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The Ultimate 3D projection system: A Practical Discussion Thread - Page 12

post #331 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Ok, ran the polarization retention tests again tonight with the linear setup.

Now in the "pure" tests, with just the filters and glasses in the beam (ie without any interaction from the screen) I got just about 100% extinction. BUT, this fell to 80% and lower, if the glasses were even a few degrees off exactly horizontal.

I still don't like that aspect of linear polarization, and will certainly look to address circular again once I have the BD II 3D in hand.

Still no sign of my Harkness sample. No idea where it could be - I think I'd better order a new one.

Ok - for the rest.

BD II 1.4 - once again failed the test, just as much in linear mode as it did in circular. Was outside of my test patterns, so less than 70% retained polarization - probably 50% to 60%, I would estimate.

Screen Innovations is coming out with a new BD II 3D screen, which I will add to my room soon.

Dalite 3D Virtual Grey - about 81 or 82%
Dalite Silver Matte - about 85%
Stewart 5D - about 87%
Stewart 3D - about 91%

Super tired tonight. So I'm off. Will try to find the Harkness sample tomorrow.
post #332 of 2268
rdjam,

just another post to emphasize how appreciative we all all of your pioneering efforts here to do what should seem so obvious to the PJ industry at large... come up with a relatively simple, elegent, and effective means of taking two stand-alone 2D projectors and assembling a top-notch passive 3D projection system.

Thanks thanks thanks.
post #333 of 2268
+1 to that.
post #334 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Thanks guys. Really appreciate that.

The 3D quality with this setup has really exceeded my initial hopes. The only piece left in the jigsaw is to pick a screen.

Surprisingly, the 3D still looks very impressive on a screen that only only retains 60% of the polarisation. Some scenes the ghosting is not apparent at all, but others are really badly obvious.

I'm very keen to see the upcoming BD II 3D, as it'll be good to have a screen that works for both 3D and 2D. I may be tempted to get something next week to tide me over until I get to try out the BD 3D.

I know I stressed it earlier in the thread, but Frame Interpolation really has a significant positive impact on the 3D playback. Using two projectors like this gives a crazy-good picture, even with no FI. But turning on the FI takes the presentation to another level.

In other words, folks will enjoy this without FI, but even more with FI. It's like a secret weapon in the mix.

While I'm waiting for the screen, I'm going to try to get hold of two business projectors to build a setup with also.
post #335 of 2268
rdjam thanx u for this great testing thread i have a question , i bought a 3d-xl but it cant pass hd audio like true hd , dts hd ....etc it only support stereo files and my av/recevier is not 3d support so i have to connect the 3d-xl to it.
post #336 of 2268
Use a splitter before the 3DXL, or just run optical to the receiver.
post #337 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

Use a splitter before the 3DXL, or just run optical to the receiver.

Yes, I would agree those are the choices. Optical is perfectly ok for many movies, and HDMI splitters are readily available that can pass the HD audio.
post #338 of 2268
thanx alot guys but the splitter didnt work the pc just find the 3d-xl , thanx GOD i found another way , i pluged the 2 outputs out of the video card , 1st one is dvi to hdmi to the 3d-xl, and other hdmi card out put to the av/recevier then i set the dvi as the primary display and the av/recevier as the extend display , then i set the sounds at the control panel to set default audio to the avreciver and it worked dd hd and 1.4hdmi to the 3d-xl.

but i dont know why i have to change the hdmi source at the 3d-xl every time i have to play a 3d from the total media , the 3d-xl image go black and wen i change the souce and return to hdmi 1 the image comes back !!
post #339 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bouda78 View Post

thanx alot guys but the splitter didnt work the pc just find the 3d-xl , thanx GOD i found another way , i pluged the 2 outputs out of the video card , 1st one is dvi to hdmi to the 3d-xl, and other hdmi card out put to the av/recevier then i set the dvi as the primary display and the av/recevier as the extend display , then i set the sounds at the control panel to set default audio to the avreciver and it worked dd hd and 1.4hdmi to the 3d-xl.

Glad that worked!

Quote:
but i dont know why i have to change the hdmi source at the 3d-xl every time i have to play a 3d from the total media , the 3d-xl image go black and wen i change the souce and return to hdmi 1 the image comes back !!

there's a lot of HDMI/HDCP stuff going on when it blanks (yes, on DVI also), but I've never had to select the input manually. I just leave it alone and it usually syncs up in a few seconds.
post #340 of 2268
Using an HTPC voids the point of the 3DXL You could hook the pc right up to the projector.
I do what you do, with two outputs from my vid card, one going to my 3D projector and one the going to the receiver. I actually use the receiver to output 1080P to my 1080 projector for 2D stuff.
post #341 of 2268
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

Using an HTPC voids the point of the 3DXL

It should be pointed out that this is only true in bouda78's case (or similar) where he is only using a single 3D projector. For the purposes of this thread (dual projector setup), you still need the 3DXL. Unless you run a special driver that can run both projectors but good playback software (TMT/PDVD/WinDVD) doesn't support dual projectors.
post #342 of 2268
I guess I meant the other way around. The 3DXL is much better than using an HTPC.
post #343 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Ok, we had a DOZEN people over tonight to watch Avatar 3D, and the unanimous verdict was that it looked WAAY better than in the cinema.

Comments were "brighter", "more color", "much smoother" etc etc.

I don't even have the final screen yet, but I am definitely calling this project a massive success.

Ahh! And I FOUND the Harkness screen sample finally today. I had put it on the top of the projection cabinet for "safekeeping" till the other samples arrived. It was the only place I hadn't looked.

I'll have screen test results for it tomorrow, for both circular and linear.

Avatar 3D was a huge hit on this setup tonight. Hard describe how good a dual pj setup can look. You have to see it to understand.
post #344 of 2268
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

Hard describe how good a dual pj setup can look. You have to see it to understand.

Camera Pictures work great
post #345 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post


Camera Pictures work great

They wouldn't begin to show the difference in this case, as the movement and lack of flicker are huge differentiators.

HOWEVER, I might just be able to film some video of each eye at particular scenes that might show some differences.

I'll give it a try tonight!
post #346 of 2268
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

They wouldn't begin to show the difference in this case, as the movement and lack of flicker are huge differentiators.

HOWEVER, I might just be able to film some video of each eye at particular scenes that might show some differences.

I'll give it a try tonight!

I was just thinking of pictures of the setup - not pictures on the screen.
Your descriptions have been good.
post #347 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post


I was just thinking of pictures of the setup - not pictures on the screen.
Your descriptions have been good.

Ahh That's easy, then!

I'll post a full set tonight. The setup is still very temporary, with lots of wires everywhere, due to being able to change things around if necessary, but you'll get the idea
post #348 of 2268
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

Ahh That's easy, then!

I'll post a full set tonight. The setup is still very temporary, with lots of wires everywhere, due to being able to change things around if necessary, but you'll get the idea

We all understand - it is a Research Project - so far

Thanks
post #349 of 2268
Did you do linear or circular for your Avatar showing?
post #350 of 2268
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

Did you do linear or circular for your Avatar showing?

And what screen material rdjam??
post #351 of 2268
Linear with the BDII is what I gathered from reading?
post #352 of 2268
rdjam wen i open the nvidia control panel there is a 3d hd at the resolution 720p @50Hz and 1080p @24Hz wen i tried the 1080p@24Hz the screen fonts become so small and the mouse movement became so slow so re set the resolution to 720p @50Hz , do i need to update the firmware?

btw the ps3 automatic set the resolution to 1080p 3d and plays perfectly
post #353 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Yes, I was running linear to the Black Diamond 1.4.

However, in my testing last weekend I found that the BD has poor polarisation for linear, just like it does for circular. So I don't want anyone to think that this would be a suitable final solution.

For last night's show, there was surprisingly little ghosting, considering how much depolarization was occurring, but you could definitely see ghosting in specific high contrast scenes, such as coming out of sleep when they arrive at Pandora, and in the company operations center.

However, the issue wasn't very visible most times elsewhere, and is a workable solution temporarily till I get a new screen.

SI is going to send me a sample of their new upcoming BD 3D screen very soon, which I am quite excited about. It holds the promise of being suitable for both 2D and 3D.

I am very seriously thinking that if I have a good 3D screen, I should be able to get similar extinction rates for both linear and circular.

If this pans out, my final system will be based on circular, as I prefer not to have to worry about keeping your head positioned just right. Last night a couple of folks laid back on the couch, only to realize the picture suffered, and had to lean back straight again.

It really is down to screen choice now, and testing the final result. I'll be testing the Harkness sample tonight, also.
post #354 of 2268
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bouda78 View Post

rdjam wen i open the nvidia control panel there is a 3d hd at the resolution 720p @50Hz and 1080p @24Hz wen i tried the 1080p@24Hz the screen fonts become so small and the mouse movement became so slow so re set the resolution to 720p @50Hz , do i need to update the firmware?

btw the ps3 automatic set the resolution to 1080p 3d and plays perfectly

What's your setup? What are you running to PC to and thru?
post #355 of 2268
pc with 450 gtx
3d-xl
optoma hd67n

my problem is that the 3d-xl goes blank wen playing 3d movie ( i have to switch to hdmi2 then 1 till image comes back)
i tried to set the resolution to 1920x1080 but the 3d movie opens at a part of the screen at 3d mode , wen setting at 720p it plays at full screen but i have to switch the hdmi selector.

ps3 works perfectly.
post #356 of 2268
pls if u can paste the firmware link.
post #357 of 2268
Did you run the nVidia 3D wizard? You want to output 1080p24 in the new standard frame-packed 3D mode.
post #358 of 2268
thank you rdjam for doing all this leg work.

I have lurked on the forum for a few years, a done A LOT of lurking lately (DIY speaker section), but I just had to post about the work you are doing. I was going to do all the same stuff in the near future.

I have wanted a dual projector setup for 3d for quite a while. Last time i looked into it there was no box available to handle the left/right issue.

I currently have a panny 3K and a elite cinegray 1.6. Obvioulsy another panny would be needed as well as a new screen.

Your current setup seems to work how I wanted for my personal use, though not as elegant as i have hoped.

I envision a single box, that would split the 1.4 into two 1.3's, while having the ability to output it own test patterns for projector alignment. hmm maybe a third output as a 1.4 passthrough a receiver for audio and other data.

I happen to have access to an engineer with vast FPGA experience, both in HDMI and 3D.

I will send you a PM
post #359 of 2268
Oh, get that guy to fix one up for us. And while he is at it get him to mod a cheap 1080p projector to handle 120Hz input. The Panny's like that ae3000 are 120Hz displays. They have frame interpolation. I don't see how they couldn't be easily fixed to handle 120Hz input.
post #360 of 2268
What will the ultimate 3d projection technology be once Laser and LED are the norm. DLP or LCOS? I can see myself getting a DLP, but unsure how great they can make the vertical lens shift.
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