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3D on Samsung 1080p DLP with Mitsubishi 3DA-1 and no Gefen - Page 31

post #901 of 1126
1/26/11 at 2:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarrod View Post

I'm using the IR glasses from the Mits starter kit, too. Glad to hear you say that these glasses are preferred to your Viewsonic DLP-links on this TV set - I'd heard several other people say that the LED light engine sets had more trouble maintaining sync with DLP-link glasses.

Still would love to get to the bottom of why my polarity seems different from yours. I definitely have to choose inverted - standard gives me pseudostereo, even with side-by-side content (XBOX360 with Black Ops). That's a bit of a mystery.

Another thing I've noticed... with the DLP glasses, YouTube 3D SbS videos would sync for no more than a second or two at a time where as the IR glasses never loose sync.
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post #902 of 1126
1/26/11 at 2:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarrod View Post

I'm using the IR glasses from the Mits starter kit, too. Glad to hear you say that these glasses are preferred to your Viewsonic DLP-links on this TV set - I'd heard several other people say that the LED light engine sets had more trouble maintaining sync with DLP-link glasses.

Still would love to get to the bottom of why my polarity seems different from yours. I definitely have to choose inverted - standard gives me pseudostereo, even with side-by-side content (XBOX360 with Black Ops). That's a bit of a mystery.

I use the Samsung SSG-1000s with my Samsung HL61A750 and I never lose sync unless someone walks in front of the IR emitter. I have talked to some who use the DLP Link Glasses and they like them but advise that too much light in the room will destroy the link.

Just out of curiosity for those that lose sync on the DLP Link Glasses, what is your lighting environment when you watch 3D? Additionally, what type of light do you use (florescent, incandescent, LED, etc.). Thanks.
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post #903 of 1126
1/26/11 at 2:24pm
Mitsubishi has released an adapter compatible with Samsung DLP sets!

http://www.unisentvoffer.com/unisent...0S/details.htm
http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/accessories/3DC100S

Quote:
Originally Posted by JCRisn View Post

Samsung and Mitsubishi have collaborated and designed an adapter for use on the Samsung 3D DLP TVs without using the Gefen HDMI Detective and without updating the EDID on the Samsung TVs! I received this information from Mr. Dan Schinasi of Samsung via an e-mail reply (shown below) on 01/25/2011.

Dear Mr. Lewandowski,
A derivative adapter for Samsung DLP was developed in collaboration with Mitsubishi. (Model 3DC-100). A distribution network is being set-up but our expectation is that Samsungparts.com will offer it on their site in the next few weeks. Additional retailers TBA.
Best regards,
Dan Schinasi

Mitsubishi is currently (01/26/2011) selling the adapter in a kit called 3DC-100S 3D Starter Pack which comes with the 3D Signal Adapter, 3D Signal Adapter Remote Control, 2 pairs of Active Shutter 3D glasses, Emitter for 3D Glasses, Disney Blu-ray 3D Showcase Disc and One HDMI cable. The selling price is $449.00 and can be found at http://www.unisentvoffer.com/unisent...0S/details.htm.
The above web page comes from: http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/accessories/3DC100S

The 3DC-100S is advertised as such, "The Mitsubishi 3D Adapter converts most types of 3D signals into the signal type Mitsubishi 3D Ready TVs and Samsung 3D capable DLP TVs are designed to display. Most 3D Blu-ray players, 3D game consoles and cable and satellite boxes can be connected to a Mitsubishi 3D DLP Home Cinema TV and Samsung 3D capable DLP TVs with the adapter for an immersive 3D experience."

I am currently investigating whether or not Mitsubishi will be selling this adapter in a kit such as the 3DA-1, for those who already have glasses and emitter, etc.
Update 01/25: I just talked with Mitsubishi and they WILL be offering the Adapter from the 3DC-100S as a stand alone kit like the 3DA-1 from the 3DC-1000. They do not have a part number yet, but they will be offering it in the future!

Thank you Samsung and Mitsubishi for responding to the cry of the Samsung 3D DLP owners!

Thank you PlumB (and all the rest) for showing how to use the 3DA-1 (from 3DC-1000) on the Samsung without the Gefen HDMI Detective.
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post #904 of 1126
1/26/11 at 2:45pm
Thread Starter 
I already have a Samsung compatible 3DA-1... I mean a 3DA-1 compatible Samsung. So much for the firmware update.

I wonder if it will allow DirecTV users with the older models to watch the 1080p 24Hz 3D ppv channels?
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post #905 of 1126
1/26/11 at 3:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlumB View Post

I already have a Samsung compatible 3DA-1... I mean a 3DA-1 compatible Samsung. So much for the firmware update.

I wonder if it will allow DirecTV users with the older models to watch the 1080p 24Hz 3D ppv channels?

So do I thanks to your firmware update!

It will be interesting to see how they handle it. I wonder if any Mits TV also have the same problem with DirecTV.

I guess Mits and Samsung decided this would be a better way to handle it rather than a firmware update to the Samsung sets.
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post #906 of 1126
1/26/11 at 3:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlumB View Post

I already have a Samsung compatible 3DA-1... I mean a 3DA-1 compatible Samsung. So much for the firmware update.

I wonder if it will allow DirecTV users with the older models to watch the 1080p 24Hz 3D ppv channels?

the pdf with specs indicates it supports 1080p 3D at 24Hz. I assume Directv now has to add all the Samsung EDID's to their database of supported 3D displays...
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post #907 of 1126
1/26/11 at 3:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulGo View Post

Mitsubishi has released an adapter compatible with Samsung DLP sets!

That figures. Literally one day after I registered powerstrip and went to the trouble to re-flash my HDMI port with the Mits EDID!

Well, good for Mitsubishi. I hope they make a lot of money from this. In the meantime I get to enjoy 3D Black Ops on my XBOX 360 using the great info shared by some terrific forum members like PlumB, without paying full retail (or waiting for a good price) on this new "universal" kit.
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post #908 of 1126
1/26/11 at 4:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers View Post

I have a question for everyone. Some of the owners of the 3DA-1 / Gefen HDMI Detective Kits sold by TRU3D are reporting that they can receive full surround audio through their kits as opposed to 2.0. TRU3D is telling some of them that they are altering both the 3DA-1 as well as the Gefen HDMI Detective. Is there anyone who has access to both a cloned 3DA-1 / Gefen HDMI Detective and one from TRU3D that could run an EDID check program and post their results. My guess is that TRU3D is only putting an EDID on the Gefen HDMI Detective that is compatible with surround sound and is not altering the 3DA-1.

Here is what TRU3D's page says for the stand alone Gefen the sell: Did you already buy a Mitsubishi 3D Adapter only to learn later that it will not work with your Samsung TV. If so TRU3D can help by re-programing your adapter and adding this HDMI detective to your total setup.

Guess this path is meaningless now, unless it becomes a cheaper (still has geek cred) than buying the new kit (for a lazy geek like me).
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post #909 of 1126
1/26/11 at 4:43pm
ITEM HAS BEEN SOLD

I have a 3DA-1 that I was intending to use, but with this new solution I think I'll wait the 3 months or whatever to get the kit. $449 seems a bit steep but it's still less than getting a new TV.

Anyway, I have a new 3DA-1 for sale. Box is opened but unused/uninstalled. $80 plus shipping. Send a message to me if interested.
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post #910 of 1126
1/26/11 at 4:45pm
I wonder if the 3DC-100 will have any better functionality compared to those (like me) who have already updated their EDID for using the 3DA-1.

I would imagine that it would be exactly the same and doubt that it would get rid of the red tint since that seems to be caused by the Samsung set itself. Would definitely like to know if it does, though.

I'm extremely happy with my setup now and, as long as the flashing of the EDID doesn't cause any harm in the long run (which it doesn't appear to do), I'll just stick with what I have. It is nice to see Samsung FINALLY making their customers happy, though....if only a little too late
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post #911 of 1126
1/26/11 at 4:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulGo View Post

Mitsubishi has released an adapter compatible with Samsung DLP sets!

http://www.unisentvoffer.com/unisent...0S/details.htm
http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/accessories/3DC100S

That is awesome if it actually comes to fruition. It took them long enough. Was anyone surprised that Mitsubishi is supporting Samsung customers rather than Samsung supporting its own customers.
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post #912 of 1126
1/26/11 at 4:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers View Post

That is awesome if it actually comes to fruition. It took them long enough.

It is already available for sale on the Mitsubishi site.
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post #913 of 1126
1/26/11 at 5:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulGo View Post

It is already available for sale on the Mitsubishi site.

Can you buy the adapter just by itself for those of us who already have an emitter and IR glasses? Additionally, I wonder if this will do an EDID check or if this will allow users to incorporate this adapter upstream of an HDMI 1.3 A/V Receiver and get full surround sound.
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post #914 of 1126
1/26/11 at 5:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarrod View Post

That figures. Literally one day after I registered powerstrip and went to the trouble to re-flash my HDMI port with the Mits EDID!

You're not alone, I got my 3DC-1000 kit yesterday, less than 24 hours ago. This is after suffering though multiple problem reprogramming the TV's EDID chip. All that's left to make the scenario complete is for someone to post that the new unit has capabilities (other than Samsung compatibility) not available to us 3DA-1 owners.
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post #915 of 1126
1/26/11 at 5:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers View Post

Can you buy the adapter just by itself for those of us who already have an emitter and IR glasses? Additionally, I wonder if this will do an EDID check or if this will allow users to incorporate this adapter upstream of an HDMI 1.3 A/V Receiver and get full surround sound.

According to the poster stated above Mitsubishi will offer the adapter as a stand alone items, but it is not yet available.
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post #916 of 1126
1/26/11 at 6:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulGo View Post

According to the poster stated above Mitsubishi will offer the adapter as a stand alone items, but it is not yet available.

If it can be placed upstream of an HDMI 1.3 A/V Receiver and give us full surround sound audio then I may be selling some gear shortly.
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post #917 of 1126
1/26/11 at 6:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers View Post

If it can be placed upstream of an HDMI 1.3 A/V Receiver and give us full surround sound audio then I may be selling some gear shortly.

What would be the application requiring it to be upstream? Just curious.
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post #918 of 1126
1/26/11 at 7:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarrod View Post
What would be the application requiring it to be upstream? Just curious.
In my experience, the newer 3D Formats will not pass through HDMI 1.3 A/V Receivers. If the newer 3D Formats are converted to 3D Checkerboard before it enters the HDMI 1.3 A/V Receiver then it will pass without any problems.

Many of us do not want to have to spend money to upgrade our A/V Receiver to HDMI 1.4. I have an Onkyo TX-SR805 A/V Receiver that is THX Ultra Certified. It does everything I need it to do besides the fact it is not HDMI 1.4 or 3D certified.
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post #919 of 1126
1/26/11 at 8:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by transco View Post
You're not alone, I got my 3DC-1000 kit yesterday, less than 24 hours ago. This is after suffering though multiple problem reprogramming the TV's EDID chip. All that's left to make the scenario complete is for someone to post that the new unit has capabilities (other than Samsung compatibility) not available to us 3DA-1 owners.

Unbelievable. I just got the Mitsubishi one last week. I hated the idea of hacking my tv, so I'm pretty bummed now. Surely the warranty on my TV expired, but would modifying the EDID prevent it from being eligible for any kind of repairs should something go wrong?

Is there anything really any different in this one from the Mitsu one other than letting it recognize Samsungs?
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post #920 of 1126
1/26/11 at 8:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulGo View Post
Mitsubishi has released an adapter compatible with Samsung DLP sets!

http://www.unisentvoffer.com/unisent...0S/details.htm
http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/accessories/3DC100S
That took all the fun out of this.
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post #921 of 1126
1/26/11 at 8:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2&2 View Post
Unbelievable. I just got the Mitsubishi one last week. I hated the idea of hacking my tv, so I'm pretty bummed now. Surely the warranty on my TV expired, but would modifying the EDID prevent it from being eligible for any kind of repairs should something go wrong?

Is there anything really any different in this one from the Mitsu one other than letting it recognize Samsungs?
No harm in flashing your HDMI3. This is just a cheaper option until the price comes down. $449.00 vs $250.00 plus $30 for software license. The unit appears to be the same, but with samsung compatibility. The rest of us just made our TV's compatible with the converter instead of the other way around.
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post #922 of 1126
1/26/11 at 9:32pm
Ahhh good things come to those that wait. I refused to do this EDID flash on principle and bellyached about Samsung openly in every forum I could including complaining to them directly. Seemed silly that Samsung supplied the glasses for a kit that only worked with Mitsu TVs.

At any rate, I give massive Kudos to PlumB for this thread. Had I not found this I would not have been aware I could be viewing 3d like I am now. I opted to wait and bit_h about it to anyone who would listen and instead got a checkerboard output Panny 3d BR player and DLP glasses to get rolling for less than $300. It was a no brainer for me because I still did not own a BR player. I know.

So now I will wait for that price to come down because that is a bit too proud for me. This announcement came just in time for me because I was tiring of waiting on this and was about to get 2 more UC DLP link glasses. I am reconsidering my options now since that kit comes with 2 glasses. Just a bit concerned about the DLP flash on the IR glasses and how that goes. I plan to use both types if I can.

My other concern is that presently I can watch 3d through my 1.3 HDMI VSX-23TXH AVR with lossless audio. From what I understand this may be a problem with the adapter. Oh the hours of research.
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post #923 of 1126
1/27/11 at 8:44am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

My other concern is that presently I can watch 3d through my 1.3 HDMI VSX-23TXH AVR with lossless audio. From what I understand this may be a problem with the adapter. Oh the hours of research.

I think unless they completely remove the EDID restrictions you'll still have problems putting it between the source and a 1.3 receiver. My guess is they've just added the Samsung PnP IDs and changed the way it modifies the ext block to make it compatible with the Samsungs, in which case you would need to connect it directly to the TV or use a gefen with a custom EDID to allow surround sound to pass to the receiver.

Although it probably depends on what source you are planning on using also. If you're using anything that sends side-by-side or top-and-bottom like cable or sat, you should be able to connect the new 3DA-1 directly to the TV with no problems. For something like the PS3 that uses frame packing you would need to convert it to checkerboard before it gets to the receiver.
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post #924 of 1126
1/27/11 at 9:07am
Thanks PlumB. I was thinking along those exact lines when I posted my concern. Whould be nice if there were a splitter that had several inputs and two outputs. One direct passthrough to the adapter or TV and the other that stripped the 1.4 compliance out for use with a 1.3 AVR. Now that just sounds like a silly device that nobody would make and therefore ought to be incorporated into the Mitsu adapter. I do not see that happening either.

So the device that fixes this is a new AVR. That is not that palatable of an option for me since my VSX-23TXH is not that old and was not cheap either. Fortunately there is time for me because my cable provider currently carries zero 3d content. I can do what I need with my checkerboard Panny player for now.

As always I will be looking here on AVS for solutions because this is the place that always seems to find them, even when they do not exist or supposedly cannot be done.
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post #925 of 1126
1/27/11 at 9:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlumB View Post

I think unless they completely remove the EDID restrictions you'll still have problems putting it between the source and a 1.3 receiver. My guess is they've just added the Samsung PnP IDs and changed the way it modifies the ext block to make it compatible with the Samsungs, in which case you would need to connect it directly to the TV or use a gefen with a custom EDID to allow surround sound to pass to the receiver.

Although it probably depends on what source you are planning on using also. If you're using anything that sends side-by-side or top-and-bottom like cable or sat, you should be able to connect the new 3DA-1 directly to the TV with no problems. For something like the PS3 that uses frame packing you would need to convert it to checkerboard before it gets to the receiver.

I am curious what you think is happening in my case. As stated earlier, I am getting the full multichannel (5.1 or 7.1) audio through my AVR as well as 3D video and it is a hdmi 1.3 compliant receiver (Denon 3808CI). If I simply connect the PS3 to the AVR and the AVR to the TV, all I get is 2D and 2.0 audio. If I first connect the PS3 to the TV, power up the PS3, play 3D of some kind (3DBR or streamed 3D doesn't seem to make a difference), then power the PS3 down, something, either the PS3 or the 3DA-1 'remembers' this configuration. I can then connect the PS3 to to the AVR and the AVR to the TV and the 3D, multichannel audio works from then on. Before I thought I had to leave the PS3 powered up to remember this state, but it turned out not to be true. As long as I don't make any hardware changes, it will continue to work. Switching the receiver between hdmi sources, 2D or 3D doesn't affect it. My question is, during the initial 'learning' (direct connect) step, what do you think is happening? It would appear that either the PS3 or the 3DA-1 EDID is being modified. My guess is it is the 3DA-1. I say this because I recently installed my second one and had to go through this learning process to get it to work. Yes, I suppose I could use MonInfo to see what changes, but to be honest, now everything is working, I'm afraid to touch it.
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post #926 of 1126
1/27/11 at 9:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

Thanks PlumB. I was thinking along those exact lines when I posted my concern. Whould be nice if there were a splitter that had several inputs and two outputs. One direct passthrough to the adapter or TV and the other that stripped the 1.4 compliance out for use with a 1.3 AVR. Now that just sounds like a silly device that nobody would make and therefore ought to be incorporated into the Mitsu adapter. I do not see that happening either.

So the device that fixes this is a new AVR. That is not that palatable of an option for me since my VSX-23TXH is not that old and was not cheap either. Fortunately there is time for me because my cable provider currently carries zero 3d content. I can do what I need with my checkerboard Panny player for now.

As always I will be looking here on AVS for solutions because this is the place that always seems to find them, even when they do not exist or supposedly cannot be done.

Mike,

Such a device would be great and I believe a company selling them would do very well. The problem might be patents and other things. Consumer Electronic companies want to put the squeeze on us to buy new equipment when we really don't need it. More importantly in today's tough economic times we can't afford it. If TRU3D is smart then they would come out with such a device as I don't believe they will be selling many more 3D kits. They need to sell such a switch for a reasonable price and that way they could sell more and make a bigger profit. It's amazing that some companies still don't understand how Wal-mart became such a successful company. Monoprice could make such a device and sell thousands of them. Myself and others have been asking for such a device for a long time now.
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post #927 of 1126
1/27/11 at 11:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

Thanks PlumB. I was thinking along those exact lines when I posted my concern. Whould be nice if there were a splitter that had several inputs and two outputs. One direct passthrough to the adapter or TV and the other that stripped the 1.4 compliance out for use with a 1.3 AVR. Now that just sounds like a silly device that nobody would make and therefore ought to be incorporated into the Mitsu adapter. I do not see that happening either.

So the device that fixes this is a new AVR. That is not that palatable of an option for me since my VSX-23TXH is not that old and was not cheap either. Fortunately there is time for me because my cable provider currently carries zero 3d content. I can do what I need with my checkerboard Panny player for now.

As always I will be looking here on AVS for solutions because this is the place that always seems to find them, even when they do not exist or supposedly cannot be done.

Your wish is my command. Take a look at this: http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2. You'll note it says high speed hdmi 1.3b, then later says it is 3D compatible. According to their tech support, this should do the job. The beauty of it is, it is a 4x2 matrix switch that, if you send the same input to both outputs, becomes a splitter. My guess is this will do the job for you. If not, you have 30 days to return it. (No, I don't work for Monoprice, but I am a long time, very satisfied customer.)
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post #928 of 1126
1/27/11 at 12:29pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by transco View Post

I am curious what you think is happening in my case. As stated earlier, I am getting the full multichannel (5.1 or 7.1) audio through my AVR as well as 3D video and it is a hdmi 1.3 compliant receiver (Denon 3808CI). If I simply connect the PS3 to the AVR and the AVR to the TV, all I get is 2D and 2.0 audio. If I first connect the PS3 to the TV, power up the PS3, play 3D of some kind (3DBR or streamed 3D doesn't seem to make a difference), then power the PS3 down, something, either the PS3 or the 3DA-1 'remembers' this configuration. I can then connect the PS3 to to the AVR and the AVR to the TV and the 3D, multichannel audio works from then on. Before I thought I had to leave the PS3 powered up to remember this state, but it turned out not to be true. As long as I don't make any hardware changes, it will continue to work. Switching the receiver between hdmi sources, 2D or 3D doesn't affect it. My question is, during the initial 'learning' (direct connect) step, what do you think is happening? It would appear that either the PS3 or the 3DA-1 EDID is being modified. My guess is it is the 3DA-1. I say this because I recently installed my second one and had to go through this learning process to get it to work. Yes, I suppose I could use MonInfo to see what changes, but to be honest, now everything is working, I'm afraid to touch it.

You would need to be more specific about where your 3DA-1(s) are in the chain and what other source you use for 3D.

Quote:


This is what I've found while testing all the updated EDIDs.

The 3DA-1 has 2 modes of operation.

1. Connected to a compatible mits TV.

The 3DA-1 takes the TV's EDID and adds only the data that will enable the source device to pass 3D content. Everything else is left unchanged.

2. Connected to an incompatible TV.

The 3DA-1 has a preset EDID that doesn't include the 3D data, it doesn't pass any of the info from the connected TV to the source device. The max audio is 2.0 and the max video resolution is 480p.

In my experience the 3DA-1 stores the modified EDID until it is connected to an incompatible TV. Once it reads the EDID of a compatible TV that's what it uses, you can change the TV's EDID all want (as long as you don't change the PnP ID) and it won't change the EDID of the 3DA-1.

Once I set my PS3 up for 3D it stays that way, I can connect it to HDMI 1 (unmodified) on my TV and it will still play 3D (although my TV can't display it until I switch it back to HDMI 3/3DA-1).

I don't have HDMI on my receiver so I can't test that, but the MonInfo report might help explain what's happening.
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post #929 of 1126
1/27/11 at 1:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickels55 View Post

PS - anyone know if this HDMI switcher will work? I'd like to connect my TiVo and 360 to the 3DA1 Adapter as well:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0030AZ44O/

Thanks for pointing this out. I'm in the same boat (but with a PS3), and this looks much cheaper than upgrading my AVR. If no one has an answer, I'll probably just go for it.
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post #930 of 1126
1/27/11 at 2:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post

Thanks for pointing this out. I'm in the same boat (but with a PS3), and this looks much cheaper than upgrading my AVR. If no one has an answer, I'll probably just go for it.

I also have a PS3 - how did I miss that in my post? So, I also want to connect all three devices. If you get it before me let me know if it works! I am not buying another thing until my 3D glasses arrive.
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