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Hey guys...we need a little rallying here... - Page 213

post #6361 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

One person actually said I ruined their son's Christmas. Whether it was true or not, it really stunk to get that email. rolleyes.gif

I'm mostly a lurker, but have a suggestion. The beginning of the web site could start with a disclaimer, e.g.

This is a not a business, but a bunch of folks pooling their resources allow the DIY community to put together some of the best speakers in the world at an affordable cost. It looks like a store, but when you place an order, you are not buying an object, you are contributing to the DIY community. This means that there is no middleman or accountant to skim some money off every transaction, but the tradeoff is that you may have to wait longer than a day (or a week) to get your order.

A click-through link on the order form with a similar statement might be a good idea. Will it scare some folks off? Sure, but these are the ones that will email you every day about their order. I will only email every couple of weeks smile.gif. You can always change this if it turns into a business.

Patiently awaiting my order...

John
post #6362 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsgjsg View Post

I'm mostly a lurker, but have a suggestion. The beginning of the web site could start with a disclaimer, e.g.
This is a not a business, but a bunch of folks pooling their resources allow the DIY community to put together some of the best speakers in the world at an affordable cost. It looks like a store, but when you place an order, you are not buying an object, you are contributing to the DIY community. This means that there is no middleman or accountant to skim some money off every transaction, but the tradeoff is that you may have to wait longer than a day (or a week) to get your order.
A click-through link on the order form with a similar statement might be a good idea. Will it scare some folks off? Sure, but these are the ones that will email you every day about their order. I will only email every couple of weeks smile.gif. You can always change this if it turns into a business.
Patiently awaiting my order...
John

nah he needs to sell as much stuff as possible to buy more fun things. he also needs to turn a profit b/c they will kick him out of the business tax club and into a hobby zone which he absolutely doesn't want to be in.
post #6363 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

It would be great if each designer had their own 'series'. But in this situation no one designer is sticking with a certain pricing structure or brand of woofers.
The designers still get credit for their work on the speakers page and they can name each speaker if they want. Now If I was running this like a company, then yes it would be very simple. Pick the designer people think is best and price ALL of his work for the Elite Series regardless of the actual component costs. But obviously that's not what's going to happen.
I'm just trying to simplify it for people that don't follow these things as close as others do. We can't clump 20 designs together with all different names or woofer brands and hope the average Joe can decide. The average Joe would then send an email asking me to explain why the Faital Pro woofer would cost him $40 more than the Eminence, but the end speaker price is the same...."Does this mean that the Eminence is a better speaker because the crossover components must cost more?" No one asked that question, just an example. biggrin.gif
Virtually every company I can think of would divide things into categories, sort of based on price. Granted that some of these mid priced designs could be better than the high cost series simply because JBL prices their woofer twice as much without twice the performance. But I'm just not sure how else to do this so the general public isn't lost.
Lately I'm getting a lot more emails. I try to answer as many as I can, but it's beginning to cause back ups, so I'm hoping to get some of that solved. No matter what I write on the website's home page, most people have no idea that this isn't some larger company with 10+ employees. The past couple weeks really bothered me because there were people that ordered Overnight Sensations and other small kits about 3-4 days before Christmas. Some were highly upset that they did not receive them for their husband, son, friend, etc. One person actually said I ruined their son's Christmas. Whether it was true or not, it really stunk to get that email. rolleyes.gif

Your approach is very sound (pun not intended). The more I've thought about it, this is much like the "cross tab" approach we discussed for the web site. If you remember, we discussed having use (HT, Music) and price/performance (budget, elite) categories and also the designer products can be slotted in the appropriate category/brand. For example, Bill's designs can show up in the budget line and the elite line. You can also search all of Bill's designs.

Sorry for taking you down a tangent. As usual, you have thought this through.
post #6364 of 9847
I've always like the BMW naming conventions, simple and easy to understand.

So, to apply to the SEOS designs, it would goes something like this.

10-10WS, 10-10WL, 10-10WU (10" SEOS; 10W = 10" Woofer)
12-12WS, 12-12WL, 12-12WU (12" SEOS; 12W = 12" Woofer)
12-15WS, 12-15WL, 12-15WU (12" SEOS; 15W= 15" Woofer)

S=Standard; budget woofer;
L=Deluxe; mid range woofer
U=Ultra, expensive woofer

The preceding 10 and 12 in each model names indicate the waveguide used.
post #6365 of 9847
Erich,
Just sent you a PM
post #6366 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

I've always like the BMW naming conventions, simple and easy to understand.
So, to apply to the SEOS designs, it would goes something like this.
10-10WS, 10-10WL, 10-10WU (10" SEOS; 10W = 10" Woofer)
12-12WS, 12-12WL, 12-12WU (12" SEOS; 12W = 12" Woofer)
12-15WS, 12-15WL, 12-15WU (12" SEOS; 15W= 15" Woofer)
S=Standard; budget woofer;
L=Deluxe; mid range woofer
U=Ultra, expensive woofer
The preceding 10 and 12 in each model names indicate the waveguide used.

That sounds like a good scheme to me. Use that along with the 'deluxiness' series names Erich came up with, the names make them easier to talk about, the model numbers describe what's in it. If there are multiple similar ones that meet the same description (or later revisions), follow, the numbers with a,b,c etc. or 1,2,3 etc.
post #6367 of 9847
A quick diversion - latest update photo for Big-Mal.
Notes: added the round-overs, sealed exposed edges w 50/50 mix of glue/water.
Today is water based primer and flat black base coat (final finish will be Duratex)
post #6368 of 9847
You don't need a primer with Duratex.
post #6369 of 9847
Crossover looking good cuzed2. Load those drivers and test it! smile.gif
post #6370 of 9847
Face2,
Thanks - This is just temporary (and WAF ) until my LRs are done.
post #6371 of 9847
RB,
Stay tuned - I am juggling multiple post-Xmas projects...
wink.gif
post #6372 of 9847
I must be the only one but I plan to veneer mine, anyone have any good links to tutorial/threads on veneering a speaker ?
post #6373 of 9847
I had pretty good luck using the iron on with PVA glue method on the TLAHs I built, but I can't remember where I read up about it. Basically you use plain veneer (no paper backing), paint a couple coats of PVA glue (Titebond) on both the veneer and the surface to be veneered, let it dry, align the veneer, and iron it on with a hot iron with a piece of brown paper between the iron and veneer (keeps veneer from burning). Takes some patience, but worked OK for me. Would love to have a vacuum press, but don't do enough veneering to make it worth it.

A great place to learn about veneering and wood finishing is PassingInterest / DustyShopfloor's speaker builds.
post #6374 of 9847
What order do the sheets go on ? I have found a good generic veneering tutorials, but I would like something speaker specific. My concerns is how to get the edges right.
post #6375 of 9847
The grid idea with the components listed makes good sense to tell relative quality of components.

This is what was done with the evonowaves and worked well.

IMO components, measurements, and specs etc are as much indication as anyone will get about performance from reading. The eloquent descriptions are really helpful too.

Seperate them into good, better, and best if necessary, i know what means without having to look it up.

Happy New Years boys make some saw dust!
post #6376 of 9847
How about separating them into driver size first. Then level 1 2 and 3?
post #6377 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by brian6751 View Post

How about separating them into driver size first. Then level 1 2 and 3?

Another option would be separate by function.

For example, on-wall vs. freestanding, "full range" vs. limited-LF

While it's cool to have all of these different people contributing interesting designs and often sharing their thought processes with the community, I suspect eventually it will make sense to edit them down to one or two per function.
post #6378 of 9847
This reminds me of an effort to herd cats...that didn't go very well either. biggrin.gif
post #6379 of 9847
At one point it was discussed about selling precut diffused kits and then we would assemble them.


Is this still happening?
post #6380 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by stgdz View Post

At one point it was discussed about selling precut diffused kits and then we would assemble them.
Is this still happening?

There was never a definite design made up. If someone lets me know exactly how they should be done, I will send the info to the CNC company.
post #6381 of 9847
Hi Eric, I'm going to get a Malcom but I see it's listed as out of stock. Should I go ahead and "order" one from your site? Or should I just order the front baffle. I don't mind waiting if you are just collecting enough orders to make it efficient to kit some up. I'm going to get some Tempests to get the stereo setup going then I can add the center later.
On another topic, what do you all think of the various folded horn subs out there? We are all clearly horn enthusiasts smile.gif so seems like a folded horn sub would be a good fit (at least for a HT setup). I'm planning on running the Tempests alone for music listening. Have been looking at inexpensive knife switches as an easy way to switch between HT receiver and stereo amp/pre-amp.
post #6382 of 9847
The original Malcolm is a pretty expensive speaker due to it's crossover. I wasn't sure how much interest there would be due to it's cost, so I figured the kit would be done later. I do have the baffles though. You can buy all the other parts from PE if you wanted to go that route.

The model using 4 of the the 6" woofers is cheaper because they're a buy out woofer from Parts Express.

The Tempest would work best with a subwoofer. If you plan on listening without a subwoofer, the Zephyr would be the best way to go. The issue with the larger folded horn subs is simply their size when it comes to shipping. They get very expensive.
post #6383 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post


The model using 4 of the the 6" woofers is cheaper because they're a buy out woofer from Parts Express.

which one would this be? i don't remember seeing it on the site. I was planning on eventually building a center but if you aren't going to do a kit for the Mal i may have to reconsider

how much larger is the 6" version ?
post #6384 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sibuna View Post

which one would this be? i don't remember seeing it on the site. I was planning on eventually building a center but if you aren't going to do a kit for the Mal i may have to reconsider
how much larger is the 6" version ?

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=299-030

and build thread

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1440063/diy-seos-for-ht-upgrade/60#post_22762253
post #6385 of 9847
ha Ive been following that thread i just apparently didn't look close enough. thanks

are there plans to do a kit on that one? or no.

Ill prob run phantom center for a bit anyway. im very space constrained and fitting in a center will be difficult.
I have Tempests and Delta Max 10s ordered
post #6386 of 9847
Thanks Eric, I'll price out the original MAL and make a decision. I'm space limited for center so the 4" wofs are perfect. May need to rethink some things in the HT. As far as Tempest vs Zephyr all I can say is Ahhhhhhh! Had myself convinced to go with the Tempest (I'm mostly a classic rock kind of guy and that mid bass kick sounded like just the ticket!). Gotta have a sub anyway for the HT so I may still go with the Tempest and if I need the sub for rock and roll I'll just add it.
Would also like to say thanks for all you are doing for the cause!
Gunther
post #6387 of 9847
Quote:
Originally Posted by bg40403 View Post

This reminds me of an effort to herd cats...that didn't go very well either. biggrin.gif

Not true. Cats are much easier. cool.gif
post #6388 of 9847
Wishing everyone a Happy New Years. !!
post #6389 of 9847
Yes, happy new year to all the cats out there ;>)
post #6390 of 9847
First, happy New Years to all of you... I have been following the progress of this project for several months across several of the forums that this project has been discussed on, and i think now that the kits are listed, and the flat packs are available, i am ready to make the jump and start outfitting my media room with some seos based speakers.

To that end, i wanted to reach out and get some advice on the sentinel vs the zephyr. My usage is 50/50 music (a wide range of music, blues mostly). My room is pretty small at 20x14 feet. Once the budget recovers and the bonus shows up, the plan is to build two of the dayton 18" subs to cover the low end. I am drawn to the zephyr due to (a perhaps unfounded) belief that they would perhaps be a bit better for my music, while not giving up much for my movie watching. All of the recent talk about the sentinel has me second guessing my choice. I cant be the only one that is deciding between these two, as they are priced within a few dollars of each other. What am i missing?

Thank you in advance for your advice to a total speaker building noob.
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