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TruVue Vango - Owner's Thread - Page 12

post #331 of 729
I am going to replace my 70 inches tv with a projector system in the near future,after rearing all the projectors review from Epson,Runco,Sim2 and JVC,from lamp type to LED light engine.
I think I am go with the LED light engine type projector like the Vango.
How does the Vango compare to Nuvision,Viviteck,or the Runco LED projector? seem to me they are very close as far as spec.
And how does the Vango if I pair this with the SI black diamond screen .8 or 1.4 gain screen?
My theather room is not a batcave.

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #332 of 729
By the way the screen size will be less then 100 inches may be 92 inches and the projector will be about 14 feet away.
post #333 of 729
Well, I'll have some more info tomorrow, since Dan is bringing both the DPI highlite and the LED to my house. My screen is acoustically transparent, so maybe the gain won't be high enough. What screen material would people suggest?

David
post #334 of 729
Dan for several Vangos measuring by aiming the meter at the lens we measured about 10 percent more lumens than my particular saample. I need to look things up again but I seem to remember on my machine we measured not 400 but about 440. based on limited sampling, I would exp[ect just under 500 lumens calibrated.

Now, I don't know why my screen is measuring significantly less gain than 1.3, measured at screen center. I cleaned the screen but that made no difference. When Tom comes over to calibrtate a Kevin's Vango shortly with his new Lumagen, I will use my Samsung to measure lumens out of the lens and then ft lamberts off the screen to see if the gaindeficiency is the same. All I can say is that in EE high brightness mode, the thing is too bright for my eyes.
post #335 of 729
Quote "Now certainly that equation has a hidden multiplier for screen gain (using the common gain x lumens/ screen area= fL equation) but if a 1.5 gain screen is used, it cannot produce more than the 600 lumens that the projector outputs, so that equation has to be flawed....am I right?" End Quote

Perhaps not. The gain of the screen is 'focused' along a specific look-angle. The increase for that angle is offset by a decrease elsewhere. So I suspect that the light from the entire screen is close to unity. Likely a bit lower owing to inefficiencies. The perforations will decease it even more. Even if you avoid moire. I am merely trying to respond to your question with a layman's perceptions.
post #336 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

When Tom comes over to calibrtate a Kevin's Vango shortly with his new Lumagen,

All I can say is that I really like the sound of that.

Kevin
post #337 of 729
[quote=mark haflich;20330872]Dan for several Vangos measuring by aiming the meter at the lens we measured about 10 percent more lumens than my particular saample. I need to look things up again but I seem to remember on my machine we measured not 400 but about 440. based on limited sampling, I would exp[ect just under 500 lumens calibrated.

Did anyone measure the lumens with the brightness turned up using the EE box?
I read through the review thread and this one and I can't remember. Of course, seeing the DPI LED will help me sort this out.

Thanks,
David
post #338 of 729
Just trying to find out which projector mount people are using with their Vangos. I'm assuming I'm looking for a Universal Mount??

Thanks.
Kevin
post #339 of 729
I have a universal interface bracket from Chief with an RPA series with my current projector. I did buy the plate specific to the Vango from AV Science that works with the RPA. Don't have the projector or the new plate yet but it looks like they are calibrating my projector very soon. I could let you know how it all goes up.

Kevin
post #340 of 729
I found a good TV show for testing how well projectors do with dark scenes. I was channel surfing the other night and happened to catch a Charlie Rose interview on PBS the other night. The background was black, they wore dark charcoal gray suits, white shirts, and colorful ties. I could see the suits against the black background, and the places where there was color (their faces, their ties, and even the table top) just jumped off the screen. The white shirts were a wonderful, bright white without any blooming. I just sat there mesmerized by the picture.

I'm not able to do a side-by-side comparison with a JVC projector, so I cannot tell you how much better (or worse) it would be with that projector. All I can say is that I really cannot imagine anyone would think poorly of the Vango's performance even when compared to the marvelous blacks from the JVC projectors.
post #341 of 729
Chief makes a heavy duty mount for it and other projectors in its weight class. AVS manufacturers a speacial plate for the Vango which sells for $150 and mates the projector to either the Chief RPA or RPMA. If one wants to use either of these one must have the plate. The U portion of these mounts won't work and chief does not manufacture a plate.

Kevin. Don't get too exited yet. Short throw Vangos are in transfit from China and should clear customs sometime next week. Then one will come across the country for Tom and I to calibrate for you.
post #342 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Kevin. Don't get too exited yet. Short throw Vangos are in transfit from China and should clear customs sometime next week. Then one will come across the country for Tom and I to calibrate for you.

Can't help it I have been excited since I said I'd buy one.

Holding some newly purchased movies back to watch when it gets here.

Hoping to see some Stanley Cup action on it as well.

Any ETA on the AV7005 and RMK8003AV?


Kevin
post #343 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Snyder View Post

Just trying to find out which projector mount people are using with their Vangos. I'm assuming I'm looking for a Universal Mount??

Thanks.
Kevin

Kevin,

I used this one. Arakno Heavy Duty Geared Projector Mount

http://www.peerlessmounts.com/pcatta...1-9029-1-3.PDF

It works as advertised and is rated for 100lbs. I mounted the Vango using the four bosses in the center rather than the bosses for the feet. The center ones are much closer to the center of mass. I hear very good things about the Chief as well. It has not required alignment touch up and is mounted using a 4in nipple.
post #344 of 729
[quote=David Shapiro;20331591]
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Dan for several Vangos measuring by aiming the meter at the lens we measured about 10 percent more lumens than my particular saample. I need to look things up again but I seem to remember on my machine we measured not 400 but about 440. based on limited sampling, I would exp[ect just under 500 lumens calibrated.

Did anyone measure the lumens with the brightness turned up using the EE box?
I read through the review thread and this one and I can't remember. Of course, seeing the DPI LED will help me sort this out.

Thanks,
David

Citation4444 measured his Mico50 at 571 in high brightness mode, I would presume the Vango is in the same region. The EE box would probably make things easier to see for various lighting conditions but won't affect lumens, it helps with colors in high brightness mode on the Vango for what I understand
post #345 of 729
Last of the Mohicans bluray would be a good movie to use as a test for dark scenes.
post #346 of 729
The high brightness mode increases the lumens by about 20%. The EE box is a many spendid device. It corrects the obvioius of the color errors caused by increasing the white point. The box also deals with how ones eyes perceive certain colors say lit under normal light but viewed under various room lighting conditions. Various tables can be down loaded into the box . The standard tables also include color correction for various room lighting conditions for LED projector using an LED gamut rather than a standard bulb gamut. But other tables can be down loaded for standard bulb gamuts viewed under different room lighting conditions. In my opinion, the high brightness mode of LED projectors is unwatchable without the corrections done by the EE box.
post #347 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

The high brightness mode oincreases the lumens by about 20%. The EE box is a many spendid device. It corrects the obvioius of the color errors caused by increasing the white point. The box also deals wiyth how ones eyes perceives certasin colors say lity under normal light but viewed under various room lighting conditions. various tables can be down loaded into the box . The standard tables also include color correction for various room lighting conditions for LED projector using an LED gamut rather than a stadard bulb gamut. But other tables can be down loaded for standard bulb gamuts viewed under different room lighting conditions. In mu opinion, the high nrightness mode of LED projectors is unwatchable without the corrections done by the EE box.

So, the lumens of the Vango with the EE box is around 700. With an approx 60 sq. ft. screen and a gain of about 1.2' taking into account a 1.3 AT screen, I'm at about 13 to 15 ft. lamberts. If I switch to a non-AT 2.0 gain screen, I'm at about 22 ft. lamberts. Is that right.

Thanks,
David
post #348 of 729
600 not 700.
post #349 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

600 not 700.

OK, 600. Then with a 2.0 screen, I'd be at about 20 ft. Lamberts. Right?

David
post #350 of 729
Screen Assistant gives 28.44 fL for Ultramatte 200, and 25.46 fL for Videomatte 200 - but those numbers aren't actually accurate- you always end up with less output than Screen Assistant calculates once calibration has been performed.

I would think that you're safe to figure sub-20 fL maybe 15-17 for your size screen once the projector is setup properly for your room.

Caveat: MSRP of a replacement screen in your size is 6k: Model A trap door , Videomatte 200 material, non-perfed multi-trigger interface.

Dan

BTW: Screen Assistant calculates 16.5 fL for your existing screen (figure 11-12 fL). 45fL for the Highlite.
post #351 of 729
Hi Dan,
What is optimal?

David
post #352 of 729
As you will see tomorrow; you can always throttle-back with more horsepower, but you can't make more output if it just isn't there.

I would like to see north of 25 fL- because that is what we'd end up with after calibration from something that Screen Assistant tells us is going to be 40+. Then, by the time the lamp has dimmed, you're still greater than 10 fL and perfectly watchable until lamp termination.

You said you like to watch HD programming and sports; a brighter image is going to be better for those scenarios- because you will not be forced to make the room a cave to see the image (yes it will be affected- especially with a white ceiling or light colored walls and carpet) but the ability to socialize during say the NBA finals or March Madness adds something that you just can't get otherwise.

20+ fL allows a decent amount of ambient light while watching non-critical programming, and the extra light doesn't hurt when you're watching something like the Dark Knight when the image switches back to IMAX 1.78:1 .

After tomorrow night, you're certainly welcome to take the trip out to me to see the Titan as a point of reference (no pun intended).

Dan

Although Cineramax has some concepts that could certainly be viewed as fringe or too-high-end; he's absolutely spot-on when it comes to the projectors! Those DCI beasts can do things other just cannot because when you start at 20,000 lumens output- you're going to be loafing on whatever size screen you want to drive. I give him props for the Superkontrasts.
post #353 of 729
Of course with an LED vs lamp illumination sourcew, one won't expereience lamp dimming. Calibrated one will get about 500 lumens, in high brightness mode the word calibration doesn't apply because the colors won't match any standard. The box fixes the obvious errors from your (not your equipment's) internal color memory. The optimal amount of ft lamberts off the screen is a personal preference. For years, CRTers like me lived with about 7 ft lamberts, stacking and blending to get say 9. Personally I like about 14 ft lamberts. I find 20 too bright in my bat cave. A few lumens less is no problem.
post #354 of 729
crt is dead, 9 fL has never been acceptable, if a crt were that dim it was obviously paired with a screen that was too big.

Once again; LED is great- but it is not a panacea. It has very real screen size limits.

Like I said, I absolutely back the technology- but David's screen is too big for any LED projector to be effective. 110 to 120 is really the max size for these projectors to throw a pleasing image, any bigger and it gets too dim when dynamic black kicks-in.

Dan
post #355 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrlittlejeans View Post

Last of the Mohicans bluray would be a good movie to use as a test for dark scenes.

I've watched that BRD on a Benq 8720, the Vango, and on a LCD flat panel TV and on all of them seem too dark. The Vango does OK with that movie, but the dark scenes don't really have enough light areas to make them visually engaging. I believe they must have messed up that Blu-Ray; it is just too dark to enjoy. The DVD is closer to what I remember seeing in the theater, and has a much more enjoyable an image.
post #356 of 729
Looks like I am delayed til the next shipment too. Something came up during calibration, I guess that is one advantage of calibration though. Saves me an extra equipment shuffle

On the bright side the B's may live to fight another day and my MLS game this week is stuck on a channel I only get in SD. I'm sour on the NBA right now so haven't even watched one game of the playoffs.

My movie queue keeps growing though. Good time to clear off the DVR.
post #357 of 729
Corey,
I am glad they found the bad apple before you got it home. The short wait will be worth it. When I bought my Dwin, Jason took it home to check it out before shipment. I did not get that one calibrated. I do like the service from AV Science. Things like this let you know that there will be help if you have problems.

Kevin
post #358 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyrax View Post

I've watched that BRD on a Benq 8720, the Vango, and on a LCD flat panel TV and on all of them seem too dark. The Vango does OK with that movie, but the dark scenes don't really have enough light areas to make them visually engaging. I believe they must have messed up that Blu-Ray; it is just too dark to enjoy. The DVD is closer to what I remember seeing in the theater, and has a much more enjoyable an image.

The bluray is really hard on displays without a high native on/off contrast ratio but looks amazing on displays with a high on/off. It was exceptional on my RS35 - the details and colors at near black are really great. It would be a good test disc for millerwill to use when comparing the Vango and his RS20 for dark scene performance.
post #359 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoKevin View Post

Corey,
I am glad they found the bad apple before you got it home. The short wait will be worth it. When I bought my Dwin, Jason took it home to check it out before shipment. I did not get that one calibrated. I do like the service from AV Science. Things like this let you know that there will be help if you have problems.

Yeah, getting a defective product by mail order has to be the worst. And aside from having some other equipment I want to put in, my aversion to recabling trumps my general impatience. I also realized I have a rare business trip coming up so it may not even matter.
post #360 of 729
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrlittlejeans View Post
The bluray is really hard on displays without a high native on/off contrast ratio but looks amazing on displays with a high on/off. It was exceptional on my RS35 - the details and colors at near black are really great. It would be a good test disc for millerwill to use when comparing the Vango and his RS20 for dark scene performance.
Tx, MLJ; glad to be remembered!
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