The Offical Epson 8350 Owners Thread - Page 140

It is funny you come here to whine about people whining...lol.

*Steps onto soapbox*

You have to understand, this thread is 140 pages long (in my view at least), and there are 10-20 pages at a time with complaints about this or that. It's not the concerns that are the problem, it's the trashing of the projector that takes place immediately after it comes up. First it was about the bulb - would it be having the issues like the 8100. Then came the iris issues. Then came the dust blobs. Pages and pages of complaints about that. And now there's the convergence talk.

I think a lot of people feel the same way as jfried. Just think about it - it's an entry-level 1080p projector, albeit one with very solid performance, but I think people who upgraded to this expected a lot more based on the reviews of this projector and the early opinions on it. There's a few users obviously very disappointed with this projector, and coming from a previous one that they liked, it's understandable.

I, on the other hand, have never seen a projector used, other than a business class projector. I'm in Canada, and had one delivered to my Texas house, and was instantly amazed at the image. Well, actually the first thing that struck me was the size of the thing! I have read this entire thread, and a dozen people have mentioned being shocked by the size... well, I was ready for the size, and was still shocked!!

The house has a wide open & high wall, and we projected a 142" image on it, and were absolutely blown away. In a lot of ways it was overkill, but I just wanted to check it out! Of course, I am rolling it back to a 100" screen in my house up here, and that was a bit of a tough change to make! I know that I've heard people talk about it being as good as their plasma or lcd, and others saying that there's no way it is... well, we had the plasma on against the opposite wall, and when I looked back and forth, sure I could tell a difference. But when I was just watching the projected image, it was great to my eye. There were no problems watching hockey on the screen - the puck movement was easy to see. Pitched baseballs didn't have any strange movements either. It's probably not to the level of a higher priced projector with CFI, but it certainly has more smoothness than my ~4 year old LCD monitor. Then I started throwing movies in, expecting to watch 5 minutes each of 2 or 3 movies. My 4 year old was going to be waking me up at 6am in the morning, but at 2am, I was still throwing discs into the HD DVD player to get as much out of it was I could.

What sucks of all of this is that due to the size and weight of the projector, I couldn't bring it as a carry-on item, and I wasn't about to check it in, so I am stuck waiting for 6 more weeks until my parents bring their motorhome up here to visit and deliver the projector.

I'm sure that I'm going to have questions about the unit, so it sucks that people like jfried are stopping reading and especially that the MississippiMan's of the thread are slowing down on their responses. Sure, a lot has been touched already, and there's no problem bringing up issues or concerns, but the constant burying of this projector has been discouraging to say the least.

*Steps off soapbox*

Guys. I think you haven't correctly understood me.
I badly speak in English. Especially, to write such opuses . I hope me will understand.
This Post http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post20307413 not for this purpose what to criticize EPSON 8350.
I will express the opinion about EPSON 8350:
- The best projector for the money and in the second level:
price / image quality / functionality.
- A projector of the second level. When the black ceases to irritate it with a gray shade.
- And the first in norm limits:

And the second within norm:

But, of course, I would like to receive the second. If will carry.
- If will carry. And convergence will be excellent not in which case I won't send it on replacement at dust detection. The dust doesn't disturb me. I will open and I will make cleaning.
If convergence disappoints me. I will try to correct it. I will open a projector.

Me disturbs much more strongly: a lamp operating time.

And into the account of this message http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post20307413
I wrote what to explain as easier to check up convergence if the choice is possible. Not the black text on a white background, the white text on a black background. It is better to use Nokia Test.
Also has shown as can be ideal to look convergence at EPSON 8350. Both photos from EPSON 8350.
Real values between two these variants. Also can disturb only true judges or users of this forum, but not the usual spectator .
I hope, me understand.

+1

The convergence-whining is especially irritating. A budget 3-chip PJ does not have perfect convergence. End of line. If that is what you require, get a 1-chip DLP. Then, at least you'll be whining about the rainbows on the Mits thread. I don't understand the iris complaints, but if I could hear mine, I would turn it off, because I don't think it adds very much to the picture.

And speaking of legitimate questions that got buried by convergence posts: Does anyone know what size the LCD panels are on the 8350?

Spec sheet in the manual says they are 18mm = .74 inches wide. Nothing else noted on them.

everyone has an opinion, don't wanna read it, don't read it, but it's the "whining and complaining" that gets things noticed and things done about it....ie 2 yr bulb replacement warranty ( verdict is out on whether or not that still applies but still)

For myself, if I spent 1200 on a LCD or Plasma TV that looked as bad as these Epsons.....it would go back instantly, so why dismiss convergence issues on a PJ just because "you" feel it's entry level when there are plenty other "entry level" PJ's without the issue?

If Epson wants to be competitive with their product, and try to convince consumers that their product is the one to get over the rest, bad convergence is something they need to rectify. Otherwise, not much point in considering them or any LCD PJ that acts the same way. Of course some people love throwing money away, and some value every dime spent.

Some fella said it best way back. We use PJ's for different reasons. Convergence won't effect the movie only user as much as the person who uses a PC with it...as I do. But bad Convergence = softer picture, and the entire point of a HD 1080p projector is for a sharp, high def picture, and the bad ones I've seen look marginally better then a SD PJ. Now get a good one and things are different.

Yaaaaaaawn

Did the previous "entry level" Epson 1080p projector, the 8100 have similar complaints about convergence issues or are these specific to the 8350?

This is my first post on this forum. Just received my 8350 two days ago and haven't turned it off since...lol
I opened the box, hooked up my PS3 along with my Pioneer VSX-1020 and now Im in heaven Im not even in a rush to buy a screen because it looks beautiful on my wall. Im just going to sit back and enjoy hopefully it stays working fine, if not that what the warranty is for.
Only bad thing I can say is my "Man Cave" no longer exists...the whole family is in here now and the 50" plasma hasn't been turned on in the family room for about two days now

This has been my experience, too, although I am using an 80" Elite pull up screen. Movie heaven. Kids want to see all their movies, even non-HD stuff, like the animated Avatar series from Nickelodian via Netflix streaming. Everything looks better when you have that much more real estate to experience it.

Are darkest blacks as black? No. But now my Pioneer Plasma almost seems too dark in comparison. Movie theaters don't achieve plasma level blacks. Movie theaters have a bit of ambient light, too. What movie theaters offer is killer sound and a huge screen. Now, for 1200 bucks plus 175 for the screen, I have a movie theater whenever I want it at home.

Deep rich accurate colors? Check.
Crystal clear 1080p picture? Check.
Immersive movie experience? Check.
True HD 5.1 rumble the walls sound? Check, thanks to Pioneer receiver and Aperion audio bookshelves with Intimus 8D subwoofer.

What more can you ask for? Perfect convergence? Not sure I would ever notice it lacks it. I guess I'll plug the lap top into the back to check, but why? My laptop has a screen. My desktop has one, too. A 20 inch LCD that seems enormous when you sit 12 inches from the screen.

Loving this PJ!!!

Ok. Has anyone tried this PJ with any of the 3D VIP products. I'm about to purchase this PJ and the VIP theatre but before I do I just wanted to hear how well it works.

Thanks

Is it me, or does the second photo show the screen to be warped? Does this affect convergence?

I can see your point, but some of us are just trying to help out others with questions, even if we do not own this projector.

To me, 1 pixel off on a 1080p projector is pretty much perfect given the size of the pixels, I can't believe people would be complaining with 1 pixel off of convergence, that is insane. In the old days of 720p projectors, even 1 pixel off we'd live with, and the pixels are like 2.25x bigger on a 720p. So 1 pixel off on a 720p is really the equivalent of 2.25 pixels off on a 1080p. So let's keep it realistic people.

I really only questioned it when a few people posted pics with convergence way way off, certainly far more than 1-2 pixels off.

I'd certainly be real happy with 1 pixel off convergence, and so should anyone else. 2 pixels off is a bit borderline, but it really depends what colors are off.

The problem you are getting in this thread is that the Epsons sold so many units that there are so many owners, therefore so many complaints. You'd think after Epson warrantied the lamp that people would stop complaining, although now a lamp shortage?

You should keep returning your projector until you get one with just good enough convergence (2 pixels or less), then just sell it and recover your money.
Then buy a DLP, it sounds like you are really unhappy with it, it just isn't for you. I can understand that, some people just don't like certain things about certain projectors.

You are judging the units from the RMA pool, the units in the RMA pool are ON AVERAGE going to have worse convergence for obvious reasons.
You have no idea the convergence accuracy percentages based on new units.

According to most, a NEW 8700ub or NEW 8350 has greatly improved convergence and quality control over the previous models.
I am defending it because Epson has done better than any other company in actually improving or addressing issues (at least they are trying). More than I can say for most of these other companies. Look in the JVC or Sony threads, even the Panny threads, all of brands and units have plenty of lemons, it's just part of the game.

I can see people getting sick of QC in projectors in general right now, it does seem pretty questionable overall, but it seems Epson is just on par with the others, if not even better than them now.
We don't dismiss it, but it's just part of the issue with LCD, it's just one of the downsides, it's not something that can be rectified at this price point.
Their isn't the money to have perfect convergence on every unit, the projector would have to cost far far more.

DLP has RBE for a percentage of users, so pick your poison.

At least you can keep exchanging it, if I pull the trigger on the Sanyo z4000 I may get totally screwed over. I didn't see very many problems on the z3000, and since the z4000 is just an upgraded z3000, that is why I am considering it. The 8700ub is still tempting though.

Well it's been 3 days since I drove 3 1/2 hours across the border to pick up my 8350 and I love it. I'm planning on reading the whole thread but it'll take a little time. Here's 3 screen shots from tonight. It's just what I wanted, a decently priced, value for money projector. It's replaced an Infocus IN74ex and to me, it's fantastic. Thanks to all for the contributions to AVSFORUM which steered me to this projector. It's just what I wanted! Cheers!

I just ordered the Sanyo z4000 instead, too cheap to pass up.
Wish me luck, hope I don't get the convergence bug!
Because if I do, Sanyo may be a royal pain to deal with.

None. No effect.
On the second picture convergence at the 5, on a five-point system.
On the first picture convergence at the 3.
I ask me to understand.
These photos not for criticism EPSON 8350. Convergence within norm on both photos.
The first case meets not so often. But all want to have the second case . And I understand those who would like like to have a second option Here is how to get lucky. (But lift your ass off the couch and go to the store. Choose a good copy. Few critics. ). Convergence within these two values. More often to the best. Deviations greater than 1 pixel does not happen. At viewing of films it doesn't disturb. Photos one are softer, others are sharper.
Convergence is the new line, the same as the previous. If to look on the statistican. But the sharpness of the new line has increased. This is not a paradox. Apparently, there are other reasons.

Looks good! I think I'll buy Beyonce Live in Concert on Blu Ray

Pretty big word there for someone who doesn't speak much English. lol

Trigger pulled today! Got a great package deal, too. I'm switching from my Optoma HD66 as I've abandoned my quest for 3D (at least for the time being). I also ordered a 120" Elite Sableframe and am really looking forward to firing this baby up. Can't wait!

Well after a month and half wait of sitting in their box doing nothing. I finally have my projector and 106" Everik screen up and running. I have my old Hitachi 50" RPLCD in the room as well and it's amazing how the picture dwarfs my old set. I'm using an old tv wall mount for my projector to easily swing in and out over my bed (bedroom setup) My picture has a slight slant which i hope to clear up soon, but still it looks bad ass. Watched Tangled for my first movie, but i can't wait for Tron Legacy after seeing the trailer play beforehand. Hope to post pics in a few days to share.

Nice to find an enthusiastic note here, from time to time. I would love to know how do you compare the Epson with your previous Infocus IN72 -which is a top-notch machine. Cheers!

Is anyone there getting a report of exact 24fps when playing a blu-ray? (or, likewise, of 60fps or 50fps when playing a ntsc or pal dvd). For some reason, I always get 23.9fps, 59.9fps and 49.9fps...
I wouldn´t worry about it, but yesterday I checked a pal dvd and it was reported at exact 50 fps, so I began wondering if there might be a strange pulldown with everything else.

100 Hour Report: I've had the projector up for a little over a couple of weeks now, and have put nearly 100 hours on it already! We use it every excuse we get, and I wanted to share my experience with it so far:

This PJ is incredible in low light conditions. The picture is beautiful and the blacks are fantastic. This is my first 1080p screen (I have several 720p LCDs) and I finally see what all the fuss is about with HD-DVDs and Blu-Ray movies. I seriously was never all that impressed with these over DVD until this projector and 85" screen.

In ambient light conditions I use the Living Room mode with a few adjustments. I definately don't like the picture as much with this setting, but I only have this issue when the morning sun is hitting that side of the house. We have good quality shades on our 6' window, but blackout curtains are on my must buy list. The room is painted a dark burgendy with a black screen wall, so when the lighting conditions are optimal the room does a goob job of sucking in the image reflection, but ambient light is a little bit of an issue in this room.

The PJ is mounted at around 7 feet with our seating positions just below it, and I cannot hear the fan, period. It's that quiet. If I mute my AVR I can hear the iris going, but with normal volume I never know it's working.

The only thing I'm concerned about is buying lamps, because we enjoy using this PJ so much. I'm really happy I went with the 8350. I'm really not worried about issues that may arise due to Epson's incredible customer service and 2 year warranty. I'm hoping 1080p 3D projectors are affordable within the next two years.

I have another PJ that I use with a PC and project CAD drawings. It's a single-chip DLP, Sanyo. Originally, a 3-LCD Sony was used for this purpose, and did a terrible job. It had convergence problems, never mind it cost $10,000. The DLP has absolutely perfect convergence over the entire screen. Single-pixel lines are black-white transitions with color fringing limited by chromatic abberation and diffraction limiting of the DMD-lens optical engine. You really should buy the correct PJ for your application, and save us the complaints about the convergence. I should point out that a single-pixel in the LCD panel is 9 microns wide. Now lining up 6 million, 9 micron pixels on three panels that are located inches apart in an optical assembly, and then holding that alignment through shipping and then intense temperature cycling cause by a 300 W lamp inside the same case is pretty impressive, at least for me. I rather enjoy what I see. If you're not satisfied with the state-of-the-art in 3-LCD, then get something else.

Couldn't have said it better. +1

It is better to laugh together. If I too badly write also me difficult to understand. Specify.
I understand that you fan EPSON. Strangely enough, I admirer EPSON.

I see the same info and see no issues with the PQ.
I believe my old Sanyo Z2000 did the same.