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Pioneer's Speaker Genius Hits Low Price Point - Page 115

post #3421 of 4209
11/12/12 at 6:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by nograveconcern View Post

Huh? My series 2 has no problem with reference level. Getting enough sub to keep up is the issue.

Alright, let's check the numbers.

Shinyav (to whom I was replying), says he's sitting 7ft from his fs52s. Let's be extra generous and call that 2m.
The fs52 has a rated sensitivity of 87dB at 2.83V. We'll assume they used the standard 1m for that.
2.83V into a 6Ohm load (again from the speaker's spec sheet) is 1.33W

So at 1.33W input power, applying 6dB drop for doubling the distance to 2m, the speaker should put out 81dB to his listening position.
From here we'll start cranking up the power. Apply 10X the power for 10dB increase, 2x the power for 3dB increase, or 1.26x the power for 1dB increase.
Our goal is to hit reference level output, defined as 105dB peaks.

1.33W -> 81dB
13.3W -> 91dB
133W -> 101dB (Uh oh, we just blew past the speaker's rated power.)
266W -> 104dB
335W -> 105dB

So there you have it. It takes an estimated 335W to hit reference peaks with a fs52 at Shinyav's relatively close listening position. That's assuming that you're fine with ZERO headroom. What amplification are you using to provide 335 clean Watts per channel? That kind of power is hard to come by. How do the speakers like being driven at nearly 3X their rated power handling (130W)? The surround channels, with their lower sensitivity AND longer listening distance, end up needing well more than double the power for the floor standers to hit reference. Keep in mind that they're rated for much less power.

Yes I realize that there are a lot of unknowns related to listening environment, program material, real impedance curves, etc. But the main point still stands. These speakers have sensitivity way too low to play reference levels. It's just not realistic, and it's not what they were made to do.

Look I own a set of the Pioneer speakers and still use them in one of my setups. They're great at what they do and at what they cost. But sometimes this discussion gets a bit carried away. There's nothing wrong with having some pride in the purchase decisions you made. You did make a great choice for how to spend your money. But these speakers are not the greatest speakers out there. They're a compromise, just like everything else. Part of that compromise is not hitting reference.
Edited by pitviper33 - 11/12/12 at 6:58am
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post #3422 of 4209
11/12/12 at 7:20am
That's quite the long theoretical reply. Your math works if you use one speaker outside, but in a small room full of speakers it works differently. The room makes a big difference and you don't lose 6db per doubling in a small enclosed space.

I've not done pink noise tests at 105db, but audyssey calibrates (at -30) to reference level turning the level of the mains down a few db. I've played my most demanding movie (Battle LA) at 0db for brief moments in my small room.

I'm also operating under the assumption that sane people don't watch movies at reference. wink.gif If your goal is to play at that level for sustained periods then, yes, the pioneers are a poor choice.
Edited by nograveconcern - 11/12/12 at 9:16am
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post #3423 of 4209
11/14/12 at 2:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GusGus748s View Post

I went to Best Buy and ended up having one of the employees connect the FS52 wit the CS22 center to 3 different receiver. Pioneer 1022, Denon 1913 and the Yamaha 673. The FS52 sounded the same with all 3 receiver. The sound was low, and I had to crank up the volume to hear it better. The center channel sounded louder than the towers. The Best Buy employee changed the settings manually, which helped. The sound was good and detailed, but I didn't like that I had to increase the volume more than I did with the Polk Audios.
Furthermore, with the FS52 and CS22 you definitely need a sub.

Hi as I had the TSi400's for almost 45 days (just under BBuy return period for silver Rewards members) - the bass to me at least is punchier and deeper with the FS52's than the TSI400s.

You do have to turn up the volume / power to get the same level of loudness with the Pioneer's as compared to the Polk's - it would be nice if the Pioneer's had the same sensitivity rating as the Polk's BUT i'll take the superior sound and cranking the volume up a little more over the Polk's (I was about to sell my 60 days old Denon 2113, purchase a $300 power conditioner, all sorts of things / ideas spinning in my head as i just could not get into the TSI400's for stereo music - immediately when hooking up the FS52's my wife could even tell how much more spread out the sound seemed (imaging) and how much clearer the sound was overall.

It felt strange to return the TSi400's which i had gotten at a great deal @ less than half price (still new) and switching to a $99 (on sale speaker) FS52 each vs the more than 2x $$$ Polk's .....

The Polk's were OK for movies / TV (at least with the CS20 as the CS10 I returned immediately, very weak).
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post #3424 of 4209
11/14/12 at 2:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRBR View Post

they do not sound low,is the others speakers that sound hi and thats my friend is not the way to judge a speaker,same thing happend to me in BB and in my own house when i compare the fs52 to my psb t45 image but once you get the desire level you will be pleasant with the much better sound they have to offer,belive me,im hearing them just right now,two fs52 and two pionner subs some people said they dont sound loud either and the song vogue from madonna was shaking my mirrors doors so they are not that bad at all!! give them a try if you dont like them just return them!!!

Hi, I'm so glad I listened to a podcast featuring an A Jones interview covering the Pioneer's which led me to try them (just b4 my TSi400's by Polk could be retrurned!).

Do you have the matching Pioneer subs? I'm fine with the FS52's for music but for movies I could use a new sub (very old low end Veloydne) & was considering two of the Pioneer 8" matching subs ($99 each on sale online which BB will price match).

For $198 one can pickup two Pioneer matching subs. Not looking to shake the walls just something to enhance movies and perhaps if they blend really well - also complement music (setup is Denon 2113, 2 FS52's, 1 CS22, 2 BS-22's). Thanks

FYI - I like the Pioneer's so much that i purchased a backup set of the FS52's and BS-22's as well as another CS22 (all were on sale online which BB matched the price, $99 per pair BS22's, $99 ea FS52's).
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post #3425 of 4209
11/14/12 at 2:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GusGus748s View Post

I know you've got to increase the volume drastically to make them sound "loud." That's probably the only complaint I've got for the Pio's. It's weird because the center channel sounds louder in my opinion.
Compared to the Polk's , it's not that the volume diff with the Pioneer's is drastic - I wish I would have noted the exact volume level that we used to use for normal TV viewing to compare to what we used for 45 days with the Polk's as opposed to present day with the Pioneer set.

Audyssey XT / Denon 2113 sets the CS22 within .5 db of the FS52's btw & to me via white noise sound test / levels not much but the center is a little louder....
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post #3426 of 4209
11/14/12 at 2:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyWash1 View Post

I have listened extensively, and owned, many of the Klipsch Synergy and Reference series speakers. I personally prefer the sound of the Pioneers over the Klipsch, even reference, due to the laid back highs and tone accuracy. The Pioneers are good as "disappearing", so that you hear the music and not the speaker, if that makes sense.
That's a good way to describe the Pioneer's vs the Polk TSi 400's that we tried for 45 days prior to stumbling upon the Pioneer's - the FS52's - the sound even my wife noticed just seems to fill the room .

Even she said with the Polk's the sound seemed as if it came "from the speaker" where with the Pioneer's the sound just seemed to appear everywhere (I could tell a HUGE diff right away & if you follow my posts here you can see I was unhappy going crazy trying to get great stereo music out of the Denon, it was the Polk's - at least for me that were the problem for MUSIC, the Pioneer's saved the day!).
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post #3427 of 4209
11/14/12 at 2:35am
Well, I guess I am one of the few out there who do not like the Pioneers as much as I like and prefer the Polk. Budget wise I think the Pioneers are excellent. Power wise they are lacking, even though they do sound good once the volume is increased by 40% on the AVR.
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post #3428 of 4209
11/14/12 at 2:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GusGus748s View Post

I agree with you, but in this instance I feel the Polk Audio towers sound better. This is my personal opinion. I do like the Pioneers too. But like I've said before, I couldn't pass on the sale.
You know, at 1st I was hesitant to believe that my supposedly mid range ($600 per pair normally priced) Polk TSI 400's were the reason for my dissatisfaction with my "new" Denon 2113 CI.

It was even more difficult to return the Polk's for the "lowly" Pioneer's -

see i walked into BB & almost bought the TSI 400's for the normal selling price of near $300 each (I believe they are still near $299 each at this time thru most sellers) - but I waited & brought some CD's the following day to BB to try out (Klipsch - Polk comparison at our local BB which while not a Magnolia at least has a listening room).

The 2nd day when i returned to BB while still full price online (this was near mid to late Sept) the tag on the TSi'400's stated only $124.99 , pretty sure that was the price or close to it, they thru in a free set of bookshelve's and $33 off for each TSi 400). - so it was an INCREDIBLE deal - $600 pair of speakers for less than 1/2 off the normal selling price (that i was considering just 12 hrs prior paying full price) with a free set of Polk bookshelves to boot .

The Pioneer's I barely listened to that day - prob i have a post on hear stating that the Pioneer's were "low" - see i fell for 2 items that caused me NOT to consider the Pioneer's, actually a few items caused me NOT to consider them early:

- $600 polks for under 1/2 price, MUST be best right?

- Pioneer ?? they don't make decent speakers right? , a joke... (no idea of these A Jones designed models)

- a $99 on sale ea Pioneer speaker - def can't be decent right?

- the short listening test of the FS52's at BB - the receiver's volume wasn't adjusted so they were lower & didn't "shine" when the sales guy switched among Polk, Klipsch and Pioneer

Anyway, my point of all of this - it was difficult to fight thru 45 days of trying to make gains with stereo music listening / setup with the Polk's & not easy at 1st to think i was returning the Polk's which I had gotten at such a "steal" (I thought that I had gotten such a great deal, $600 speakers for under $300) - returning that sort of "deal" just didn't sound too good - ....

So i def can understand at 1st not being impressed with the Pioneer's if the sales guy flips thru diff sets of speakers w/o adjusting the volume & also I received a super deal on Polk towers ..... (definitely check out the CS20 Polk center over the CS10 if you also are in need of a matching / new center, though it is HUGE , the CS20 has great "fullness" ) ....
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post #3429 of 4209
11/14/12 at 2:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GusGus748s View Post

Well, I guess I am one of the few out there who do not like the Pioneers as much as I like and prefer the Polk. Budget wise I think the Pioneers are excellent. Power wise they are lacking, even though they do sound good once the volume is increased by 40% on the AVR.
While I can't say for sure what level's we were listening at with the TSI 400's (Monitor 60's) and CS10 / CS20 Polk's - I'm positive we aren't having to raise the volume anywhere near 40% .

If i had to guess - instead of a volume level of approx 52 were are now at 60 or 62 for typical TV watching / listening.

I wish I wouldn't have found this thread as now I'm wondering - hmmm, was I able to use much less power with the Polk's , thus making the Denon 2113 last longer ? I've no issue with the volume level of the Pioneer's but wondering now - how much harder are we pushing the Denon ? Guess I shouldn't worry as I bought an extra of each Pioneer (such low cost to begin with plus all were on sale) speakers for another room (Zone 2) and to have as backup's years down the line.

I bought extra Pioneer's while on sale as speakers are one item that I don't update very often & we like the Pioneer's so much (FS52's especially, I've yet to even listen to the BS22's with sub up front) that I went with a backup of each speaker to replace when they eventually fail (as the only speakers I have liked as much or more than the Pioneer's - Magnepan 1.7's & a set of Paradigm towers which were $2k) .

In fact I was ready to get a dedicated amp, user zone2 pre out and Magnepan's & was giving up on the Denon 2113 / Polk combo for music (TV / movies were OK).

I hope i'm not killing our Denon with the Pioneer's & lots of 5.1 listening (at least we use the sub & cut off bass to all speakers at 80Hz except for stereo listening which I prefer just the FS52's with the Denon Pure Direct mode) ......

I can see a longer life from your amp with the Polk's as a plus for sure .
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post #3430 of 4209
11/14/12 at 2:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hushdrops View Post

You know, at 1st I was hesitant to believe that my supposedly mid range ($600 per pair normally priced) Polk TSI 400's were the reason for my dissatisfaction with my "new" Denon 2113 CI.
It was even more difficult to return the Polk's for the "lowly" Pioneer's -
see i walked into BB & almost bought the TSI 400's for the normal selling price of near $300 each (I believe they are still near $299 each at this time thru most sellers) - but I waited & brought some CD's the following day to BB to try out (Klipsch - Polk comparison at our local BB which while not a Magnolia at least has a listening room).
The 2nd day when i returned to BB while still full price online (this was near mid to late Sept) the tag on the TSi'400's stated only $124.99 , pretty sure that was the price or close to it, they thru in a free set of bookshelve's and $33 off for each TSi 400). - so it was an INCREDIBLE deal - $600 pair of speakers for less than 1/2 off the normal selling price (that i was considering just 12 hrs prior paying full price) with a free set of Polk bookshelves to boot .
The Pioneer's I barely listened to that day - prob i have a post on hear stating that the Pioneer's were "low" - see i fell for 2 items that caused me NOT to consider the Pioneer's, actually a few items caused me NOT to consider them early:
- $600 polks for under 1/2 price, MUST be best right?
- Pioneer ?? they don't make decent speakers right? , a joke... (no idea of these A Jones designed models)
- a $99 on sale ea Pioneer speaker - def can't be decent right?
- the short listening test of the FS52's at BB - the receiver's volume wasn't adjusted so they were lower & didn't "shine" when the sales guy switched among Polk, Klipsch and Pioneer
Anyway, my point of all of this - it was difficult to fight thru 45 days of trying to make gains with stereo music listening / setup with the Polk's & not easy at 1st to think i was returning the Polk's which I had gotten at such a "steal" (I thought that I had gotten such a great deal, $600 speakers for under $300) - returning that sort of "deal" just didn't sound too good - ....
So i def can understand at 1st not being impressed with the Pioneer's if the sales guy flips thru diff sets of speakers w/o adjusting the volume & also I received a super deal on Polk towers ..... (definitely check out the CS20 Polk center over the CS10 if you also are in need of a matching / new center, though it is HUGE , the CS20 has great "fullness" ) ....

I completely understand what you are saying. I went to Best Buy approximately 4 times to listen to the speakers over and over again. I even brought my wife along the last time, and she even agreed with me (she rarely does) that the Pioneer sounded like they had no power at all. Pioneer sounded good, but the volume was set pretty more than half way to get a good sound out of them. The Polk TSi300 and TSi400 and Klipsch reference they had sounded much better at lower volume and had good bass. I turned the volume up (the same as the Pioneer) and you can really hear them.

So, I ended up buying the Polk Monitor 70 II series, with a Klipsch Reference RW-12d 12. I will be buying the center speaker most likely CS2 in a couple of weeks.
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post #3431 of 4209
11/14/12 at 3:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hushdrops View Post

While I can't say for sure what level's we were listening at with the TSI 400's (Monitor 60's) and CS10 / CS20 Polk's - I'm positive we aren't having to raise the volume anywhere near 40% .
If i had to guess - instead of a volume level of approx 52 were are now at 60 or 62 for typical TV watching / listening.
I wish I wouldn't have found this thread as now I'm wondering - hmmm, was I able to use much less power with the Polk's , thus making the Denon 2113 last longer ? I've no issue with the volume level of the Pioneer's but wondering now - how much harder are we pushing the Denon ? Guess I shouldn't worry as I bought an extra of each Pioneer (such low cost to begin with plus all were on sale) speakers for another room (Zone 2) and to have as backup's years down the line.
I bought extra Pioneer's while on sale as speakers are one item that I don't update very often & we like the Pioneer's so much (FS52's especially, I've yet to even listen to the BS22's with sub up front) that I went with a backup of each speaker to replace when they eventually fail (as the only speakers I have liked as much or more than the Pioneer's - Magnepan 1.7's & a set of Paradigm towers which were $2k) .
In fact I was ready to get a dedicated amp, user zone2 pre out and Magnepan's & was giving up on the Denon 2113 / Polk combo for music (TV / movies were OK).
I hope i'm not killing our Denon with the Pioneer's & lots of 5.1 listening (at least we use the sub & cut off bass to all speakers at 80Hz except for stereo listening which I prefer just the FS52's with the Denon Pure Direct mode) ......
I can see a longer life from your amp with the Polk's as a plus for sure .

I've got an Onkyo HT-R960. I ran the Audyssey, and the highest I've got to go is 45 volume wise. If the wife is present then I've got to set it to 40. I get the sub. Thursday. So, I'll have to run Audyssey again, and try to set everything up as good a possible. I'll probably keep the volume around the same biggrin.gif
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post #3432 of 4209
11/14/12 at 5:52am
buying speakers because they are "louder" is not a good way to do it imo. to remedy the "quiet" speakers, just increase the volume some, and then you get better quality sound at the same loudness level. the only reason you should use the "loudness" of the speaker for purchasing reasons is if you plan to listen at reference levels and using the receiver at full volume is still not loud enough for you.
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post #3433 of 4209
11/14/12 at 6:18am
Got the new receiver in yesterday and set it up with banana plugs last night. I'm pretty sure the old receiver was blown when two speaker wires from two different speakers touched ever so slightly. One of the wires shot right out of the back of the receiver. I now have no exposed wire anywhere, and man, do these speakers sound great. I haven't had a chance to really push them yet, but I plan on remedying that tonight. The home theater is finally complete....for now. biggrin.gif
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post #3434 of 4209
11/14/12 at 6:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisv784 View Post

Got the new receiver in yesterday and set it up with banana plugs last night. I'm pretty sure the old receiver was blown when two speaker wires from two different speakers touched ever so slightly. One of the wires shot right out of the back of the receiver. I now have no exposed wire anywhere, and man, do these speakers sound great. I haven't had a chance to really push them yet, but I plan on remedying that tonight. The home theater is finally complete....for now. biggrin.gif

One recording that I love listening to on these speakers is the Dave Matthews/ Tim Reynolds at Radio City blu-ray from 2007. That music really shines on these Andrew Jones loudspeakers.
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post #3435 of 4209
11/14/12 at 6:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hushdrops View Post

While I can't say for sure what level's we were listening at with the TSI 400's (Monitor 60's) and CS10 / CS20 Polk's - I'm positive we aren't having to raise the volume anywhere near 40% .
If i had to guess - instead of a volume level of approx 52 were are now at 60 or 62 for typical TV watching / listening.
Raising the "volume" to get to the same SPL doesn't make any sense. What you're raising is the voltage. (Or the power, depending on how you want to look at it.) According to the specs, you're right; you aren't raising the voltage anywhere near 40% to get the same SPL. It's much closer to 125%. Naturally it's hard to be very exact based solely on the specs, as there's no reason to believe the two manufacturers measured them in the same way. But no matter how you measured it, 87dB versus 91dB is BIG.

But should you care? I really don't think so. Turning the knob a little farther is pretty easy to do. As long as you keep it 10dB below reference, the Pioneers will perform great. It sounds like you have your receiver set to display volume as "absolute" instead of the much more informative relative mode. But you're not pushing the limits. You wouldn't have chosen these speakers if you were, as they start to sound like crap.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hushdrops View Post

I wish I wouldn't have found this thread as now I'm wondering - hmmm, was I able to use much less power with the Polk's , thus making the Denon 2113 last longer ? I've no issue with the volume level of the Pioneer's but wondering now - how much harder are we pushing the Denon ?
I hope i'm not killing our Denon with the Pioneer's & lots of 5.1 listening (at least we use the sub & cut off bass to all speakers at 80Hz except for stereo listening which I prefer just the FS52's with the Denon Pure Direct mode) ......
I can see a longer life from your amp with the Polk's as a plus for sure .
You won't hurt your receiver. I'll give you 3 reasons.
1. If you're primarily watching TV/movies, as it sounds, the average sound level is relatively low. Even if you were watching movies at reference (which as discussed above is outside the capability of your setup), the average power per channel would be under 10W. If you're 10dB below reference, the average is under 1W. The receiver is just putting along at these levels. It's not even trying. Long sessions of loud, dynamically compressed music would be far more taxing.
2. The receiver has thermal protection circuits built in. It'll cut its own output before any catastrophic failure occurs. Sure a life of running continuously close to its maximum output would be a little hard on it without triggering those protections, but you're not doing that.
3. You're just plain not doing anything it wasn't designed to do. You're doing with it exactly what it's made for. Worry less; listen more! biggrin.gif
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post #3436 of 4209
11/14/12 at 7:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hushdrops View Post
Do you have the matching Pioneer subs? I'm fine with the FS52's for music but for movies I could use a new sub (very old low end Veloydne) & was considering two of the Pioneer 8" matching subs ($99 each on sale online which BB will price match).

The matching sub is generally considered mediocre; two of them won't make them much better.

Egg has a discontinued Klipsch on sale for $300 frequently (it's $500 at the moment). That's a great deal.

I have that sub paired with my series 1 Pioneers.

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post #3437 of 4209
11/14/12 at 8:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hushdrops View Post

Hi, I'm so glad I listened to a podcast featuring an A Jones interview covering the Pioneer's which led me to try them (just b4 my TSi400's by Polk could be retrurned!).
Do you have the matching Pioneer subs? I'm fine with the FS52's for music but for movies I could use a new sub (very old low end Veloydne) & was considering two of the Pioneer 8" matching subs ($99 each on sale online which BB will price match).
For $198 one can pickup two Pioneer matching subs. Not looking to shake the walls just something to enhance movies and perhaps if they blend really well - also complement music (setup is Denon 2113, 2 FS52's, 1 CS22, 2 BS-22's). Thanks
FYI - I like the Pioneer's so much that i purchased a backup set of the FS52's and BS-22's as well as another CS22 (all were on sale online which BB matched the price, $99 per pair BS22's, $99 ea FS52's).

i have two pioneers subs and they sound good on my room,you will be ok with the sound they give,bet on that!!!!
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post #3438 of 4209
11/14/12 at 8:38am
btw way i have the 2 subs below the 52s and i feel more low end when the subs are out of phase.maybe because the 52s are back ported and the subs are front ported,just a tip!! i switch to 80hz crossover point on the 52s and there is obviously no differences when i swtich phases on the subs but sould i leave it like that? is better to use large (no crossover) on the 52s or is better to crossover them?
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post #3439 of 4209
11/14/12 at 8:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post

The matching sub is generally considered mediocre; two of them won't make them much better.
Egg has a discontinued Klipsch on sale for $300 frequently (it's $500 at the moment). That's a great deal.
I have that sub paired with my series 1 Pioneers.

"generally" does not apply on my situation since in very happy with the set up (2 pio subs) btw im not a stereophile,just a regular guy!!
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post #3440 of 4209
11/14/12 at 9:54am
To put the tweeters closer to ear level I am going to need to turn the fs52 and bs22 upside-down. I have found the badges do not turn. Has anyone removed them with success or possibly blacked them out with a sharpie?
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post #3441 of 4209
11/14/12 at 9:58am
Can't you just pull the grill off and flip it over? IDK, haven't tried...which brings up the question: why would you want the FS 52 upside down? Are you hanging them from the ceiling?
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post #3442 of 4209
11/14/12 at 10:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by nograveconcern View Post

Can't you just pull the grill off and flip it over? IDK, haven't tried...which brings up the question: why would you want the FS 52 upside down? Are you hanging them from the ceiling?

I could just pull the grills off but I prefer them on. Keeps fingers out. If you just flip the grills, the posts no longer match up to still cover the cones. The 52s are sitting up on a mantle shelf flanking a bookshelf/HT wall unit. Looks much better than it sounds. Anyway, the shelf where the speaker sits is almost exactly at sitting ear level.
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post #3443 of 4209
11/14/12 at 11:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hushdrops View Post

That's a good way to describe the Pioneer's vs the Polk TSi 400's that we tried for 45 days prior to stumbling upon the Pioneer's - the FS52's - the sound even my wife noticed just seems to fill the room .
Even she said with the Polk's the sound seemed as if it came "from the speaker" where with the Pioneer's the sound just seemed to appear everywhere (I could tell a HUGE diff right away & if you follow my posts here you can see I was unhappy going crazy trying to get great stereo music out of the Denon, it was the Polk's - at least for me that were the problem for MUSIC, the Pioneer's saved the day!).

And I for sure, do not need a drastic volume level increase for the Pioneer speakers - and I do not
compare an overall loudness level in a Best Buy open showroom. > There is plenty of room left on
the volume dial, in a 20 X 30 open room for me. Even the BS22 shelf speakers are not a wimp.
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post #3444 of 4209
11/14/12 at 11:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hushdrops View Post

I can see a longer life from your amp with the Polk's as a plus for sure .

No, not really - and do not under estimate the receivers, or the speakers.
The key is to stay below reference level - which the majority do.
Edited by zieglj01 - 11/14/12 at 3:58pm
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post #3445 of 4209
11/14/12 at 12:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmabry View Post

To put the tweeters closer to ear level I am going to need to turn the fs52 and bs22 upside-down. I have found the badges do not turn. Has anyone removed them with success or possibly blacked them out with a sharpie?

You're gonna put a tower upside down? How does this put the tweeter close to ear level? Are you laying on the floor? confused.gif
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post #3446 of 4209
11/14/12 at 12:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrotel View Post

buying speakers because they are "louder" is not a good way to do it imo. to remedy the "quiet" speakers, just increase the volume some, and then you get better quality sound at the same loudness level. the only reason you should use the "loudness" of the speaker for purchasing reasons is if you plan to listen at reference levels and using the receiver at full volume is still not loud enough for you.

Ok, let me put it this way. The Monitor 70 that I've been listening to all day with music and movies are overall a better sounding speaker than the Pioneers. I am glad I was lucky to find them on sale rather than buying the Pioneers biggrin.gif Nothing against the Pioneers, but they just do not offer that big clear and detailed sound that I was looking for.
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post #3447 of 4209
11/14/12 at 4:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by [Irishman] View Post

One recording that I love listening to on these speakers is the Dave Matthews/ Tim Reynolds at Radio City blu-ray from 2007. That music really shines on these Andrew Jones loudspeakers.

Funny you say this, because before I had the speakers mounted, they were hooked up put on tables just to test them and make sure they work etc., and that was the first thing I put on. Sounded spectacular. I picked up the new Call of Duty tonight, so I might give the speakers a workout tonight.
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post #3448 of 4209
11/14/12 at 4:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by afrogt View Post

You're gonna put a tower upside down? How does this put the tweeter close to ear level? Are you laying on the floor? confused.gif

8b2103fc867fe36d5de8c192fc778655.jpg

Ok, so I'm in the middle of completely redoing this room. Led lighting on a dimmer remote to all the shelves as well as uplighting. Anyway, as you can see, I'm going to batwing the FS52s on both sides of the unit. I'm also making a mount to raise a different plasma screen and the cc will slide in right below it.
So, I'd like to flip the FSs and not have the silver badges upside down. If nothing else, it's sharpie time so they blend in. At least with a $99 speaker, I won't feel like I committed sacrilidge.
If they were front ported I'd just put them sideways on the second shelf. They fit perfectly rolleyes.gif I don't think they'd be very happy there though.
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post #3449 of 4209
11/14/12 at 5:01pm
You could sell your 52s and get 2 more c22 centers to use as LR speakers
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post #3450 of 4209
11/14/12 at 5:37pm
Quote:
So, I'd like to flip the FSs and not have the silver badges upside down. If nothing else, it's sharpie time so they blend in. At least with a $99 speaker, I won't feel like I committed sacrilidge.

That grille may be symmetrical. Its possible you wont have to flip the logo around. I'll let you know shortly as Best Buy is on my way home.
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