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The Official HSU VTF-15H Thread - Page 13

post #361 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by cacihome View Post

Ok. My VTF-15H arrived!

Ehhh. I will not bother saying anything, besides it is the best subwoofer I have owned!...As simple as that... WOW!

Will post SPL readings soon with more detailed review, but I am getting new SPL room records.
Again WOW!
I am so happy, I even feel Dr. Hsu designed this exactly for my tastes.AHHAHAHAHAH

The feets, the cabinet construction(fit &finish), the triangular ports, the driver, all are excellent... This product has at last ended my quest for a subwoofer, it is really great!

I heard Jurassic Park 3 (DTS), in the scene where the two dinosaurs fight, and the sub ports were literally blowing up the curtains...Since those curtains are very very heavy, this is a first in my room!
I had in that same corner the ULS-15 and the A7s-450, and they were good... but this thing is putting out more bass than the two together...I just can't believe this. It even makes me sick after a while of hearing it.
It has extremely good transients in Die Hard 4, and hard hitting midbass in movies like LOTR3 (Oliphants stomps).

Congrats! glad to hear your enjoying your new toy. what subs have you had in the past?

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #362 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Devin1886 View Post

Congrats! glad to hear your enjoying your new toy. what subs have you had in the past?

Some Velodynes 10-12" inches...
Several HSU subs, including MBM.
A7s-450.A7-450, polks, Infinity's, etc...
post #363 of 5093
and hear it goes again...... more reason for me to want to sell my dual drive ULS for a dual drive 15H........
post #364 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimwyn View Post

and hear it goes again...... more reason for me to want to sell my dual drive ULS for a dual drive 15H........

Ehhh. I can't imagine someone needing two VTF-15 in a room smaller than at least 6,000 cufeet...Honestly.

Just by ear...the VTF-15, both ports open, feels more powerful than two ULS's...(In my room, with movies I watch constantly)...It is simply at another level.
post #365 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by cacihome View Post

Some Velodynes 10-12" inches...
Several HSU subs, including MBM.
A7s-450.A7-450, polks, Infinity's, etc...

Thanks caci good to know which subs it puts to shame. Have you had a chance to throw any music at it?
post #366 of 5093
No, so far I haven't had the time... But as far as movies go...even with both ports open, q at .5, it feels as tight as a sealed sub.
post #367 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by cacihome View Post

Ehhh. I can't imagine someone needing two VTF-15 in a room smaller than at least 6,000 cufeet...Honestly.

Just by ear...the VTF-15, both ports open, feels more powerful than two ULS's...(In my room, with movies I watch constantly)...It is simply at another level.

have you actually had 2 ULS's before in your room?

Also do you think 2 ULS's + 2 MBMs = 2 VTF 15Hs?
post #368 of 5093
Nope...that is why I said just by ear...
But I had the ULS-15 stacked with the A7s-450...A7s-450 was more powerful than the ULS-15 in the midbass/upperbass.
I think 1 MBM-12 + 2 3.3 = VTF-15 H...Again as close as I can put the match...In terms of bass perceived...
post #369 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by kimwyn View Post

and hear it goes again...... More reason for me to want to sell my dual drive uls for a dual drive 15h........

+1:d
post #370 of 5093
At what point is a sub to big...Can it be?
Currently running a older Mirage PS12-90.

Room is 13'w back of couch is at 16'D Ceiling 10'. Open to kitchen area behind main watching couch.

Right now I have my current sub in left corner of wall facing diagnal.

My sub looks like a peanut compared to this new one

See pic.

1


Thanks
post #371 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by cacihome View Post


Just by ear...the VTF-15, both ports open, feels more powerful than two ULS's...(In my room, with movies I watch constantly)...It is simply at another level.

I have both the VTF-15 and the ULS 15 here, and I have to say that doing a comparison between the two has proven to be quite difficult thus far.

Why?

The VTF-15 is simply WAY more powerful than the ULS 15. It just isn't even close. I can't help but get the feeling that even two ULS-15's wouldn't quite give me what I'm getting from the VTF-15h.
post #372 of 5093
Yep, in terms of palpable bass, a more fair comparison would be 2 3.3 or ULS or HO's + MBM vs a VTF-15H, I think...
post #373 of 5093
Cacimar, congrats on getting the 15H, I know how long you waited for it to arrive. BTW I knew you'd love it. Now you have the same sh$t eating grim on your face that I do.

Before tonight i had only played with 1 port open. Tonight I finally got around to the 2 port mode. With my HO w/turbo I obviously (due to the turbo being attached) ran in full extension mode. I'm finding I like the 15H better in 2 port open mode vs. 1 port. When in 2 ports open(make sure you only use EQ2 with 2 ports open) Q=0.7 it gives me extension to 16Hz before it starts to drop off while giving me more mid bass than 1 port open mode. 1 port open EQ1, Q=0.7 gives me extension to around 12Hz, but I loose some mid bass.

What mode are you guys using?
post #374 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowtye8 View Post

At what point is a sub to big...Can it be?
Currently running a older Mirage PS12-90.

Room is 13'w back of couch is at 16'D Ceiling 10'. Open to kitchen area behind main watching couch.

Right now I have my current sub in left corner of wall facing diagnal.

My sub looks like a peanut compared to this new one
Thanks

The 15H is a LOT bigger than the PS12-90. Tthe PS12-900 is pretty much 16x16x16 while the 15H is 26x18x27 with feet and grill and ships at 123lbs. You may want to make a model of it's dimensions with some boxes before you get it. On second thought forget I said that. Just get it you can always move other things around.
post #375 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by hometheatergeek View Post

Congrats and great write up Legairre. Have you found a setting yet where the sub would work with music as well as movies without having to make adjustments to the sub? IOW set it and forget it (wasn't that on a commercial I saw on TV somewhere) So far I'm liking what you all are writing about but I do not think I would want to have to change settings between music sessions and a movie. I do not have to do that with my present subs.

This sub has very clean sounding bass and so once you have your preference dialed in, you can just leave it in that mode for music. For example I have a flat response in my room down to 16 hz with both of the ports open (maximum output). In addition I have the Q control set to 3 because in my room, the bottom end does not need additional boost or smoothing out. Maximum output combined with lower Q contol (3 is lowest) gives the most midbass response and highest midbass headroom. I'm aiming for as much mid-upper bass response and headroom as possible while at the same time having a matching lower end (down to 16 hz). Since the setting mentioned allows me to do this I just leave it there. It sounds great with music (both in movie soundtracks and cds).

Dr. Hsu demoed the VTF-15h at the open house using maximum output mode (both ports open). Most of the demo consisted of music with only 1 movie scene demo.

I mentioned earlier that sealed mode sounds great with music, but since this sub has quick enough transients and great sound quality, I think you'd be fine in any mode.

-Len
post #376 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by cacihome View Post

Ok. My VTF-15H arrived!

Ehhh. I will not bother saying anything, besides it is the best subwoofer I have owned!...As simple as that... WOW!

Will post SPL readings soon with more detailed review, but I am getting new SPL room records.

I am so happy, I even feel Dr. Hsu designed this exactly for my tastes.AHHAH

The feets, the cabinet construction(fit &finish), the triangular ports, the driver, all are excellent... This product has at last ended my quest for a subwoofer, it is really great!

I heard Jurassic Park 3 (DTS), in the scene where the two dinosaurs fight, and the sub ports were literally blowing up the curtains...Since those curtains are very very heavy, this is a first in my room!
I had in that same corner the ULS-15 and the A7s-450, and they were good... but this thing is putting out more bass than the two together...I just can't believe this. It even makes me sick after a while of hearing it.
It has extremely good transients in Die Hard 4, and hard hitting midbass in movies like LOTR3 (Oliphants stomps).

Nice! Finally got it, eh? I was wondering if the VTF-15h could outdo the tandem that you had co-located in that corner. Looks like it does!

I agree with you on the transients. Very quick. I know in my write-up I used Toy Story 1, but I had to watch the previous 2 before watching the 3rd. Toy Story 3 has some very quick tempo Latin guitar music and the VTF-15H kept up with the mains no problem while delivering great sound quality.

Battle scenes in Band of Brothers really felt like bombs were dropping, cannons were firing, and grenades were going off. And I'm not just talking about output; I mean they sounded pretty realistic (well-timed, solid texture without overhang).

Glad you got your sub! Let us know what you think about it with music.

-Len
post #377 of 5093
See now I think I'm going to have to get me one of these. This sub sounds pretty nasty. And I like nasty! Can't wait to hear some thoughts on music. I am about 55/45% movies to music but I really like my sub to sound good playing all kinds of music too. So far it seems like with so many options on how to play it there is probably a setting that will work fantastic for music as well.

I have been telling the wife I have been waiting for the perfect sub and can you believe she said "honey you work hard if this makes you happy...get it"

I got happy and then thought...."uh oh" what do you want, but she said "nothing" I just deserved it since I don't ever get myself much. What do you guys think? I myself am feeling deserving. I'll wait a bit to save up, it was a little higher/bigger than I was planning on but I am willing to make exceptions when necessity presents itself.


Yup! Think I'll start posting those "Earthquake Prone Area" notices around the neighborhood now!
post #378 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin View Post

I have both the VTF-15 and the ULS 15 here, and I have to say that doing a comparison between the two has proven to be quite difficult thus far.

Why?

The VTF-15 is simply WAY more powerful than the ULS 15. It just isn't even close. I can't help but get the feeling that even two ULS-15's wouldn't quite give me what I'm getting from the VTF-15h.

wait till the guys in the ULS thread get a load of this post.......
post #379 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimwyn View Post

wait till the guys in the ULS thread get a load of this post.......

Kim,

Rob has not heard a dual drive ULS-15 system yet. You have not heard a ULS-15 Dual Drive system yet (soon for you). Even cacihome has not owned a Dual Drive system. I also believe the VTF-15H will have more output then a single ULS-15 due to it's ported design. But until I buy one VTF-15 to compare it against my Dual Drive system or if someone else does, it is still speculation. Just as Pete said "one VTF-15 has as much output as a ULS-15 + MBM" I would also hope that when the Dr creates a new subwoofer, he improves on his previous designs so that it becomes the new subwoofer to own.

You either need to stop reading this thread (I won't) or wait and see what your Dual Drive system can do once you get the second one. How much longer of a wait do you have?
post #380 of 5093
Pete, did say it would take dual drive to meet or exceed a single VTF-15H. http://forum.hsuresearch.com/showpos...1&postcount=11

Quote:


The build quality, sound quality, feature set, and output capability of this new subwoofer is extremely impressive. One would need ULS-15 DualDrive to match/exceed the clean output capability of one VTF-15H from 16-100Hz. Of course, the VTF-15H is twice the size too, but very impressive in many respects!
post #381 of 5093
I wouldn't be surprised if A VTF-15H could sound louder than a dual drive, unless you co-located the ULS-15s. As for sounding better, a dual drive can have the advantage of better room coverage, less localization, and all the other advantage of multiple subs, and then there is the issue of what sound you prefer- ported vs sealed. Personally I prefer sealed although Hsu's ported subs sound superb as well. The one area where the ULS trounces the VTF-15H is it simply looks better!
post #382 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by hometheatergeek View Post

Kim,

Rob has not heard a dual drive ULS-15 system yet. You have not heard a ULS-15 Dual Drive system yet (soon for you). Even cacihome has not owned a Dual Drive system. I also believe the VTF-15H will have more output then a single ULS-15 due to it's ported design. But until I buy one VTF-15 to compare it against my Dual Drive system or if someone else does, it is still speculation. Just as Pete said "one VTF-15 has as much output as a ULS-15 + MBM" I would also hope that when the Dr creates a new subwoofer, he improves on his previous designs so that it becomes the new subwoofer to own.

You either need to stop reading this thread (I won't) or wait and see what your Dual Drive system can do once you get the second one. How much longer of a wait do you have?

i'll be setting up next saturday december 4th and i cant wait. you know you'll definitely be hearing from me
post #383 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimwyn View Post

i'll be setting up next saturday december 4th and i cant wait. you know you'll definitely be hearing from me

That might be a slight problem. My company is moving which will require me to work the weekend of the 4th and the 11th so starting 11/29 I will have to work for 18 days straight. I'll try to fit you in where I can.

Let's move this back to the ULS-15 thread. Carry on boys with the new VTF-15H. Keep posting new revelations as they become apparent. Try the Air Bender movie on those VTF15.
post #384 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by hometheatergeek View Post

Kim,

Rob has not heard a dual drive ULS-15 system yet. You have not heard a ULS-15 Dual Drive system yet (soon for you). Even cacihome has not owned a Dual Drive system. I also believe the VTF-15H will have more output then a single ULS-15 due to it's ported design. But until I buy one VTF-15 to compare it against my Dual Drive system or if someone else does, it is still speculation. Just as Pete said "one VTF-15 has as much output as a ULS-15 + MBM" I would also hope that when the Dr creates a new subwoofer, he improves on his previous designs so that it becomes the new subwoofer to own.

You either need to stop reading this thread (I won't) or wait and see what your Dual Drive system can do once you get the second one. How much longer of a wait do you have?


Just for comparison sakes...The ULS and the A7s-450 were stacked in that same corner...They had hit 117-118db cleanly at about 11 feet in different movies like WOTW, LOTR3,etc.... I will put today the new measurements found with the VTF-15H, but I am more than confident saying that the VT-15H will surpass them...At the CES, I heard ULS dual drives, and while they were amazing, just in midbass/upperbass punchiness (without CEA 10%limits) just by ear and memory, the VTF-15 H feels simply more powerful...

BTW, my room is actually bigger than the CES room where I heard the ULS DD...
post #385 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by hometheatergeek View Post

Kim,

Rob has not heard a dual drive ULS-15 system yet. You have not heard a ULS-15 Dual Drive system yet (soon for you). Even cacihome has not owned a Dual Drive system. I also believe the VTF-15H will have more output then a single ULS-15 due to it's ported design. But until I buy one VTF-15 to compare it against my Dual Drive system or if someone else does, it is still speculation. Just as Pete said "one VTF-15 has as much output as a ULS-15 + MBM" I would also hope that when the Dr creates a new subwoofer, he improves on his previous designs so that it becomes the new subwoofer to own.

You either need to stop reading this thread (I won't) or wait and see what your Dual Drive system can do once you get the second one. How much longer of a wait do you have?

All valid points (with the clarification that someone else pointed out that Pete actually said one would need two uls-15's to match the clean output of the VTF-15h). Based on my evaluation at this point (and I have still not done *extensive* comparisons by any means) Pete's statement appears to be absolutely accurate. The point that I was making in my prior post (and this is not directed at you HTGeek as I know you already realize this) was that you really can't make a fair comparison between one ULS-15 and one VTF-15h, as the latter simply has *far* more output than the former. Again, not even close.

One VTF-15h vs two ULS-15's would be a much more interesting comparison.
post #386 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete_Hsu View Post

In general I am always very wary about comparing different data sets. There are many different variables involved, even when looking at CEA2010 data. For example, does one use single tone bursts or an averaging of tone bursts? Was there a fudge factor to convert the CEA2010 peak output to RMS output? Does one measure with the subwoofer in normal orientation or a different orientation?

Our measurement procedure is as follows:

We place the subwoofer in the middle of a parking lot. We use Beta 1.62 version of the CEA2010 software developed by Don Keele. We use a TES 1356 SPL Calibrator to calibrate the mic (Earthworks M30) before each test. We use the Pre-pro mic preamp, the same one that Don Keele uses. We do not use any fudge factor. We place the subwoofer in the normal upright position as suggested in the CEA2010, place the mic on the floor directly in front of the front baffle, 1 m from the woofer dust cap. We then test up to the highest level without hitting 'fail'. We do not use averaging.

So the reality is that our data is not directly comparable to any other data set that is gathered without using the exact same test procedures that we do. We believe in the validity of our methodology, but we do have to be careful about making extrapolations.

Sincerely,

Hi Pete:

Congratulations on the VTF-15H - by all accounts it's a nice piece.

For those wondering about Ilkka's test measurements, he used the same software (and release version) as Hsu Research. But Ilkka measured at 2M GP and also normalized output to RMS and not peak. To obtain the 1M GP Peak equivalent to Ilkka's data, add 9 dB (not 6 dB) to his reported values.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...mpilation.html

The way Hsu Research is reporting the CEA-2010 values complies with the requirements of the standard - 1M GP Peak SPL. Keele's program generates peak SPL values (not RMS), so if one is measuring at 1M just take the direct readings from the software.

The standard does require the data to be repeatable to within 0.1 dB, but it does not require multiple readings of the same test frequency to be averaged. With that said, the standard does require averaging of the 20-32 Hz values to obtain the "Ultra Low Bass score" and averaging of the 40-63 Hz values to obtain the "Low Bass score".
post #387 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by julianzart View Post

See now I think I'm going to have to get me one of these. This sub sounds pretty nasty. And I like nasty! Can't wait to hear some thoughts on music. I am about 55/45% movies to music but I really like my sub to sound good playing all kinds of music too. So far it seems like with so many options on how to play it there is probably a setting that will work fantastic for music as well.

I have been telling the wife I have been waiting for the perfect sub and can you believe she said "honey you work hard if this makes you happy...get it"

I got happy and then thought...."uh oh" what do you want, but she said "nothing" I just deserved it since I don't ever get myself much. What do you guys think? I myself am feeling deserving. I'll wait a bit to save up, it was a little higher/bigger than I was planning on but I am willing to make exceptions when necessity presents itself.


Yup! Think I'll start posting those "Earthquake Prone Area" notices around the neighborhood now!

If the wife okays it i say go for it. This sounds like a very very good sub, i personally dont have it but maybe one day i can hear one in person or own one. Im running the 18.2 from chase home theater but it sound sounds like Dr. Hsu has a nice sub that everyone is enjoying.

So if it was me i would be pulling the trigger, i love my sub but im not biased to anyone company or sub. I just love seeing companies keep coming out with better and better products for reasonable prices, i think thats what keeps this hobby fun.
post #388 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Legairre View Post

The 15H is a LOT bigger than the PS12-90. Tthe PS12-900 is pretty much 16x16x16 while the 15H is 26x18x27 with feet and grill and ships at 123lbs. You may want to make a model of it's dimensions with some boxes before you get it. On second thought forget I said that. Just get it you can always move other things around.

Thanks. I think I am going to pull the trigger. I would assume I could set my Mains up as small speakers(well dont remember at the moment how they were setup in Audessey)to cut the Freq to them and let this monster handle all the lows.
Right now I have to drive the B&W's pretty hard to get some loudbase because the Mirage cant satisfy my needs.
It seems to be between this and the VTF-3 MK3. I will call HSU tommorow.
Thanks
Dennis
post #389 of 5093
I pulled the trigger last night for the VTF-15H. With the holiday mail ,I am sure I will not see it to end of next week but I will report back.

Still following this thread in the meantime
post #390 of 5093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Mullen View Post

To obtain the 1M GP Peak equivalent to Ilkka's data, add 9 dB (not 6 dB) to his reported values.

Ed,

Why not run the CEA2010 test for yourselves instead of relying Ilkka's numbers while throwing in an estimation for distance? From my understanding Ilkka's numbers were also tested with a different amp than what the current PB-13 uses, so it's not even an accurate comparison if someone was looking for a new sub.
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