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Official OPPO BDP-93 Owner's Thread - Page 872

post #26131 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by venkatesh_m View Post

It might be worth it to just convert the folder structure to ISO using ImageBurn to see if there are still issues.

I'm trying this now as an experiment and will report my findings (after this weekend).

Although, as I mentioned before, it's not a true test, since the sheer act of just copying the BDMV folder structure to another drive (or duplicating it on the same drive) can also result in the glitches going away. The true test will be if, after 6 months of creating ISOs from folder structures, I never see a glitch again.
post #26132 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatherom View Post

I'm trying this now as an experiment and will report my findings (after this weekend).

Although, as I mentioned before, it's not a true test, since the sheer act of just copying the BDMV folder structure to another drive (or duplicating it on the same drive) can also result in the glitches going away. The true test will be if, after 6 months of creating ISOs from folder structures, I never see a glitch again.

I'll re-recommend trying a complete wipe of the HDD, then put the affected BDMV folder on it again. See if the previously observed glitches are gone. The other thing to remember is that when a HDD is getting full, the access time increases and data rate declines. So a full HDD will always perform worse than an empty one, especially with individual files scattered all across the platter that belong in a single folder. So you're looking at data fragmentation, not file fragmentation. De-fragging only addresses file fragmentation.
post #26133 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

I'll re-recommend trying a complete wipe of the HDD, then put the affected BDMV folder on it again. See if the previously observed glitches are gone. The other thing to remember is that when a HDD is getting full, the access time increases and data rate declines. So a full HDD will always perform worse than an empty one, especially with individual files scattered all across the platter that belong in a single folder. So you're looking at data fragmentation, not file fragmentation. De-fragging only addresses file fragmentation.

Oh, definitely point taken and appreciated.

My current primary viewing drive is a 1TB passport and it is admittedly fairly full.

Here's my conundrum though...as I mentioned, even the sheer act of copying the folder structure and duplicating it *on the same drive* will cause the glitch to go away (or the glitch may move to other spots in the movie). So if I were to wipe the drive completely and put the folder structure back on there and the glitches go away, I haven't really proven that much and not really come up with a permanent solution to the problem.

The glitches I'm experiencing happen in a random spot in a film. Once present, they will happen every time (i.e. if I rewind and watch the offending segment again). But the presence of a glitch is only specific to that "instance" or "copy", if you will, of the folder structure. The moment that folder structure is copied to another drive, duplicated on the same drive, etc...the glitches either vanish or (potentially) new glitches form in other portions of the film.

I guess this is my long winded way of saying that I think my approach is going to be to ONLY use ISOs. If I never see a glitch again, I have a sure-fire solution. If I experience a glitch when using an ISO, then I may have to use a clean (or relatively) clean drive for just viewing purposes to minimize the potential of glitches happening.
post #26134 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatherom View Post

Oh, definitely point taken and appreciated.

My current primary viewing drive is a 1TB passport and it is admittedly fairly full.
.

Yes, a slow drive to start with. I'd still consider wiping it completely just to start fresh. I don't know if it will perform a bit better using a powered USB hub, but it might.
post #26135 of 26581
I sold my BDP-93 due to upgrading to the 103D.

The guy I told it to, has an Amp which doesn't have HDMI.

He has apparently connected the HDMI to his TV, and Optical to his Amp for playing his SACD's.

He says if he has HDMI and Optical connected, when he plays his SACD's he is hearing "noise" but if he disconnects the HDMI, it's gone.

Any ideas if it's possible to have both connected and not have the noise?
post #26136 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by networkn View Post

I sold my BDP-93 due to upgrading to the 103D.

The guy I told it to, has an Amp which doesn't have HDMI.

He has apparently connected the HDMI to his TV, and Optical to his Amp for playing his SACD's.

He says if he has HDMI and Optical connected, when he plays his SACD's he is hearing "noise" but if he disconnects the HDMI, it's gone.

Any ideas if it's possible to have both connected and not have the noise?

You can't send SACD audio over optical. I'm surprised he hears anything at all.
post #26137 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

You can't send SACD audio over optical. I'm surprised he hears anything at all.

What interfaces can you play SACD over?
post #26138 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by networkn View Post

What interfaces can you play SACD over?

analog and hdmi
post #26139 of 26581
For anyone copying files to a hard drive only when you need to playback, have you considered trying an SSD in a eSATA dock? Access times should be much faster and theoretically should negate any issues with slower seeking magnetic hard drives, plus also completely silent. Might even improve folder playback, but it is a fairly expensive option (although admittedly there are a number of sales on 120GB SSD at the moment).

I haven't tested this myself, but it should work.
post #26140 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by IanD View Post

For anyone copying files to a hard drive only when you need to playback, have you considered trying an SSD in a eSATA dock? Access times should be much faster and theoretically should negate any issues with slower seeking magnetic hard drives, plus also completely silent. Might even improve folder playback, but it is a fairly expensive option (although admittedly there are a number of sales on 120GB SSD at the moment).

I haven't tested this myself, but it should work.

Remember the speed of the transfer will be limited by the speed of the slower drive.
post #26141 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by networkn View Post

I sold my BDP-93 due to upgrading to the 103D.

The guy I told it to, has an Amp which doesn't have HDMI.

He has apparently connected the HDMI to his TV, and Optical to his Amp for playing his SACD's.

He says if he has HDMI and Optical connected, when he plays his SACD's he is hearing "noise" but if he disconnects the HDMI, it's gone.

Any ideas if it's possible to have both connected and not have the noise?

If he's hearing music over Optical when playing SACDs, he's probably got the 93 set to convert SACDs to PCM - and optical can carry stereo PCM.

That would also be sent to the TV over the HDMI cable - and if the TV has "audio return" active, and he's using an HDMI cable that supports it, maybe that's the source of the noise.

Just tell him to connect to his amp via analog and be done with it. My AVR is also pre-HDMI and I'm perfectly happy listening through the 93's analog output, which has superb sound.
post #26142 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post

If he's hearing music over Optical when playing SACDs, he's probably got the 93 set to convert SACDs to PCM - and optical can carry stereo PCM.
I do not think he is hearing music, he's hearing silence.

>>He says if he has HDMI and Optical connected, when he plays his SACD's he is hearing "noise" but if he disconnects the HDMI, it's gone.<<

The 93 converts DSD to 88.2/24, and that is not permissible for copy-protected SACD over open digital outputs.

The only way to hear an SACD over S/PDIF is if it is a hybrid disc and you can access the CD layer. I don't think the 93 can do that -- at least I saw no menu for that on my 93. A regular CD player will see it, though.
post #26143 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

I do not think he is hearing music, he's hearing silence.

>>He says if he has HDMI and Optical connected, when he plays his SACD's he is hearing "noise" but if he disconnects the HDMI, it's gone.<<

The 93 converts DSD to 88.2/24, and that is not permissible for copy-protected SACD over open digital outputs.

The only way to hear an SACD over S/PDIF is if it is a hybrid disc and you can access the CD layer. I don't think the 93 can do that -- at least I saw no menu for that on my 93. A regular CD player will see it, though.

Actually, Roger, the first item on the 93's Playback Setup menu is:

SACD Priority [ Multi-Channel | Stereo | CD Mode ]

So while it defaults to the SACD layer (in multichannel mode if available), it can be set to play the CD layer of a hybrid SACD.

However, if the CD layer is all that the SACD spec allows to be played over SP/DIF, that's just one more argument for using the analog outputs (and leaving it set it to play the SACD layer).

-Phil
post #26144 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post

Actually, Roger, the first item on the 93's Playback Setup menu is:

SACD Priority [ Multi-Channel | Stereo | CD Mode ]
Do'h, there it was, hiding in plain sight! I went straight to the audio menu by mistake.

Thanks, Phil!
post #26145 of 26581
So tonight I was able to do my first experiment. Used the same drive as I usually do (2TB Western Digital Elements, wall-powered), but tonight my wife and I decided to watch a movie that I have as folder structures. So I used ImgBurn to make an ISO out of it and we watched that. I thought we were golden, but during the last 10 minutes of the movie, I saw one of the glitches (slow video, normal audio, then the video "snapped" back into place). It was admittedly a small glitch, but it was definitely there. Rewound over and over (much to my wife's dismay since we were enthralled in the movie) and the glitch happened in the same spot every time.

To really do these tests, I have to watch a movie from start to finish each time. So it's gonna take me a while to gather empirical data.

My next test may be to take the suggestion of wiping these WD slower RPM drives clean and making sure they're not too full. Or, I may go right to a 7200rpm drive over eSata. If THAT still has glitches, I'll be pretty bummed, since I now own two BDP-93s and am just recently starting to experience these glitches. I hope to god it's just a simple thing like the hard drive, as some have suggested.
post #26146 of 26581
OK, I didn't do an exhaustive search of this enormous thread, but with a couple cursory searches I couldn't find anything similar.

I recently rented the 2D versions of Pixar's Planes and Monsters University. I had no problems with the audio (I saw all the posts about the audio issues). What did happen in both movies was that they would pause at every chapter, a graphic with the chapter name would pop up in the lower left corner, and then (in the case of Planes) the movie would resume after about 10 seconds. In the case of MU, the video never resumed -- it was frozen at the chapter switch -- but the audio would resume.

Any ideas? I updated the firmware on 12/6/13 with no improvement.

System:
Oppo BD-P93 via HDMI to Yamaha RX-A2020 via HDMI to Panasonic TC-P60VT60.

Thanks,
Kieran
post #26147 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kieran View Post

OK, I didn't do an exhaustive search of this enormous thread, but with a couple cursory searches I couldn't find anything similar.

I recently rented the 2D versions of Pixar's Planes and Monsters University. I had no problems with the audio (I saw all the posts about the audio issues). What did happen in both movies was that they would pause at every chapter, a graphic with the chapter name would pop up in the lower left corner, and then (in the case of Planes) the movie would resume after about 10 seconds. In the case of MU, the video never resumed -- it was frozen at the chapter switch -- but the audio would resume.

Any ideas? I updated the firmware on 12/6/13 with no improvement.

System:
Oppo BD-P93 via HDMI to Yamaha RX-A2020 via HDMI to Panasonic TC-P60VT60.

Thanks,
Kieran

We used to hear of things like that years ago, but I'm not remembering if it was even on OPPO players.

Make sure BD-Live is off, erase Persistent Storage, and turn the player off and on again.

If still no good, do the above again and also Reset Factory Defaults.

If still no good, write up the details for OPPO support and see what they say.

-Bill
post #26148 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

We used to hear of things like that years ago, but I'm not remembering if it was even on OPPO players.

Make sure BD-Live is off, erase Persistent Storage, and turn the player off and on again.

If still no good, do the above again and also Reset Factory Defaults.

If still no good, write up the details for OPPO support and see what they say.

-Bill
Thanks for the suggestions. Nothing helped, so I guess I'll call Oppo later this week. The only other thing I'm going to try first is to hook the Oppo directly to the TV, bypassing the Yamaha AVR, and see if that helps.
post #26149 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kieran View Post

Thanks for the suggestions. Nothing helped, so I guess I'll call Oppo later this week. The only other thing I'm going to try first is to hook the Oppo directly to the TV, bypassing the Yamaha AVR, and see if that helps.

That's definitely worth trying. The bad behavior sounds like an issue of java programming on the disc that the player is not handling well, but with HDMI you never know: could be some handshaking behavior from the display chain is confusing the player. Simplifying the connections is always a good diagnostic technique.

-Bill
post #26150 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kieran View Post

What did happen in both movies was that they would pause at every chapter, a graphic with the chapter name would pop up in the lower left corner, and then (in the case of Planes) the movie would resume after about 10 seconds.

Apart from coinciding with chapters, that operation sounds a lot like the special video commentaries that some titles have, where you press a remote button when a symbol appears to view a short video on the making of that scene or some other additional information. However, normally you have to activate that particular feature when playing the movie for it to work.

I will admit that I have been perplexed by some of the titles menu selection methods of late where you have options (eg Theatrical or Extended versions) that simply change the text colour of the label to identify selection. The problem is that they don't tell you whether white or blue, for example, means selected or unselected if there are only 2 options: I usually have to operate by trial and error in this situation. It would be far better if they highlight a box around the label and change the font colour to signify selection. The menu authoring policy by some of the studios is seriously not consumer-friendly.

Your experience has reminded me that the Oppo has a number of options in Setup that enable or disable various icons that appear on screen when certain things happen. I have these all disabled on my Oppo, but I wonder if having them enabled can give rise to the mentioned issue as the player perhaps pauses for a key to be pressed at the appropriate point each time. Maybe you could try disabling those notifications and see if it helps: can't do any harm.
post #26151 of 26581
So, since I don't have a ton of time to diagnose the ISO vs blu-ray folders glitch problem, I've decided to go from my USB self-powered WD passport drive to the exact opposite. smile.gif Got an eSATA dock and a Samsung 250GB SSD. This SSD drive will solely be for viewing on the Oppo. Since it's an SSD, there shouldn't be an issue with drive noise.

I'm going to start with blu-ray folders and see if the glitches go away. If not, I'll try ISOs. If there are still glitches after all of that, which I don't expect will be the case, but if there is...I guess I'll have to swallow the notion that the Oppo has some playback issues. But I suspect moving to this drive will solve the problem.

Will post my findings within a week or two.
post #26152 of 26581
Why would turning off my display either by remote or manually turn my 93 off also? I turn on my panel to set up a DVD-A and turn it off and it's shutting the Oppo off too, this has never happened before.
post #26153 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

Why would turning off my display either by remote or manually turn my 93 off also? I turn on my panel to set up a DVD-A and turn it off and it's shutting the Oppo off too, this has never happened before.

That's the function of HDMI-CEC. Turn it off in the player (and in the display, just to be sure).

-Bill
post #26154 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

That's the function of HDMI-CEC. Turn it off in the player (and in the display, just to be sure).

-Bill



Bill you saved me, I have no idea how that got turned on. I am not familiar with that setting and might have committed hari kari soon biggrin.gif
I can't find it in my Panny TV but turning it off in the 93 did the trick. Thank you very much!



John.
post #26155 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

Bill you saved me, I have no idea how that got turned on. I am not familiar with that setting and might have committed hari kari soon biggrin.gif
I can't find it in my Panny TV but turning it off in the 93 did the trick. Thank you very much!



John.

Very good! Just in case you want to disable this on the TV:
Quote:
Trade names for CEC are Anynet+ (Samsung), Aquos Link (Sharp), BRAVIA Link and BRAVIA Sync (Sony), HDMI-CEC (Hitachi), E-link (AOC), Kuro Link (Pioneer), CE-Link and Regza Link (Toshiba), RIHD (Remote Interactive over HDMI) (Onkyo), RuncoLink (Runco International), SimpLink (LG), T-Link (ITT), HDAVI Control, EZ-Sync, VIERA Link (Panasonic), EasyLink (Philips), and NetCommand for HDMI (Mitsubishi)

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI-CEC#CEC

-Bill
post #26156 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

Very good! Just in case you want to disable this on the TV:
From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI-CEC#CEC

-Bill



No wonder I couldn't find the darn thing it was hiding as Vierra Link on my TV. I'll never forget that thanks again.
post #26157 of 26581
I forget, does the BDP-93 decode FLAC streaming?
post #26158 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

So a full HDD will always perform worse than an empty one, especially with individual files scattered all across the platter that belong in a single folder. So you're looking at data fragmentation, not file fragmentation. De-fragging only addresses file fragmentation.
Hi !
What should be the limit on filling 2TB HDD to get decent performance ? How many free space should be left on the HDD ? Any differences with ISO compared to FLAC, for example ?
Thanks a lot.
Edited by dofin - 12/9/13 at 10:50pm
post #26159 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by dofin View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

So a full HDD will always perform worse than an empty one, especially with individual files scattered all across the platter that belong in a single folder. So you're looking at data fragmentation, not file fragmentation. De-fragging only addresses file fragmentation.
Hi !
What should be the limit on filling 2TB HDD to get decent performance ? How many free space should be left on the HDD ? Any differences with ISO compared to FLAC, for example ?
Thanks a lot.
FLAC?

With my 8 attached drives filled with ISOs only, I've crammed them full till I can't fit another ISO Blu Ray (i.e. it shows something like 5GB - 25GB free on a 2TB drive) and they still all play just fine with no problems.


Max
post #26160 of 26581
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

I forget, does the BDP-93 decode FLAC streaming?

Yes.

-Bill
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