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Official OPPO BDP-93 Owner's Thread - Page 862

post #25831 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

I still keep wishing one of these updates would fix this ridiculous freezing and sluggish menus, but I guess it won't ever happen, since it's been years of it.

I'm not claiming to have a solution to this, but are you possibly using a Logitech Harmony remote with the BDP-93? For the first several months that I owned my BDP-93, the menus felt painfully sluggish. I forget why I eventually used the factory remote for some small task, but when I did, I realized that the menus responded lightning fast. Repeated tests more or less confirmed that my Harmony One was the root of the sluggish response in my case. I've tried adjusting various timing settings with the Harmony, but I've still never been able to approach the response that I get with the factory remote. Despite this, I still control the BDP-93 with my Harmony.
post #25832 of 26597
I am using a harmony remote, but I do remember so many issues from before I had one. I'll ty the main remote to just see if much is different, though. I'm pretty sure at least the freezing issue would be unrelated. A lot of times the freezing happens if I am fast forwarding through a file. Sometimes, though, even the MENUS freeze.
post #25833 of 26597
I just spoke with Oppo about the blu-ray 3D playback issue I've been having that seemed to be introduced with the last firmware and it seems the engineers were able to replicate the problem on their demo so in a weird way that's good news. Now we just have to be patient for the fix to come in a future release which I'm hoping won't be too long. smile.gif
post #25834 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by IanD View Post

Do you have output set to 1080p explicity?

A vob file is usually accompanied by .ifo files in a DVD to let the player know how to handle it: it's possible that upscaling is only properly handled when playing back as proper DVD structure (which unfortunately means ISO if a file). DVDs are usually interlaced and normally played back as DVDs on the Oppo: not many media files tend to be interlaced these days and so are easier to scale.

Is playback any different if you play the vob file back as part of a DVD structure on a DVD disc? Ifoedit can recreate the DVD structure from vob files IIRC.

I do think I left out the .ifo file (didn't think I needed it) when I copied the disc. I will try it with an actual disc and see if the results are better.

Thanks for responding!
post #25835 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tangled Cable View Post

I do think I left out the .ifo file (didn't think I needed it) when I copied the disc. I will try it with an actual disc and see if the results are better.

Thanks for responding!

The player doesn't see anything in the DVD directory structure apart from the VOB files.

-Bill
post #25836 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikonf5 View Post

From what I understand, the m2ts files contain the left eye information only, and are used by themselves to play the 3D disc in 2D if the viewer chooses to, or if the display is not 3D-capable AND and only if the disc allows itself to be viewed in 2D.

That's what I thought as well, until I read an article by someone and then checked out a 3D structure to confirm it. Consequently, some of my previous posts may appear to conflict with the most recent.

In reality, ssif files contain both left eye and right eye difference information in a single interleaved file. Whilst the m2ts files generally contain 2D (left eye) information only, there is also a separate m2ts file for the right eye difference information. I confirmed with a 3D title that the left eye and right eye difference m2ts files combined were equal in size to the largest ssif file.

I'm assuming now, that when 3D playback is required, the ssif file is played, whilst if 2D playback is required, one of the m2ts files is played. Consequently, there shouldn't be rapid swapping between 2 files when playing 3D (which I had thought beforehand) unless players play 3D in a screwy fashion by using the m2ts files instead.

According to some of the forums, it is possible to stream an ssif file and decode it to 3D with the right equipment. Unfortunately the Oppo doesn't even recognise a standalone ssif file: I was hoping that like m2ts playback, it might.

If one can afford it, an ISO capable Oppo is the easiest solution to playing full backups and as has been mentioned, 3D ISO is not hugely different in size from a movie-only file. However, there are media players that will handle 3D MVC mkv playback and software that can create a movie-only 3D MVC mkv that aren't Cinavia infected and certain HTPC combinations that can play ISO ripped with SpeedMenu, so there are some future options if Oppo disappears from the equation.

I certainly will need my ISO capable Oppo pried from my cold dead hands, but it is comforting to know there are other options.

A note of concern: chipset manufacturers seem to be scaling back release of better featured media player chips. Realtek is supposedly not releasing another model after the 1186. I suspect the studios have been leveraging demands to close down remaining loopholes to unprotected playback of media and the manufacturers don't see a future. I think this will only leave a limited number of unencumbered options for media playback, including HTPC (although I understand the studios are trying to get their hooks into CPUs as well). It seems significant to me that Intel GPU have not implemented 23.976fps playback until the latest iteration and even that still hasn't fixed the colourspace expansion bug, so perfect playback of media is still compromised: I can't understand these engineering stuffups unless it was deliberately intended to cripple perfect playback all along.
post #25837 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tangled Cable View Post

I do think I left out the .ifo file (didn't think I needed it) when I copied the disc. I will try it with an actual disc and see if the results are better.

Thanks for responding!

You don't need the ifo and vts_0x_0.vob menu files if playing a standalone vob file.

I was suggesting perhaps a complete DVD structure on a DVD disc might get handled a little differently than a standalone vob file, because the ifo files in the structure contain additional information: it's worth comparing the two in playback just in case.
post #25838 of 26597
This is probably a longshot, but here goes. Several months back, I noticed that certain Blu-rays of mine would not zoom (with current firmware--they give the operation prohibited symbol). Knowing that this had been an issue with BD-Java discs in the past, I thought maybe they missed some corner case. I opened a case with Oppo, and... nothing. No resolution, still a problem. Zoom is not a very big deal for me on these discs, but maybe for someone else. It turns out AFAICT every Japanese Studio Ghibli Blu-ray has this problem, and I'm guessing Oppo doesn't act on it because they don't have a sample disc handy.

Now today suddenly it's a much bigger deal. One of those discs (not all of them), says "Operation prohibited by disc" when you try to change the audio or subtitle options using the AUDIO and SUBTITLE buttons on the remote. Not such a big deal unless you also know that apparently due to a menu authoring error, the only way to select certain languages on this disc is through the remote--i.e. the disc is actually unusable due to this issue. I filed another bug with Oppo but am not hopeful.

Now I know BD authoring allows a crazy amount of control freakery by the disc authors, but can these operations truly be blocked by the disc, or is this a sign of a player problem? Do any of our resident beta testers have access to any Japanese Studio Ghibli discs for testing?

Yeah, I know, it's a long shot...
post #25839 of 26597
^ I don't have the disc, but yes, the Blu-ray spec gives the authoring studios A LOT more control of Prevented User Operations than was true with SD-DVD for example. Fortunately, most of the studios don't abuse this power, except for trying to force people to view their preview trailers when you load the disc. In some cases the studios are using ridiculously complicated disc authoring (absurd branching structures) to try to make life more difficult for copying software, and the PUOs can keep them from also having to figure out how to actually make that silly authoring work in the face of the user trying to do some operation with the remote.

Anyway, you said you got the disc info to OPPO, so they will check it out. But it may not be "fixable" if the studio has chosen to author the disc in this fashion. Blu-ray certification tests require the player to honor PUOs, and for discs with BD-Java programming, the control of playback is actually in the hands of the on-disc program anyway.

By the way, preventing audio track or subtitle track changes using the player's pop-up menus while a Title is playing is actually fairly common because the timing is different for the track you are trying to change to. I.e., they make you do it through the disc's own menus so that the alternate playlist with the correct timing gets played. That complexity I was talking about…..
--Bob
post #25840 of 26597
Note that DVDs have a much simpler authoring language (it's too small to have a name) but even there it is possible to prohibit subtitle and audio selection with the remote buttons. You see it once in a blue moon.

-Bill
post #25841 of 26597
Thanks. I've verified elsewhere that that's actually just how the Japanese Ghibli discs are (locking zoom, and once in a while locking language controls too). PITA. But at least it's not the fault of the player. Also, FWIW, the language option I was looking for is in the menu, it's just not listed in the same place as all the other language options. Handy!
post #25842 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by CatBus View Post

Thanks. I've verified elsewhere that that's actually just how the Japanese Ghibli discs are (locking zoom, and once in a while locking language controls too). PITA. But at least it's not the fault of the player. Also, FWIW, the language option I was looking for is in the menu, it's just not listed in the same place as all the other language options. Handy!

People who make backups solve that in a way: no menus, no javascript, just a container with video, audio and subtitle tracks.

-Bill
post #25843 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

I am using a harmony remote, but I do remember so many issues from before I had one. I'll ty the main remote to just see if much is different, though. I'm pretty sure at least the freezing issue would be unrelated. A lot of times the freezing happens if I am fast forwarding through a file. Sometimes, though, even the MENUS freeze.

Luckily, I don't think that I've ever had any issues with the BDP-93 freezing. If you do get a chance to try the factory remote, though, I'd be interested in hearing the results to confirm my suspicion. If anyone else here has zeroed in on the optimal timing values for a Harmony remote with the BDP-93, I'd love to hear those as well.
post #25844 of 26597
Can anyone tell me what DAC is used in the 93 and if that same or some other DAC is used in the 103? Also, I would like to confirm that the 103 with the latest firmware CAN play DSD files. I looked at the release notes for the latest and Beta firmware and it mentions DSD in passing, but does not clearly state that downloaded (not on SACD discs) DSD can be played. I understand that the 93 will not ever be able to be upgraded to allow it to play streaming DSD files.
Thanks for your help/responses!smile.gif
post #25845 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbeemer View Post

Can anyone tell me what DAC is used in the 93 and if that same or some other DAC is used in the 103? Also, I would like to confirm that the 103 with the latest firmware CAN play DSD files. I looked at the release notes for the latest and Beta firmware and it mentions DSD in passing, but does not clearly state that downloaded (not on SACD discs) DSD can be played. I understand that the 93 will not ever be able to be upgraded to allow it to play streaming DSD files.
Thanks for your help/responses!smile.gif

Both players use the Cirrus Logic CS4382A.

The -103 plays DSD files.

-Bill
post #25846 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

Both players use the Cirrus Logic CS4382A.

The -103 plays DSD files.

-Bill
Thank you, Bill, I knew you would know the answer!biggrin.gif:D
post #25847 of 26597
Just curious but has anyone had a problem with audio dropouts on Monsters University 3D that was solved by switching from Bitstream to LPCM output similar to the Total Recall problem? Or is it just with ISO capable firmware?



Max
post #25848 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Just curious but has anyone had a problem with audio dropouts on Monsters University 3D that was solved by switching from Bitstream to LPCM output similar to the Total Recall problem? Or is it just with ISO capable firmware?



Max

Huge number of complaints about this disc, not specific to OPPO. It may be more like BRAVE, in that both titles use a large number of small M2TS files.

Did you find that LPCM works better for you on this title?

-Bill
post #25849 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Just curious but has anyone had a problem with audio dropouts on Monsters University 3D that was solved by switching from Bitstream to LPCM output similar to the Total Recall problem? Or is it just with ISO capable firmware?



Max

Huge number of complaints about this disc, not specific to OPPO. It may be more like BRAVE, in that both titles use a large number of small M2TS files.

Did you find that LPCM works better for you on this title?

-Bill
Yep, LPCM completely eliminated the issue (just as with Total Recall). These studios and their odd authoring experiments are really getting old.


Max
post #25850 of 26597
I had dropouts on Monsters U also. I ended up listening to the 2.0 track. I didn't try the lpcm method.
post #25851 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Just curious but has anyone had a problem with audio dropouts on Monsters University 3D that was solved by switching from Bitstream to LPCM output similar to the Total Recall problem? Or is it just with ISO capable firmware?



Max

As Bill mentioned, this release is FUBAR.
I actually counted all the seamless branching files, this film is made up of over 130 small files. (2D version)
The thing most surprising about this release is that it plays at all.
post #25852 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Just curious but has anyone had a problem with audio dropouts on Monsters University 3D that was solved by switching from Bitstream to LPCM output similar to the Total Recall problem? Or is it just with ISO capable firmware?



Max

As Bill mentioned, this release is FUBAR.
I actually counted all the seamless branching files, this film is made up of over 130 small files. (2D version)
The thing most surprising about this release is that it plays at all.
What the heck is wrong with these studios? I just ripped it to my hard drive array and it plays fine on LPCM. If they're trying this crap to prevent copying, it's not working. All it's doing is giving regular users grief.


Max
post #25853 of 26597
Now I finally sued Netflix for the first time on this and on my third movie it freakin froze on that too.

Also what in the WORLD is the deal with the movie having 2 channel audio rather than dolby digital or dts? How pathetic. So to stream Netflix movies, you're losing BOTH the picture quality and sound quality. Is there a setting I am missing related to audio for Netflix? I read somewhere that apparently some movies on it have surround and most don't, so I assume I was simply watching one of the many they dumbly have pcm on.
post #25854 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

Now I finally sued Netflix for the first time on this and on my third movie it freakin froze on that too.

Also what in the WORLD is the deal with the movie having 2 channel audio rather than dolby digital or dts? How pathetic. So to stream Netflix movies, you're losing BOTH the picture quality and sound quality. Is there a setting I am missing related to audio for Netflix? I read somewhere that apparently some movies on it have surround and most don't, so I assume I was simply watching one of the many they dumbly have pcm on.
BDP-93/95 will only support older Netflix interface at 720P with 2.0 Dolby stereo. The player will scale that to 1080P.
The newer BDP-103/105 offers Netflix 3.0 interface at 1080P with 5.1 Dolby Digital surround sound.
post #25855 of 26597
What sucks is I bet my TiVo will do 5.1 (haven't checked, just guessing), but then that means no 24p. This really sucks and adds to my negative opinions aboit Oppo, though. A lot of tv companies, for example, will update their tvs to work with newer interfaces EVEN IF it's a past year's model. I wonder what I could get used for the 93 if I want to buy a 103. WIll have to look at ebay and see if it's worth doing that.
post #25856 of 26597
In case I sell this, I now am hoping someone will quickly summarize all of this ISO talk. I ahev the altest firmware and my AVS disc I burned an ISO on works, so what am I misunderstanding?
post #25857 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

In case I sell this, I now am hoping someone will quickly summarize all of this ISO talk. I ahev the altest firmware and my AVS disc I burned an ISO on works, so what am I misunderstanding?

An ISO is a disc image in file form. When you burn that to optical media properly, it is no longer an ISO file, but simply DVD or Blu-ray video like any other.

That works, and is not what people mean by ISO support.

They want to maintain a collection of ISO files on a hard drive without burning them to optical media. Then browse and play them like any other media file container, except that the ISO file is an exact duplicate of the original disc.

The studios don't want you doing this which is why you can't have the feature on any sort of product that requires licensing from the Blu-ray authorities.

Which totally sucks, dude.

-Bill
post #25858 of 26597
Ah, ok, I understand now. Thanks. I think I am going to try to sell it (wish I had known not to do the firmware update, where it would maybe get more, though) and get the 103, where I will, if nothing else, get quicker response times. Any other improvements with the 103 over the 93, other than loading and remote response times, Netflix 3.0, and overall interface? I assume nothing much picture quality-wise, unless someone ahs a 4k set?
post #25859 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

Ah, ok, I understand now. Thanks. I think I am going to try to sell it (wish I had known not to do the firmware update, where it would maybe get more, though) and get the 103, where I will, if nothing else, get quicker response times. Any other improvements with the 103 over the 93, other than loading and remote response times, Netflix 3.0, and overall interface? I assume nothing much picture quality-wise, unless someone ahs a 4k set?

If you haven't been happy with the -93 I don't see why you would be happier with the -103 or -103D.

-Bill
post #25860 of 26597
Quote:
Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

What sucks is I bet my TiVo will do 5.1 (haven't checked, just guessing), but then that means no 24p. This really sucks and adds to my negative opinions aboit Oppo, though. A lot of tv companies, for example, will update their tvs to work with newer interfaces EVEN IF it's a past year's model. I wonder what I could get used for the 93 if I want to buy a 103. WIll have to look at ebay and see if it's worth doing that.

Newer TiVo's have the option of doing 1080P/24.

- Rich
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