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"Reel Time" Build Log-14' Scope, 9.7 17,000W Transducer Audio, Dedicated Stadium Room - Page 5

post #121 of 368
Aren't you still going to be throwing away like 25-30% of your PJ's resolution into drawing black bars in 2.40 mode without the A-lens ?
post #122 of 368
Impressive and innovative build. Keep at it.
post #123 of 368
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HFGuy View Post

Aren't you still going to be throwing away like 25-30% of your PJ's resolution into drawing black bars in 2.40 mode without the A-lens ?

No doubt I'm not using all of the pixels in the panel of the scope projector since I'm doing zoom. It's a compromise in the end. I've read the threads were folks go back and forth and sacrifice their children in the name of A-lens vs. Zoom. I'm not really siding with one or the other. I had the A-lens, and just switched the setup to try to find the best compromise all around. I can still go with an A-lens later if I wanted, but I wouldn't need the lift of the one I have that I will be selling.

I'm also compromising on the contrast of a JVC to the 6010, but that's a cost decision vs what I get from the 6010. I was trying overall to minimize the costs all around, knowing that newer PJ's are on the horizon and I can switch if I want to both or just one.
post #124 of 368
I will be buying a PJ myself in a a year or two and have been thinking about this same thing. The cost of the A-lens just seems insane to me, I mean they are almost as much as the projector themself! Ideally by the time I am ready to buy my PJ 4k projectors will be more affordable (it's all relative) and then the zooming method has no real disadvantage for 2k material.
post #125 of 368
May I ask why two projectors instead of using the zoom memory function? You mentioned you did not like the size of the 16:9 at 14' wide and decided for a 12' wide instead. What didn't you like? Too much area for the seating distance?

Thanks so much for the level of detail provided on this thread. I wish I had seen it before I built the room of my HT. But it has been truly inspirational, I know, cliche and all :-)
post #126 of 368
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos View Post

May I ask why two projectors instead of using the zoom memory function?

Outside of the Panny, the only other PJs that have lens memory are the new EPSON 61000 (yet to be released) at $6K MSRP, and the new mid-level JVC and Sony, both at around $7K MSRP. I really didn't want to go with the Panny, and the JVC and Sony had two primary issues: 1) they are around $7K each and 2) they are rated for 1800 lumens max. Between those two I would lean towards the JVC, but it's still an unknown on the lamp life and the 3D has a good bit of crosstalk. So at that price point, I just didn't want to bite. The main draw for me to the JVC would be the contrast and the 4K-lite which would benefit me for for the scope. But in the end I looked at it and the 6010 is 2,400 lumens and I can have two of them for the price of the JVC. While I'm sure there are benefits outweighing the 6010 in the JVC, I just couldn't look past the fact I could have two PJ's for the price of one. Especially given the brighter lumens, very good darks, good 3D, glasses included (4 when you buy two PJs), and the possibility of running a dual gun 3D setup in the future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos View Post

You mentioned you did not like the size of the 16:9 at 14' wide and decided for a 12' wide instead. What didn't you like? Too much area for the seating distance?

I was talking about a 14' wide constant height image (CIH) when using the A-lens. A 14' wide 2.35:1 scope screen is 71" high. Keeping the height at 71" equates to a 10'-6" wide, 145" diag 16:9 screen. The two PJ's are just letting me do what the lens memory would have on a single (i.e. going back and forth between the two maximum screen sizes for each format). I'll be going for something between a 14'-15' wide 2.35:1 on the one projector, and a 12' wide, 81" high, 165" diag 16:9.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos View Post

Thanks so much for the level of detail provided on this thread. I wish I had seen it before I built the room of my HT. But it has been truly inspirational, I know, cliche and all :-)

Thanks Carlos! It certainly has been a journey. I'm looking forward to the end of it, or at least the first Phase!
post #127 of 368
I just now read through this whole thread and all I can say is.... WOW!!!! Incredible build and I'm loving all the details and photos.. I can not wait to see the ceiling (always been a huge dream of mine)!
post #128 of 368
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rolla94 View Post

I just now read through this whole thread and all I can say is.... WOW!!!! Incredible build and I'm loving all the details and photos.. I can not wait to see the ceiling (always been a huge dream of mine)!

Well, I got up at 6:30 this morning to get'a work'n! Lots of drywall dust to get rid of before I get going again. MMan won't be happy if I don't get the room clean again!

Then it's off to trim and doors. I'm sure the wife and kids won't mind their Christmas gifts not being wrapped this year!
post #129 of 368
Thanks for the info. Not sure why I though the 6010 had zoom memory

I like your idea of using two projectors. I expect my 6010 later this week and I'll see if A-Lens or dual PJs are in my future.
post #130 of 368
Thread Starter 
Spent the whole morning on Saturday vacuuming the ceiling, walls, and floor with a tiny four-inch brush off of my shop vac. Had to work on a bunch of other to do items around the house in preparation for a party that night. So I didn't get any further on the HT that day.

Woke up on Sunday and changed plans a bit. I went ahead and primed the entire theater since all my trim is preprimed as well. Figured that would save some cut-in work. Now I have one big white room!

The trim is going to take some time with all those wall bumps! A friend in construction came over Saturday night and said he feels sorry for my trim guy! Then I told him it was me!

The base will be one thing, but the crown will be some nasty angles. Oh well.

I had about 15-20 people crowd in at our Christmas party Saturday night for a demo. Threw in some opening chapters of Terminator Salvation and I think they were blown away. They couldn't believe the sound was coming out of the drywall like that.

On another note, for that demo I hooked up on of my new 6010s. Didn't even go though any calibration and the image out of it was fantastic. Great color, blacks, and pop. Big step up from the temporary 9100 I had before.
post #131 of 368
....to see what lays ahead in store for the Screen upgrade.
post #132 of 368
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

....to see what lays ahead in store for the Screen upgrade.

Me too!
post #133 of 368
Hi RTD,

Just wanted so say that this build is super interesting to follow! The dual projectors, the transducers, the angled walls - you my friend have some interesting ideas! And they are all very well executed. I will be following eagerly through the rest of the build

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedTopDown View Post

Well, that's where I'm at right now. MMan didn't get enough of us and is coming back into town between Christmas and New Years. We'll be redoing the screen, addressing some drywall and primer issues that came through the paint, and making it a lot bigger!

So how did it go after MMan's second visit? Did you get rid of the paint stripes?

Another thing I was wondering about regarding the transducers is how low do they go (frequency wise that is)? And do they need to be cut off at a certain frequency in order to avoid screen vibration?

Keep up the good work and keep the pictures comin'!
post #134 of 368
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Chris View Post

Hi RTD,

So how did it go after MMan's second visit? Did you get rid of the paint stripes?

Absewlootly we did. And much more. How does a 2.0+ gain screen with decent ambient light performance sound. (pun intended) And perhaps most important to RTD, not a single trace of visible Screen artifacts, despite the obvious gain characteristics of this whopper.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1384291

I don't want RTD's Thread to become a DIY Screen Showcase, so I posted the linked-to Pictorial on DIY Screens. But I'll gladly answer any Q's on this thread, and if RTD chooses to post any images himself (he has all the original, non-retouched copies that I've posted...) I'll let him decide.


Quote:


Another thing I was wondering about regarding the transducers is how low do they go (frequency wise that is)?

They've been extensively tested down to 20Hz +/- 3 db on applicable material. Realistically....on Drywall or dense Lumber...and supplemented with the correct Sound Boards, a consistently good 35 hz tone is easily maintained.

Quote:


And do they need to be cut off at a certain frequency in order to avoid screen vibration?

I personally have "never" seen and resonant derived distortion of a visible image. At any volume or input level...at any frequency. We were jammin' the system so hard....it blew a 20 amp breaker, yet you could place your nose right up to the screen and look ahead or down across the surface sideways and absolutely no visible vibration can be detected.

The general rule is to roll off the Transducers at approx. 60hz to 80hz which is a standard reference for most THX-oriented systems. Myself, I always utilize as much of the Low Frequency reproduction the Transducers can provide as that always seems to produce the most even, saturated Bass response without overt "booming" from the LFE system.

Quote:


Keep up the good work and keep the pictures comin'!

Of fer shur, with the Trim being ready to get underway, as well as the Room's paint scheme and Star Field, and with the seating on hand and the Carpet ordered, it'll be happening sooner rather than later, I'm certain of that!

From here on out, I'm a'lettin' RTD do the talkin'

But....here's a Teaser at 180+ inches diagonal. Kinda "Dwarfs" most HT Screens.

post #135 of 368
Thread Starter 
Well MMan (as I expected) beat me to the punch on getting some info up on the thread concerning our work this week. He's already showing some of the shots he took in the thread he posted above. I'm going to try and take some tripod shots with my Canon DSLR this week for more detail.

The focus of MMan's visit this week was to get the screen wall smoothed out to perfection and then paint again. In the end we decided to utilize a 16' long 100" tall piece of polycarbonate that was just a hair under 3/16" thick. When I picked it up near Trenton (!) on Wednesday, the ticket had it weighing in at 130 lbs! Here is it sticking out the back of my truck, ready for the 2.5 hr ride home.



And here it is standing in the HT



Together, MMan and I troweled on about 4 gallons of a Liquid Nails plastic sheet adhesive in about 30 minutes since our working time was 45. Using my two boys, the four of us then hoisted it up and sat it on a 2x4 board we had a attached to the wall previously. After an initial misfire, we adjusted the position and pressed it up to the wall and started screwing in the truss head screws to hold it up there. I then rolled it all out with a floor laminate roller a few times to get a good set. Here it is afterwards all nice and shiny.





While the sheet was white, it still was somewhat translucent. So MMan started with a base of Glidden white gripper primer, say 3-4 sprays.



We tried out an initial mix of MMan's special paint that had a lot of silver in it. See his post and thread above. All those coats went up on Thursday and on Friday, we threw some images at it before we proceeded any further. While I liked the depth and contrast that mix of paint provided, I just couldn't get past the visibility of the screen in bright scenes. So I traded off and had him brew up a concoction that was far more white. Again see the thread linked above, but MMan added some pearl base and some leftover silver mix from the first go in Sherwin Williams Pro Classic Interior Enamel (Extra White - Satin).

After four coats were applied, we called it a day and cleaned up before testing it all out. Here are a couple shots after we were done.





That night we watched LOTR ROTK to test it out. I was extremely pleased with the result. I couldn't notice the screen at all and the images were fantastic. Now I could see a slight difference in the contract and depth, but not enough to want the other paint back. The prior version with all the visible screen I just couldn't take.

I threw in Dark Knight, Terminator Salvation, and Planet Earth the next morning before I took MMan to the airport for his flight home. Again, I was very happy with the resulting image on an absolutely flat, smooth wall.

BTW - The image we were throwing for all but Planet Earth (16:9) was a 15' wide scope from about 21'. The Epson 6010 was in Cinema mode with the lamp at ECO.

It was some long days, but it was well worth it. MMan delivered again, and did I mention he was coming down with a cold to boot!?! What a trooper. Thank MMan!

I'll get some shots up soon. Next steps are to paint around where the star field will go and start cutting and nailing up the trim. Oh, that's going to take some time with all those angles!
post #136 of 368
looking amazing, can't wait for more.
happy new year to all.
post #137 of 368
Looking great! Love to see another BIG screen in action!
post #138 of 368
Thread Starter 
Well, with the screen all done, it was time to get started on the trim. To help protect the screen, I picked up a 16'x12' heavy duty tarp and attached it to the wall.



I still need to be careful swinging those 16' boards around!

I got the two doors up first. The door I needed for the AV closet would have been a custom size, so I just ended up going with a double-20" door. I had to mount it on the outside however. That allows the doors to swing open and for the rack to JUST make it past the doors. The one door actually blocks me from getting behind the rack and into the closet, so I have to either: 1) take the right side door off of it's hinges or 2) mount a 1/2" board across the two doors essentially joining them together into a single door - I would then cut the hinges on the one side and let the door swing as one unit. I haven't decided yet. Pros and cons both ways. I won't get back there very often, so I might just leave it as two doubles. We'll see.





Entrance door is a solid core 3-0 1-3/4" door with self-closing hinges. I'm probably just going to have a push/pull setup without a door knob. Yet to be determined. It's certainly one heavy door. Solid cores are heavy, and can't believe what another 3/8" thickness adds.





Now to get some seals from Ted!

The doors went up Friday night, and I spent most of Saturday and Sunday installing the baseboard. Oh so many miter cuts! Looks good finished though, at least IMHO.





I went with 7-1/4" tall baseboard, which meant I had to cut it flat on the saw. Not ideal, but no other alternative really without ripping and I wasn't going to do that. New saw with dual-bevel, slide, and laser really helped a lot.

I'm just going to use the same baseboard kind of like a casing at the front. This should frame out the screen well and I'll attach my cloth-covered fabric panels from there to the screen wall. I added a plinth block at the base and might do some kind of a corbel at the top. I'll need something that the crown can butt up to there also.



At the back of the room, I went ahead and created the baseboard to go around the plenums that flank the bar area and have the rear subs enclosed. I made them up as one piece, gluing and pin nailing them together. I will mount after I tile so I don't need to use a quarter round. I left a long notch in the middle to hold a fabric covered panel that will slide in and cover the opening. BTW - The opening is not centered, but after the panel goes up it will look that way.







Well, that's where I am for now. Lots more trim to come. I also need to build out the four steps (two on each side) and then finish off the baseboard around them.

Let me know what you think!

Question - What's the best thing to fill in the gaps around the door rough-in and the door jamb that's the best for soundproofing? I know I just can't cover up with the casing and leave it hollow. I'll ask Ted as well when I order the seals.
post #139 of 368
Thread Starter 
Making some decisions on color schemes and such. All opinions welcome. We moved on the carpet already and ordered it, so hopefully the majority agree with our call. I still welcome any thoughts.

Carpet

Was leaning one way and then switched. We've always thought we'd go the red-route and we did. We were going with a black/brown background carpet from Stanton, but changed to and ordered the following carpet from Kane. Very much the same construction and make-up as the Stanton. This is the French Scroll style and I really like the color name... Sultan's Palace! Maybe I'll rename my HT to that!

Here in black from manu's site:



Color swatch from manu's site:



Actual sample although iPhone LED flash made it look brighter red than it is.

post #140 of 368
Thread Starter 
Wallpaper

We are looking to wallpaper the center sections of the four "bumps", two on each side and the front angled walls on each side of the screen. The center sections of the "bumps" are 22" wide with 2" returns, so this should give it a bit of a column look. The angled front walls are about 34" wide after taking into consideration the large molding I plan to run up the edge.

I'm concerned about the wallpaper at all on the bumps, but the paper at the front will be in the "viewing cone" if you will. That being said, the wall itself sits back about 2 feet from the screen and there will be black velvet panels between the wall edge and the screen. Then there's the 7-1/4" molding before the wall paper would start and only be about 34" wide. I think I'm okay since the walls angle away (see prior photos) from the screen on anything reflecting back. There will be some, but I don't think it will be much.

But I'm open to any and all thoughts. Main reason being the wallpaper has a subtle gold metalic in it. So here's a pic of it below.

We are thinking of going with a darker, goldy brown for the paint on the rest of the walls. Not sure of trim color yet.

Wife's hand helps give you the scale of it, which I believe fits well with the 9'-11' ceilings.

post #141 of 368
Pshhhh what a slacker ! Those should be coping joints ! Looks great BTW.
post #142 of 368
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HFGuy View Post

Pshhhh what a slacker ! Those should be coping joints ! Looks great BTW.

Thanks! If I had to cope, I would have absolutely no trim! This took long enough.
post #143 of 368
Growing up I helped my father renovate a few house, we always used coping joints, looks GREAT but wow it takes alot more effort.
post #144 of 368
Thread Starter 
Carpentry

We signed off on some designs for the back wall bar and the sit-down bar/third row. Planning this in a slightly distressed finish mahogany like the family room wall. Made a few modifications from this design in an effort to make it look more like a single hutch unit than just kitchen cabinets.

Countertop will be the same for the wall bar and the third row. Depth of the third row "box" will be ~20"





post #145 of 368
Thread Starter 
Made as much headway as I can on cleaning and setting up the AV Rack and Closet. I have to leave a few spaces out on the left side in order to reach in and turn on my lights. I haven't done the electrical finishing work including hooking up the two Grafik Eye units that are located in the closet. I just reach in and turn on a couple of standard switches.



I created a single articulating support to carry all of the lines from the closet to the rack. Just made it out of 1/2 EMT conduit and strapped lines to it. Added hinges on each end and split it in the middle. I mounted the same 1/2" EMT conduit to the walls to help tidy things up



Pretty pleased with the neatness of the cabling. I have a few to tie down here and there, but for the most part it's done.

post #146 of 368
Very impressive rack!
post #147 of 368
I love it when I see a nice rack...that one is no exception. Nice!
post #148 of 368
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by miahallen View Post

Very impressive rack!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon_B View Post

I love it when I see a nice rack...that one is no exception. Nice!

Thank you both! I knew it was a lot of work to tie down everything do neat, didn't expect all those hours and hours. At least it doesn't look like a rat's nest!
post #149 of 368
Thread Starter 
Paint!

Finally getting around to putting up some color and these white walls. Painted black (Mouse Ears) all around the enclosed area of the soffit for the star field. Felt like I was painting death.

With a lowered crown going all the way around below the soffit on the side walls by only a couple of inches, I went ahead and painted the soffit and the area behind the crown. This will be a lot easier than trying to paint after the crown is up. I'll be installing rope lighting behind this crown.

The soffit color is a deep blacky-blue (Behr Starless Night UL230-1), although the one photo with the flash on makes it look far more blue that it really is.

Some images...







post #150 of 368
Thread Starter 
More Trim

Picked up another load of trim last night (20 16' pieces) which should do it. All total I'll have about 40 16' pieces of trim in the room before it's all said and done.

Just finished putting up one side wall worth of the inverted base which the crown will be mounted onto. All those nasty angles again. The "bumps" look really neat and different, but man are they time-consuming and a pain.



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