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JVC RS40/X3 Calibration Thread - Page 11

post #301 of 431
6/7/11 at 9:26am
Once I get more hours on the bulb I will do a more detailed calibration. With the VideoEQ I should be able to get the gamma better. I also plan to try out different gamma curves. I can store 4 presets, so could easily have 2-3 different curves for different material.

CalMAN 4 can only do 100% saturation levels, but I know that they are working on adding that feature. I need to look into calculating what the other saturation levels should be and testing them manually.

I believe that the VideoEq just assumes that everything is linear from 0-100% saturation levels.
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post #302 of 431
6/7/11 at 9:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeerGuy View Post

Once I get more hours on the bulb I will do a more detailed calibration.

Sounds great. I look forward to your results, and your quick calibration already netted very high end results. Bravo.

Dan
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post #303 of 431
6/7/11 at 4:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by zbroke View Post

- Hours: 752
- Delivery: Dec 8th 2010
- Screen size: 128"
- Throw lens/screen: 14' give or take a few inches...
- Natural mode
- Color space: normal
- Gamma normal
- High Lamp
- Iris fully open (0)
- I did a very quick calibration from white levels (using the Lumagen mini)

I did not do an ANSI reading cause I was running against the clock.

The reading at center screen shows 115 lux or 519 Lumens.

- Same settings described above
- Took my measurement upon startup (no warm-up time)
- Using Lumangen mini - user setting 4 [means nothing to you guys but it's just for my reference down the line]
- 995 Hours on the clock.

Center screen is showing 85.9 lux or 388 Lumens. A 34% drop in 250 hours. It caught me offguard. Gotta be honest, I'm still using Normal lamp with aperture at -7 although I'm probably opening it to -5 later tonight. I'm still very happy and my brain is certainly not registering a 34% drop.

Go Mavs!
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post #304 of 431
6/7/11 at 4:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by zbroke View Post

- Same settings described above
- Took my measurement upon startup (no warm-up time)
- Using Lumangen mini - user setting 4 [means nothing to you guys but it's just for my reference down the line]
- 995 Hours on the clock.

Center screen is showing 85.9 lux or 388 Lumens. A 34% drop in 250 hours. It caught me offguard. Gotta be honest, I'm still using Normal lamp with aperture at -7 although I'm probably opening it to -5 later tonight. I'm still very happy and my brain is certainly not registering a 34% drop.

Go Mavs!

Hi,

Thanks for the update.

Doesn't that mean you are probably only getting roughly 250 lumens in your normal viewing? If I recall correctly you are using a 1.3 gain screen. Have you given up on watching 3D? If not, how much crosstalk are you experiencing?

Thanks again.

Larry
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post #305 of 431
6/10/11 at 7:51am
I've searched the thread but couldn't find a specific answer.

I just recieved my RS40 and I'm looking to do an intial calibration. I have an old Avai calibration DVD and I'm using a fat PS3 as a bluray player. I know the Avai DVD will not be ideal but will it give me any major errors if I'm just using it to do simple calibration on contrast, brightness, and color?

I have a Spyder 3 Pro I use to calibrate my computer monitor but I believe this unit can not be used to accurately calibrate a projector correct?

I don't have a laptop but are there any Ipad calibration apps or programs out?
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post #306 of 431
6/10/11 at 2:17pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by npc2396 View Post

I've searched the thread but couldn't find a specific answer.

I just recieved my RS40 and I'm looking to do an intial calibration. I have an old Avai calibration DVD and I'm using a fat PS3 as a bluray player. I know the Avai DVD will not be ideal but will it give me any major errors if I'm just using it to do simple calibration on contrast, brightness, and color?

I have a Spyder 3 Pro I use to calibrate my computer monitor but I believe this unit can not be used to accurately calibrate a projector correct?

I don't have a laptop but are there any Ipad calibration apps or programs out?

If you have access to a PC with a DVD burner, then your best choice for a calibration disc is to simply download the ISO image file for the "AVS HD Calibration Disc" (link provided in Post #1 of this thread):

(1) download the AVCHD version; (2) extract the ISO image file; (3 ) then burn a DVD using IMGBURN or NERO.

This disc will play on your PS3 with full HD resolution.

As far as low cost colorimeters go, the Eye One Display 2 LT (about $150) is considered better than the Spyder 3. Really accurate calibration sensors start at near $1K (e.g., Eye One Pro). Check out the info and the links in Post #1 of this thread.
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post #307 of 431
6/10/11 at 2:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

Really accurate calibration sensors start at near $1K (e.g., Eye One Pro).

You forgot the Chroma 5
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post #308 of 431
6/10/11 at 3:18pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nudgiator View Post

You forgot the Chroma 5

I don't know that the Chroma 5 is really all that accurate on its own. However you can pay to get one that has been calibrated for use with specific calibration software (i.e., ChromaPure which has a feature to support calibration tables). You can also pay to have a Eye One LT calibrated for use with this same software. As for having the sensor itself being and remaining accurate, I believe that the Eye One Pro is generally accepted as being more accurate and stable over time than the either the Eye One LT or the Chroma 5.

That being said, I do agree that if you purchase the ChromaPure software along with a calibrated Chroma 5 it can provide accurate calibrations for a total cost of well under $1K.
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post #309 of 431
6/15/11 at 11:52am
I posted this in the Display Calibration side. In case you don't make it their. I thought this really relevant to the RS40/X3.

I have the VideoEQ pro which I think they stopped marketing.

But in thinking of getting a RS40/X3 and having 3d, the VideoEQ is only 1.3 hdmi compliant. How will this effect 3d? (and why do they say the VEQ is 3D?)The Lumagen RadianceMini 3D is 1.4.

And whats the advantage of one over the other if you don't mind. Looks like 1.3 HDMI vrs 1.4 HDMI. Seems the VideoEQ is falling out of favor.

Dave
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post #310 of 431
6/15/11 at 12:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hagar View Post

But in thinking of getting a RS40/X3 and having 3d, the VideoEQ is only 1.3 hdmi compliant. How will this effect 3d? (and why do they say the VEQ is 3D?)The Lumagen RadianceMini 3D is 1.4.

ALL Radiances use a HDMI 1.3-chip. I am owner of a Lumagen Radiance XE with 3D add-on. 3D works perfect. For your info: at the moment there are no HDMI 1.4 chips available. But HDMI 1.4 is very similar to HDMI 1.3. Therefore it's possible to use 3D also with a HDMI 1.3 chip. But a firmware update is necessary.
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post #311 of 431
6/15/11 at 12:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

I don't know that the Chroma 5 is really all that accurate on its own.

The Chroma 5 is calibrated and NIST certificated ex factory. It's nearly as accurate as the i1pro. I own both, a Chroma 5 and an i1pro and have checked it.

Quote:


However you can pay to get one that has been calibrated for use with specific calibration software (i.e., ChromaPure which has a feature to support calibration tables). You can also pay to have a Eye One LT calibrated for use with this same software.

That's IMHO not necessary at the beginning of the sensors life cycle.

Quote:


As for having the sensor itself being and remaining accurate, I believe that the Eye One Pro is generally accepted as being more accurate and stable over time than the either the Eye One LT or the Chroma 5.

Yep, that's true. You should always keep the sensor dry, store it dark and not so warm.
I use my i1pro only for profiling the Chroma 5. The Chroma 5 is much more faster than the i1pro and needs no dark calibration. With the Chroma 5 it's also possible to read 10 IRE accurate BEHIND 3D-glasses while measuring REFLECTIVE ! That's IMPOSSIBLE with an i1pro.
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post #312 of 431
6/15/11 at 7:45pm
I understand that the RS 40 does not have the same color calibration options as the RS 60. Can this be overcome with an AVR that has a built in ISF Video calibration like the new Onkyo TX-NR1009?

Thanks.
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post #313 of 431
6/15/11 at 8:06pm
You can adjust the gamut of the RS40 via the service menu
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post #314 of 431
6/15/11 at 10:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KallanOz View Post

I understand that the RS 40 does not have the same color calibration options as the RS 60. Can this be overcome with an AVR that has a built in ISF Video calibration like the new Onkyo TX-NR1009?

Thanks.

I recall the isf menu on my 906 was for primaries only, I have never used it and wonder how accurate it was, same as RS50/60 having CMS but how well it's designed is another issue.
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post #315 of 431
6/16/11 at 10:14am

I haven't tried it myself, but reports here have been that while the RS40 service menu can adjust the color points some, the banding and other artifacts it causes make it a less pleasing picture than without adjustment.

EDIT: not sure this is true anymore
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post #316 of 431
6/16/11 at 10:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobearQSI View Post

I haven't tried it myself, but reports here have been that while the RS40 service menu can adjust the color points some, the banding and other artifacts it causes make it a less pleasing picture than without adjustment. Here's one such report:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post19863293

Are you talking about gamma, or gamut? The post you linked to is talking about the gamma corrections, right?
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post #317 of 431
6/16/11 at 11:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobearQSI View Post
I haven't tried it myself, but reports here have been that while the RS40 service menu can adjust the color points some, the banding and other artifacts it causes make it a less pleasing picture than without adjustment. Here's one such report:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post19863293
That's no problem when you choose a gamut preset which lies near Rec.709 like the STANDARD preset.
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post #318 of 431
6/16/11 at 11:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shagg View Post
Are you talking about gamma, or gamut? The post you linked to is talking about the gamma corrections, right?
Oops - I was talking about gamut, but the post I linked to was gamma.

I remember some discussion here about the RS40 service menu color adjustments doing more harm than good (ie, they adjust the color points at the edge of the triangle well, but wreak havoc on colors in the middle). But, I also could have confused other discussion with that as well.

I edited my original post and removed the link. What's the general consensus here? If you have a meter, is it better to tweak the RS40 service menu gamut adjustments, or does it look better if left alone?
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post #319 of 431
6/16/11 at 7:45pm
So their is no advantage to getting an avr that has ISF?
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post #320 of 431
6/17/11 at 12:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by KallanOz View Post

So their is no advantage to getting an avr that has ISF?

For full calibration I would say no.
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post #321 of 431
6/21/11 at 6:20am
Thread Starter 
I've updated Post #1 of this thread to include info and a link for the new X-rite i1 Display Pro III (also called i1 Display 3 by some dealers), It is scheduled to begin shipping in July. This new model of colorimeter has a MSRP in the same ballpark as the Display 2 and is said to have much better accuracy than the Display 2 and less change of accuracy over time (as compared to either the Display 2 or the Chroma 5). HERE is the manufacturer's link. Tom, at ChromaPure, had some good things to say about this new model - LINK.
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post #322 of 431
6/21/11 at 10:50pm
The 'non contact' nature mentioned by Tom is very interesting, how would it differs in operation when measuring a front projector than say an i1Pro?
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post #323 of 431
6/24/11 at 6:35am
Thread Starter 
Tom Huffman in another thread posted the following important info concerning the new X-rite colorimeters:
____________________________________________________________ ____________
Information on X-Rite i1 Display Pro III colorimeter and compatable software:
"I just had a lengthy discussion with X-Rite, and here's what I learned. There are actually 3 versions of this meter--ColorMunki, i1 Display Pro III retail, and an i1 Display Pro III OEM.
  • The ColorMunki and Display Pro retail are for the retail market only and are designed to work with the included X-Rite software for monitor profiling.
  • The retail versions will NOT function in ChromaPure or any other vendor's software other than X-Rite. Only the OEM version will work because the code in ChromaPure includes a password for enabling it.
  • The retail and OEM versions of the i1 Display Pro are otherwise identical.
  • If you want to use this meter with ChromaPure, then you have to obtain the meter from ChromaPure directly, one of my partners (e.g. AVS), or another OEM vendor. Versions of this meter obtained in the retail market will not work."
The OEM version of the i1 Display Pro III is expected to begin shipping around mid-July 2011. ____________________________________________________________ _____________

I have updated Post #1 of this thread to include the above information.

Also the AV Science Store is now selling the i1 Display Pro III (OEM)/ChromaPure packages (LINK). The orders thru AVS will be passed on to Tom at ChromaPure to ship.
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post #324 of 431
6/27/11 at 1:27pm
Can someone give a few more details on using the lux meter? 1, should I be using it on a 100ire test pattern screen or something?

Also is there some other way to convert lux into lumens? Because that spread sheet tell me nothing, I can't edit it in any way either since I don't own Excel.
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post #325 of 431
6/27/11 at 1:50pm
1. Use a 100 IRE field pattern
2. lumen = lux * screensize
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post #326 of 431
6/27/11 at 2:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nudgiator View Post

1. Use a 100 IRE field pattern
2. lumen = lux * screensize

I think you meant screen square area, where screen area is in square meters.

for sq feet lumen = lux*screenarea/10.76
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post #327 of 431
6/28/11 at 7:43am
I made a Window's program that will convert from measured lux to lumens, fL and nits for a given screen size.

 

Luminosity Calc.zip 6.330078125k . file
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post #328 of 431
6/28/11 at 7:52am
Ah thats precicely what I needed, thanks! So now I just take 9 measurements on different parts of the green(grid like pattern), and average them out?
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post #329 of 431
6/28/11 at 8:01am
If all you want is the change in brightness of your bulb over time, then just take a single reading in the center of the screen.
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post #330 of 431
6/28/11 at 8:24am
Right on, thanks pal.
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