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Replacing current setup

post #1 of 23
10/18/10 at 12:43pm
Thread Starter 
Hey all,

I am in the middle of replacing my current Yamaha HTIB piece by piece and was wondering what order I should do it in.

My inclination is to replace the speakers first and the receiver second followed by the sub woofer last. I think I will gain more by replacing the speakers so I would like to do this first. I just don't want to damage the speakers by under powering them or anything like that. I plan on going with the Polk Audio RTiA7's up front, the CSiA6 center, and the FXiA6 surrounds. Would this blow up my current receiver/ruin the speakers running them on my current receiver?

I am also planning on getting the Pioneer Elite VSX-32 as my AVR, will I need to upgrade to an external amp? I don't think I will have to but this AVR supports preouts so I can if I need to.

No plans on a sub woofer as of right now. I haven't been super impressed with the Polk sub woofers any suggestions to go with this setup?

I've also been confused about power protection, what are your views on the Panamax M5300, M5400 and the Monster HDP2500?

Thank you very much for any suggestions, this is very much a work in progress and I wouldn't even be this far without lurking on AVS all the time!

Andrew
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post #2 of 23
10/18/10 at 12:53pm
What is your current budget, and when do you expect your next bit of budget?

Is this exclusively for HT?

I would upgrade the sub before the receiver (and no you will not need an external amp with a different receiver, only if you get a pre/pro and that is probably a few upgrades away).

I'd almost be tempted to upgrade the sub before the speakers as the biggest improvement in HT experience from that setup.
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post #3 of 23
10/18/10 at 1:22pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick240 View Post

What is your current budget, and when do you expect your next bit of budget?

Is this exclusively for HT?

I would upgrade the sub before the receiver (and no you will not need an external amp with a different receiver, only if you get a pre/pro and that is probably a few upgrades away).

I'd almost be tempted to upgrade the sub before the speakers as the biggest improvement in HT experience from that setup.

HT 40%/Gaming 40%/Music 20%

I was considering the speakers first because my dialogue doesn't seem clear and I think my music listening will benefit from the speakers as well.

I would also like to upgrade the receiver before the sub just from an ease of use stand point. I hate my current receivers setup menu and it doesn't have HDMI.

I can't really reveal my budget since these items will be purchased on an employee discount which I can reveal to you is 5% over cost but cannot reveal to you what cost is. You can however fill in the gaps as you would like.

Thanks for the quick response! Any thoughts on the power protection?

Andrew
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post #4 of 23
10/18/10 at 3:43pm
Thread Starter 
To the person who voted receiver, why? Just trying to understand everything while making my decisions.
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post #5 of 23
10/18/10 at 4:23pm
I would look to upgrade the receiver first, as that is the foundation of your audio system. Then you can add individual speakers as you have cash available (starting with your center and then fronts). I'd upgrade your center channel first as that is where most dialogue comes from (but upgrading fronts first would work too).
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post #6 of 23
10/18/10 at 5:53pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjmc View Post

I would look to upgrade the receiver first, as that is the foundation of your audio system. Then you can add individual speakers as you have cash available (starting with your center and then fronts). I'd upgrade your center channel first as that is where most dialogue comes from (but upgrading fronts first would work too).

I understand that point, but to the same token wouldn't you want to upgrade the receiver last so it was the most up to date? Speakers don't change a lot receivers do. Though hopefully I'm done with all of this in the next 4-6 months.
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post #7 of 23
10/18/10 at 6:30pm
I know that a receiver with all the latest technology/features is tempting but I'd replace the speakers first. The Polks that you've listed should provide a significant improvement in sound quality (assuming the listening space isn't an acoustic nightmare) compared to the Yamaha HTIB speakers. Next I'd go for a subwoofer since 80% of your listening is HT and games. Upgrading the speakers and sub before the receiver allows you to then pick a receiver with characteristics that are a match for your sound stage. Also, going this route will probably result in a speaker/sub set-up that you'll keep for a while. At the end of the day, this approach is (IMO) more likely to result in the generally recommended budget allocation for HT - to wit, 2/3 for speakers, 1/3 for receiver. Finally, if you start with the receiver, you'll probably want upgrade it again (can you say new technology/features?) about the time you finally finish up with the speakers and sub. JMO
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post #8 of 23
10/18/10 at 6:44pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by samsurd2 View Post

I know that a receiver with all the latest technology/features is tempting but I'd replace the speakers first. The Polks that you've listed should provide a significant improvement in sound quality (assuming the listening space isn't an acoustic nightmare) compared to the Yamaha HTIB speakers. Next I'd go for a subwoofer since 80% of your listening is HT and games. Upgrading the speakers and sub before the receiver allows you to then pick a receiver with characteristics that are a match for your sound stage. Also, going this route will probably result in a speaker/sub set-up that you'll keep for a while. At the end of the day, this approach is (IMO) more likely to result in the generally recommended budget allocation for HT - to wit, 2/3 for speakers, 1/3 for receiver. Finally, if you start with the receiver, you'll probably want upgrade it again (can you say new technology/features?) about the time you finally finish up with the speakers and sub. JMO

That was my initial thought. Sadly my room is probably an acoustic nightmare It is an unfinished basement ATM with cement floors. This will not be its permanent home, I rent currently. I am really wanting to buy something nice that will last me a while, so accommodating that room specifically is not my goal.

Thanks for the advice!
Andrew
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post #9 of 23
10/19/10 at 12:50pm
Thread Starter 
Shameless self bump for more opinions! I am also now considering the Onkyo NR708 as opposed to the VSX-32, thoughts?
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post #10 of 23
10/19/10 at 1:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewbkillen View Post

Shameless self bump for more opinions! I am also now considering the Onkyo NR708 as opposed to the VSX-32, thoughts?

I had a theater a while back that I had to get rid of and when I started my new theater I got a 75$ denon 1508. From their I added Paradigm monitor speakers and then upgraded to the Paradigm studios. The studios sounded great with the little denon. I just upgraded the receiver to the Denon 3310 and at loud volumes it sounds a lot better than the 1508 but at moderate listening levels there is not a huge difference. The speakers will give you a much bigger improvement than the receiver. Unfortunately, I clicked on receiver so my bad. I think speakers should be 1st.
If you do go with a receiver now, is Denon on the list of what you can get discounts on? In my opinion Denon has some of the best midrange receivers.
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post #11 of 23
10/19/10 at 1:38pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post

I had a theater a while back that I had to get rid of and when I started my new theater I got a 75$ denon 1508. From their I added Paradigm monitor speakers and then upgraded to the Paradigm studios. The studios sounded great with the little denon. I just upgraded the receiver to the Denon 3310 and at loud volumes it sounds a lot better than the 1508 but at moderate listening levels there is not a huge difference. The speakers will give you a much bigger improvement than the receiver. Unfortunately, I clicked on receiver so my bad. I think speakers should be 1st.
If you do go with a receiver now, is Denon on the list of what you can get discounts on? In my opinion Denon has some of the best midrange receivers.

Denon is on the short list of items I can get a discount on. I have been impressed SQ wise with my fathers 3308 but it is a GUI nightmare. I have demoed the vsx-32 side by side with the 2311 and actually like the VSX-32 better, just my opinion. Have the Denon GUI's gotten infinitely better the last couple of years? The 2311 I demoed was in a sound room with no display.

Thanks for the advice mjpearce!

Andrew
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post #12 of 23
10/19/10 at 2:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewbkillen View Post

Denon is on the short list of items I can get a discount on. I have been impressed SQ wise with my fathers 3308 but it is a GUI nightmare. I have demoed the vsx-32 side by side with the 2311 and actually like the VSX-32 better, just my opinion. Have the Denon GUI's gotten infinitely better the last couple of years? The 2311 I demoed was in a sound room with no display.

Thanks for the advice mjpearce!

Andrew

There was a 2808 and a 3808. I'm not sure what the GUI looked like on either of them. The 3310's GUI is very nice and I really like it. I bought a Pioneer 1020 and its GUI was a little more flashy. I didn't like the way MCACC made my center channel sound so I returned the Pioneer. I probably could have played around with the setting and fixed it but it didn't have pre amp outputs so I returned it. I didn't think the Pioneer had as much power as my old Denon 1508 so I couldn't keep it. The good thing with MCACC is you can adjust it more than audyssey. In my room, the audyssey just worked a lot better. I had looked at the Elite 32 and thought about getting one but I had a problem with the reduction in weight. The Elite 21 from last year was 38 lbs and the Elite 32 is 29 lbs. I don't know where that 9 lbs went so I decided to stay away from it. I just thought that was weird. The 32 maybe just as powerful as the old 21 but the weight thing would have been in the back of my mind. Also there were no pioneer elite dealers around me so it would have been more difficult to find one. All the receivers your mentioned are good so its just personal preference.
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post #13 of 23
10/19/10 at 3:09pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post

There was a 2808 and a 3808. I'm not sure what the GUI looked like on either of them. The 3310's GUI is very nice and I really like it. I bought a Pioneer 1020 and its GUI was a little more flashy. I didn't like the way MCACC made my center channel sound so I returned the Pioneer. I probably could have played around with the setting and fixed it but it didn't have pre amp outputs so I returned it. I didn't think the Pioneer had as much power as my old Denon 1508 so I couldn't keep it. The good thing with MCACC is you can adjust it more than audyssey. In my room, the audyssey just worked a lot better. I had looked at the Elite 32 and thought about getting one but I had a problem with the reduction in weight. The Elite 21 from last year was 38 lbs and the Elite 32 is 29 lbs. I don't know where that 9 lbs went so I decided to stay away from it. I just thought that was weird. The 32 maybe just as powerful as the old 21 but the weight thing would have been in the back of my mind. Also there were no pioneer elite dealers around me so it would have been more difficult to find one. All the receivers your mentioned are good so its just personal preference.

Why would you be concerned about the weight, n00b srry
I have an elite dealer here in town and about 40 miles away

Thanks again,
Andrew
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post #14 of 23
10/19/10 at 7:45pm
I just felt like they might have taken something off the amps. That's the only thing I could think of that would cause a drop of 9 lbs but if you listened to it and like it I wouldn't let that bother you. I just had no way to test it without buying it.
Just to let you know the bookshelf polk rti were reviewed by home theater mag and got a really good review. Here's the link if you want to check it out.
http://hometheatermag.com/compactspe...peaker_system/
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post #15 of 23
10/19/10 at 8:39pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post

I just felt like they might have taken something off the amps. That's the only thing I could think of that would cause a drop of 9 lbs but if you listened to it and like it I wouldn't let that bother you. I just had no way to test it without buying it.
Just to let you know the bookshelf polk rti were reviewed by home theater mag and got a really good review. Here's the link if you want to check it out.
http://hometheatermag.com/compactspe...peaker_system/

I actually had already seen that review and it helped my decision. The only question that I have after reading it, again, is whether or not the bookshelf RTia1's would be better surrounds than the FXia6's.

Andrew
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post #16 of 23
10/20/10 at 9:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewbkillen View Post

I actually had already seen that review and it helped my decision. The only question that I have after reading it, again, is whether or not the bookshelf RTia1's would be better surrounds than the FXia6's.

Andrew

Yea that's always a difficult decision. I went with bookshelves for my surrounds and now I'm kind of thinking about getting some Dipoles. Decisions decisions.
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post #17 of 23
10/20/10 at 1:35pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post

Yea that's always a difficult decision. I went with bookshelves for my surrounds and now I'm kind of thinking about getting some Dipoles. Decisions decisions.

Yeah I have pretty limited options as far as where I can place my surrounds so I hope the dipoles will help with that I'll let you know if it is worth the upgrade!

On another note I am planning on auditioning the Def Tech Supercube II & III's in the next week. Anybody have good things to say about these? Any other subs I should consider within the following brands, Klipsch, Def Tech, Polk, B&W, Martin Logan, or Mirage?

Andrew
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post #18 of 23
10/20/10 at 1:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewbkillen View Post

Yeah I have pretty limited options as far as where I can place my surrounds so I hope the dipoles will help with that I'll let you know if it is worth the upgrade!

On another note I am planning on auditioning the Def Tech Supercube II & III's in the next week. Anybody have good things to say about these? Any other subs I should consider within the following brands, Klipsch, Def Tech, Polk, B&W, Martin Logan, or Mirage?

Andrew

I know you said you get a deep discount on product from work - but for the sub you might want to consider applying some of your 5.0 savings and buy something from one of the ID companies that do subs really well (i.e. not from work).

Your HT experience will thank you.
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post #19 of 23
10/20/10 at 2:04pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick240 View Post


I know you said you get a deep discount on product from work - but for the sub you might want to consider applying some of your 5.0 savings and buy something from one of the ID companies that do subs really well (i.e. not from work).

Your HT experience will thank you.

I understand that these brands, at retail, are usually overpriced but they can't really be bad subs right? I'm also kind of old school and I don't know if I could blind buy a piece of audio equipment.

What ID brands would you recommend?

Thanks,
Andrew
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post #20 of 23
10/20/10 at 2:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewbkillen View Post

I understand that these brands, at retail, are usually overpriced but they can't really be bad subs right? I'm also kind of old school and I don't know if I could blind buy a piece of audio equipment.

What ID brands would you recommend?

Thanks,
Andrew

Decide what your sub budget is and check the subwoofer sub-forum for threads.

If music is important, along with HT, then consider a Rythmik (that's what I have).

The basic great subs list (sorry if I miss one):
- SVS
- HSU
- Outlaw
- Epik
- ChaseHomeTheater (new guy on the block)
- eD

Paradigm also makes some good ones (I had a DSP3100) and their dealers can be talked down.

From your list DefTech and ML make some good ones.

I suggest you listen to the SuperCubes; look at the price you would pay for one that you like; then see what you could get from an ID for the same money (and decide if you want to add $100 of your other savings to it).

Most of them let you try for 30 days and return (but shipping can be a lot for a sub). You can also go to the thread for a sub your interested in and see if someone will let you come to their house for a demo.
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post #21 of 23
10/20/10 at 2:22pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick240 View Post

Decide what your sub budget is and check the subwoofer sub-forum for threads.

If music is important, along with HT, then consider a Rythmik (that's what I have).

The basic great subs list (sorry if I miss one):
- SVS
- HSU
- Outlaw
- Epik
- ChaseHomeTheater (new guy on the block)
- eD

Paradigm also makes some good ones (I had a DSP3100) and their dealers can be talked down.

From your list DefTech and ML make some good ones.

I suggest you listen to the SuperCubes; look at the price you would pay for one that you like; then see what you could get from an ID for the same money (and decide if you want to add $100 of your other savings to it).

Most of them let you try for 30 days and return (but shipping can be a lot for a sub). You can also go to the thread for a sub your interested in and see if someone will let you come to their house for a demo.

A lot of good info there, thanks! I'll have to start digging in tomorrow on research for subs.

Andrew
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post #22 of 23
10/20/10 at 5:10pm
I have heard the supercube 2 and it was impressive. The small footprint is nice but you pay a lot for the small size. An SVS would be bigger but you would get a just as good a sub for 1/2 the price or less. I would not say the brands you mention are bad at all. You can get a better sub for a cheaper price from the id brands but considering your discount it might even out. B&W makes good speakers but I am not sure about their subs. I currently own a Klipsch KSW10. Its nothing great but it improved movie watching. I really didn’t feel like spending much on a sub and I found it for 100 off craigs list. Their reference subs are nice too.
Yea I would love to hear what you think of the dipoles. My front speakers are paradigm studio 20s and cc570. I have been looking at some used adp470s but I don’t know if they are worth the price for my small theater room.
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post #23 of 23
10/21/10 at 12:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewbkillen View Post

A lot of good info there, thanks! I'll have to start digging in tomorrow on research for subs.

Andrew

Check this thread re. available subs
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8#post18569728
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