or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Speakers › **Official Ascend Acoustics Tower Thread**
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

**Official Ascend Acoustics Tower Thread** - Page 8

post #211 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by malaplace View Post

Or a Salk owner haha...

why would we care
post #212 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascend View Post

Chu, you mean after all this time you still haven't joined our little forum?

I have found that by limiting certain access to forum members only, spam is greatly reduced. Also, we have had issues in the past where a picture from our forum (with a large file size) was used somewhere else on a high traffic site without our permission. It was being referenced such that our server was "serving" the picture and this caused serious bandwidth issues and forum problems as the forum can only support so many connections at one time. Limiting access as we do is a necessary evil, at least until we can find a solution.



That makes me sad, posting a picture of this finish option in a thread dedicated to this speaker is important information to share with those interested in the speaker. Pictures of various finish options for many brands of loudspeakers are posted on this forum every day. This is not vaporware, this pair of speakers is being picked up by the customer in about 3 hours.

I will be sad to say goodbye to this pair -- pictures don't do them justice. I will try to take some decent pictures later today before we say goodbye to them.

it is sad they took pictures down, and being a member of most forums is required to view pictures and search. It is a little annoying when your just hitting a link to see a picture.
post #213 of 1484
[quote=Nuance;20832321
Dave, is that the RAAL ribbon?

P.S. Don't forget that the limited horizontal dispersion of a ribbon helps with ceiling/floor reflections, and that is a good thing. I'll take a properly integrated, quality ribbon any day.[/QUOTE]
I think that depends on the situation...

Let's add that the limited horizontal dispersion also limits the sweet spot in that direction as well.

Nuance...it is buried in the Ascend forum, but here are a couple of posts from Dave about the RAAL ribbon that Tower uses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davef View Post

We have been working with Aleksandar Radisavljevic for some time now with regard to offering our customers our own custom version of what is widely considered to be the best ribbon tweeter available... This is a 20mm wide ribbon with an Amorphous core transformer and the combination of this RT with the dedicated mid of the Sierra Tower is remarkable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davef View Post

I should mention this tweeter is being made for us by RAAL and is based on their OEM only 70-20XR model with an Amorphous core transformer. It is, in my opinion, a considerable step up from the Raal 70-10D, having twice the ribbon area. It is an extremely robust and dynamic ribbon tweeter.
post #214 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Really? That's pretty pathetic that someone would do that. Why not have someone besides yourself post the pictures? That way they cannot be accused of "marketing."

I wonder if me being a moderator is the reason. Then again, I think it takes someone to complain as well.
post #215 of 1484
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

I'm always around but choose to ignore the tasteless pot shots.

There is a general misnomer about ribbons tweeters that seems to be running rampant in this thread (and another). Their horizontal dispersion is actually quite good, though it will depend on the quality of the driver, size and implementation. The vertical dispersion will not be as nice as a quality dome, due to the shape and size of the driver, but most people listen sitting down instead of standing, so... A well implemented quality dome should have better overall dispersion, but in my opinion it isn't as resolving, and some quality ribbons can actually be crossed lower than a typical dome (this is also a general misunderstanding, as I've seen it said they all have to be crossed higher than a dome), thus allowing for a fuller sounding midrange (more accurate IMO). No one wants a thin midrange. Driver design is just like speaker design in that there are tradeoffs. Having the option to choose is certainly better than be limited to one option. If you like a dome - great. If you want to try a ribbon - cool. The important thing is that said driver(s) are implemented correctly, and considering Dave knows what he's doing I think you guys are a good shape.

Dave, is that the RAAL ribbon?

P.S. Don't forget that the limited horizontal dispersion of a ribbon helps with ceiling/floor reflections, and that is a good thing. I'll take a properly integrated, quality ribbon any day.

Just having a little fun
On a related note, I was contemplating trying out the RAAL in my Towers but once you modify the cabinet for the Tweeter cutout(slight nip/tuck) one cannot go back to the Domes. At this point(after the crossover mod) i am even more pleased with the current sound they offer. Hopefully we can put together another fall GTG so you boys can hear the newest version and for us to meet up again.
post #216 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

I think that depends on the situation...

Let's add that the limited horizontal dispersion also limits the sweet spot in that direction as well.

Nuance...it is buried in the Ascend forum, but here are a couple of posts from Dave about the RAAL ribbon that Tower uses.

That's the thing, I wouldn't call the horizontal dispersion limited at all: just different. Actually, I would probably say the horizontal dispersion of a well implemented ribbon is very good, but the dispersion of a well implemented dome is great. It's more a case where the dome is just better rather than the ribbon being "limited." Again, trade-offs. I sit in the sweet spot and sometimes one seat over to each side, and I lose nothing. Off-axis, power handling and polar response are extremely important.

Thanks for the confirmation on the RAAL, Curtis; that should sound so sweet!


Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

I wonder if me being a moderator is the reason. Then again, I think it takes someone to complain as well.

Honestly I would guess that's why. Still, whoever complained is, IMO, acting ridiculous.

Quote:
Originally Posted by merrymaid520 View Post

Just having a little fun
On a related note, I was contemplating trying out the RAAL in my Towers but once you modify the cabinet for the Tweeter cutout(slight nip/tuck) one cannot go back to the Domes. At this point(after the crossover mod) i am even more pleased with the current sound they offer. Hopefully we can put together another fall GTG so you boys can hear the newest version and for us to meet up again.

I know you were; my comment wasn't directed at you bud.

A Fall GTG sounds great. I look forward to hearing the v2 Ascend Tower.
post #217 of 1484
Maybe the dispersion is not such a big deal if you're one of the little people.
post #218 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

I wonder if me being a moderator is the reason. Then again, I think it takes someone to complain as well.

I'm a member of the Ascend forum-want me to try to upload the pics and see what happens?
post #219 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by holt7153 View Post


I'm a member of the Ascend forum-want me to try to upload the pics and see what happens?

Nothing should happen, but yes, go for it.
post #220 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

That's the thing, I wouldn't call the horizontal dispersion limited at all: just different. Actually, I would probably say the horizontal dispersion of a well implemented ribbon is very good, but the dispersion of a well implemented dome is great. It's more a case where the dome is just better rather than the ribbon being "limited." Again, trade-offs. I sit in the sweet spot and sometimes one seat over to each side, and I lose nothing. Off-axis, power handling and polar response are extremely important.

Yeah...I'd like to compare the dome and ribbon version. The dome version's imaging was excellent from where ever you sat/stood.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

A Fall GTG sounds great. I look forward to hearing the v2 Ascend Tower.

I wouldn't call it a V2 since merrymaid's was not a production model. In any case, would like to read your impressions.
post #221 of 1484
post #222 of 1484
Looking forward to Dave's pics with a real camera rather than an iPhone.
post #223 of 1484
One reason for the assumption that horizontal dispersion is limited in a ribbon is that almost every pure ribbon tweeter requires a high crossover point. Using a high crossover point means that the driver that is producing the mids (most often a woofer), must now also be crossed over higher to compensate. Since woofers start to beam as you get higher in frequency (depending on the size of the woofer), it is the woofer that becomes dispersion limited, such that the upper mids / lower high-frequency range drop-off quickly off axis. This is often a serious performance hindrance because the ribbon will have wide horizontal dispersion while the woofer will have limited dispersion where their frequency range overlaps.

However, the ribbon we are using can be crossed low without issue, thus if implemented properly, the problem I mentioned above is resolved.

The width of the ribbon itself, combined with faceplate integration and style determines the horizontal dispersion characteristics. A 20mm wide ribbon (which is what we are using) will have more limited horizontal dispersion compared to a more typical 10 or 8mm wide ribbon. However, the benefits of the larger width far outweigh having more directional horizontal dispersion, which depending on the room -- is not necessarily a bad thing.

Our dome is certainly more suited to fill a room with sound, however, there is a level of smoothness, transparency, warmth and detail with the RAAL that surpasses any dome and also any other ribbon I have experience with.

Many have asked if I think it is worth the price -- for some the answer is definitely a YES, to others, it is NO -- it all depends on one's usage and I would recommend discussing with me directly.

For example, we had a demo yesterday where the customer was directly comparing the ribbon version to the dome. For some material he preferred the ribbon, for other material he preferred the dome.
post #224 of 1484

Minor correction --

This is our satin espresso finish, not high gloss dark cherry.
post #225 of 1484
That was a fantastic post, Dave - thank you.

I agree: with heavier music like Metallica or Dream Theater the differences between the dome and ribbon become less apparent. But when listening to Keiko Matsui or something like the drum demo track off the Focal Demo CD (#4 I think), the ribbon is oh so sweet. I love how accurate metallic instruments are, especially symbols and high hats; the sheen ad glimmer is awesome.

I highly recommend at least listening to the ribbon version if you have such opportunity. You know Dave is going to do a fine job with it.

Brandon, I'll be curious to see if you stay with the dome or move to the ribbon. Either way, as long as you're happy nothing else matters.

P.S. The speakers look great! Thanks for the pics, holt.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

I wouldn't call it a V2 since merrymaid's was not a production model. In any case, would like to read your impressions.

My fault, Curtis. Sorry about that.
post #226 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascend View Post

Minor correction --

This is our satin espresso finish, not high gloss dark cherry.

Oops, sorry about that. I tried to edit the header but it won't let me
post #227 of 1484
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Brandon, I'll be curious to see if you stay with the dome or move to the ribbon. Either way, as long as you're happy nothing else matters.

.

Nuance,
If all goes as planned, Erin and I are hoping to build in the spring. With a new room etc, I would hate to make any changes in my setup until I am settled in. I have lots of layout ideas to benefit our living room area sound wise without sacrificing WAF. So for now the Dome Towers will stay and if I feel the need to try the RAAL, I will then.
post #228 of 1484
Since I haven't been able to find it on the website - can anyone tell me what the pricing is going to be on these towers with the RAAL 70-20XR ribbons....

Also, have any designs been laid out for a CC in with those same components...?

Thank you....
post #229 of 1484
Hi Warp!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Since I haven't been able to find it on the website - can anyone tell me what the pricing is going to be on these towers with the RAAL 70-20XR ribbons....

Right now, the ribbon upgrade is $350 per speaker ($700/pair). However, due to the fall of the dollar against the Euro, pricing is going up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Also, have any designs been laid out for a CC in with those same components...?

Yes, matching center is in the works. More info regarding this can be found on our forum.
post #230 of 1484
I want these speakers, but have Energy RC's all around. Rc50 mains, RC-LCR center, RC-10 surrounds.

Would these sort of match up for movies? And more importantly, sound much better then the RC-50's for music? Thanks
post #231 of 1484
Any ideas on what these new towers will be priced at? Will there be a matching center channel?
post #232 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascend View Post

Hi Warp!



Right now, the ribbon upgrade is $350 per speaker ($700/pair). However, due to the fall of the dollar against the Euro, pricing is going up



Yes, matching center is in the works. More info regarding this can be found on our forum.


Thank you Dave.....

Appreciate it...
post #233 of 1484
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by drewTT View Post

Any ideas on what these new towers will be priced at? Will there be a matching center channel?

Depending on finish, the base ones start out around $1899 and for true Piano black they jump up to $2600. The RAAL upgrade is $700/pair per Dave's post above. The center channel is in development and I don't believe its been priced yet, but my rudimentary arithmetic comes up with roughly half of $1900
post #234 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by merrymaid520 View Post

Depending on finish, the base ones start out around $1899 and for true Piano black they jump up to $2600. The RAAL upgrade is $700/pair per Dave's post above. The center channel is in development and I don't believe its been priced yet, but my rudimentary arithmetic comes up with roughly half of $1900

Thanks. Will need to compare these with the new Polk LSiM 705 towers. Priced pretty close.
post #235 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by merrymaid520 View Post


Depending on finish, the base ones start out around $1899 and for true Piano black they jump up to $2600. The RAAL upgrade is $700/pair per Dave's post above. The center channel is in development and I don't believe its been priced yet, but my rudimentary arithmetic comes up with roughly half of $1900

Piano black is now a $950 upgrade option if I understood Dave's last communication. So 1899 + 950
post #236 of 1484
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

Piano black is now a $950 upgrade option if I understood Dave's last communication. So 1899 + 950

You are probably correct. Mine were done so long ago and I had heard prices may go up due to small batches. Thanks for clarifying.
post #237 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by merrymaid520 View Post


You are probably correct. Mine were done so long ago and I had heard prices may go up due to small batches. Thanks for clarifying.

No problems..I only know as I just asked to switch preorder options and was sadly disappointed at the increase. Especially after seeing the Les beautifully reflecting off that finish..
post #238 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

Piano black is now a $950 upgrade option if I understood Dave's last communication. So 1899 + 950

Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

No problems..I only know as I just asked to switch preorder options and was sadly disappointed at the increase. Especially after seeing the Les beautifully reflecting off that finish..

Sadly, that $950 price is our cost on the finish, not even a cent of profit

At this point, it does not make much sense to build a true hand rubbed piano black full bamboo enclosure here in the US. We will continue to offer the option but I am not confident that we can maintain that $950 upgrade price as there is a ton of additional handling involved in this particular finish. I believe Jim Salk offers this option for $1800/pair on the Song Towers and when we factor in all the additional handling and packaging needs, we should be charging a similar price and most likely will be in the very near future. It just can't be done (the right way) for less money here in the USA.
post #239 of 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peen View Post

I want these speakers, but have Energy RC's all around. Rc50 mains, RC-LCR center, RC-10 surrounds.

Would these sort of match up for movies? And more importantly, sound much better then the RC-50's for music? Thanks

The standard Sierra-1 is much more resolving than the RC70 for music. The RC70 has more bass, of course. I would bet good money that the Sierra Tower is a much better speaker than the RC50.
post #240 of 1484
Sounds like you have heard them both. Would it sound bad to have the Sierra towers and Energy center and surrounds you think?

Also, how much extra would the Satin Espresso be? Thanks
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Speakers
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Speakers › **Official Ascend Acoustics Tower Thread**