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The official Epson 8700UB thread - Page 89

post #2641 of 2825
11/28/12 at 7:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

You planned that all along, did't cha Dawg !!!

Couldn't say I didn't think it might be a possibility!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpmst3 View Post

Wow, what an adventure! I just hope that the new refurb is worth keeping. Your story really has me apprehensive about a refurb projector.
I know the support has always been excellent, but that is a lot to go through to save a little money.
I am now leaning back towards the 5020.

I will report back on how it goes!

What happened between here:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jmeier21 View Post

Epson came through with a perfect 8700UB replacement! Couldn't be happier, that's all I wanted was a working unit! Thanks Epson!!!

And here:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jmeier21 View Post

Epson hits a home run. Brand new 5010 on its way...thanks Epson!

Dude are they sending you a Brand New One!? They offered up to send me a 5010 but it is a refurb, how did you end up getting a new one? Maybe its because your at the beginning of your warranty and I am at the end of mine!
Edited by cheezit73 - 11/28/12 at 7:35pm
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post #2642 of 2825
11/29/12 at 7:46pm
I am new to AVS Forum and I have been reading these recent comments closely (as I have just ordered an 8350 from VA). I really wanted the 8700UB-R though - and may still change my mind - but many of these comments are putting me off a refurb unit.

But, as importantly, I am trying to find the answer here on this thread to my particular question which is: Why did Epson drop THX and 'Ultra Black' features from the 8000 chassis? I am wondering if all these problems with bad panels, lamps, focus pulls etc. on the UB models meant Epson decided to cut its losses and narrow the SKUs down to just one i.e. the 8350?
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post #2643 of 2825
11/30/12 at 12:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicalfox View Post

I am new to AVS Forum and I have been reading these recent comments closely (as I have just ordered an 8350 from VA). I really wanted the 8700UB-R though - and may still change my mind - but many of these comments are putting me off a refurb unit.
But, as importantly, I am trying to find the answer here on this thread to my particular question which is: Why did Epson drop THX and 'Ultra Black' features from the 8000 chassis? I am wondering if all these problems with bad panels, lamps, focus pulls etc. on the UB models meant Epson decided to cut its losses and narrow the SKUs down to just one i.e. the 8350?

The 8350 was an update to the 8100 model, which did not have THX or high-contract panels. The 8500/8700 line was replaced by the 50x0/60x0 line, which does (though THX was not available on the 5010 for some reason). To my knowledge, the 8350 is the end-of-line for that numbering scheme, though the 30x0 line seems to be the closest thing to a replacement.

If you can afford it (and are serious about picture quality), I would definitely go for the 8700-R while it's still around. I did just that, and though I had to jump through a hoop or two, it was definitely worth it. The picture is so beautiful, I've felt the need to replace a large chunk of my DVD collection with Blu-ray just to get the best from it (though that's wound up increasing the cost of the projector by another 33%, to date biggrin.gif ).
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post #2644 of 2825
11/30/12 at 12:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulcamp View Post

The 8350 was an update to the 8100 model, which did not have THX or high-contract panels. The 8500/8700 line was replaced by the 50x0/60x0 line, which does (though THX was not available on the 5010 for some reason). To my knowledge, the 8350 is the end-of-line for that numbering scheme, though the 30x0 line seems to be the closest thing to a replacement.
If you can afford it (and are serious about picture quality), I would definitely go for the 8700-R while it's still around. I did just that, and though I had to jump through a hoop or two, it was definitely worth it. The picture is so beautiful, I've felt the need to replace a large chunk of my DVD collection with Blu-ray just to get the best from it (though that's wound up increasing the cost of the projector by another 33%, to date biggrin.gif ).

Good advice, Soulcamp, thanks. I may well turn the 8350 around on Monday when it arrives. I must say I am also attracted to the fact that the THX mode, according to most reviews, obviates the need for an expensive calibration (although I realize further tweaking for your particular environment can always improve the image). And, yes, image quality is hugely important to me. The VA deal also includes a 25ft HDMI cable which makes the deal even more tempting.
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post #2645 of 2825
11/30/12 at 1:35am
I just recieved my 8700ub-R from Visual apex. It is replacing my 5.5 year old AE1000u that has performed well for me and is 425 hours into its fourth lamp at 6737 total hours.

Upon turning it on, I was a bit surprised I did not go WOW, since my point of reference was a 5.5 year old projector. My first reaction was, am i watching the new Epson or my old Panasonic. But after some A/B comparisons with my old Panasonic, I could see significant improvements in all objective categories except one. As has been stated by many the 8700 has great black levels outstanding contrast and nice color pop. But what my projector seems to lack is accurate color reproduction. In every color setting it is very green biased.

I spent a couple hours calibrating with Disney WOW and found the indicated settings to be not to far from the factory presets. But despite these calibrations, the green cast did not lift. When looking at anything that should look neutral or gray, this projector makes it green. One thing I noticed in the WOW calibration was a very Green look to the 1x1 pixel tests. And convergence showed some green hanging by as much as a full pixel in some areas, although not nearly as bad as my AE1000 was hanging in all colors and it was not showing this green cast.

Do any owners of this projector have any comments that might help me determine if this green cast is something I can calibrate out, or if it is just something this projector does, or if I just got a bad one.
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post #2646 of 2825
11/30/12 at 1:50am
Reset the PJ back to factory default settings. If you still have the green cast in all color modes, get it replaced.
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post #2647 of 2825
11/30/12 at 4:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TCroly View Post

I just recieved my 8700ub-R from Visual apex. It is replacing my 5.5 year old AE1000u that has performed well for me and is 425 hours into its fourth lamp at 6737 total hours.
Upon turning it on, I was a bit surprised I did not go WOW, since my point of reference was a 5.5 year old projector. My first reaction was, am i watching the new Epson or my old Panasonic. But after some A/B comparisons with my old Panasonic, I could see significant improvements in all objective categories except one. As has been stated by many the 8700 has great black levels outstanding contrast and nice color pop. But what my projector seems to lack is accurate color reproduction. In every color setting it is very green biased.
I spent a couple hours calibrating with Disney WOW and found the indicated settings to be not to far from the factory presets. But despite these calibrations, the green cast did not lift. When looking at anything that should look neutral or gray, this projector makes it green. One thing I noticed in the WOW calibration was a very Green look to the 1x1 pixel tests. And convergence showed some green hanging by as much as a full pixel in some areas, although not nearly as bad as my AE1000 was hanging in all colors and it was not showing this green cast.
Do any owners of this projector have any comments that might help me determine if this green cast is something I can calibrate out, or if it is just something this projector does, or if I just got a bad one.

Projector Central mentions a green cast a couple of times in its review of the 8350, so maybe it's common to the 8000 platform?
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post #2648 of 2825
11/30/12 at 8:03pm
My 8700 arrived and I really like it!! The first thing I did was pull up the pattern so I could center the picture on the screen. While doing this I checked the convergence and it looked good. On a white screen I do notice that one side of the screen has a very slight green hue and the other has a very slight red hue to it. I have noticed this on other projectors as well so I'm guessing it's normal for a LCD projector. Other than that the picture is great!! The image is more detailed than my 8100 was and the contrast is a big improvement.
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post #2649 of 2825
12/1/12 at 10:04am
My fourteen month old 8700 UB just had the bulb give up at only 465 hours. After it cooled down
I tried it again and was able to get approximately three more hours out of it and then it went again.
I called Epson and they are sending me a replacement lamp, but I have to say that I am a little
disappointed that I got so few hours out of my supposed 4,000 hour lamp usage. Has anyone
else had this problem?
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post #2650 of 2825
12/1/12 at 6:03pm
This is a known problem with this model run.
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post #2651 of 2825
12/1/12 at 9:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jmeier21 View Post

Epson hits a home run. Brand new 5010 on its way...thanks Epson!

Wait, what happened?

The last thing you posted was about receiving a perfect 8700:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jmeier21 View Post

Epson came through with a perfect 8700UB replacement! Couldn't be happier, that's all I wanted was a working unit! Thanks Epson!!!
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post #2652 of 2825
12/2/12 at 5:01pm
Can someone with an 8700 confirm with me if color temperature and skin tone adjustments are available in THX color mode? On my projectors these choices are grayed out when THX color mode is selected.

Also is there anywherein the menus where you can confirm the version of firmware in the projector?
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post #2653 of 2825
12/3/12 at 1:20pm
Recently purchased an 8700ub Refurb from Visual Apex. Pleased with picture but based on some of the posting i am reading I need to look into convergence more closely.

Main problem I am having is a No Signal error when using my cable DVR (Comcast). Problem is not consistent. I am using a Sony STR 1000 receiver as my switcher with HDMI throughout. Blu-Ray does not have this problem.

Curious if anyone has had any issues with this using an 8700? Imagine it is a cable box and receiver communication issue but have no idea and frustrated that it is intermittent. Tried powering up in different sequences but has no effect. Any advice on this would be great.

Also, seeing a light blue baseball size shadow in upper right of 120" screen which only is visible when screen is black.... can i assume this is a dust blob?

Thanks for the help!
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post #2654 of 2825
12/3/12 at 4:47pm
was perfect for about 8 hours, then started to develop a red bar along the bottom right half of the screen. So I wrote Epson a lenthy email regarding my displeasure with there QC, and got a call back a day later. They offered me a new 5010 and I excepted.
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post #2655 of 2825
12/3/12 at 5:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheezit73 View Post

Well thought I would give you all an update, three weeks have gone by since I called Epson for a replacement and the journey has been as expected and also NOT as expected. The quick of it is that it is the same old story, Great customer service (with a bump), poor quality control.
Summary:
Refurb #1: Yellowish cast on all white plastic pieces especially air intake (guessing nicotine?) Gunk and grime in and around all the ports, poor convergence, VERY sharp lens with uniform focus unfortunately everything else was a deal breaker.
Refurb #2: Poor convergence, very bad color uniformity issue, Loud iris.
Called in pretty upset after #2 was bad when I had been reassured after #1 that #2 would be perfect. Got elevated to a Level 2 support and the rep dropped the ball big time, basically I spent an hour on the phone during which time he said he spoke with advanced product support and the were going to do "something" to the projector that they were going to send me. When I asked him to elaborate on just what "something" meant he kept dodging the question. He advised me I could call back later in the day or the next day to get the tracking #. I called back the next day and found out that there was no record of my conversation with the rep or any replacement on the way. Long story short I went through several supervisors and eventually ended up on the phone with a customer relations specialist in Los Angeles. She set me up with a replacement that was going to be double checked by techincians before being sent to me and she assured me it would be perfect. which leads us to:
Refurb#3 the perfect double checked unit: Ummmm..... not so much, Loud iris, poor focus uniformity, very soft, poor convergence red is off horribly, loud fan with irregular noise, iris appears to not open all the way up even when turned off causing overall dark image.
Ahhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Ok so now it's the day before Thanksgiving, call the advanced specialist and leave a message on her extension she gave me, no call back. Its a holiday so I am patient, I call again Monday morning, no call back by today. So I called the regular private line and....
REDEMPTION!!!
I explain the rep the situation, he verifies a few things and looks at the notes. Tells me I should not be having to go through all of this and personally offers his apologies regarding the whole mess. Asks me to hold for a few minutes and comes back with an Advanced specialist. The advanced specialist also apologizes and tells me that for my troubles he is going to have a refurbished 5010 double checked by the techs and sent out to me asap! I am so ecstatic the extra Lumens are going to be great for my 16 foot throw!
So will I buy Epson again in the future? Absolutely based on the end result and the obvious fact that Epson does value it customers. I will let you all know how the 5010 turns out..!

So I received the 5010. What a difference between it and my 8700 for my situation of a 16 foot throw to a 120" screen the extra lumens are very apparent! So off to the 5010 thread I go. I will say this, my 8700 worked pretty flawlessly for the almost two years I had it up until the last minute and the picture was great! All in all Epson has treated me right even if it took a while. Hopefully this 5010 carries me a year or so and depending on the new tech that is out I would still buy another Epson new.
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post #2656 of 2825
12/3/12 at 5:57pm
Glad to hear you finally got things sorted out. Let's hope no one else has to go through it.
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post #2657 of 2825
12/4/12 at 9:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TCroly View Post

I just recieved my 8700ub-R from Visual apex. .... But what my projector seems to lack is accurate color reproduction. In every color setting it is very green biased.
Ah, AFAIK my VA 8700UB-R is perfect, but also AFAIK it has a "very green bias." You see, fact is I am "total green blind!" I cannot honestly say that I've ever seen anything green in my life. To me, the picture looks perfect. The blacks look black. If I compare them to actual black I can see that they are dark gray, but if I don't do that they appear black indeed. It was not like that with my old Sanyo Z2, with which darkly lit scenes were sometimes almost completely washed out. Some movies were almost if not actually impossible to watch.
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post #2658 of 2825
12/4/12 at 11:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TCroly View Post

Can someone with an 8700 confirm with me if color temperature and skin tone adjustments are available in THX color mode? On my projectors these choices are grayed out when THX color mode is selected.
Also is there anywherein the menus where you can confirm the version of firmware in the projector?

I ask this question again for any 8700 owner to answer.

The reason is, that I was able to remove the strong green bias from the neutral color images by adjusting color temperature and also adjusting the skin tone adjustment. But these controls are grayed out in the THX mode. Lacking these controls, the THX mode on my project producing a color result that no one could call balanced. Yet reading through this thread, it appears that many people use the THX mode as their preferred color mode.
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post #2659 of 2825
12/4/12 at 9:10pm
Yes you can not adjust those settings on the THX mode. It should not have a green cast as you describe. I never liked my THX mode until I calibrated it using this method: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1134710/epson-calibration-guide-1080-1080ub-6100-6500ub-7500ub/0_60 and then it looked great. Out of the box I liked the theatre black modes.
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post #2660 of 2825
12/5/12 at 6:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheezit73 View Post

Yes you can not adjust those settings on the THX mode. It should not have a green cast as you describe. I never liked my THX mode until I calibrated it using this method: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1134710/epson-calibration-guide-1080-1080ub-6100-6500ub-7500ub/0_60 and then it looked great. Out of the box I liked the theatre black modes.
If the adjustments can't be made in the THX mode then won't making them elsewhere have no effect on the THX mode? When you switch to THX mode won't it revert back to the factory presets for THX?
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post #2661 of 2825
12/5/12 at 9:07am
Correct the settings do not transfer from mode to mode. The color temperature and skin tone are not adjustable in THX mode because they are fixed at the THX specified settings. Where you really need to make the changes is the in the advanced color controls as in the thread I linked. As I have said I used THX mode on my 8700 and even before I calibrated it it never had the green cast you describe, I would send it back for another.
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post #2662 of 2825
12/5/12 at 11:39am
I wouldn't send a projector back that's otherwise perfect unless it CANNOT be calibrated. Mine had a green hue as well when I got it. Don't look for a problem where there really isn't one.

But I don't use THX mode either. I use theater black and calibrated IT using a color analyzer. It looks STUNNING!! Forget THX mode.... the projector has much more to offer
when tweaked correctly in another mode.

I think one reason THX mode has a lot of green in it, is to reach a higher foot lambert figure. Green puts out the most lumens. It's a compromise.

Theater black one, properly calibrated seems to give the best overall image, at least it does for me. Greyscale post calibration is spot on. There is also a trick to getting all the colors right
mentioned elsewhere on the forum.

Why these things are never perfect from the factory is beyond me, but it has kept me busy calibrating displays for many years.
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post #2663 of 2825
12/5/12 at 3:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinman View Post

I wouldn't send a projector back that's otherwise perfect unless it CANNOT be calibrated. Mine had a green hue as well when I got it. Don't look for a problem where there really isn't one.
But I don't use THX mode either. I use theater black and calibrated IT using a color analyzer. It looks STUNNING!! Forget THX mode.... the projector has much more to offer
when tweaked correctly in another mode.
I think one reason THX mode has a lot of green in it, is to reach a higher foot lambert figure. Green puts out the most lumens. It's a compromise.
Theater black one, properly calibrated seems to give the best overall image, at least it does for me. Greyscale post calibration is spot on. There is also a trick to getting all the colors right
mentioned elsewhere on the forum.
Why these things are never perfect from the factory is beyond me, but it has kept me busy calibrating displays for many years.

I agree with this advice. The out of the box color rendition from this refirbished projector is not perfect. It is not horrible, but needs some adjustment to make it acceptable to me.

I found it possible to produce an acceptable result by adjusting color temperature and skin tone settings in Living room and theater black 2, but I really could not come up with acceptable color result in THX, So I just won't use THX. But I did read in projector reviews.com's review of the 8500 and 8700 that the THX color mode was not as adjustable in the 8500 as it was in the 8700. So it occurred to me that my 8700ub-r might be equipped with 8500 firmware.
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post #2664 of 2825
12/6/12 at 3:40pm
Question guys. I have been gone a while. Some health issues in the family. I have a 8700ub. Bought it back early 2011. It has 169 hours on it. No joke. Due to the already mentioned issues, there just hasn't been much movie time. Anyways, when I got the projector I was told that I could get the extended warranty at any time before the 2yr was up. So today I email Epson to get the process started and they are telling me now that I had to do it within the first 180 days of owning the PJ and for an extra 1yr warranty now is over 500 bucks.

WTF? Any truth to this?
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post #2665 of 2825
12/9/12 at 9:29pm
Here are some pics of what I was talking about with the red and green hues. Is this normal for this projector or should I call Epson for a replacement?


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post #2666 of 2825
12/10/12 at 11:36am
While LCD will always have some kind of color shifts from one side of the screen to the other, the amount of shift that your projector is exibiting seems excessive to me. I would send this projector back for replacement.
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post #2667 of 2825
12/10/12 at 11:47am
All,

I have a brand new lamp for my 8700 if anyone is interested in purchasing?
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post #2668 of 2825
12/10/12 at 1:40pm
jtenn, That is bad return it asap.
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post #2669 of 2825
12/10/12 at 4:22pm
I have a 8700ub thinking of getting the epson HC5020 UB will I notice a big difference in the 2d,

Thanks
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post #2670 of 2825
12/10/12 at 5:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsil View Post

jtenn, That is bad return it asap.
I called Epson today and explained what was going on with the projector and they said it needs to be replaced. I didn't want to put a $1970.10 hold on my credit card so they had me drop it off at FedEx and they paid the shipping. While I'm waiting for the replacement to arrive I guess I will break out my Sanyo Z5 and use it until the new one arrives.
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