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Audyssey MultEQ XT32 + SubEQ HT thread

post #1 of 89
12/5/10 at 3:36pm
Thread Starter 
I have yet to see an organized thread with user thoughts and feedback specifically on the new Audyssey MultEQ XT32 + SubEQ HT. Audyssey Sub EQ HT is currently in every AVR that uses MultEQ XT32. Receivers with XT32 + SubEQ HT are unique in that now a single unit marries MultEQ XT with the impressive subwoofer processing found in the SVS AS-EQ1.

The XT32 + SubEQ HT processing changes the game in the way a receiver handles dual subs. Lower end receivers with X.2 designations basically have an internal "y-splitter". Some higher end receivers with Audyssey MultEQ XT (like the Onkyo 1007, 1008) take a step forward in calibrating dual subs in that they individually ping each sub and apply individual distance/delay and calibration. Now with MultEQ XT32 + SubEQ HT, each sub is calibrated individually (like the XT); however, they are also pinged TOGETHER (similar to the as-eq1). This final step allows Audyssey to take into consideration the way each sub interacts with each other.

IMO, the XT32 + SubEQ HT is significant because instead of buying the as-eq1 and having a separate unit, you can allocate that $800 toward a single premium receiver and have it all in one package. Currently the XT32 is available on the Onkyo TX-NR3008 and 5008, the Denon AVR-4311ci, and the Integra DTR-70.2 (?-> DHC-80.2, DTR-80.2).

* Audyssey Sub EQ HT press release



Our newest and most accurate room correction solution with more than ten thousand individual control points allowing finer details of the room’s problems to be captured and corrected. The ultra high resolution filters are applied to all channels including the subwoofers, with the most obvious benefit being heard in the low frequency range where correction is needed the most.
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post #2 of 89
12/5/10 at 3:49pm
^^^

is there a problem with discussing this in audyssey sticky thread?

seems to me that xt32 has been extensively discussed there...
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post #3 of 89
12/5/10 at 4:18pm
Thread Starter 
The XT32 has been discussed there; however, the wonderful Audyssey thread jumps to so many topics that at times it is almost like reading Tweets.
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post #4 of 89
12/5/10 at 5:52pm
I agree, that thread is informative, but it's all over the map....
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post #5 of 89
12/5/10 at 5:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

I agree, that thread is informative, but it's all over the map....

... anyone want to place bets on how many posts before this one does the same?
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post #6 of 89
12/5/10 at 8:29pm
To get this back on track. I am very interested in this new tech and might even upgrade my receiver in the near future just because of it. So I would like to hear what people that do own these new receivers have to say about.
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post #7 of 89
12/5/10 at 8:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by stitch1 View Post

To get this back on track. I am very interested in this new tech and might even upgrade my receiver in the near future just because of it. So I would like to hear what people that do own these new receivers have to say about.

Me too. Subscribing to this now.
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post #8 of 89
12/5/10 at 9:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

I agree, that thread is informative, but it's all over the map....

Yes, but Chris (Audyssey CTO) has said he will only attend to that thread.
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post #9 of 89
12/5/10 at 9:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pbc View Post

... anyone want to place bets on how many posts before this one does the same?

Anyone want to place bets on how many posts before this thread gets closed since there is already a dedicated thread for Audyssey discussions?
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post #10 of 89
12/6/10 at 8:51am
Thread Starter 
Yes, I know that Chris (Audyssey CTO) only posts in the Audyssey thread. If you have a specific question for him, go the that thread or PM him. The problem is that the Audyssey thread can be difficult to search and discuss with specific topics due to the vast amount of technologies and products they are involved with.

I was hoping to get user feedback on those utilizing the newer Audyssey XT32. I have been hearing that some think the XT32 + SubEQ HT may not do as good of a job as the AS-EQ1. Can we allow this thread to start, so we can specifically get user thoughts on this topic and others pertaining to the XT32.
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post #11 of 89
12/6/10 at 12:26pm
Thanks for starting this thread. Wouldn't have known about this otherwise.

I was original thinking of purchasing an Onkyo 808. Now I am thinking maybe I should save up for an Onkyo 3008...

There is a huge increase in filter points going from Multi-EQ to Multi-EQXT32. The price difference would be about $600...

Any one with XT32 experience want to chime in?

Daniel
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post #12 of 89
12/6/10 at 2:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by deepstang View Post
The XT32 has been discussed there; however, the wonderful Audyssey thread jumps to so many topics that at times it is almost like reading Tweets.
Yes the Audyssey thread is a mishmash. There was an effort to encourage different threads based on different Audyssey technologies months ago but it was shot down by the mods so this is the only alternative. If Audyssey chooses not to participate, well, it could be a missed opportunity.
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post #13 of 89
12/6/10 at 3:47pm
Hai,

Personally i think audyssey has such a wide range of tech that having a dedicated thread to each of them is not a bad idea even if its job is to point to the correct posts in the mega thread Chris visits.

For example it seems to me that the function set of XT32 compared to the others is already leading to posts that any older version is 'useless' or that XT32 is the only version to handle multiple subs (not true denon avp handles 3 subs per sub base using XT not XT32).

I think EQ, Dynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and other tricks by audyssey or other brands are becoming such a important part stickies per 'type' would not be a bad idea.

Daniel.
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post #14 of 89
12/6/10 at 3:58pm
WEll look at it this way the XT 32 + Sub EQ is going to be limited when compared to a stand alone product, soley dedicated to Sub EQ.

I would say based on my experience with my 3007 that XT32+Sub EQ will bring most of the needed benefits to majority of the listeners out there.

Those that have a system to greater scale, multiple subs, larger facility, more listening positions (8 or more seats) The AS-EQ1 might have the necessary dexterity to harness the system further.
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post #15 of 89
12/6/10 at 4:01pm
I'd like to see this thread expand into more that just XT32, I would love to see more talk and in depth conversation about DSX here as well.
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post #16 of 89
12/6/10 at 4:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by khellandros66 View Post
I'd like to see this thread expand into more that just XT32, I would love to see more talk and in depth conversation about DSX here as well.
I agree. It would be so great if we had a thread to discuss all things Audyssey.



AJ
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post #17 of 89
12/6/10 at 9:15pm
I have the Denon 4311CI, the AS-EQ1, and two subs. Audyssey Sub EQ HT is functionally the same as using a separate sub equalizer such as the AS-EQ1 or the Audyssey Sub Equalizer, and both provide the same resolution for the sub channels. In theory, there should be no difference. In practice, I have been switching back and forth between using Sub EQ HT and the AS-EQ1, and I still haven't concluded that there is any difference.

If you want to upgrade the capabilities of your AVR, consider one of the newer units with XT32, DSX, 9-channel amplification, etc. and allow Sub EQ HT to improve your bass response. If you are satisfied with your current AVR, but want to focus solely on improving bass response, consider the stand-alone sub equalizer.

Having said that, I don't think we need a separate threadthe Audyssey thread covers these discussions quite nicely, IMHO.
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post #18 of 89
12/7/10 at 4:55am
I considered SubEQHT a "must have" on my new AVR (Onk 3008) and think it will be the "starting point" moving forward. Dual subs are, IMHO, more important than moving beyond 5 speakers; most rooms that I've been in have decent immersion but bad (in some way) bass. Getting clean/powerful/good bass in a room is very difficult; adding another sub (in a different location) with software to even the peaks is one of the best ways to fix this problem (that almost everyone has!).

I'm thrilled with XT32 and the sub technology in my 3008; my full review is below; but, in general, it's just "better". Clarity is better, bass is better, since of space is better.. The only thing that I was surprised about is how "over reference" I like my bass; I run it +4DB hot in the setup for the subwoofer; I didn't expect that.

In short, coming from the Pioneer 1018 to the Onk, the biggest thing, by far, that I've noticed so far is room corrections in Audessey. Its not magic, but it's certainly better than a few generations ago!
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post #19 of 89
12/7/10 at 6:08am
Largest difference for me was in the LCR channels. Much smoother and 'fuller' if that's even a word. The bass was already very good in XT, XT32 gives me the opportunity to move them around and stagger them so I can overcome the final few problems.

I use the Onkyo PR-SC5508.
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post #20 of 89
12/7/10 at 9:38am
I had never considered getting a second sub until I got the NR5008 which has two sub outs and takes advantage of them with the new Audessey bass management software. These facts also encouraged me to try a "different" second sub instead of going with the same sub as my first which is recommended in may sub forums. In addition to trying to even out the bass response in my 20' x 16' x 8' room I also wanted to increase my low end. Since I now have a receiver and software to manage a second sub I went ahead and sprung for a HSU ULS-15(behind the chair) to add to my older Velodyne SPL-8(under the window). Now when I play organ music or classical with low bass notes my system really produces that low fluttering bass the SPL-8 just was not capable of. When I unleashed Transformers Revenge of the Fallen on the new system I was awe struck and the dog ran for cover. All those low notes cranked by the robots are faithfully and robustly reproduced so now the house is a rockin! Now I understand the people who I once thought were nuts with their multiple subs. Mutiple subs rock! The more the merrier!
LL
LL
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post #21 of 89
12/7/10 at 9:59am
Great timing on this thread as I am in the market for a new receiver.
I've tried the HK and had issues with locking up and memory loss issues - AVR435. Got tired of having to spend 15 minutes every couple weeks to set up everything.

I have narrowed down my selection to receivers that have the best room correction algorithms out there as my room isn't the best.
  • Anthem MRX series with ARC.
  • Pioneer with Advanced MCACC
  • Denon/Onkyo with MultEQ XT32

Tried the Anthem MRX 700 - very impressed with the ARC.
Currently trying the Advanced MCACC in a Pioneer VSX-1125.

Unfortunately I am not going to be able to set up all three technologies in a blind ABX test session - so my results will be purely subjective and backed up with some measurements from a RS analog meter and some frequency sweeps in my main listening position with REW and the RS calibration file (unconfirmed and uncorrected for my meter).

I'm very afraid of the Denon's quality as my local retailer had to power cycle the receiver 5x before getting sound out of it from a DVD source playing a CD - which pretty much seems in line with the reports of owners here.

In actual use - is the MultEQ XT32 THAT much better than the lesser MultEQ XT?
Are there actual room response measurements with calibrated microphone sources that confirm the subjective listening tests?
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post #22 of 89
12/7/10 at 2:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Incriminator View Post

In actual use - is the MultEQ XT32 THAT much better than the lesser MultEQ XT?

If you have 2 subs, absolutely. And most people SHOULD have 2 subs (IMHO)..

For everything else, I really can't comment, other than to say that XT32 stands NO chance of being worse, and some reasonable possibility that it will be better. I considered it a "must have" on my new AVR, and, compared the older Pioneer calibration, it's dramatically better. But I've never compared XT to XT32, so can't comment directly on the differences between those 2. It's a very difficult test to setup (A/B) because you'd actually have to A/B between level matched AVRs (not just amps/cables/etc, like a normal A/B test).

I can't see how XT32 could be worse than XT, so, if nothing else, you're preventing any 2nd guessing in the future by going with XT32 today.
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post #23 of 89
12/7/10 at 4:57pm
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Originally Posted by mjfink View Post

if nothing else, you're preventing any 2nd guessing in the future by going with XT32 today.

Really? How about XT64 next year or XT128 or whatever is next?
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post #24 of 89
12/8/10 at 4:35am
We'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

I love Audessey, I think it's the most powerful room correction SW out there, and, in general, that room correction makes a HUGE difference to your audio experience. I'm willing to pay more to upgrade to the newer versions (as the become available) assuming that they make a difference that I can hear. At some point (maybe right now, maybe X1024, I don't know) there will be a trivial (non-noticeable) gain increasing the amount of filer resolution.

When that happens (and it will), I'll just have to be the fan-boy for something else; right now, IMHO, room correction is one of the most cost effective upgrades that you can make. At some point, we'll be a parity, and there will be other upgrades that supersede it's cost effectiveness...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary J View Post

Really? How about XT64 next year or XT128 or whatever is next?
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post #25 of 89
2/4/11 at 12:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

I have the Denon 4311CI, the AS-EQ1, and two subs. Audyssey Sub EQ HT is functionally the same as using a separate sub equalizer such as the AS-EQ1 or the Audyssey Sub Equalizer, and both provide the same resolution for the sub channels. In theory, there should be no difference. In practice, I have been switching back and forth between using Sub EQ HT and the AS-EQ1, and I still haven't concluded that there is any difference.


Are you able to use just the Sub EQ HT feature in the 4311CI? In other words, use Audyssey to measure distances, levels, etc., but no EQ'ing for main channels... just EQ on the sub(s).
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post #26 of 89
2/4/11 at 12:34pm
No -- if you just want Sub EQ, get a Sub EQ
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post #27 of 89
2/4/11 at 1:07pm
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post

No -- if you just want Sub EQ, get a Sub EQ

Are you certain?

I already have a SubEQ. The Denon AVP is going to get the XT32 update, and I'm wondering if there is any reason to keep the SubEQ. I only want to EQ the sub-channel, not the mains.
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post #28 of 89
2/4/11 at 1:11pm
Yes, I am certain
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post #29 of 89
2/4/11 at 1:12pm
OK thanks.
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post #30 of 89
2/4/11 at 1:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam S View Post

Are you certain?

I already have a SubEQ. The Denon AVP is going to get the XT32 update, and I'm wondering if there is any reason to keep the SubEQ. I only want to EQ the sub-channel, not the mains.

The AVP has the option to bypass EQ'ing on the Front L/R channels and do only the rest. It means your CC & surrounds will still be EQ'd though, which isn't a bad thing for surround blending.
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