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Official JVC RS-50 Owner's Thread - Page 137

post #4081 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post


Kevin, I recall a while back someone tried this and ended up with the same exact lumen output as when using one of the color modes in the RS50.

I'd be curious if there is a light advantage, but don't see how it's possible. The Blue and Green have to be pulled down a significant amount from color profile=off in order to get D65.

The only advantage I see is the CMS with the mini and the 40 is easier to work, calibrated I imagine we are in the same ballpark with the 50 providing better dynamic contrast.

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #4082 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

I think most (or at least many) owners of the 2011 JVC projectors would now agree that the combination of the RS40 plus the Lumagen Radiance Mini-3D video processor is overall the best combination. By that I mean you get the brightest picture (most actual lumens from the projector) and a far better CMS/grey scale/gamma processing that what JVC has put into the RS50 and RS60. As a plus the combined cost for the RS40 plus the Mini-3D is less than a RS50. If you contact Mark H. at the AVS Store I suspect he can give you a very good deal on the combo.

Thanks guys for the reply. So if I understand right because of the problems with the bulbs (brightness drop off)on 50/60, its best to get the 40. Since it does not have the CMS(and the CMS on 50/60 is not efficient) its best combined with Mini-3D.

I have an RS10 that I was hoping to upgrade early next year. From what I have read the bulbs in 55/65 is the same as the 50/60. If so, do u guys expect the 55/65 to fare better than the 50/60 from a year ago? Sorry if this has been answered before.
post #4083 of 4215
But to be fair as per my Isf calibrator u can get very close with the cms in the 50/60 if your calibrator knows what he is doing. Mine is a level 1 and 2 instructor and well known in the industry. He said the lumagen would only give u slightly better results.
post #4084 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by stlcity View Post


Thanks guys for the reply. So if I understand right because of the problems with the bulbs (brightness drop off)on 50/60, its best to get the 40. Since it does not have the CMS(and the CMS on 50/60 is not efficient) its best combined with Mini-3D.

I have an RS10 that I was hoping to upgrade early next year. From what I have read the bulbs in 55/65 is the same as the 50/60. If so, do u guys expect the 55/65 to fare better than the 50/60 from a year ago? Sorry if this has been answered before.

IMHO, the advantage of this combo is support for all 3D formats with the mini and an easier CMS to calibrate. I just don't see how you will get more lumens with the mini when it is fully calibrated. The 40 is brighter out of the box because it doesn't have the CMS and filters, but if you intend to pro calibrate it, you will likely end up with the same lumens output.

I personally would take the better contrast of the 50 with a pro calibration with someone that knows how to calibrate these projectors if I was not concerned about 3D formats from DirecTV.

I believe the lumens issue was two fold, one expectations of D65 ratings, and bulb issues early on which seem to be resolved.

Why it became a big concern is many of us did not have full light control and went with larger throws and screens based on what was advertised by JVC. I do think one needs to consider their viewing environment before choosing, and consider if they will get a pro cal by a qualified person. There is no doubt the 50 is a better unit when installed and calibrated in the right environment, it just may not fit your HT.
post #4085 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gotchaa View Post


IMHO, the advantage of this combo is support for all 3D formats with the mini and an easier CMS to calibrate. I just don't see how you will get more lumens with the mini when it is fully calibrated. The 40 is brighter out of the box because it doesn't have the CMS and filters, but if you intend to pro calibrate it, you will likely end up with the same lumens output.

I personally would take the better contrast of the 50 with a pro calibration with someone that knows how to calibrate these projectors if I was not concerned about 3D formats from DirecTV.

I believe the lumens issue was two fold, one expectations of D65 ratings, and bulb issues early on which seem to be resolved.

Why it became a big concern is many of us did not have full light control and went with larger throws and screens based on what was advertised by JVC. I do think one needs to consider their viewing environment before choosing, and consider if they will get a pro cal by a qualified person. There is no doubt the 50 is a better unit when installed and calibrated in the right environment, it just may not fit your HT.

I completely agree hence why I have the 60 on a 100" screen short throw pro Isf cal and looks amazing. FYI espn 3d now works as do all the 3d channels on direct tv. Espn changed formats in the last few weeks.
post #4086 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gotchaa View Post

IMHO, the advantage of this combo is support for all 3D formats with the mini and an easier CMS to calibrate. I just don't see how you will get more lumens with the mini when it is fully calibrated. The 40 is brighter out of the box because it doesn't have the CMS and filters, but if you intend to pro calibrate it, you will likely end up with the same lumens output.

I personally would take the better contrast of the 50 with a pro calibration with someone that knows how to calibrate these projectors if I was not concerned about 3D formats from DirecTV.

I believe the lumens issue was two fold, one expectations of D65 ratings, and bulb issues early on which seem to be resolved.

Why it became a big concern is many of us did not have full light control and went with larger throws and screens based on what was advertised by JVC. I do think one needs to consider their viewing environment before choosing, and consider if they will get a pro cal by a qualified person. There is no doubt the 50 is a better unit when installed and calibrated in the right environment, it just may not fit your HT.

I agree with this but the CR difference with typical settings only yields about a 10K:1 improvement for the 50 (over the 40) even tho the advertised difference is 20K:1. The 55 should do better with typical settings since it it rated at 80K:1. The other thing is the Lamp Iris which the 50/55/60/65 have but the 40/45 do not. I believe Manni found the lamp iris does help preserve ANSI CR as the Iris is closed so this obviously favors the 50/55/60/65's.
post #4087 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech5635 View Post


I completely agree hence why I have the 60 on a 100" screen short throw pro Isf cal and looks amazing. FYI espn 3d now works as do all the 3d channels on direct tv. Espn changed formats in the last few weeks.

That is great news regarding Directv and ESPN, I suppose they can take this off their 2012 enhancement marketing.

It does appear that the 50/60 wider color gamut was the cause of reduced lumens@D65, great for photographers I suppose looking to use Adobe profile, bad for HT. It seems that this was one area they corrected due to all the complaints from Kevin

Yes we will credit him for 2012 lumens increase if indeed it turns out to be brighter!! I hear they are shipping his picture as an addendum in the user manual "Here are your Lumens"
post #4088 of 4215
Will be taking delivery of my RS50 tomorrow to use with my Black Diamond III
1.4 gain. Total light controlled room so I'm looking for some good contrast compared to my BenQ W5000. Hopefully a newer bulb but we'll have to see how long it lasts. My calibrator is very good and has done a number of these pjs. He says it takes longer with the 50s CMS but that in the end it calibrates beautifully. Here's hoping.
John
post #4089 of 4215
Got my pj today and did the latest firmware update.That was fun getting it to be recognized by Windows. Gets installed Friday and I'm very curious to see how it performs.
John
post #4090 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech5635 View Post

Attachment 223174

Wow dude... that is a mighty good lookin' calibration!

I wonder as Jason points out if the need to pull back blue/green (and possibly even a bit of red??), puts it at about the same lumens as using the CP's?

Any idea what your lumens is at this point? Gotta light meter handy??
post #4091 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gotchaa View Post

That is great news regarding Directv and ESPN, I suppose they can take this off their 2012 enhancement marketing.

It does appear that the 50/60 wider color gamut was the cause of reduced lumens@D65, great for photographers I suppose looking to use Adobe profile, bad for HT. It seems that this was one area they corrected due to all the complaints from Kevin

Yes we will credit him for 2012 lumens increase if indeed it turns out to be brighter!! I hear they are shipping his picture as an addendum in the user manual "Here are your Lumens"


Don't forget all the contributions from Geof and Jason as well (which makes three they'll need to include in the flyer announcement...)

post #4092 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gotchaa View Post

IMHO, the advantage of this combo is support for all 3D formats with the mini and an easier CMS to calibrate. I just don't see how you will get more lumens with the mini when it is fully calibrated. The 40 is brighter out of the box because it doesn't have the CMS and filters, but if you intend to pro calibrate it, you will likely end up with the same lumens output.

I personally would take the better contrast of the 50 with a pro calibration with someone that knows how to calibrate these projectors if I was not concerned about 3D formats from DirecTV.

I believe the lumens issue was two fold, one expectations of D65 ratings, and bulb issues early on which seem to be resolved.

Why it became a big concern is many of us did not have full light control and went with larger throws and screens based on what was advertised by JVC. I do think one needs to consider their viewing environment before choosing, and consider if they will get a pro cal by a qualified person. There is no doubt the 50 is a better unit when installed and calibrated in the right environment, it just may not fit your HT.


Good assesment and the biggest thing I noticed over the 40 that no one really talks about, but was so shockingly obvious was the image depth on the 50. My friend bought the 40 recently and when I helped him do the initial calibration, we put on some demo stuff I brought over and I couldn't help noticing the image looked a little "flat". When I came home I put on these same scenes to confirm my impression (and I did!). Did feel a tad brighter but nothing that blew me away (and his screen is 4" smaller than mine).
post #4093 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post


Wow dude... that is a mighty good lookin' calibration!

I wonder as Jason points out if the need to pull back blue/green (and possibly even a bit of red??), puts it at about the same lumens as using the CP's?

Any idea what your lumens is at this point? Gotta light meter handy??

Not sure about my lumens output. I have never measured that. Any suggestions on light meters? And how to do it?
post #4094 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

Good assesment and the biggest thing I noticed over the 40 that no one really talks about, but was so shockingly obvious was the image depth on the 50. My friend bought the 40 recently and when I helped him do the initial calibration, we put on some demo stuff I brought over and I couldn't help noticing the image looked a little "flat". When I came home I put on these same scenes to confirm my impression (and I did!). Did feel a tad brighter but nothing that blew me away (and his screen is 4" smaller than mine).

kevin, it's interesting you mention that because I remember my RS50's 3D being more appealing than my original RS40. I had both side by side for a week. I noticed less ghosting on the RS50 vs. my original RS40, but chalked it up to sample variances.

maybe it has something to do with the different gamma modes in 3D?
post #4095 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech5635 View Post

Not sure about my lumens output. I have never measured that. Any suggestions on light meters? And how to do it?

Oh very easy. Earlier this year I picked up a Mastech Digital Illuminance/Light Meter LX1330B off Amazon for less the $40, which will give your Lux reading and if you search this thread we have had many discussions on the conversion to Lumens, and as I recall I believe it was even Ron or Joe who came up with a nice little spreadsheet!
post #4096 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

kevin, it's interesting you mention that because I remember my RS50's 3D being more appealing than my original RS40. I had both side by side for a week. I noticed less ghosting on the RS50 vs. my original RS40, but chalked it up to sample variances.

maybe it has something to do with the different gamma modes in 3D?

Oh no it's true because I forgot to mention I noticed a lot more ghosting with both Megamind and Xmas Carol (than I remember on mine).
post #4097 of 4215
Wow!

A very promising and exciting excerpt from Cine4home's initial review of the X70/90 (over the x7/9):

2D brightness
We start with the maximum brightness of the projector, which is achieved (as with its predecessor) with the color profile "Off" in Anwenderpreset in conjunction with the high lamp mode and minimum projection distance. Our light meter displays 1230 lumens, which is amazingly accurate indication of the work (1200 lumens). So far, the marketing division of JVC was already honest, but as we just explained, the brightness is only "worth anything" if it is accompanied with not-too-wrong colors.

And here are the first surprise (!) Was purchased during the previous generation, the maximum light output with the typical lack of red UHP lamp from almost 40%, it still scarce in X70/90 only 25%. The calibration to the standard demanded by video 6500K / D65 color temperature of costs with the new models so only 25% brightness & contrast (compared to 40%). Accordingly, the light was higher yield of the pre-series X90 after calibration: Around 930 lumens achieved this with accurate colors, which are about 20% more than the direct predecessor X7 (760 lumens) and still 10% more than the X3. Even in Eco mode (-25%), the X70/X90 virtually as bright as its predecessor in high lamp mode!

This gain was achieved solely through the optical color correction of the light path, without compromising the primary colors

I think someone is about come back again (thanks to Geof for finding this!)!

post #4098 of 4215
I'm not sure I found this but I did find it to be a pleasant "unadvertised" upgrade over the 50/60. Additional lumens means the iris can be closed more and that, coupled with this years additional 10K CR improvement for the 55/65, likely means a noticeable CR improvement over last years models. According to cine4home's review of the X3/X7/X9 the typical on/off CR delta between 40 and 50 was about 10K:1. Perhaps this years difference will be more like 20-25K:1. Couple that with the 4K-lite capability and 1/16 pixel adjustment resolution and this years 55 seems to be a very nice improvement over last years 50. I think JVC has a more compelling lineup across the board this year.
post #4099 of 4215
this thread is starting to become an ad for the 55/65 instead of the usual complaints for the 50/60. i don't know which hurts more.
post #4100 of 4215
Is there anyone who purchased their rs-50 from AVS ? could you PM me? thank you. I assume there are many so if I don't respond, it means I got my answer, thanks for your time.
post #4101 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by mntwister View Post

Is there anyone who purchased their rs-50 from AVS ? could you PM me? thank you. I assume there are many so if I don't respond, it means I got my answer, thanks for your time.

What do you want to know? Many of us purchased our RS50's from AVS....they are a reputable dealer with top shelf customer support.
post #4102 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by bosng View Post

this thread is starting to become an ad for the 55/65 instead of the usual complaints for the 50/60. i don't know which hurts more.

What's there more to discuss on the 50/60? If you've got something bring it!

Any time a new model comes out to replace the current one that's not a good thing but talking about it in relation/comparison to the current one's in order to help others make informed decisions is (good; IMO).

Maybe it's time to shut this thread down and open an official JVC 2012 projector discussion?
post #4103 of 4215
i don't think shutting this thread down is really necessary but new ones for the upcoming projectors need their own thread.

i'm sure someone some time now or in the future will want to ask a question/talk about the rs50 and it would be great to not have to wade through pages of discussion off topic.
post #4104 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by bosng View Post

i don't think shutting this thread down is really necessary but new ones for the upcoming projectors need their own thread.

i'm sure someone some time now or in the future will want to ask a question/talk about the rs50 and it would be great to not have to wade through pages of discussion off topic.

Good point. And to this I would ask, have people found the screen selection utility effective, ie the one where you input a number corresponding to your screen type.
John
post #4105 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by bosng View Post

this thread is starting to become an ad for the 55/65 instead of the usual complaints for the 50/60. i don't know which hurts more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bosng View Post

i don't think shutting this thread down is really necessary but new ones for the upcoming projectors need their own thread.

i'm sure someone some time now or in the future will want to ask a question/talk about the rs50 and it would be great to not have to wade through pages of discussion off topic.

I'm not trying to advertise the new JVC's (and I don't think anyone was) but I don't think a comparison between the 50 and 55 is out of line in this thread. I also don't think the thread should be shut down and I do agree that it should remain mostly 50 discussion -- the new ones should be discussed in a separate thread and as of now there are several to choose from.
post #4106 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayray View Post

Good point. And to this I would ask, have people found the screen selection utility effective, ie the one where you input a number corresponding to your screen type.
John

Where do you input your screen type? I have a Carada BW 1.4, and I've never seen that option in the menu anywhere.
post #4107 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by conan48 View Post

Where do you input your screen type? I have a Carada BW 1.4, and I've never seen that option in the menu anywhere.

Installation menu --> Screen Adjust
http://pro.jvc.com/pro/attributes/PR...just_mode.html
post #4108 of 4215
Quote:
Originally Posted by conan48 View Post

Where do you input your screen type? I have a Carada BW 1.4, and I've never seen that option in the menu anywhere.

You need to look at the Screen Adjustment Mode chart. The Carada BW is number 5.

Oops, too slow....
post #4109 of 4215
thanks guys. It seems to look the same at 5 as at 0 for the Carada BW, but other numbers create a cooler or warmer image. Pretty interesting.
post #4110 of 4215
Yes I noticed the same thing with my Carada CCW. Both are pretty much color flat. Other screens not so much as we can see by looking at the other choices. I think it's useful that the projector can compensate for various screen materials.
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