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Anthem MRX Receivers - 300, 500, 700 Owners Thread & Tweaking Guide - Page 520

post #15571 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phrehdd View Post

Perhaps a future Oppo will allow for this or a 3rd party splitter made specifically for this task and made with fidelity in mind.

The for-purchase Sony server, about the only 4K source around now, has two HDMI outputs which to me makes sense in a time of transition.

Plenty of external splitters have been on the market this year.
post #15572 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by sneill View Post

And that is what I am highlighting to Nick
- this is not clear in the current user manual / It doesn't match like for like

This is appreciated and normally I would look into it but as the gen1 has been discontinued I would ask that tech support be contacted for setup/operation help for matters like this. I don't have time nor resource for revisiting previously completed product unless there's a major issue. I believe that the new UI and manual are already clearer and more streamlined... time will tell of course.
post #15573 of 16451
Thanks for all your help Nick!

Time for a new 10 series thread?smile.gif
post #15574 of 16451
Does anyone know if the new ARC 1M in the new MRX line can process a signal natively up to 96khz or does it down-sample to 48k Samples/Sec?

Not a huge concern for me, just curious.

Thanks,

Kyle
post #15575 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by philb37 View Post

Thanks for all your help Nick!

Time for a new 10 series thread?smile.gif
yeah +1,
and get a mod to move all x10 msg over, since the new line will have totally different setup menue and feat. questions n answers would just mix up badly for readers.
post #15576 of 16451
OK, hoping this helps with the discussion about 7.1 DTS-HD MA on a 1st Gen MRX running a 5.1 speaker setup. I have an MRX700 with a 5.1 setup and ran some tests.

First, here is a picture of my Listening Mode Presets



OK, now here is the signal from a 5.1 DTS-HD MA movie (127 Hours). It shows that the audio track is 5.1 DTS-HD MA and the next picture shows DTS-HD MSTR is being output and pressing the Audio button on the MRX front panel shows that "None" is set




Here are my 7.1 DTS-HD MA results using a movie (A Good Day To Die Hard). This first picture shows that the audio track is 7.1 DTS-HD MA yet the audio out screen says 5.1 DTS is being output



Furthermore, pressing the Audio button shows that 5.1 DTS is being used instead of None


If I press the Audio button and change it from 5.1 DTS to None (as shown), then you can see the new audio output information shows DTS-HD MSTR is being output



I also used some Dolby TrueHD movies to test their behavior. 5.1 TrueHD movies output as Dolby TrueHD. Playing a 7.1 Dolby TrueHD movie (The Nightmare Before Christmas) also outputs as Dolby TrueHD with None automatically selected (i.e. when you press the Audio button, it says None).



In a nutshell:
A 7.1 DTS-HD MA signal is the only trigger to this "issue". If running a 5.1 setup and a 7.1 DTS-HD MA signal is input, the output will read DTS 5.1 and the Audio button will default to DTS 5.1. If you change from DTS 5.1 to None, the output signal will now say DTS-HD MSTR, just like it automatically does for 5.1 DTS-HD MA movies.

*Note*
- Changing a 7.1 DTS-HD MA movie from DTS 5.1 to None under the Audio button will cause the change to stick until you either turn off the MRX OR access the main setup menu on the MRX. Either of those actions cause the "issue" to start all over (i.e. - you must select None from the Audio button in order for the audio output to say DTS-HD MSTR).
Edited by BigCoolJesus - 10/2/13 at 1:14pm
post #15577 of 16451
^ These are processing configurations. There is no actual output of either DTS or DTS-HD MA from the MRX. What comes out of the MRX is Analog audio, not a digital Bitstream

The question has to be is there any actual difference in what the gen 1 MRX units are doing for DTS-HD MA 7.1 input when the processing configuration for a 5.1 speaker setup is set to NONE vs. DTS 5.1.

Logically, there SHOULD BE NO DIFFERENCE. The processing configuration choice between DTS 5.1 and NONE should be irrelevant -- with both working like NONE -- since there are more input content channels than output speaker channels. But it can be checked with something like the DTS-HD MA 7.1 test track on Disney's WOW, Blu-ray. If the Rear channels are coming out in the Side speakers then you are getting decoding of the full 7.1 (followed by down-mix to 5.1 for output). Check with both the NONE and DTS 5.1 settings and then we'll know.
--Bob
post #15578 of 16451
When comparing this DTS-HD MA issue to Dolby TrueHD it is strange, as with the Dolby TrueHD signal the MRX audio output always says Dolby TrueHD and None is always automatically selected when the Audio button is pushed no matter if it is a 5.1 or 7.1 signal.

But with DTS-HD MA, the audio output screen reports different formats between DTS-HD MA 5.1 and 7.1 if one has a 5.1 setup and is watching a 7.1 movie (a DTS-HD MA movie says output is DTS-HD MSTR whereas a DTS-HD MA 7.1 movie says output is DTS 5.1 unless one manually changes the Audio button setting from DTS 5.1 to None every time the receiver is turned off or the main menu is accessed).
post #15579 of 16451
Yeah, sounds screwy to me. What's showing as DTS 5.1 may actually mean NEO:6 processing is engaged, but again that makes no sense when the input already includes more channels than you have speakers configured. Could be a bug, or it could be just a cosmetic glitch in the UI. Again, the real question is whether the NONE and DTS 5.1 displays are actually DOING anything in this case, and if so, is anything different happening between the two.
--Bob
post #15580 of 16451
Hello all,
I did some more comparisons with my Oppo set to Bitstream and LPCM, through my MRX700. I compared different movies each from different Movie Studios. It seams like Disney's 7.1 BRs with DTS Master Audio work the way they should by down mixing a 7.1 HD to 5.1 HD. I compared the sound to LPCM, and they were pretty identical. But when I compared Oblivion (Universal studios),
The LPCM mix was far superior to the Bitstream version.
post #15581 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCoolJesus View Post

Changing a 7.1 DTS-HD MA movie from DTS 5.1 to None under the Audio button will cause the change to stick until you either turn off the MRX OR access the main setup menu on the MRX. Either of those actions cause the "issue" to start all over (i.e. - you must select None from the Audio button in order for the audio output to say DTS-HD MSTR).

That's intentional. Check your listening mode presets in the setup menu. Set it to Last Used to make the last on-the-fly selection stick, otherwise select your preferred mode, even if None, if you want that one every time aside from temporary on the fly changes.

sorry, missed the first picture (and battling a very slow connection here)... just saw that DTS 5.1 is already set to None. Head-scratcher.
Edited by Nick @ Anthem - 10/2/13 at 2:00pm
post #15582 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

but again that makes no sense when the input already includes more channels than you have speakers configured.

except that you can make the selection even though the DSP ignores it when there aren't enough speakers. Was always the case in all our products. I'm getting the feeling that not all users are exploring listening mode presets in the setup menu, and that's one factor in all this sudden consciousness over what's displayed.
post #15583 of 16451
Well, I am glad that you guys are seeing this too. FYI, Nick I read the manual and some explanations/features are confusing or never addressed. I still continues to believe that this is the best AVR on the market. Thank you for addressing some of our questions.
post #15584 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thucydes View Post

Does anyone know if the new ARC 1M in the new MRX line can process a signal natively up to 96khz or does it down-sample to 48k Samples/Sec?

Depends on how much processing is going on. The more there is, the more likely it'll switch to 48, for example when turning on Dolby Volume.
post #15585 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Yeah, sounds screwy to me. What's showing as DTS 5.1 may actually mean NEO:6 processing is engaged, but again that makes no sense when the input already includes more channels than you have speakers configured. Could be a bug, or it could be just a cosmetic glitch in the UI. Again, the real question is whether the NONE and DTS 5.1 displays are actually DOING anything in this case, and if so, is anything different happening between the two.
--Bob

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post

That's intentional. Check your listening mode presets in the setup menu. Set it to Last Used to make the last on-the-fly selection stick, otherwise select your preferred mode, even if None, if you want that one every time aside from temporary on the fly changes.

sorry, missed the first picture (and battling a very slow connection here)... just saw that DTS 5.1 is already set to None. Head-scratcher.

Yea. Weird/screwy indeed. I'm going to go the ignorant route and just trust that everything is doing what it should. Saves time (and sanity)

If I had to make a guess, I would go agree with Bob's reasoning as to why it is saying 5.1 DTS (though not sure why it doesn't do the same with 7.1 to 5.1 Dolby TrueHD, but that is a completely different audio company/process so who knows)
post #15586 of 16451
Thanks for replying Nick,

So if you have just ARC enabled (no other processing) and are listening to say a 96khz stereo FLAC file through PCM it should process it natively and not down-sample? My understanding of the existing mrx x00 models was that with ARC enabled it couldn't process 96khz natively.

If so that is a noteworthy upgrade and makes the new mrx x10 models closer in line with your big boy D2v, AVM processor's abilities.
post #15587 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post

because HDMI 1.4 passes 4K, and as of a couple of years ago HDMI does not permit manufacturers to talk in terms of version number, but only supported features. That's how it always should have been because when v1.2 and v1.3 appeared consumers all over presumed that all optional features were standard, and all they looked for on a spec sheet was the version number which can lead to disappointment.

My understanding is that HDMI 1.4 does not pass 4K at 60HZ (fps) .............. so a blanket statement by manufacturer's ..............saying their product can pass 4K signals appears to be untrue.....the claim should include the caveat ........"but, will not pass a 4K 60HZ signal". That part seems to be for the customer to find out on their own later. I am interested in improved video and 4K, but only see myself using it in the form of a new disc system. I don't think I am interested in streaming it or anything........so I am concerned with switching ability.

"because HDMI 1.4 passes 4K"....................your statement is the same thing "Brian" was saying........it frankly seems misleading. Maybe there is something I am not understanding......but I have read that there will be 60HZ content with a 4K disc system.
post #15588 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post

I don't know a quick way of determining which movie does what except by comparing action scenes using different settings. Dolby Volume has been my go-to since it appeared since it's predictable and works on everything (when needed).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post

press Mode then up/down

Nice addition, quicker to change on the fly, less menu navigation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post

gen 1 - yes, leveler is a global setting

gen 2 - leveler is set per-input

Dolby Volume does two things - adjust dynamic range, and perform loudness compensation. I don't have a manual page reference handy but I'm sure it's all explained, with more info on Dolby's site. In summary it's like the old loudness curves (search Fletcher-Munson, when has to do with declining sensitivity of our hearing to some frequencies more than others as level drops) except that it has gone hi-tech with volume control setting as well as input signal being factors in amount of compensation.

also:

There are two kinds of DRC. The newer one is Dolby Volume and it applies to any kind of input. Initial reaction was negative but that's because defaulting to highest setting was required. I think it's great for late night TV when leveler is set on 5. In practice, the original kind works on DD 5.1 movies and TrueHD may enable it behind the scenes.

Thanks, I'll read Dolby's website to educate myself on this functionality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post

This is appreciated and normally I would look into it but as the gen1 has been discontinued I would ask that tech support be contacted for setup/operation help for matters like this. I don't have time nor resource for revisiting previously completed product unless there's a major issue. I believe that the new UI and manual are already clearer and more streamlined... time will tell of course.

No problem, I was just highlighting some anomalies in the old user manual.
Hopefully the new manual will be clearer/easier to follow, I'll have a MRX510 in few weeks to try out.

thanks for all your replies, appreciate it.
post #15589 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by JKR1963 View Post

so a blanket statement by manufacturer's ..............saying their product can pass 4K signals appears to be untrue..... Maybe there is something I am not understanding......but I have read that there will be 60HZ content with a 4K disc system.

4K and 4K60 are two different things. So-called 4K came first and was never a blanket term covering something that hadn't appeared yet. It always meant 24 or 30 Hz. Now that there's 60 Hz, everywhere I look the distinction is made by saying 4K60 not 4K. You might want to do a seach of other "4K" products (not "4K60") to see whether 60 Hz is in their specs.
post #15590 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thucydes View Post

So if you have just ARC enabled (no other processing) and are listening to say a 96khz stereo FLAC file through PCM it should process it natively and not down-sample?

Sorry I don't have enough details about conditions involved, so for now the answer is "48k or better". As well, these things may change over time. The idea is to run the DSP without running out of power resulting in pops or dropouts. That's when things need to get turned down.
post #15591 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post

4K and 4K60 are two different things. So-called 4K came first and was never a blanket term covering something that hadn't appeared yet. It always meant 24 or 30 Hz. Now that there's 60 Hz, everywhere I look the distinction is made by saying 4K60 not 4K. You might want to do a seach of other "4K" products (not "4K60") to see whether 60 Hz is in their specs.

I know fully well that other manufacturer's are discussing it in the same way as you are (Onkyo etc.). 4K is a new format and the 4K Refers to the number of pixels and line's of vertical and horizontal resolution does it not?

4K can obviously have different frame rates...........24, 30, or 60 .............4K 60 is one of the possibilities in the 4K format, not a different new format. So for any company to claim that their unit passes a 4K signal in not completely true. I wish Anthem would have waited for HDMI 2.0 (a few of the Display Port Inputs might not be a bad idea ... if it looked like they may be needed?).

I was interested in the 710 and may still be .......... it is up to my judgement to determine if I may need HDMI 2.0 or not during the potential ownership period of the 710. This will, for me, be likely to be determined when I hear if a new Blu ray spec with 4K capability ........and player's and disc's will be coming or not....I think they have been working it out and we will likely know in the next 6 month's or less.
post #15592 of 16451
4k is a stupid name and no consumer equipment is claiming to support real 4k which is a pro format. In the consumer world it is not 4096 pixels. It is simply 2160p and that is all the manufacturers should be claiming. Frame rate will be 23.976 Hz most of the time.

Why do you think you need 4k @ 60 Hz transmission anyway?
post #15593 of 16451
Taking a tangent from all the 7.1/5.1 conversations, what happens if you only have 3.1? I was assuming that with "None" selected, all the extra channels from 5.1 & 7.1 would be redirected to my FL & FR. Correct? Otherwise, I have been blissfully ignorant for the past 3 years...
post #15594 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by nw06 View Post

Taking a tangent from all the 7.1/5.1 conversations, what happens if you only have 3.1? I was assuming that with "None" selected, all the extra channels from 5.1 & 7.1 would be redirected to my FL & FR. Correct? Otherwise, I have been blissfully ignorant for the past 3 years...
You are correct.
post #15595 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCoolJesus View Post


Yea. Weird/screwy indeed. I'm going to go the ignorant route and just trust that everything is doing what it should. Saves time (and sanity)

If I had to make a guess, I would go agree with Bob's reasoning as to why it is saying 5.1 DTS (though not sure why it doesn't do the same with 7.1 to 5.1 Dolby TrueHD, but that is a completely different audio company/process so who knows)
I'm not sure neo:6 is being engaged because on a 7.1 system neo:6 uses the back speakers. For me when it defaults to DTS.5.1 with 7.1 DTS-HD MA my back speakers are automatically turned off. Then when I set it to None they are back on again. If Neo:6 was being engaged the the back speakers wouldn't turn off would they? On a 7.1 system you really need to check it each time because you could watch a movie thinking your back speakers are on when they are actually off because it defaulted to DTS 5.1.
post #15596 of 16451
I just built some DIY speaker kits (SEOS Tempests) and ran ARC. Here are my charts and trims.


Tempest ARC.jpg 155k .jpg file

Tempest ARC2.jpg 154k .jpg file

Tempest ARC3.jpg 148k .jpg file

Trims:

FRONT LEFT = 0
CENTER = 0
FRONT RIGHT = -1
SURROUND RIGHT = 0
SURROUND LEFT = +1
SUB = 0

Thanks
atabea
Edited by atabea - 10/2/13 at 6:06pm
post #15597 of 16451
Hi atabea, could you post your target window too? Thanks
post #15598 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Legairre View Post

Hi atabea, could you post your target window too? Thanks

Targets window added. Also, I am running the subs "flat"

thanks
atabea
post #15599 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVfile View Post

4k is a stupid name and no consumer equipment is claiming to support real 4k which is a pro format. In the consumer world it is not 4096 pixels. It is simply 2160p and that is all the manufacturers should be claiming. Frame rate will be 23.976 Hz most of the time.

Why do you think you need 4k @ 60 Hz transmission anyway?

What it actually is, or if it is being named accurately is not what is relevant.........is it? There is the possibility of modification of the Blu ray standard to include an "improved and upgraded" signal vs 1080p (whether it is named 4K, UHD or whatever). This is what I am concerned about........apparently lots of tv shows would be 60HZ (fps)............

Why do you think HDMI 2.0 was developed.........for no good reason to mess with us?
post #15600 of 16451
Quote:
Originally Posted by atabea View Post

Targets window added. Also, I am running the subs "flat"

thanks
atabea
Sub is at 120Hz and your fronts, center and surrounds all go nice and low. All your graphs look really good. Your sub is flat until just below 20Hz so you have the crossover bypass engaged and running as flat. If I had any comments it would be that your fronts have a spike around 40-50Hz but that's probably due to placement near a boundary. You're system looks really good to me and if your speakers sound as good as they graph you build a mean speaker. Nice work cool.gif. Really nice work cool.gif
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