 each with free shipping. I almost wish I would have waited to get these. I guess Ill wait till theyve been circulated a bit more, and still live up to the previous generations performance.
post #3036 of 5316
Hey Guys

I am an absolute noob when it comes to speakers so I had a couple of questions.

Would I be able to use either the BS-41 or the BS-22 as computer speakers straight out of my computer? Or would I need a reciever?
Also, would someone post a picture of the back of the speaker(inputs and stuff) or just tell me what inputs are available.

I was basically planning to get either the BS-41s or BS-22s and combine them with the SW8 MK2 Sub and use them with a laptop.

EDIT: Forgot to say this will be pretty much for music only and will be used in a bedroom
Edited by Prakhar - 9/26/12 at 2:20pm
post #3037 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prakhar View Post

Hey Guys
I am an absolute noob when it comes to speakers so I had a couple of questions.
Would I be able to use either the BS-41 or the BS-22 as computer speakers straight out of my computer? Or would I need a reciever?
Also, would someone post a picture of the back of the speaker(inputs and stuff) or just tell me what inputs are available.
I was basically planning to get either the BS-41s or BS-22s and combine them with the SW8 MK2 Sub and use them with a laptop.

Cannot power them directly from the computer output. The only input on the back of the speaker is the speaker terminals. As one individual suggested in another thread, you can get a cheap 20 watt stereo amp for 19 bucks on amazon. Youll also need a 1/8 phono to RCA adapter, if you dont have one. Thats about the cheapest way to get a little bit of sound out of these speakers while you save for a real receiver. I'm willing to bet it will put most computer speakers to shame. I haven't used that small amp yet, but I just ordered one to drive my dayton b652s for my office computer.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0049P6OTI/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00
post #3038 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prakhar View Post

Hey Guys
I am an absolute noob when it comes to speakers so I had a couple of questions.
Would I be able to use either the BS-41 or the BS-22 as computer speakers straight out of my computer? Or would I need a reciever?
Also, would someone post a picture of the back of the speaker(inputs and stuff) or just tell me what inputs are available.
I was basically planning to get either the BS-41s or BS-22s and combine them with the SW8 MK2 Sub and use them with a laptop.

A pic of the back of the 22's are here. The 21's and 41's are more or less identical.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3381565&CatId=5689

You need an amp of some sort. These are not powered speakers and your PC would not have speaker level outputs.

A receiver, integrated amp, or desk-top amp that can accept analog, USB, or possibly optical inputs (Mac's have optical out...not sure about PC's) will be required.

Brian
post #3039 of 5316
Ok so what I would need to set this up is....

Something like this to hook go from the computer to the amp: http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10218&cs_id=1021815&p_id=5596&seq=1&format=2
And an amp like this one: http://www.amazon.com/LP-2020A-Lepai-Tripath-Class-T-Amplifier/dp/B0049P6OTI/ref=cm_cmu_pg_t

and then what kind of cable would I need to go from the amp to the speakers?
post #3040 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prakhar View Post

Ok so what I would need to set this up is....
Something like this to hook go from the computer to the amp: http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10218&cs_id=1021815&p_id=5596&seq=1&format=2
And an amp like this one: http://www.amazon.com/LP-2020A-Lepai-Tripath-Class-T-Amplifier/dp/B0049P6OTI/ref=cm_cmu_pg_t
and then what kind of cable would I need to go from the amp to the speakers?

That should work.

As the amp also has a mini-plug input, you could also use a cable with mini-plugs on both ends, rather than the one you listed. There would be no difference in sound.

As for speaker wire, nothing fancy. I would say 18g or 16g lamp cord would be more than adequate,

Monoprice has this, which will be fine:

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10239&cs_id=1023903&p_id=2822&seq=1&format=2

If the speakers are to sit on a desk, you only need a few feet. Monoprice does not have anything less than 50' that I could find. But, it's dirt cheap.

brian
post #3041 of 5316
Hmm so that wire just... uhhh.. goes into the terminals on the back of the speaker from the amp? Dont I need a connector of some type (like a RCA plug, mini jack, or something else?

Sorry If I sound really noobish. I have absolutely no idea what speakers are like as I normally do most of my listening on headphones.
post #3042 of 5316
Does anybody know why FS52 (2012 model) is $99 and last years FS51 is still $199 ?
post #3043 of 5316
What would I expect the sound quality to like on a $99. speaker ? Did last years model sound better ? Anybody know ?
post #3044 of 5316
FS 52s are sold individually and FS51s are sold as a pair
post #3045 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Category 3 View Post

Does anybody know why FS52 (2012 model) is $99 and last years FS51 is still $199 ?

As was stated, the FS52 is sold by the each. Also read this >
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-57490890-47/mission-impossible-design-great-sounding-affordable-speakers/
post #3046 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prakhar View Post

Hmm so that wire just... uhhh.. goes into the terminals on the back of the speaker from the amp? Dont I need a connector of some type (like a RCA plug, mini jack, or something else?
Sorry If I sound really noobish. I have absolutely no idea what speakers are like as I normally do most of my listening on headphones.

Everyone has to start somewhere :-)

The speaker wire does not require any sort of connector. Just strip the ends so that they look like the picture in the monoprice link.

The amp has spring clips that accept the bare wire, and the speakers have binding posts that have holes in them that also accept stripped ends.

Notice that the amp and the speaker have each terminal color coded red and black? Just make sure that the wire that connects to the red terminal on the amp connects to the red terminal on the speaker, and make sure black goes to black. If you get it wrong, nothing will explode, but the sound will be compromised.

I suspect that when you see things with your own eyes, it will all make sense.

Brian
post #3047 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Category 3 View Post

What would I expect the sound quality to like on a $99. speaker ? Did last years model sound better ? Anybody know ?

I currently own the 21's, 22's, and tomorrow, UPS willing, I will get a pair of 41's and a C21 (for future HT evaluation).

I have read posts that say these are good speakers for the money. Wrong. IMHO, they are good speakers. Period.

They are not glitzy, but the build quality is excellent. For the price, it is laughable. Andrew Jones clearly made a deal with the devil to do what he did with this line.

I use these in a 3.1 music only system augmented with a NHT Evolution U2 sub. Yeah, I am into overkill. :-)

I cross them over at 120 hertz, so I really don't have anything to say regarding the low end capability, but from there on up, I continue to be amazed. No, they will not play loud enough to crack plaster, and on their own, they will not go low enough to create seismic events, but kept below a max of say 85-90db at the listening chair, and crossed over properly to a quality sub, they are simply amazing. The center image I get is as solid as anything I have had in that system. Imaging is very good side to side and front to back.

Comparing the 21's to the 22's, I am finding the 22's to maybe be a tad bright for my tastes. But, I have only had the 22's for a few days, so I have more listening to do. I know I have read some comments that felt the 21's were a bit laid back. Myself, I did not hear that, I just heard nice smooth treble and outstanding midrange. That surprised me since I am of an age (51) where high end hearing loss is surely taking place. I would have thought that I would prefer the brighter speaker, but maybe my ears are not as shot as I might have feared. :-)

Other speakers which I own that I have directly compared to the 21's were NHT Classic 2, NHT Absolute Zero, and PSB Alpha B1. In this system, I preferred the Pioneers to all of those. I found the treble on the Pios to be smoother. Maybe I prefer soft domes to metal tweeters? I have not had a speaker with a soft dome for over 20 years, but whatever the reason, I grin from ear to ear with the Pios.

OK, enough Pio ad copy from me. :-)

Brian
post #3048 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post

I currently own the 21's, 22's, and tomorrow, UPS willing, I will get a pair of 41's and a C21 (for future HT evaluation).
I have read posts that say these are good speakers for the money. Wrong. IMHO, they are good speakers. Period.
They are not glitzy, but the build quality is excellent. For the price, it is laughable. Andrew Jones clearly made a deal with the devil to do what he did with this line.
I use these in a 3.1 music only system augmented with a NHT Evolution U2 sub. Yeah, I am into overkill. :-)
I cross them over at 120 hertz, so I really don't have anything to say regarding the low end capability, but from there on up, I continue to be amazed. No, they will not play loud enough to crack plaster, and on their own, they will not go low enough to create seismic events, but kept below a max of say 85-90db at the listening chair, and crossed over properly to a quality sub, they are simply amazing. The center image I get is as solid as anything I have had in that system. Imaging is very good side to side and front to back.
Comparing the 21's to the 22's, I am finding the 22's to maybe be a tad bright for my tastes. But, I have only had the 22's for a few days, so I have more listening to do. I know I have read some comments that felt the 21's were a bit laid back. Myself, I did not hear that, I just heard nice smooth treble and outstanding midrange. That surprised me since I am of an age (51) where high end hearing loss is surely taking place. I would have thought that I would prefer the brighter speaker, but maybe my ears are not as shot as I might have feared. :-)
Other speakers which I own that I have directly compared to the 21's were NHT Classic 2, NHT Absolute Zero, and PSB Alpha B1. In this system, I preferred the Pioneers to all of those. I found the treble on the Pios to be smoother. Maybe I prefer soft domes to metal tweeters? I have not had a speaker with a soft dome for over 20 years, but whatever the reason, I grin from ear to ear with the Pios.
OK, enough Pio ad copy from me. :-)
Brian

Can you please do a side to side comparison with the BS41s and newer BS22s? If not, any brief comments on how they compare and which you prefer?
post #3049 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post

I currently own the 21's, 22's, and tomorrow, UPS willing, I will get a pair of 41's and a C21 (for future HT evaluation).
I have read posts that say these are good speakers for the money. Wrong. IMHO, they are good speakers. Period.

Brian

Hi - I have friends carrying these speakers to India. So 51s are ruled out. Between the 21s and 41s..assuming they go on sale at 50 and 100 dollars respectively - you think the 41s are worth twice the price of 21 if I plan to use it as front speakers?

Other option is to spend the 100 bucks not on 41s but the 22s since 42s do not seem to be on the anvil.
Edited by arnprasad - 9/26/12 at 10:49pm
post #3050 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrotel View Post

Can you please do a side to side comparison with the BS41s and newer BS22s? If not, any brief comments on how they compare and which you prefer?

Sure.....once the 41's get here, that is the plan.

BGL
post #3051 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnprasad View Post

Hi - I have friends carrying these speakers to India. So 51s are ruled out. Between the 21s and 41s..assuming they go on sale at 50 and 100 dollars respectively - you think the 41s are worth twice the price of 21 if I plan to use it as front speakers?
Other option is to spend the 100 bucks not on 41s but the 22s since 42s do not seem to be on the anvil.

Well, if you are using a sub, I would guess not, but I won't really know for sure until the 41's arrive today.

I would expect that the 21 and 41 are voiced very similarly with the exception of the 41 going a bit lower.

BGL
post #3052 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post

Well, if you are using a sub, I would guess not, but I won't really know for sure until the 41's arrive today.
I would expect that the 21 and 41 are voiced very similarly with the exception of the 41 going a bit lower.
BGL

Thanks, Also would the 22s with a sub equal the 51/52? I want to know what I am missing by going with the 21/22 instead of 51/52.
post #3053 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prakhar View Post

Ok so what I would need to set this up is....
Something like this to hook go from the computer to the amp: http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10218&cs_id=1021815&p_id=5596&seq=1&format=2
And an amp like this one: http://www.amazon.com/LP-2020A-Lepai-Tripath-Class-T-Amplifier/dp/B0049P6OTI/ref=cm_cmu_pg_t
and then what kind of cable would I need to go from the amp to the speakers?


That amp does not have a sub out so you will have to split the signal coming off your laptop so that one goes to the T amp and the other goes to the sub.
post #3054 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by nograveconcern View Post

That amp does not have a sub out so you will have to split the signal coming off your laptop so that one goes to the T amp and the other goes to the sub.

Crap..I missed that he has a sub. Good catch. The poor guy is already confused enough. :-)

Something like this will be needed:

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=104&cp_id=10429&cs_id=1042903&p_id=7208&seq=1&format=2

That will split the audio from the PC. Then buy another of the cables originally chosen so that one goes to the amp, and the other to the sub.

Or......

The sub he mentioned does have speaker terminals. He can go from the amp to the sub to the L/R with his speaker cables.

Brian
post #3055 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post


Or......
The sub he mentioned does have speaker terminals. He can go from the amp to the sub to the L/R with his speaker cables.
Brian

This is the way to go. That way once he gets it all dialed in, it won't be thrown out of whack every time somebody bumps the volume knob on the amplifier.
post #3056 of 5316
Okay so thanks to everyone who's helped me so far. So here's sort of what I have got so far.

Laptop Out

A cable like this one: http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10218&cs_id=1021815&p_id=5596&seq=1&format=2

This Amp:http://www.amazon.com/LP-2020A-Lepai-Tripath-Class-T-Amplifier/dp/B0049P6OTI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1348802190&sr=8-1&keywords=t+amp

A Subwoofer: http://www.amazon.com/BIC-America-F12-475-Watt-Subwoofer/dp/B0015A8Y5M/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1348802389&sr=1-1&keywords=Bic+F12

The Speakers: Either BS-41s or BS-22s or BS-21s

And this cable to hook up the amp to sub and sub to speakers: http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10239&cs_id=1023903&p_id=2822&seq=1&format=2

Am I correct and would this system be pretty good for pretty much music only?
post #3057 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prakhar View Post

Okay so thanks to everyone who's helped me so far. So here's sort of what I have got so far.
Laptop Out
A cable like this one: http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10218&cs_id=1021815&p_id=5596&seq=1&format=2
This Amp:http://www.amazon.com/LP-2020A-Lepai-Tripath-Class-T-Amplifier/dp/B0049P6OTI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1348802190&sr=8-1&keywords=t+amp
A Subwoofer: http://www.amazon.com/BIC-America-F12-475-Watt-Subwoofer/dp/B0015A8Y5M/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1348802389&sr=1-1&keywords=Bic+F12
The Speakers: Either BS-41s or BS-22s or BS-21s
And this cable to hook up the amp to sub and sub to speakers: http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10239&cs_id=1023903&p_id=2822&seq=1&format=2
Am I correct and would this system be pretty good for pretty much music only?

That's a good setup. The weak link could be your laptop output. Depends on how good the laptop internal soundcard is. But you could always upgrade that later with an external DAC, or if your laptop has optical or HDMI out, you could upgrade to an HT receiver.
post #3058 of 5316
I got my FS51s and C21 in the mail yesterday. This is my first foray into high-end (at least to me) home theater. I had been in the market for a new speaker system to replace my puny HTiB, so I trolled this forum, and read a few reviews online. Although I don't need big speakers, as I live in a small apartment, I couldn't pass up the New Egg deal, paying $170 for speakers that CNET raved about as being worth 3x that much.

I hooked them up to an old JVC receiver (a mid-range unit from about 1994) that a friend of mine had given me. I know that I have little frame of reference, but the sound was transcendent. I was worried that such an old receiver wouldn't be able to power these speakers, and maybe it's just the small size of the room, but there is plenty of power available. Eventually, when I move to a bigger place, I look forward to adding satellites, a sub, and a new receiver. I have a feeling I will be enjoying these speakers for many years.

Thanks to all on this forum who helped make my decision much easier, and I look forward to learning even more about hifi.

2l8cfgz.jpg
post #3059 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCGreaves View Post

This is my first foray into high-end (at least to me) home theater. I had been in the market for a new speaker system to replace my puny HTiB ... I know that I have little frame of reference, but the sound was transcendent.

Congratulations on your audio joy. I'm sure that many of us remember that first step beyond the HTiB (much like the step to the HTiB) and the discovery of just how much better the stuff to which we listened could sound.
Quote:
Eventually, when I move to a bigger place, I look forward to adding satellites, a sub, and a new receiver.

For $50 you might want to seriously consider getting the SP-BS21-LR speakers now. While they are available right now, there is a finite supply and clearly people are still buying these. When you want to go to 5.1 you don't want to have to upgrade all your speakers to get voice matched ones because there are no (affordable) SP-BS21-LR speakers left. For another $50 you can insure yourself for 7.1.

Until you have the 5.1 or 7.1, maybe you have a stereo system with which you can use them, or like me you can hook them up to your old receiver (mine's a Sony STR-DB840 DD/DTS 5.1) and use them in A+B mode so you're driving the front left and right through the SP-FS51-LR and SP-BS21-LR.
Quote:
I have a feeling I will be enjoying these speakers for many years.

I'm still on the same set of bargain speakers (of comparable cost and value to these Pioneers) in my home theater (images and maybe web site missing) which were my step up from a HTiB. I've upgraded the sub twice and the receiver once.

I actually ran back to the shop to get another pair of the bookshelf speakers years before I had a 7.1 system.

I also bought that another set of SP-BS21-LR speakers for a future upgrade of the 5.1 system I built with the SP-FS51-LR, SP-C21 and SP-BS21-LR speakers, so I have put my little money where my big mouth is.
post #3060 of 5316
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrotel View Post

Can you please do a side to side comparison with the BS41s and newer BS22s? If not, any brief comments on how they compare and which you prefer?

My initial observations were repeated. To me the 22's seem a bit brighter than the 21's and the 41's, and not in a way that I find pleasing. The difference can be subtle, and may depend on the material but it did seem that way to me.

To re-iterate what I may have said previously, all three were crossed over at 120hertz, and augmented with an NHT U2 sub system, so no comments on overall low end extension. Music used was Dire Straits "Telegraph Road" from the remastered Love Over Gold CD, and two tracks from a black triangle Beatles Abbey Road; "Come Together" and "Here Comes the Sun". I picked them because the Dire Straits CD seems a bit bright to start with, and as for Abbey Road, I have been listening to that for about 40 years, so I know it pretty well.

I found that the 41 seemed to slot in between the 22 and 21 in terms of treble. It seemed brighter than the 21, but not as bright as the 22. That may be because the 41 is physically larger and the tweeter may have been more aligned with my ears (I used 24" stands), but while they were brighter than the 21, they were not harsh.

Back to the 22, I found the treble to be somewhat grainy. There is some cymbal work at the end of Come Together that really brought that forward. There is also a wood block or maybe a pair of drum sticks that click throughout "Telegraph Road" which really made it easy to hear which speaker was brighter. I definitely preferred the 21 to the 22.

The midrange seemed about the same for all three. I played some Miles Davis ("Kind of Blue" SACD) when I was done testing and Miles's horn just bloomed through the 41's.

Speaking of the 41, what I found was that they seemed to blend better with the sub than either the 21 or 22. I did check subwoofer phase, so I don't really have an answer as to why since all three were crossed ver at the same value. but it seemed to me that kick drum and tom tom whacks seemed to have better definition than 21 and 22. It was not at all unpleasant.

So, given the choice, I guess I would rank then 41, then 21, then 22. Of course YMMV. Actually, Your Mileage Probably WILL Vary since we all listen for different things and have different ears and different systems, but that's how the worked out for me. I am actually sending the 22's back and may keep an eye out for another pair of 41's. My next step is to swap in the 41's, 21's, and a C21 Center in my HT rig (currently NHT Classic). That should be fun; $250 vs. $2K. :-)

Brian
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