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Hey guys...we need a little rallying here... - Page 219

post #6541 of 7533
1/14/13 at 3:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pgwalsh View Post

we'll know soon enough it the TD12M's were included. If not, another option is to get a blank baffle and 2 cu ft box. Then you'd just need to make a few cuts etc.

It looks like the TD12M could fit in the Eminence 4012HO hole, depending on what you might need/be willing to do.

Blow-by-blow on dimensions; TD12M's dimensions in in., followed by 4012HO's in ():

Overall dia. 12.38 (12.5)
So that works if you don't mind a .06" annular gap around the TD12, or you could fill it.

Baffle hole dia.: 11.06 (11.18)
If enlarging the baffle cutout is necessary, the way I've done that is to put a roundover on the top edge, then use a pattern bit with a top bearing running on the enlarged part.
If you don’t have one I’ll send you one.

Mtg holes: .28 dia. on 11.59 dia. bolt circle (.25 dia. on 11.69 dia. bolt circle)
Might work as is; if not you could rotate the TD12M and drill new ones.

Mounting flange thickness: .65 (?)
The 4012HO flange looks like it might be a bit thicker; if you think it matters you could use washers with the screws to raise the TD12M and rope caulk to fill the gap or make a spacer

Mounting depth: 6.56 depth (5.32)
From the pic's I've seen of Erich's boxes the depth won't be an issue.
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post #6542 of 7533
1/14/13 at 3:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChopShop1 View Post

So I am psyched..my three Sentinels should be arriving anytime now! I can't wait to get these three built. I have just finished up my two single 18"subs for my family room and am ready to build the lcr. I have been holding off on the subs for the DHT becuase once I get the lcr done, and love them(which I am sure I will) I can place the order for my surround, height, width speakers and build the other subs in the while I wait for that order.

Erich was also kind enough to reach out to me and offer the slot ported version of the baffle, as there were a couple extras. I think the slots look a little more aggressive, so I was happy.

I am curious, what are some of you who have these already using to power them. Not the sentinel in particular, but similar designs. I think I'll experiment, I have some Outlaw 7500s that I was thinking about using with them, but also maybe using in the family room. If the 4520 does the trick in there, it makes it much less $$ for me to get the SEOS setup up and running. If I decide to use the Outlaws in the family room, I looked at maybe the emotiva XPR5s. I need 13 channels of amplification(lcr, rear, two sets of sides, heights and width). 3 XPRs could be had for about $5k. They have a 29db gain as opposed to the 32db of the xpa models. I figured that with such high sensitivity desings, that is a plus. Anything else out there anyone has used that you think would compare favorably for the same or less$$??

Are you going to use the 8" B&C minion kit for your surrounds heights and wides? Or are you going with something bigger?
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post #6543 of 7533
1/14/13 at 4:11pm
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post #6544 of 7533
1/14/13 at 5:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehoeft View Post

Are you going to use the 8" B&C minion kit for your surrounds heights and wides? Or are you going with something bigger?

Still trying to decide actually. I initially told Erich that I was going to use Sentinels, and he said I was out of my mind:D in a nice way of course. More so than needing the Sentinel for those, I am concerned about perfect matching, especially with the heights and wides. Erich said the Minions will be a good match, as they were designed for use together. I was concerned with the different CD and horn, but I trust that he knows better than I do. It would cost twice as much to run the Sentinels all around, and I would never use all of their potential, but I may do it anyway. The only reason I am even concidering it, is that the minions would fit soooo much better into the pillars.
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post #6545 of 7533
1/14/13 at 5:24pm
The baffles for the A&E woofers will be custom made to fit nicely.

There were some people asking about assembled crossovers. I don't really know how to that as good as other people. Plus I won't really have the spare time right now. It's not too bad ordering the parts from PE and packaging everything. But soldering things up as needed would be pretty tough at the moment.

But I have some good news. One of the forum members is going to help with preassembled crossovers for all designs. We're figuring out what terminals to to use right now, and then figure any additional costs to get that done. I think somewhere around $5 - $10 for an assembled board would be worth it. The only thing I need to figure out is shipping them.

My idea was to ship crossover parts to him, and then he can ship a box of various assembled boards back to me. So there might be some extra shipping charges involved in that. I thought about those "ship anywhere" boxes from the post office for about $6 so he could ship them out from his house to whoever orders. But that might actually be more expensive than just shipping me a bunch of assembled boards to me in one box. Plus most of these use some big parts and I doubt they'd even fit in those standard small USPS boxes. biggrin.gif

So, long story short: assembled crossovers will be an option. The terminals will add some extra money, and then we have to figure additional shipping fees. And of course I recommended the forum member should get something for his time, like $5-$10. Just guessing, but I bet we can do that for an extra $10 - $15 for a completed crossover? I'll have to add everything up.
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post #6546 of 7533
1/14/13 at 5:33pm
^^^^ love this idea. I'd be willing to pay whatever it comes out to be with assembly and shipping. Doing this really will make purchasing these kits very straight forward where ANYONE can go the DIY route. Applause to yourself and everyone with their hands in this whole project.
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post #6547 of 7533
1/14/13 at 5:54pm
Erich that sounds like a great idea.
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post #6548 of 7533
1/14/13 at 5:55pm
Screw Superman, we have Erich.
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post #6549 of 7533
1/14/13 at 6:33pm
Was thinking about when SEOS flat pack cabinets and premade crossovers were gonna come out and erichs ahead of us as always biggrin.gif

Are some crossovers more complex than others? I would probably charge slightly different prices depending on how much time it takes him to do it.

Unfortunately there is some liability here, in the "crossover actually needs to work". Is there any way to test that easily? make sure the circuit is correct? add that into the time costs as well
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post #6550 of 7533
1/14/13 at 6:51pm
Does anyone have measurements of the EOS-10? I'm pondering an RF7 clone.
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post #6551 of 7533
1/14/13 at 10:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Does anyone have measurements of the EOS-10? I'm pondering an RF7 clone.

These where taken at different times and at different levels and such, not very scientific but should give you an idea of the FR of those drivers in that waveguide.

DNA-150:



DNA-205:



DNA-350:



DNA-360:
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post #6552 of 7533
1/14/13 at 10:25pm
I'm guessing none were at 1w/1m. Do you know what drive level they were at, so I can normalize to 1w/1m? Do you have the impedance trace as well?
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post #6553 of 7533
1/14/13 at 11:28pm
mtg90, I didn't know I sent you that model. Is that the one from the Zilch kit? I can't recall if you had that one, or the model that was a little deeper.
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post #6554 of 7533
1/15/13 at 8:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

The baffles for the A&E woofers will be custom made to fit nicely. .



Awesome. Will you make it double baffle Erich?
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post #6555 of 7533
1/15/13 at 9:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

mtg90, I didn't know I sent you that model. Is that the one from the Zilch kit? I can't recall if you had that one, or the model that was a little deeper.
It has the same dimensions as what you have listed for the EOS-10, 10.25"W x 8.5"H x 5"D.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

I'm guessing none were at 1w/1m. Do you know what drive level they were at, so I can normalize to 1w/1m? Do you have the impedance trace as well?
No these were just setup and swept at whatever level I had it set to and not at 1m either, this was just a quick and dirty FR measurement. I might be able to re-test them today and get impedance measurements as well.
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post #6556 of 7533
1/15/13 at 6:47pm
VERYinterested - How do the fusion 12 and 15 compare?

Did you ever settle on a price for assembling the crossovers?

Would these designs work woth no brace and just massive thick wood like 1 3/4" or 2+"?
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post #6557 of 7533
1/15/13 at 7:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post


No these were just setup and swept at whatever level I had it set to and not at 1m either, this was just a quick and dirty FR measurement. I might be able to re-test them today and get impedance measurements as well.

That would be awesome cool.gif

I'm mostly interested in the dna 360
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post #6558 of 7533
1/16/13 at 12:56pm
Hey guys please if you could answer some questions.

I am no audio expert but I like good sound and would say I can notice small differences in quality and I am looking to take a big leap forward. My wife has given me the go ahead to build some SEOS LCR's and I am seriously looking at building the Fusion 12 Tempests but I need some help with a few questions. My current setup is utilizing all Energy C series speakers, C-300 Mains, CC-100 Center. Obviously from what I have read the SEOS should blow these out of the water however I have some setup limitations. I am in a similar boat as JAVA with a fixed Non AT screen and not a high possibility of changing that, however I can raise my screen up a bit. So I would be placing the center under the screen and could tilt it slightly upward. I am going to keep these for a long time and eventually may build another theatre with an AT screen so I want to keep all 3 LCR identical and stay away from building something like the Malcolm or "BUC". So given that my current centers tweeter is at about 17" and angled upward I just want to confirm with you guys that although maybe not ideal, having the Tempest as a center at I am guessing the horn around 24" high and tilted towards the LP and the mains on either side of the screen with the horns at seated ear level (36") that I am still going to be ok? My thinking is my current center channel is already a compromise and the Tempests horn being even closer to ear height should be less of one plus not being a horizontal speaker on top of the fact that the SEOS is superior to my current setup. What says you guys is it going to be worth it for me to do this? Below is a picture of the room.

Thanks!

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post #6559 of 7533
1/16/13 at 1:15pm
I think the SEOS speakers are going to look great in that room.

Why not build yourself an AT screen? It's pretty easy, and cheap.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1436181/110-diy-spandex-at-screen/180#post_22838027
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post #6560 of 7533
1/16/13 at 1:23pm
I agree with smokarz. It's probably not the answer you want to hear...but you did say you like good sound.
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post #6561 of 7533
1/16/13 at 1:27pm
It is possible to build the center in a shorter enclosure and sealed.
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post #6562 of 7533
1/16/13 at 2:21pm
Phantom center is cheap:) Tilting the center back ~10-15 degrees also works.
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post #6563 of 7533
1/16/13 at 3:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheezit73 View Post

Hey guys please if you could answer some questions.

I am no audio expert but I like good sound and would say I can notice small differences in quality and I am looking to take a big leap forward. My wife has given me the go ahead to build some SEOS LCR's and I am seriously looking at building the Fusion 12 Tempests but I need some help with a few questions. My current setup is utilizing all Energy C series speakers, C-300 Mains, CC-100 Center. Obviously from what I have read the SEOS should blow these out of the water however I have some setup limitations. I am in a similar boat as JAVA with a fixed Non AT screen and not a high possibility of changing that, however I can raise my screen up a bit. So I would be placing the center under the screen and could tilt it slightly upward. I am going to keep these for a long time and eventually may build another theatre with an AT screen so I want to keep all 3 LCR identical and stay away from building something like the Malcolm or "BUC". So given that my current centers tweeter is at about 17" and angled upward I just want to confirm with you guys that although maybe not ideal, having the Tempest as a center at I am guessing the horn around 24" high and tilted towards the LP and the mains on either side of the screen with the horns at seated ear level (36") that I am still going to be ok? My thinking is my current center channel is already a compromise and the Tempests horn being even closer to ear height should be less of one plus not being a horizontal speaker on top of the fact that the SEOS is superior to my current setup. What says you guys is it going to be worth it for me to do this? Below is a picture of the room.

Thanks!


I would build the center that fits well, rather than raise the screen. You may be living with this for a while, so do it right. Later if you go to an AT screen, then build a new box, new crossover and a new woofer to go with the CD and SEOS horn. It would not be a large cost to do so.
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post #6564 of 7533
1/16/13 at 4:12pm
Thanks for the responses guys!
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

I think the SEOS speakers are going to look great in that room.

Why not build yourself an AT screen? It's pretty easy, and cheap.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1436181/110-diy-spandex-at-screen/180#post_22838027

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon_B View Post

I agree with smokarz. It's probably not the answer you want to hear...but you did say you like good sound.

I took my screen down and set it on the floor about two feet into the room and ran some videos, AT "Might" be a possibility maybe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Face2 View Post

It is possible to build the center in a shorter enclosure and sealed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mobeer4don View Post

Phantom center is cheap:) Tilting the center back ~10-15 degrees also works.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

I would build the center that fits well, rather than raise the screen. You may be living with this for a while, so do it right. Later if you go to an AT screen, then build a new box, new crossover and a new woofer to go with the CD and SEOS horn. It would not be a large cost to do so.

I don't want to use a phantom as it limits the 4311's DSX processing options. Well I would only have to raise the screen two inches to fit the Tempest under. I am leaning towards trying to go AT, I get that having all the speakers on the same plane at the proper height will always be best. I guess I just want to understand a better perspective of what I would be sacrificing putting the center Tempest under the screen, is it going to be hugely messed up or just not the best but still acceptable. All other things being equal are there different issues with this type of speaker vs what I have now as far as the center channel in this placement? I guess I am thinking its not ideal now and not ideal with the Tempest but the Tempest is still better! I appreciate the opinions guys, so keep em coming and be patient with my novice-ness with these speakers!
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post #6565 of 7533
1/16/13 at 4:46pm
Cheezit73,

I'm not sure if it will help in your situation, but it was discussed earlier that the Tempest and Zephyr could be used in a smaller sealed box that was only 21" tall. Would that help out at all, or are you mostly wondering if angling them is an issue?
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post #6566 of 7533
1/16/13 at 5:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Cheezit73,

I'm not sure if it will help in your situation, but it was discussed earlier that the Tempest and Zephyr could be used in a smaller sealed box that was only 21" tall. Would that help out at all, or are you mostly wondering if angling them is an issue?

Erich I am not worried about the 26" height so much as wondering just what the effect of angling the center up and the bottom of the speaker being basically right on the floor. I am leaning more and more towards AT but if I can compromise for now by placing the as designed Tempest as a center below the screen I will.

Thanks!
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post #6567 of 7533
1/16/13 at 5:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheezit73 View Post

Erich I am not worried about the 26" height so much as wondering just what the effect of angling the center up and the bottom of the speaker being basically right on the floor. I am leaning more and more towards AT but if I can compromise for now by placing the as designed Tempest as a center below the screen I will.

Thanks!

I angled all of my mains about +5°. http://www.avsforum.com/t/1417294/seos12-2512-build/180#post_22304412

If you read back in the thread a bit you'll see my concerns about getting the tweeters up as high as my fixed screen would allow me. Ideally, I'd love to get an AT screen, but I just got a new Carada screen. The angling works fine for me.
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post #6568 of 7533
1/16/13 at 5:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

That would be awesome cool.gif

I'm mostly interested in the dna 360

I did that one in both the SEOS-12 and EOS-10

2.83V / 1M, sensitivity came in a little bit higher then I expected. Also those sweeps were LOUD, glad I had hearing protection on:

SEOS-12:


EOS-10:


Impedance graph, can get you the .zma file if you want.

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post #6569 of 7533
1/16/13 at 6:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Java View Post

I angled all of my mains about +5°. http://www.avsforum.com/t/1417294/seos12-2512-build/180#post_22304412

If you read back in the thread a bit you'll see my concerns about getting the tweeters up as high as my fixed screen would allow me. Ideally, I'd love to get an AT screen, but I just got a new Carada screen. The angling works fine for me.

Thanks for the first hand Java and your SEOS's look sweet! I think I am just going to go for it and build them and put them in the room as is for now until I can fully figure out going AT in my room! I go back and forth on having the speakers visible and hidden, I like the clean look but I think the Tempest looks really cool with it's 3 ports and would be sweet to see them out in the open as well!
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post #6570 of 7533
1/17/13 at 7:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post

I did that one in both the SEOS-12 and EOS-10

2.83V / 1M, sensitivity came in a little bit higher then I expected. Also those sweeps were LOUD, glad I had hearing protection on:

SEOS-12:


EOS-10:


Impedance graph, can get you the .zma file if you want.


Thanks!
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