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Is Sound Quality that explicitly dependent on the AVR ? + 5.1 Audio-Only Setup

post #1 of 11
12/8/10 at 10:08pm
Thread Starter 
Hey guys.My question as above:

Is Sound Quality that explicitly dependent on the AVR ?

My background:

Firstly,I'm not even slightly an audiophile.I've been using crappy PC Speakers until now (the Z5500's, just for the info),and boy,do they suck when it comes to music.

So,I assume,just about any upgrade to an AV-R and bookshelf speakers will be heads above my previous setup when it comes to SQ.I'm a student and my budget is tight , 250-350$ for the AVR only..I'm willing to go for anything that sounds good for Music to hook up to my PC (through digital),and something that would be better than my earlier Z5500 setup.

1)I've been looking into the budget AVR Yamaha RX V367.I've heard folks here say that it sucks when it comes to SQ alone.Is it going to matter That much for my background? Or should I just end up with a costlier AVR , sacrificing my budget I've kept aside for buying good bookshelf speakers.(Two pairs of AudioEngine A5/anything else I find better at the time of auditioning.).

2)I live in a dorm,so as I can't crank things up too loud,it kinda doesn't matter if the AVR O/Ps 100W or 150W on its channels. (If I'm not mistaken,on a scale, Loudness is prop. to the wattage driven,right?)

3)I DO NOT intend to use the Video processing capabilities at all.I just want a 5.1 Audio-Only setup,and as far as i know,its hard to come by 5.1 AUDIO-only Receivers(Stereo receivers wont be my thing,as I'm going for surround).

I'd be thankful if anyone here helped me with the decision
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post #2 of 11
12/8/10 at 10:23pm
1) The main problem with the 367 is that it's the most stripped down of the line. With that price, Yamaha has to make real compromises in the power supply, to name one obvious area. It's feature set is also going to be stripped down to the bare minimum, so make SURE it does what you think it does.

2) Loudness is not proportional to power. Loudness is logarithmic to power. Double power, and loudness only goes up by 3 dB, a small gain in SPL. This is explained in detail in numerous places online. The short answer is that the receiver needs very little power to put out 90 dB SPL or so, and then the power goes up. The 367 is a huge step up from what I had in my dorm in college, for sure

3) Was this a question? Sorry, I am tired.

So here's the skinny, I think. For a dorm, I suggest speakers of 90 dB senstivity if at all possible. Or maybe 89 dB. And the 367 is an ok choice as you don't need a lot of power for that application. Lack of bass is maybe a good idea to minimize complaints. But where I went to school, outside "quiet" hours, you would hear people cranking their stereos pretty loud from time to time

If you don't need the latest HDMI 1.4 and such, you could look at used/closeout deals, and maybe find a better receiver for less. Knowing dorms, it's not worth spending much money. Things get damaged/stolen, etc. But say you found some used, older model with the features you needed for $300, it might be worth looking at, if you can trust the seller, etc.

Good luck
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post #3 of 11
12/8/10 at 10:42pm
To answer your question - no. Speakers are a lot more important than the receiver when it comes to sound quality. Get an AVR with enough power and the inputs that you need. After that you are paying for features that won't matter nearly as much as the speakers you select. I suspect the Yamaha will be just fine for your purposes.
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post #4 of 11
12/8/10 at 10:48pm
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the response.The thing is,I was planning on getting a refurbished or used model without all these bells and whistles,and just decodes various audio formats well with a good SQ.But,where I live,I can't find a 'trusted' seller to buy a used one from,and I'm not quite familiar with online shopping that much,so getting a refurbished one was out of my options.

HDMI 1.4 and 3D isn't at all important to me,and frankly I don't plan to use it for the next 5 years,so I kinda feel I'm paying for basically these 2 new techs,which I'd never use.

It's just that I would move on to Sony or Harman Kardon (heard Onkyo runs too hot) if it reproduces audio better than the V367.Only thing I care about is the Audio quality.That's all that matters.
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post #5 of 11
12/8/10 at 11:05pm
I believe you can get the Denon 1611 for under $300 in certain places. Regardless you should be able to get it under $350 and it is within your budget.

This is if you want to stick to new of course.
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post #6 of 11
12/9/10 at 5:38am
Just out of curiosity, what types of music formats do you plan to play in 5.1?

For just music, a good 2.0 (maybe 2.1) system is the way to go -- unless you're sitting on a pile of SACDs or lossless music files that are recorded in 5.1...?

Even a 4.0 system might be better than 5.1...
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post #7 of 11
12/9/10 at 6:28am
just my .02. but what about a refurbished onkyo from accessories for less? not sure if they have a 606 or somethin there but I suspect that would be around the 250-300 mark.
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post #8 of 11
12/9/10 at 6:33am
there just checked you could get a onkyo 508 for 199 which would suit your needs just fine. the you have money left overe for a decent used set of bookshelf speakers
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post #9 of 11
12/9/10 at 9:40am
If you're concerned about sound quality, whether you go with a Yamaha, Onkyo, Denon or whatever won't make a difference. What will make the most difference is the speakers you are using. If you're on a budget, refurbished is a good idea. You could also look into a decent set of used speakers and ditch the crappy computer speakers.
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post #10 of 11
12/11/10 at 1:07am
Thread Starter 
@palehorse: I listen to Alternative rock,Electronic,R&B and mainly Pop.I figured that for music,a 4.0 setup with a decent stereo amplifier would be the way to go for just music,but I'm into gaming and a bit of a movie buff too,so 5.1,if possible,should be my thing.(Anyways,my entire library alternates between 320k and FLAC).

@sdmfer: Yep,I was thinking about that Onkyo one too,but the folks here seem to find that Denon and Yamaha are better choices.I know Onkyo is an option for people like me on a tight budget,but I can't seem to get past the heat-up issue,since I plan to use it for long stretches of time (My current setup stays powered for almost 12 hrs a day).

@jake227: Refurbished is the best choice for me,but going online for purchases isn't quite possible for me.And I can't seem to find a dealer to get a used one from (a 'trusted' one).So,a new unit is likely my only option here,given the circumstances.

Anyways,thanks again for the suggs.So far I'm swinging between a Denon 1611 or a Yamaha V465.

The V465 supports all the necessary HD Audio codecs and throws(5x105W) under 400$ and doesn't have those unwanted 3D capabilities at this entry-level price.I feel this should be my way to go.
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post #11 of 11
12/11/10 at 3:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by palehorse View Post

Just out of curiosity, what types of music formats do you plan to play in 5.1?

For just music, a good 2.0 (maybe 2.1) system is the way to go -- unless you're sitting on a pile of SACDs or lossless music files that are recorded in 5.1...?

Even a 4.0 system might be better than 5.1...

I wouldn't necessarily say that.

Have read recently of some very respected professionals in the field recommending for home users to employ 5.1 for 2 channel stereo music.

I had always believed myself to stick with what ever format the original source was recorded in. That's why I only got myself a 5.1 receiver as most movies are in 5.1 - not 7.1. But why were some pros recommending playing 2 channel over a 5.1 system..??

It's so someone doesn't have to spend huge sums of money on equipment and room treatment to get a large soundstage. A properly set up 5.1 can mimic a bigger soundstage for you on much more modest budget levels. It does take a lot of setup and fine tuning to achieve though. It can be well worth it.

And a center is still beneficial to put a vocal back in the center if it was there in 2ch ... as having the extra speakers at the sides pulls the sound field wider. You need the center to refill that hole.

I now listen to 90% of 2 track stereo music in 5.1 and love the extra wide and deep sound stage it produces. Note you can make the effect as strong or as subtle as you what with the adjustments that are available on most AV receivers. You can stretch and deepen a soundstage to taste.
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