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CRE X1000 Worlds First 3 LED 3 LCD 1080p Projector..Anybody heard of these guys? - Page 37

post #1081 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laredo View Post

Thank you for the day & night pictures Dave.

This projector is now back on my Xmas list.

Is it just my monitor or is there sort of a blue/red predominance. Did not see
a lot of rich green in the picture content.

Have owned or had older projectors that cost more that did not look as good as this already does in your photos.

Again, thank you for your time and work.

yup, no green and tons o blue, it seems .
post #1082 of 1270
the new hybreds are using the 2 leds for red and blue and blue laser with a filter for green for a reason the green led just cant put out the lumens it seems.
post #1083 of 1270
Has it been determined whether the latest iteration of this projector has the ability to tune the colors with a color management system? I've read earlier posts and it is not clear. Seems like the answer is no.
post #1084 of 1270
Doesn't seem to be able to produce any black
post #1085 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by eat meat View Post

yup, no green and tons o blue, it seems .

A couple things to keep in mind:

1. I'm projecting on a light grey/bluish wall, not intended for projector use, so you'll probably see more blue than if it was projecting on a nice screen, or even just a plain white wall.

2. I'm using just a simple point and shoot canon powershot for these photos which is not known for taking good indoor pictures, let alone night photos. 2b, I'm not a photographer, thus the point and shoot camera

3. There wasn't a whole lot of green content in the main video samples.

Here's three pics of a sample photo with more color variation from http://www.pbase.com/jackcnd/image/91065360





post #1086 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackB View Post

Has it been determined whether the latest iteration of this projector has the ability to tune the colors with a color management system? I've read earlier posts and it is not clear. Seems like the answer is no.

With the Field/Service Menu

you can adjust the

RGBLowEnd: (Bias, Offset, Cuts, Cutoff, Sub-brightness, RGB brightness)
RGBHighEnd: (Drive, Gain, Sub-contrast, RGB contrast)

i've verified this myself by opening one red, green, and blue step image and adjusting the RGB, and RGB offset values and watching one side or the other of the step image change as I adjust the value (0-255).
post #1087 of 1270
bhch-dave
I just got my projector last week and tried several different settings and not really happy with the picture. I have not used the service menu yet.
I am not a professional so i am a little careful with it. Do navigate it the same as the regular menu? Do you have any suggestions as to what settings I should try? Any suggestions would be very helpful.
Thanks tvjunkie17
post #1088 of 1270
I've watched quite a few Blu-Rays on this projector and every night I'm simply rewarded with newfound awe at how amazing everything looks time and time again. It's substantially quieter than any other projector I've used, it's bright enough to use during the day and is just breathtaking at night/in a dark room/man cave.

I had been looking for quite some time for a native 1080p LED Projector that wasn't over $10k. As far as I know, the CRE brands are the only ones on the market right now. (it's the only 1080p LED LCD projector, the other more expensive ones use DLP)

Finally a High Quality projector, at a price I can afford, that doesn't need new bulbs each year.

I don't understand what the other guy's complaint about the filter is all about, also if you have your own calibration equipment, there are posts online that will tell you how to access the service menu.

I'm definitely thinking about picking up a second one of these (again, the px model for the shorter throw), current one is for the living room HTPC, but now the cave is needing some attention one, the question is do I have enough room to replace the three gaming monitors in the man cave...
post #1089 of 1270
Quote:


Brightness 2800Lumens
Contrast Ratio 50,000:1
CRE X1000

http://chuangrong.en.alibaba.com/pro...projector.html

Quote:


Brightness 3000lumens
Contrast Ratio 100,000:1
CRE X1000

http://chuangrong.en.alibaba.com/pro...or_Beamer.html


when are they gona nail down the specs....
post #1090 of 1270
tvjunkie-17

it sounds like you purchased the nx model, so I don't know if my settings will help you directly. I can tell you exactly what I did though.

I went through this guide first:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=948496 following the pdf instructions.

After I got the regular menu settings to about as good as I could, I took a look at the service menu.

I don't have any fancy calibration equipment, if you did, or are planning on getting some, you may want to look at this guide http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10457 I'm sure others could give you much better calibration information than I could, but I can only tell you what I've done.

as far as the factory menu (and keep in mind this is all done using the px model, but i'm guessing your menu is probably very similiar if not identical), press 1, 2, 3, 4, on the remote, then press down twice to navigate to the color temp setting, press right to access it. From here, depending on what color tone you have selected from the regular menu, will determine what initial settings you have. This also means you have 3 customizable presets you can adjust (Normal, Warm, and Cool) For me the normal setting has all the values set at 128 (min of 0 man of 255). so that's the one I used to adjust, because it was easier to set back if I needed to. I loaded up a fullscreen Red step scale image, and adjusted the R value (press down once, to select the R value, press right or left to then adjust the values) until I got the greatest range on the step scale. I then did the same thing with the R offset (press up and down to navigate to the other values, right and left to change them), this time it changed the opposite side of the step scale. I then repeated this process with a blue and green step scale image and adjusted the B and G (and their offsets) values respectively.

I know this is certainly not the most accurate way or method to calibrate a projector, but without equipment, it seemed to work out ok for me.
post #1091 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by eat meat View Post

http://chuangrong.en.alibaba.com/pro...projector.html


http://chuangrong.en.alibaba.com/pro...or_Beamer.html


when are they gona nail down the specs....

it sure looks like those are the sets of specs to the two different models they sell. The PX model is 2800 lumens and 50k:1 contrast ratio along with a shorter throw lens. The NX model is 3000 lumens, 100k:1 contrast ratio and a longer throw lens.

They were originally planning on making an NS model which probably would've been 3000 lumens, 100k:1 contrast ratio and a shorter throw lens, for whatever reason that was put on hold.
post #1092 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laredo View Post

I've watched quite a few Blu-Rays on this projector...

Hey Laredo, pardon me but couldn't you have made it clear that this is someone else's review you copied-and-pasted?

I thought--how'd this guy get this pj in two days and then I realized...
post #1093 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhch-dave View Post

it sure looks like those are the sets of specs to the two different models they sell. The PX model is 2800 lumens and 50k:1 contrast ratio along with a shorter throw lens. The NX model is 3000 lumens, 100k:1 contrast ratio and a longer throw lens.

They were originally planning on making an NS model which probably would've been 3000 lumens, 100k:1 contrast ratio and a shorter throw lens, for whatever reason that was put on hold.

Yet you list both ratios as 1.3; why would anyone buy the PX over the NX.
post #1094 of 1270
I put in the title "Another Amazon Review"

Sorry if that was not specific enough

The only negative review one star review is from "Roving Traveler"
a contributor on this forum who never bought one owned one or saw one. But,
had a compulsion to do a very damaging "Seagull" review.

I haven't given up on this projector and am still thinking of getting one.
post #1095 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laredo View Post

I put in the title "Another Amazon Review"

Sorry if that was not specific enough

The only negative review one star review is from "Roving Traveler"
a contributor on this forum who never bought one owned one or saw one. But,
had a compulsion to do a very damaging "Seagull" review.

I haven't given up on this projector and am still thinking of getting one.

Get over it.

A review were someone says the colors are fairly accurate. I woulde like two people to agree on what fairly accurate means.

Without calibrating most people think their display is amazing because that is what they were told when they bought it or from the reviews of people that have no idea what an accurate display should look like.

People go into, insert store name here, and look at the display with the biggest punch i.e. oversaturated colors or set to sports mode, or torch mode as the store display mode is known and pick it because they think that the display has the best colors.

They are wrong it is not calibrated and it is not even accurate.

I thought my Vidikron was accurate as it was calibrated before I bought it, however when I finally bought my calibration gear it was off. Whether it was off because of the bulb aging or another reason I do not know. All I klnow is I thought it looked amazing, however, once recalibrated it looked the way it should according to standards not my personal opinion.

You still need to go look up seagulling as what comes up has nothing to do with what you are talking about here. (just because you think it means something does not mean it is the excepted meaning) Just like a review based on opinion.
post #1096 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserfan View Post

Yet you list both ratios as 1.3; why would anyone buy the PX over the NX.

Good question, I only have the PX http://www.amazon.com/CRE-X1000PX-Na.../dp/B007RM2E3U and the NX http://www.amazon.com/CRE-X1000NX-Na.../dp/B006OIJQV6 models listed on amazon, the listings on alibaba appear to be from the manufacturer (probably their main sales channel). I believe, the 1.3 figure you mention that I have listed, isn't actually a ratio, but rather an optical zoom power.

Pretty much all the information in my listings are direct from CRE. I didn't have the throw ratio listed, because CRE didn't include that ratio in their data sheet. They did include diagonal measurements at certain distances for both of the projectors, but to calculate throw ratio you also need the projected display width, something CRE hadn't supplied. I could measure and calculate that now for the px model, I just haven't yet.

All that said, to answer your question, I can tell you why I purchased the PX model instead of the NX model. My reasoning and interest in this projector was always for a dual or triple projector setup with my HTPC. Current video cards can easily push the higher resolutions (3840x1080 for dual landscape or 5760x1080 for triple landscape or 2160x1920 dual portrait and 3420x1920 triple portrait). Doing this with projectors eliminates the bezels of monitors. But you either need a big wall to do all three flat (or shrink the display), or you need to curve/angle the outer edges of your screen to accomodate (or just because you want to). The shorter throw of the PX model gives you much greater flexibility in doing this with projector placement. The room my projector is going in is rectangular shaped, on the shorter walls, the NX would've been fine, but on the two long sides, I really would've been pressed for room to get the size I wanted. The other benefit of the shorter throw is that because the projector is closer to the wall, for the picture size, compared to a longer throw lens projector, you tend to see more lumens on the wall as there's a shorter path for the light to travel and get dispersed.

In summary, to me the short throw lens was more important than the 200 extra lumens or the additional contrast. Ideally I was hoping to get the NS model but since that was shelved in development, I decided the PX would suffice, so far I've been quite content.
post #1097 of 1270
Thank You bhch-dave for the information on settings. I am still a little leery to play with them. I looked at it and my settings are 128 also and I have the NX model. Right now I am using the dynamic preset with a lower saturation and is looking very good. Can you adjust the contrast and brightness from this menu? For general information I bought my projector directly from Hans and I got it in 3 days from Honk Kong to my door in Florida. When I tried to buy it from Alibaba they had a problem with my credit card even though I had the credit card company on the phone helping me with the transaction but it failed and Hans emailed me with the option to pay him with paypal which I did and it was a very smooth transaction.
post #1098 of 1270
I am thinking of ordering one of these to play with.

I throw from overhead 11.5 feet to a Stewart 100" Blackhawk screen.

I currently have an Epson 6500UB with a zoom ration of 2:1:1

Which CRE X1000 model best fits this throw?

Thanks.....
post #1099 of 1270
I'd asked about the differences:

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhch-dave View Post

Good question, I only have the PX... the shorter throw of the PX model gives you much greater flexibility...

Thanks for the explanation--I guess I didn't find the specifics relative to "distance from pj to screen" for the PX and the NX. I suppose you get that by comparing the user guides...?
post #1100 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhch-dave View Post

Also took some night shots:

Full Set Here http://www.flickr.com/photos/7926221...7629922931345/

Thanks for posting the photos and other info about the CRE projector. Too rich for my blood in terms of price, but at least gives hope eventually some budget priced LED projectors will be available with similar qualities. Also I get that some folks want the perfect color specs etc. But other folks like me primarily want a big image size and reliability with a decent picture, and don't have a problem accepting colors etc that are not perfect.
post #1101 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by tvjunkie-17 View Post

Right now I am using the dynamic preset with a lower saturation and is looking very good. Can you adjust the contrast and brightness from this menu?

That's very exciting to hear!

You can adjust the contrast and brightness from the service menu, as well as many other (if not all) regular menu settings.

To adjust contrast and brightness, enter the service menu (1,2,3,4) press down once to select PIC MODE, press right to access pic mode. From here you can adjust the different picture mode profiles: USER, STANDARD, DYNAMIC, and SOFT (in my case I have "user" set) and their settings: CONTRAST, BRIGHTNESS, SATURATION, SHARPNESS.

I actually just went back to check the brightness and contrast after adjusting the gains and offsets the other day and fine tuned them even more, I'm very pleased.
post #1102 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laredo View Post

I throw from overhead 11.5 feet to a Stewart 100" Blackhawk screen.

Which CRE X1000 model best fits this throw?

Ok, I believe the distances were posted a while back by someone else. Here they are again though.

this one from Hans:

this one from the manual:


at first it's a little confusing, they give us the diagonal in inches, and the projector distance in meters... Anyway, 11.5 ft turns out to be about 3.5 meters.

with the NX(L) model at 11.5 feet (3.5 meters) we'll get a diagonal screen size of 76 inches and can zoom up to 92 inches, with the PX model at 11.5 feet (3.5 meters) we'll get a diagonal screen size of 112 inches and can zoom up to 135.

To get your 100 inch diagonal, with the PX you'll want the projector about 9 1/2 feet away, with the NX you'll want the projector about 12 1/2 feet away (give or take a few inches).
post #1103 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserfan View Post

I suppose you get that by comparing the user guides...?

Because it wasn't directly listed in the manufacturers information, I specifically included either "long throw" or "short throw" in the listing title, and technical details of both the listings. When I get a chance to calculate the throw rations, I'll update the listings to include that as well.
post #1104 of 1270
Here's some shots from me readjusting the brightness and contrast (all calibration was eyeballed, nothing fancy).

all steps visible


all red and green steps visible, the blue steps were visible to about 4 bars to the end.
post #1105 of 1270
This projector is looking better and better as time goes on. I believe that one of the previous concerns mentioned was the ability to tweak the color settings. It looks like this service menu option solves that issue even though it is not commonly known,,,,, YET.
It looks like we have a projector that lasts a lifetime,,,, is whisper quiet and has the ability to be tweaked.
My only concerns at this point would be the inorganic panel availability should they ever need to be replaced. I would also add that this projector has had to undergo some SEVERE Beta testing through sites like this one that are full of opinionated doubting Thomas's and so far it has exceeded expectations pretty well considering the fact that it doesn't require a lamp and it priced within the typical users price range. It is understandable that some people with conventional lamp based projectors would react harshly to its presence in the market since it muffles many of their bragging rights. The thing that usually goes unmentioned when making comparisons between this projector and lamp based projectors is that the lamp based projector images are constantly degrading as the lamp ages while this one keeps the SAME image. This bring to mind the story of turtle and the hair race except at the end of this race the Hair is barley visible or somewhere along the race the hair explodes.

Bohanna
post #1106 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhch-dave View Post

I believe the distances were posted a while back by someone else. Here they are again though.

You're probably right, I've lost track of this thread several times, sorry.

Is the heavy BLUE in your screenshots real, or the fault of the camera?? As posted they don't appear to have any grey at all. I suppose there are screenshots here somewhere of a B&W movie...
post #1107 of 1270
If you can tune the gains and offsets of the RGB with calibration equipment does this means that you can always get the picture to be close to spot on? Or, is there a great deal of dependence on the factory settings of the LEDs to achieve this spot on calibrated picture? I was wondering if, like some calibration reports on other video displays I have read, you may not be able to get a spot on picture because the factory mis-engineered the engine. I hope this question(s) make sense.
post #1108 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackB View Post

If you can tune the gains and offsets of the RGB with calibration equipment does this means that you can always get the picture to be close to spot on? Or, is there a great deal of dependence on the factory settings of the LEDs to achieve this spot on calibrated picture? I was wondering if, like some calibration reports on other video displays I have read, you may not be able to get a spot on picture because the factory mis-engineered the engine. I hope this question(s) make sense.

These LEDS can do the correct sat, lum, and hue so it is not limited as some projectors or displays.

The driver they use to "drive" the LEDs will have limits, however, a decent driver will allow for over saturated colors and then the factory or the end user can adjust the colors into proper REC-709 or whatever standard they want.

This also assumes that the factory or service menu does not run out of adjustment to correct Hue, Sat, and Lum. ( I calibrated a MITS HC-4000 and ran out of Hue adjustment... it was close but the menu did not allow for enough correction) Only someone with gear can determine if this projector is able to be calibrated to REC-709... close without gear is close.

Also this is a two point color (really gray scale) calibration usually considered 30% IRE and 80% IRE. This will get close to great results, and for the price is a very good amount of calibration. Higher end prjectors can calibrate more points for color really gray scale.

The next question is the gamma curve... is it setable and if not what is it set at? 2.2, 2.0, 2.35, 2.5?
Gamma makes a very big difference when watching a movie go from dark to bright and vice versa.
post #1109 of 1270
The RGB-gain and RGB-offset controls, currently available on this projector, are normally used for basic greyscale calibration. With a black and white picture, the RGB controls are adjusted until white looks white and black looks black without any color tint. When this is done, the three primary colors, RGB, are in their correct mix.

To be able to calibrate the colors to the Rec709 standard, the projector needs to provide a more complex 6-point Full Color Management System (CMS) that allows for the individual adjustment of the three primary colors (RED, GREEN, BLUE) and three secondary colors (YELLOW, CYAN, MAGENTA) to the level and accuracy required. This involves the use of special calibration software and instrument.
post #1110 of 1270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserfan View Post

You're probably right, I've lost track of this thread several times, sorry.

Is the heavy BLUE in your screenshots real, or the fault of the camera?? As posted they don't appear to have any grey at all. I suppose there are screenshots here somewhere of a B&W movie...

the camera doesn't seem to pick up all the steps, with my eyes, i can see all the white, red and green steps, the blue is the only one i can't see all of, there are 4 steps on the far right of the blue lines, that I don't see an edge to.
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