92" Mitsubishi DLP @ CES!!! - Page 52

I wanted to add some recent feedback. I am still using Natural with low color temperature setting. I am doing all the calibration in the DVDO DUO with autocalibrate feature of ChromaPure.

There was a trick I was aware of that would eliminate most of out of the box the color clipping with the internal contrast maxed at 63. For some reason with the DUO you can dial back the contrast in the DUOs input Picture Contol 5 clicks and it does not effect max white much but it dramatically reduces color clipping above white and eliminates any color clipping below max white.

The actual effect is very subtle, it is important though at the clear screen can hold the extra details the change reveals. You are giving up a small amount of brightness for the extra highlight and reflections but the image is really, really good. Still seeting 41.7 ft lamberts

I also switched away from my HP Windows Media Extender as my live TV source uing the Ceton and went back to using my Tivo HD on the 92840. While the images of the Tivo HD and the HP Extender are very similar. The Tivo can send out native resolutions and the DUO scales better than HP. The net effect is much better SD content and a smoothness on 720P and 1080I content the HP can't match. The HP takes all content and makes it 1080i. The big let down with the HP is some scrolling problems with certain content that is 720P... The Tivo has none of this and if the HP is an 8, the Tvio HD in native through the DUO is 10 as a Live TV source.. I like the Windows Media interface better but on and image quality basis.. the Tivo is the clear winner. Live TV coming straight out of the PC is maybe a 7.

Live TV now looks tremendous on the 92840. Skin tones are better. It just looks superb. Nothing will make this set ideal for a room with incompatible lighting.. but I never expected it to look anywhere near this good with Live TV in my living room. I have only watched a few minutes of "The 5th Element" so I am have not really seen this beast dance yet with top notch Blu-Ray content.

I am very pleased. One thing that is hard with this set is setting black levels. The reflective screen means you need the room really dark to set black correctly. I am going to get a larg black drape to block reflections during calibration.

I need to recalibrate with the brightness at least one click higher to 34. Black should occur at digial 16 with digital 17 barely visibile and 17 is not visible at the 33 brightness level I am running now. Not sure underwhat conditions the default of 31 brightness would allow you to see 17, maybe on the 82" clear screen. My 2009 matte screen 82" would show 17 at the 31 default.

22-23" is 3 ft now?

And all TVs are a waste of money if a DLP is.

What i read.......

More pics! Looks awful at Fry's, i'm sure it's less than ideal setup.

Screen captures are hard. I tried some back in Post 1450, and there are a few others people posted in October, but to do a good job I think you really need a tripod to keep the camera steady. The shots I posted were taken when my TV was only about a week old and before the bulb had a chance to stabilize. The PQ was very good then and much better now. The factory settings aren't completely awful, but you can do a lot more with it in the right environment. If you have some prior experience with rear projection, you already know not to expect too much from a showroom. If not, there is some discussion toward the bottom of page 12 on the LaserVue A94 thread which may be helpful. On this thread, Gtgray's posts/reviews on the last couple of pages are pretty objective and increasingly positive as he gets more time with the set. And even though he was able to see the TV several times in a couple of showrooms, I believe that he was concerned about black levels, screen reflectivity, etc. I don't mean to speak for him, but his posts then, supported the conclusion that the showroom experience just isn't that strong for big rear projection sets. Fortunately, or unfortunately, I wasn't able to see one before buying it and had to go on prior experience with Mits DLP's, and on other people's reviews, but I couldn't be more pleased. If you are looking for a big display with a superb picture, and have a reasonably light-controlled environment (pretty much a normal rear projection environment), you won't be disappointed. I hope this helps.

Are Mits tv's at CES today?

Mits generally doesnt reveal until their own event which i believe is usually late April.

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENT! wrong answer. We are all waiting to see whats at CES.

Last year for example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WOB0y5yQV0

Thinking along these lines:

http://www.dlp.com/cinema/dlp-enhanced-4k/default.aspx

But for home use.....

Wait all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that Mits generally doesn't reveal much, if anything, at CES.


I don't think I'd advise holding my breath waiting for that one.

It looks like they are there. I saw a youtube with the Home Cinema Laser Display. So at least Laservue is there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpVZ_AUrKc4

minute 1:17

Anyone at the ces show actually stop in to see what Mits has there???

I think they are showing tomorrow. I did a little digging and rumor has it they have a 92" FPTV to reveal. We will see though.

Anyone stop by Mits at CES?? If so, what's cooking???

I just installed a new version of ChromaPure with some improvements in the autocalibrate feature which supports DUO VP as well as Lumagen's line of Video Processors. With a little hand tweaking after the atuo routine was run I was able to see a Red dE of 0.1 and the rest were very low, while not equal to that. These color errors are miniscule as depending on which expert you go by anything lower than 2.0 dE on color is not visually detectable.

I have found that in fact a low color error is detectable despite the expert claims and that when you get to these very low errors the image gets a certain quality I had not seen before on a Mits' rear projector. My 82" was just not capable of this kind of color accuracy.

I have done only dark room calibrations on the WD-92840. Clearly the set is at it best as are most HDTVs in a light controlled room. I will at some point in the near futre do a daylight calibration and see how much improvement can be made in that mode.

I am getting close to 200 hours on the 92 now and have done a half-dozen calibrations (all auto calcs) my overall satifaction with this display keeps going up.

I cranked up the old 5th Element Blu-Ray which I have seen on anumber of different displays including at least 5 different DLPs. The 92840 with a tight calibration is a superb presentation of this Blu-Ray.

My cousin is there and he texted me that Mits has the 2012 92" set there.

He said he would email me the info.

I am seriously looking at buying this set.

Actually one major stumbling block for me is finding the right stand. It has to house my audio components and I can't find the right one.

Finding the right stand is a problem that everyone is having with the 92840. Most people, at least the owners on this thread, agree that the best viewing height requires a stand height of 12" or 13". But getting all your components to fit in that space can be a challenge, although in theory you could make a stand as wide as you would like, or as deep. I went with a compromise of 14". Several people, including myself, had custom stands made specifically to address height versus component issues. You should be able to find someone local (cabinetmaker, woodworker) to make a good custom stand for you for about $300-350. The stand issue is sort of inherent to the size/height of this set, but the quality of the display is well worth whatever compromises I need to make regarding specific component location.

I'm the owner on a 82740 but was wondering why Mitsubishi does not do both passive and active 3D. I don't want to get into the debate of passive VS active but seems reasonable to offer both and have a bigger edge over the competition. Maybe we will see more at CES ( at least hoping).

Technically not cost effective or mass production feasible.

Passive requires a perfect positioning of each row of pixels on the screen and then to have that screen treated with special opposing polarizing elements that cross the screen horizontally and that each line of the material is no more than one pixel wide. Both images are displayed at the same time, and each image has a different polarization. The odd lines of the picture are one polarization and the even lines are the other polarization.

In a rear projection TV the entire image is projected through a lens, bounced off a mirror and then through a Fresnel lens (magnifier the size of a screen - it is the back side of the screen) and then through the Lenticular screen (vertical grooved screen - the front of the screen), it simply is not feasible to create perfect enough alignment of each individual pixel or line in any form of mass production. There is no way to create two different polarizations on a rear projection TV.

LCD can do this because the pixels are not projected; you are looking directly at the pixels. Possibly plasma might be treated to work the same way but no one has done it yet.

In the theater they use front projection, not rear projection. Here they project two images at the same time, from special polarizing lenses. Each image has a different polarization (or lens). These are projected on to and bounce off of a special silver screen that maintains the two polarizations. Rear projection requires the image to pass through the screen so the screen cannot maintain different polarizations. The only type of passive that would work on rear projection and be feasible for mass production would be the old fashion anaglyphic type (red and green) which nobody wants.

HUH? for $300-$350 I'll build you a piece of plywood on cinder blocks.

Yeah, I wouldn't expect much of a custom cabinet for only $300-$350. Just the wood alone isn't cheap these days. It would be easy to go through more than that just for materials to build the cabinet. And most people are going to want to get at least some cash to cover the labor that's involved.

You sound a touch pricey. I spent $350 for a very nice custom stand, and several other owners who posted their costs back in October/November spent about the same.

I spent that much on a VERY nice stand. Steel construction w/ real wood, and only 15" high(for my 82838).

No I'm not pricey my labor alone would be that much no matter what it's made of or how simple it is. Secondly I think we may need to determine what's nice, what's custom and what's real wood.

That's not to say there aren't cabinet makers, woodworkers or carpenters that will build one on the cheap, but if we're talking VERY nice , custom made with REAL QUALITY wood, $350 won't cut it.

The one thing that ulitmately surprises me is that I am okay with my stand at 15". By definition that is too tall for this set. But the high brightness and somewhat wider vertical sweet spotof the clear screen means I have not been that conscious of the impact of the stand at 15"

My budget right now has NO place for spending any money let alone on a stand so I am not giving the custom stand a lot of premeditation. At some point sure. I do feel that unless you are trying to run this thing is high ambient lighting (which I suggest you don't) 15 inches will work fine. A stand in the 12" to 13" range is pretty much gravy.. 15 inches will work satisfactory. I am at 14 feet so that might be part of why it is working out for me.

I am eager to hear what new trickery if any was done for 2012 on the 92" sets. Mits seems to improve at least something significant each year. They still need to work on their linearity. I would like to see the sets not be clipping color with out of the box settings.

If I were them I would work on a screen coating and tightening up the native geometry.. Extra brightness never hurts but I am sure they have to be pushing the very limits of what 180 watt lamps can do. I could never have imagined that the 2011 92" would be so much brighter than the 2009 82".

The 82840 is probably a real gem for the money, the extra lamp per square centimer can only help for those who are going to be doing a lot of daylight viewing.

I am pleased to hear that your 15" stand is working for you. No need to spend extra money if you don't have to. I thought the extra distance might help. I am up very close with a 14" stand and it's still okay. In a perfect world, I wouldn't mind it being an inch or two lower, but I decided I wanted two (adjustable) shelves and I just didn't think I could get away with that at less than 14". A little better native geometry would be very welcome, although I only notice with a Guide (like DirecTV) up. But the vertical axis really isn't too bad considering the size of the set, is it?

With Geometery Correction off. I have a slight dip on horizontal lines in the top 3rd of the screen. Like you say non-corrected geometry is noticeable only on certain programs guides. On my set you really have to be looking for it with the Guide on the Tivo HD. In real world content you don't see it all. The TV is definitely sharper with Geometery Correction is off. This is one of those compromises I made with the last set as well. I will take the sharper picture and deal with the imperfect geometry.

Yes, the vertical vertical axis viewing on the 92" is suprisingly good compared to the matte screen 82"...

I wonder if there are new models coming out for 2012. Direct Buy just sent me a speical offer. They are either giving them a good deal or dumping them for new models. They are less than half of retail for the 92840.

Well, that's certainly true. If you want custom w/o pressboard, I'd say you'd have to spend at least triple that amount...

Hopefully with improvements! Any info on what we might see in the next release?