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Awkward center speaker placement- what do you think?

post #1 of 16
10/28/10 at 9:48am
Thread Starter 
I wanted to get your advice re. placement of my center speaker (Mirage OMD-C1). There's a fireplace in the center of the room where the speaker would normally go. My options are to either place the speaker about 3 feet to the right of the central axis, which would place it only ~2 ft from the right speaker (OMD-15), or to mount it on the ceiling (8.5ft high), a few inches from the front wall and right above the projector screen. Note that my room is 19(l)x14(w) ft, and main sitting location is about 10 ft from the front wall.

The first option would keep the speaker at ear level, but I'm worried about the sound being too shifted to the right (and the center and right speaker being too close together). The second option would keep the speaker centered, but the speaker would be placed at an angle and about 5 ft above ear level.
(Note that I'll be using a pair of OMD-5's as surrounds.)

Also note that I have a Denon AVR-991 receiver with Audyssey MultEQ XT, which will hopefully help with the imperfect placement.

Thanks for your advice!
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post #2 of 16
10/28/10 at 9:58am
Without a picture to actually see what you're up against, my vote would be to give a phantom center channel a try.

IOWs don't use a center. The AVR's auto set-up scheme(Audyssey) will detect that you have no center and the center info will be routed to the main left and right speakers. People sitting off center may notice a shifting of the image, but at the least, I say it is worth a try.
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post #3 of 16
10/28/10 at 10:02am
I don't think I would recommend either of those choices. Neither of them really have a good outcome. Placing the center that close to the right main will make the voices from the center channel sound like everyone is always shifted to the right. This would be distracting to me. Also placing the center in the ceiling would be distracting. The voices are not supposed to sound like they are coming out of the ceiling. The best hope for the center to be in the ceiling would be to get an in wall speaker that can be pointed downward with pivots. If it where me I still don't think I would do that. My best suggestion would be just to use a phantom center.
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post #4 of 16
10/28/10 at 10:08pm
Thread Starter 
Here's a picture of my living room. Perhaps I'll try putting the speaker to the side, and if that sounds bad, will remove it altogether. I'd hate to remove it though, since it's such a great speaker.. I thought Audyssey could 'magically' compensate for the off-center position

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post #5 of 16
10/28/10 at 10:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pichco View Post

I thought Audyssey could 'magically' compensate for the off-center position

The physical location of a speaker, which gives you directional cues, is something that DSP cannot compensate for.

I would highly recommend going with a phantom center in your situation.
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post #6 of 16
10/29/10 at 3:34am
How often do you use this equipment? Is it just for movies? If it's just used on occasion I may have another idea. You could put the center channel on a simple pole stand in the center below the screen in the proper position for watching movies. I wouldn't use the fire place while doing this. Then when you are done, simply move the center and the stand to the corner by that plant. You wouldn't even have to disconnect the speaker wire. I have made stands like this for my rear surrounds for under $50 for two of them. You only need one.
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post #7 of 16
10/29/10 at 6:55am
If the only place people are sitting while watching movies is the couch in the foreground and not the loveseat on the left, a phantom center should give good results with no shifting of the image to either side.

I couldn't imagine someone wanting to sit in the loveseat for a movie anyway, you'd be awfully close to both the screen and the left speaker.
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post #8 of 16
10/29/10 at 10:44am
Well maybe not the easiest scenario to work with but would the be a problem getting a bracket and mounting it above the screen ? I Was under the impression you could have a center channel above or below the screen . And maybe with a bracket you could face it to were it points at a angle toward the couch ?
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post #9 of 16
10/29/10 at 11:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DCM88 View Post

Well maybe not the easiest scenario to work with but would the be a problem getting a bracket and mounting it above the screen ?

It would work, but it would depend on how much he wants the speaker up there when not in use.

I agree, if this is for occasional movie viewing, just get a moveable or rolling stand and move the center to the left when not in use. That'll make it sound best.

Placing it off axis will have pretty bad sound compromises.
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post #10 of 16
10/30/10 at 3:17pm
Thread Starter 
Speaker stand-- I don't know why I didn't think about it. Excellent advice!

By the way, As a non-audiophile, how much should I expect the Audyssey calibration to effect the overall sound from my speakers? Assuming my room isn't very oddly shaped (which it isn't) and my speakers aren't from different brands/styles (which they aren't) etc., would I be able to hear a dramatic difference before/after MultEQ XT calibration? (Better yet, would my girlfriend be able to tell the difference?)
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post #11 of 16
10/30/10 at 3:24pm
^^^^

Depends on which version of Audyssey you are using. MultEQ XT means that the receiver is capable of being upgraded to the pro version of Audyssey, which is leaps and bounds better IMHO over the standard mic they give you that came with the unit. No way of knowing (other than testing the results...but that could be due to user error as well) how good the mic that came with the unit is. The differences lie in the amount of processing they allow for the pro vs. non-pro and the microphone as well as an understanding of how the acoustics are working in the room to interpret the physical results. If it were me, I'd go with the pro version, but that all depends on you wallet size! I should think you would hear a marked inprovement with the pro version. Non-pro version is more of a gamble. Best wishes!
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post #12 of 16
10/30/10 at 3:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pichco View Post

I thought Audyssey could 'magically' compensate for the off-center position

Quote:
Originally Posted by XanderMoser View Post

The physical location of a speaker, which gives you directional cues, is something that DSP cannot compensate for.

Trinnov can.

Why not put the center on a stand directly in front of the fireplace when you need it and move it out of the way when you don't? Just make sure the fire is not lit when you watch a movie.
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post #13 of 16
11/1/10 at 1:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

Trinnov can.

I looked at their DSP correction devices, and couldn't find enough details on the actual corrections made and processes involved.

Where did you hear about this?

Sure if there are multiple channels you could use DSP to redirect some signal from one channel into another to move the image over...but that is far from ideal.

But if there is a single mono sound source, there is no DSP that can make that source seem to come from a different location...at least on the same plane. I say this because I suppose you could add time delays/reverberation to attempt to make the sound appear from farther back. But that is beside the point.
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post #14 of 16
11/1/10 at 2:19pm
Yes, it requires the use of multiple channels for this. See: http://www.stereophile.com/integrate..._42/index.html
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post #15 of 16
11/1/10 at 2:44pm
My solution for mounting a Mirage OMDC1 underneath a shelf. This may work if, say, you have a mantel that allows for this solution and if the screen is acoustically transparent. At least, it would be easy to slide the speaker on and off the mount for those times when you want to light a fire or you don't want to see a big speaker suspended over your fireplace.


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post19321267
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post #16 of 16
11/1/10 at 2:53pm
I second the idea of using an acoustically transparent screen with center behind. Doesn't get any better than that.
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