4k by 2k or Quad HD...lots of rumors? thoughts? - Page 69

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

No references to back up your claims.

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

Why would I need any references? It's a known fact!

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

Your facts are based on news reports? ROFLMAO!!! The only item that is not available is the h.265, because it hasn't been released. The other items are available now.
Just need to deal with the companies that develop the product. Know a little a bit about satellites and how to setup a system.

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

Actually, the link tells you what is available in your area. For example, 8mile13 is in Europe, if I recall correctly. SES has Europe covered with satellites, but he have to do some research on what satellites are available to him. USA is not as well covered as Europe.

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

Cripes! How obtuse can you be!
THERE ARE NO 2160P SATELLITE TRANSMISSONS BEING DONE TODAY.
And none of your links says any different. I would laugh but your sheer obstinance is nothing short of pitiful.
Talking to you is like trying to nail JELL-O to the wall!

SES worked in collaboration with Sony to transmit live 4K content at the show. The dedicated video channel was uplinked from the SES headquarters in Luxembourg via the ASTRA Satellite System. The 4K programming, captured with a Sony F65 camera, was encoded and played out in the “Quad HD” format in the Sony and SES exhibit booths, using the H.264 compression standard, at a data rate of 50 Mb/s.
http://broadcastengineering.com/shows/disappointing-3-d-tv-sales-make-4k-next-big-thing

Sony Corp prototyped a system that enables to transmit 4k (3,840 x 2,160-pixel) video in real time via a satellite connection.

The company demonstrated the transmission of 4k video at IBC 2012, which runs from Sept 6 to 11, 2012, in Amsterdam, the Netherlands. This is the first time that such a transmission has been demonstrated in public.

Sony realized the system in collaboration with SES S.A., a Luxembourg-based major satellite distribution firm. From a base of SES in Luxembourg, an edited 4k video content was transmitted in the "DVB-S2" format via a satellite. With the H.264 technology, the 4k video was compressed to 50Mbps.

The real-time 4k video transmission system announced this time has a transmission rate of 50Mbps with the H.264 technology. But Sony aims to increase the compression rate to realize a transmission rate of 10M to 20Mbps. Also, for satellite connection, it plans to enable a two-channel transmission with one transponder.
http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/english/NEWS_EN/20120911/239254/

Originally Posted by sytech 

Why would there be any 2160p satellite broadcast today. There are no direct view 4K available to purchase yet and Sony has sold maybe a few hundred thousand 4K projectors world wide.

Sony has demo 2160p 4K satellite transmissions using existing h.264 at 50 Mbps and fully expects h.265 to cut it down to 20 Mbps. So obviously there are no technical hurdles to overcome. It will just take a few years until it will be financially it worth for DirecTV/Dish to start transmitting. It will take almost the same space as broadcasting a regular 1080p channel. The content from the studios will already be in 4K so DirecTV and DIsh cost will be the same as broadcasting a HD signal. ESPN will probably also be one of the first to make investment in 4K/8K cameras and could start send out 4K material also in the next few years.

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

THERE ARE NO 2160P SATELLITE TRANSMISSONS BEING DONE TODAY.

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

Talking to you is like trying to nail JELL-O to the wall!

Originally Posted by sytech 

Why would there be any 2160p satellite broadcast today. There are no direct view 4K available to purchase yet and Sony has sold maybe a few hundred thousand 4K projectors world wide. .

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

Wrong! Do you realize that 4k is transmitted via satellite to theaters? The first transmission was done in 2004.
http://www.cbc-raleigh.com/capcom/news/2004/microspace_04/digital_cinema_delivery/digital_cinema_delivery.htm
Sony is also involved with Microspace as well.
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/sony-selects-microspace-to-deliver-first-4k-digital-feature-via-satellite-52153247.html
Then you have lot of testing for UHDTV 4k via satellite. Here is a paper of a test in 2008. Yes, it UHDTV via KA band. I hope you poster realize on the investment that is being made with UHDTV, it is most likely in the Billions. None of you seem to realize on
http://arc.aiaa.org/doi/abs/10.2514/6.2011-8044
Another article, but does show another 4k TV, that has been out since 2010. http://www.tvtechnology.com/article/focusing-on-uhdtv/214105
Every time I see you posts, they are always negative. Reminds me of Ghostbusters for some reason....

Originally Posted by 8mile13 

I live in west -europe receive Astra1, Astra2, Astra3 + Hotbird on my dish.
Astra1
http://nl.kingofsat.net/pos-19.2E.php
Astra2
http://en.kingofsat.net/pos-28.2E.php
Astra3
http://nl.kingofsat.net/pos-23.5E.php
Hotbird
http://nl.kingofsat.net/pos-13E.php

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

Actually, there is quite a few brands other than Sony that have 4k now. Here is a monitor that was sold in 2010. http://www.tvlogicusa.com/product/product.php?model=LQM-071W#

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

That 56" 4K Monitor is a PROFESSIONAL grade monitor. It sells/sold for $66,000!
http://vidkey.com/564kmonitor3840x216010bitlcdpanelxvp4xhdmiinputand4xhd3gsdiinput-lum-560w.aspx
Why in the world do you continue to post links to professional grade equipment? Consumers aren't going to buy something like that. Not now, not ever.

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

I own Professional equipment, and so does many on this forum. The quality is much better than consumer brand. If the consumer know about the pro equipment, then they might buy it.
There has always been two tiers to audio/video equipment.

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

No - consumers won't buy professional display equipment no matter how many links you show. They are frightfully expensive, have features that are specifically designed for professional applications and most of the time, use connectors that are not found on consumer grade source devices.
Showing a Sony or LG 84" 4K TV even with prices of $20,000 to $25,000 is totally different than showing a 56" 4K Monitor that sells/sold for $66,000. And once you realize that, then maybe you will stop posting the BS links to professional equipment and make believe like they are selling them to consumers.

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

The 4k market from 2008 to present has been in the professional market. In 2013, it is finally making it to Consumers. There is variety of buyers, so it is their decision on what to buy. Your average consumer won't be coming to avsforum, they will go to the dealer to check out the TV. The 4k TV will be sold at high end audio stores, and not you local Sam's, Walmart or Target. The high end audio video stores will show the consumer the professional models as well. My dealer showed me the Pansonic Pro's, and my dealer has given me great deals on new equipment. So, keep your opinions to yourself.

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

So you think that neither LG nor Sony are going to have their new 4K TVs sold at Best Buy? Mass market consumers do shop at Best Buy you know. They also shop at Sony Style Stores where I am sure Sony will have their 4K TV set up.
And it delights me to offer my opinions especially when it comes to you because you or a dozen like you do not represent a meaningful segment of the marketplace.

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

LG has added their 3D 84" 4K TV to their website:
http://www.lg.com/us/tvs/lg-84LM9600-led-tv

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

Does LG have 4k content like Sony or Red? No! Here is a company that delivers 4k content to the theaters now via satellite. http://www.microspace.com/ Have you heard about Nirvanx cloud storage? http://www.nirvanix.com/news-events/press-releases/2012/2012-04-09.aspx
"San Diego, April 9, 2012 – Nirvanix, the leading provider of enterprise-class cloud storage services, today announced that it is featuring a promotional offer of 1TB of cloud storage for free for 30 days to qualified NAB Show 2012 attendees. This offer enables companies to test drive cloud storage and experience its benefits without making a financial commitment.
Cloud test drivers can join the rapidly growing number of media and entertainment companies that are already using Nirvanix public, hybrid and private cloud storage services. These companies are using Nirvanix technology for secure petabyte-scale digital backup and archival, workflow, content collaboration and distribution across the globe of a massive number and variety of file types from 3D movies and HD video, 2K/4K/8K/IMAX files to CGI elements, MPEGs and JPEGs."
Well, LG, needs to spend money on working with companies that can deliver the content. Sony & RED are doing that. The only issue that should have been resolved is HEVC h.265. This is like building a new car and forgetting to install the software in the computer.
http://hometheaterreview.com/could-h265-compression-bring-4k-to-blu-ray-andor-streaming-media/
Does the new TV sets have h.264 or h.265 decoders in them? Perhaps the new TV's can be upgraded? Probably not, they want to sell you a new set every 2 years.

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

Disney Partners With LG Offering 3D Movie Rentals
http://www.homemediamagazine.com/disney/disney-partners-lg-offering-3d-movie-rentals-28511

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart 

DIRECTV: All Channels Will Be HD In 2016
http://www.tvpredictions.com/dhd100112.htm

Philip J. Goswitz, SVP, Space & Communications / Technology Development for DirectTV, Inc. indicated that the satellite pay-TV company will be increasing its efforts to offer Ultra-HDTV transmissions by 2016, and begin switching off any remaining vestiges of the old Standard-Def spectrum in favor of full HD channels.

Goswitz, speaking at the Euroconsult conference last month, was able to forecast a 2016 rollout of U-HDTV based on DirectTV’s current commitment to switch its SD channels (currently using Ku-band frequencies) to their local-to-local Ka-band frequencies.
...

Originally Posted by rogo 

These are the same DirecTV people who have footdragged on offering core channels in HD for many, many years? I'll believe it when I see it. AMC just became available in HD recently on DirecTV. Cooking Channel, among many others, still isn't. Hard to take them seriously on this topic.

Originally Posted by dr1394 

You're kidding right? ATSC (of any version) is a joke and everyone knows it.

Originally Posted by kevinsert 

lol if anyone bought 4K tv on this thread..now you should get Red /Alexa camera and few PL mount lenses(each one is 25K ).then start shooting your own Honey Boo Boo @4K show for yourself..

Originally Posted by Nitro67 

You should be setup for the future. So have you bought the 4k Monitor yet? Are you going to wait for 8K?

Originally Posted by coolscan 

I understand that you mean to be ironic, but to just correct some misapprehensions.
The Alexa is a 2K camera (3.2k sensor) so it's not useful for 4K content unless you want to upconvert.
The Red cameras can use DSLR lenses from Canon, Nikon and Leica, so no need for expensive PL-mount cine glass.
In addition to Red and Sony Pro 4K-6K cameras you also have Semi-pro 4K cameras from Canon (C500&1D-C), Sony(fs700) and JVC.
You will still need deep pockets to produce your own 4K content.

Originally Posted by 8mile13 

I will buy a 4K 50'' OLED Do not have a 4K monitor.

Originally Posted by kevinsert 

dude i have red epic and so many lenses even canon l primes for 5d mark iii.

you think i dont know canon c100 c500 and sony cameras,they are not in same line with red and arri believe me.

Alexa will record 4k with upgrade dont worry camera or sensor doesnt need to be real 4k for this.

there is already 4k prores support on quicktime.

so i think you are crazy for K's too but believe its not about resolution.dynamic range color space etc. more important then res!!

and alexa is far ahead better than Epic even with 2k.

you cant tell difference between 2k 4k even on big cinema screen from usual distance.im on the phone now gotta find that tech. research about this in soon and post it here..

Originally Posted by coolscan 

Yeah sure. You probably know how to use the Epic too. I know, and I didn't put C500 and fs700 in the same category. I didn't mention the C100, as it's a 2K camera. No it won't.
There will be no 4K from Arri before they release a new 4K camera.
Arri has said so themselves. So what? You can't use 4K prores on Alexa files unless you up-convert the material first. Yeah, let's mediately dilute the idea that you need a 4K sensor (or preferably higher) camera for shooting 4K. Yeah, let me get dragged into an endless discussion with a Alexa fanboy about which is the best camera.
Sell your Epic (if you really own one) and buy a Alexa if it such a wonder camera. That's rubbish.
Had you followed this thread and other threads on AVS you would have seen this have been disputed a long time ago. We are past that discussion looong ago.
Only Alexa fanboys and DP's shooting with it still claim "2K is good enough" to defend their choice (or stupidity).
Let's cheer Arri on for their effort in not pushing image quality forward

My only point of my former post was to correct you on the notion that Alexa isn't a 4K camera, not to end up in a stupid discussion on the merit of general camera technology.

...
Support for 10-bit bit-depth is becoming very important in many mass market applications, especially related to 1080p HD and UHDTV, including the following examples:

• The bit depth supported by the ITU-R BT. 2020 recommendation on UHDTV is 10 or 12 bits (8 bits is not supported at the moment).
• Content producers are mastering and archiving 1080p HD content in 10-bit bit-depth.
• Support for 10-bit bit-depth is becoming available on consumer display systems. The larger physical size of UHDTV displays, coupled with the wider color gamut and higher dynamic ranges supported by them, may more readily expose the visual artifacts of 8-bit video content.
• Nowadays, many consumer interfaces support 10-bit bit-depth (HDMI1.4a, DisplayPort support 12 bits at least).

Besides, most of the digital video workflow elements now support at least 10-bit, from the acquisition to the rendering. Furthermore, a number of broadcasters (some of them represented on this contribution) evaluating the creation of 1080p HD and UHDTV services have identified the need for a 10-bit profile being able to use HEVC for delivering UHDTV content.
...