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Official OPPO BDP-95 Owner's Thread - Page 277

post #8281 of 11017
what about having both, the 95 & 93? could use the 95 hooked up to an amp to play SACD etc and then use the 93 for bluray movies.
post #8282 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

Generally, the stereo inputs on an AVR will result in an A-D-A conversion, so you're not really getting full benefit of the Oppo's DAC.

The 3312CI has "Stereo/Direct Modes w/Pure Analog Path".
post #8283 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbuthooked View Post

Unfortunately i am using the denon amps for the surrounds so it looks like i am stuck... I guess i should have done some homework befoe pulling the trigger on the oppo. Im sure i will still enjoy it but i hate not being able to get the most out of what you buy.

Maybe you'll get the most from these products by using HDMI. If you are advantageously using Audyssey or bass management, then that tips the scale to HDMI over analog direct.
post #8284 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lotus00 View Post

what about having both, the 95 & 93? could use the 95 hooked up to an amp to play SACD etc and then use the 93 for bluray movies.

Since all outputs are always active, there's no need to have both models. But assuming you're talking about having everything in 1 room, how are you going to deal with all the speakers you'll have connected to the amp and AVR?
post #8285 of 11017
Thanks for the feedback and it has given me something to think about... I really do like the denon but I am within my 30 days if there happened to be a better option that would offer both preouts and multichannel inputs?? Let the research begin (again)
post #8286 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbuthooked View Post

Thanks for the feedback and it has given me something to think about... I really do like the denon but I am within my 30 days if there happened to be a better option that would offer both preouts and multichannel inputs?? Let the research begin (again)

No idea what your budget is, but the Denon 4311CI is an excellent receiver that has both (and if you look around in the deals forum, you can find ways to get it for a LOT less than MSRP). But unless your room has excellent acoustics and won't benefit from Audyssey, I really think you'd be better off forgetting about using the analog outputs and just go with HDMI (and use Audyssey) in which case it would make sense to exchange the 95 for a 93.
post #8287 of 11017
Hmmmmmm, spend more money on a new receiver or actually save money and drop down to the 93. Saving money is not something i have come across during this whole process so it would be nice! Maybe this would be the smart decision and although i'll know it could be sounding better im sure it will still sound great nevertheless. I guess no matter what you have it could always sound better so maybe it is time to just sit back and enjoy. I have to ask though will the sound quality of the 93 via HDMI be much less quality than the 95 via analog? Please feel free to lie to make be feel better

Thanks again
post #8288 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbuthooked View Post
I have to ask though will the sound quality of the 93 via HDMI be much less quality than the 95 via analog? Please feel free to lie to make be feel better
There's really no way to answer that question because it depends on the rest of your system, including your speakers and that all important component - the room everything is in. If your system benefits from Audyssey, then the 93 via HDMI (with Audyssey turned on) will most likely sound better than analog output on the 95 without any room correction.
post #8289 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbuthooked View Post

I have to ask though will the sound quality of the 93 via HDMI be much less quality than the 95 via analog? Please feel free to lie to make be feel better

Thanks again

No it will not be "much less" (or even discernible in most systems). The 93 can functionally do everything the 95 can except it lacks the dedicated stereo outputs. But you can enjoy industry-leading analog audio quality from either one, as well as HDMI and all it offers.

Here's a notion: trade the 95 in for a 93 and use the $500 windfall towards a new AVR or anything else you like.
post #8290 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

Since all outputs are always active, there's no need to have both models. But assuming you're talking about having everything in 1 room, how are you going to deal with all the speakers you'll have connected to the amp and AVR?

Ha yes more speakers! everything terminates in one room which is main listening room (zone 1 - 5.1). Looks like on the onkyo only front high is available for additional speakers. It would be great to use HDMI for bluray and the mutlichannel analog for sacd and my live music collection...
post #8291 of 11017
last question and again i appreciate the help... I fully understand now that i am not taking advantage of the 95's DAC when it comes to multichannel inputs but i am at least benefiting somewhat when i listen to 2 channel? it goes back to having it hooked up from the oppos's FL & FR to the denon's CD input. It seems like the 2 responses i received contradict if in fact setting the denon to pure direct would help or not.
post #8292 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbuthooked View Post

last question and again i appreciate the help... I fully understand now that i am not taking advantage of the 95's DAC when it comes to multichannel inputs but i am at least benefiting somewhat when i listen to 2 channel? it goes back to having it hooked up from the oppos's FL & FR to the denon's CD input. It seems like the 2 responses i received contradict if in fact setting the denon to pure direct would help or not.

Why not do the comparison? Run the stereo inputs thru the Denon CD input using Stereo Direct Pure Analog. That avoids any DSP or conversions. Compare that with digital connections and whatever processing you use. If you like the processed results better, the BDP-93 will serve equally well. If you want analog direct for 5.1, you'll need a new AVR with 5.1 analog bypass and probably want to keep the 95.
post #8293 of 11017
I own the BDP-83 SE Nuforce Edition. Is there anyone who's compared it with the BDP-95? Is there enough of an improvement to justify moving from the BDP-83 NE to the BDP-95?
post #8294 of 11017
This post inspired me to look further. Remuxing is much faster than re-encoding, but it can still take quite a while, particularly if the file is accessed over the network, such as on a NAS.

For a problematic file, I first tried to input a value for the "Video aspect ratio type" field, but it didn't seem to take a standard value (such as simply 2.35). With this an error was thrown.

I came back to this tonight and after comparing a good file that displayed properly, with one that did not, I found that the bad file had no values for the "Video display width" and "Video display height" fields.

Copying the values from the "Video pixel width/height" into the display width/height field seems to be the trick. It takes only a few seconds and no remuxing is needed. This is wonderful.

The steps:
  1. Open mkvmerge GUI (mmg.exe)
  2. In the File menu, select Header editor (or Ctrl-E) - note, you don't need to load the file into the input file area first
  3. In the new window, select Open from the file menu (CTRL-O)
  4. Enter correct values into the Video pixel width and height
  5. File->Save (CTRL-S)

Note - if your file is access by a media server, and you find this does not work, be sure that you perform a rescan of the content directories in your media server. If it still doesn't work, you may want to try renaming the file and rescanning again. I have found my Twonky to have a bit of strange memory at times.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

mkvmerge also has a header editor (and a command line utility for doing the same thing). Have you ever tried just modifying the attributes in the header rather than remuxing a new file? I'm genuinely curious about this.

-Bill
post #8295 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by joel57 View Post

I own the BDP-83 SE Nuforce Edition. Is there anyone who's compared it with the BDP-95? Is there enough of an improvement to justify moving from the BDP-83 NE to the BDP-95?

Not that I've read publicly. In fact, the closest I've seen was a comparison between the 93 NE and NXE and the 95 done by the avguide.com in the fall of last year found here.

Incidentally, the reviewer, Steven Stone, went on to state:

Quote:


How did the NuForce NXE board fare against the Oppo BDP-95? For two-channel material I used the BDP-95's dedicated balanced two-channel output, but I also listened to the single-ended RCAs. After many hours using CDs, SACDs, and Blu-Ray music discs, I declared a tie. The best sounding unit depended on the source. For two-channel-only material the BDP-95 delivered the best sonics. It combined slightly better low-level detail with superior low-frequency weight and definition. But on multi-channel sources, such as music Blu-Rays and movies, the BDP-93 NXE multi-channel outputs had superior fidelity to the BDP-95's standard 5.1 outputs
post #8296 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

Why not do the comparison? Run the stereo inputs thru the Denon CD input using Stereo Direct Pure Analog. That avoids any DSP or conversions. Compare that with digital connections and whatever processing you use. If you like the processed results better, the BDP-93 will serve equally well. If you want analog direct for 5.1, you'll need a new AVR with 5.1 analog bypass and probably want to keep the 95.

I'm not sure the 3312ci accomplishes what he needs in pure direct. From my 3311 manual it says pure direct cuts off the display and video analog circuits, but only says audyssey cannot be adjusted. It doesn't declare it a pure analog path.

Newbuthooked:
you will want to use the audyssey byp L/R which optimizes all speakers except the fl/fr which are bypassed.

You might want to seek out batpig in the denon forums.
post #8297 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by baniels View Post


I came back to this tonight and after comparing a good file that displayed properly, with one that did not, I found that the bad file had no values for the "Video display width" and "Video display height" fields.

Copying the values from the "Video pixel width/height" into the display width/height field seems to be the trick. It takes only a few seconds and no remuxing is needed. This is wonderful.

Very good! As we suspected, the problem files are missing some pixel dimension values that the OPPO needs.

Two things:

(1) Could you write this up for OPPO? Maybe they could apply some defaults for these attributes, which seems to work well for VLC and other devices.

(2) How was the original file produced? It would be good to know which tools do and and do not populate those fields. We know that mkvmerge does, and I think Handbrake does also.

Thanks for checking into this.

-Bill
post #8298 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by glangford View Post

I'm not sure the 3312ci accomplishes what he needs in pure direct. From my 3311 manual it says pure direct cuts off the display and video analog circuits, but only says audyssey cannot be adjusted. It doesn't declare it a pure analog path.

Newbuthooked:
you will want to use the audyssey byp L/R which optimizes all speakers except the fl/fr which are bypassed.

You might want to seek out batpig in the denon forums.

I didnt have much time last night (Inlaws are in town) but just switching 2 channel listening from HDMI to RCA via the CD input, there was a definite change in sound... My initial thought is that the latter sounded better but i would have to give it more time. I will try audyssey byp L/R tonight and see what results i get. Tanks for all the info and i will checkout some of batpig's posts and maybe drop him a note.
post #8299 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by starman7 View Post

Many thanks guys...

It does now seem to be working with Deep Colour set to 30 bits.
I may turn Deep Colour to OFF as I am not really watching much video through the HDMI 2.

Another quirk... (never a dull moment with this player I'm finding )... is that YouTube is now not working.
I tested the connection (which was fine), but then YouTube just seems to "hang" there. I then retested the connection and bam... nothing.
I reset the player and did a full power down reboot.
Connection was fine. Tried YouTube again... but no joy.
Tried the connection test again and bam... another nothing.
Don't get me wrong... I love this player but it seems to have more 'quirks' than all my other kit put together!

Anyone?
post #8300 of 11017
Thread Starter 
YouTube Leanback not working is a known issue at the moment that OPPO is trying to resolve through Google.
post #8301 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuromancer View Post

YouTube Leanback not working is a known issue at the moment that OPPO is trying to resolve through Google.

Thanks Neuromancer. What is YouTube "Leanback"???

Thanks again.
post #8302 of 11017
^ It's what YouTube calls their app on the OPPO. The idea is that rather than the normal web interface where you search for and select individual clips to play one at a time, with Leanback you do a search and the app plays a sequence of results clips for you while you "lean back".

(You know Google PAYS people real money to come up with marketing names like this?)
--Bob
post #8303 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

Very good! As we suspected, the problem files are missing some pixel dimension values that the OPPO needs.

Two things:

(1) Could you write this up for OPPO? Maybe they could apply some defaults for these attributes, which seems to work well for VLC and other devices.

(2) How was the original file produced? It would be good to know which tools do and and do not populate those fields. We know that mkvmerge does, and I think Handbrake does also.

Thanks for checking into this.

-Bill

I guess another question is whether or not the OPPO was displaying these files CORRECTLY given the bogus data in their headers?

To match other playback software, OPPO might need to IGNORE these problematic data fields. Which is OK as far as it goes, but means the player would not do the best possible job of rending clips where the unusual/abnormal data in those fields was, in fact, CORRECT.
--Bob
post #8304 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

^ It's what YouTube calls their app on the OPPO. The idea is that rather than the normal web interface where you search for and select individual clips to play one at a time, with Leanback you do a search and the app plays a sequence of results clips for you while you "lean back".

(You know Google PAYS people real money to come up with marketing names like this?)
--Bob

Haha... thanks Bob. That actually does make sense...

By the way... I've been using that "RATATOUILE" disc test to try and get a COLOUR SPACE and DEEP COLOUR setting I like best on the OPPO 95 and my Pioneer 60" KURO...

And... to be honest...

I've settled on COLOUR SPACE "RGB VIDEO LEVEL", but the DEEP COLOUR settings seem to make no difference at all.

The banding at the scene where the Rat is in the jar and the man is pulling it out of frame (at the time mark you suggested)... is very VERY hard to see in any of the DEEP COLOUR settings on my set-up.

It may be marginally better in some settings than others but the differences are sooo tiny on my KURO that after 45 minutes of "back-and-forth" I settled on 36 bits for HDMI 1 and I decided to set HDMI 2 to DEEP COLOUR "OFF" to help the audio (less bandwidth going through the HDMI lead).

Thank you for your tip and help with this test though.
post #8305 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by starman7 View Post

Haha... thanks Bob. That actually does make sense...

By the way... I've been using that "RATATOUILE" disc test to try and get a COLOUR SPACE and DEEP COLOUR setting I like best on the OPPO 95 and my Pioneer 60" KURO...

And... to be honest...

I've settled on COLOUR SPACE "RGB VIDEO LEVEL", but the DEEP COLOUR settings seem to make no difference at all.

The banding at the scene where the Rat is in the jar and the man is pulling it out of frame (at the time mark you suggested)... is very VERY hard to see in any of the DEEP COLOUR settings on my set-up.

It may be marginally better in some settings than others but the differences are sooo tiny on my KURO that after 45 minutes of "back-and-forth" I settled on 36 bits for HDMI 1 and I decided to set HDMI 2 to DEEP COLOUR "OFF" to help the audio (less bandwidth going through the HDMI lead).

Thank you for your tip and help with this test though.

Many displays don't support Deep Color formatted input, which means the handshake will default to Deep Color OFF ( = 24 bits). Other Displays do "lip service" to Deep Color formatted data by accepting 30 or 36 bit input but immediately truncating that down to 24 bits on input as the first step!

If you CAN'T see a difference, the Deep Color OFF (or OFF (Dithered) if that looks better) is PREFERABLE as that is a lower bandwidth signal than 30 or 36 bit and thus is likely to be less problematic during handshakes.

Other Kuro owners have also reported that RGB Video Level with Deep Color OFF seems to be working best for them. I don't know if that's true across ALL Kuro models, but at least it seems consistent with what you are finding.

Keep in mind that the more significant differences you are looking for here mostly arise from BUGS in the display or AVR (if that's in the video path). If your Display has no bugs then you are less likely to see significant differences. Truly minor differences are probably actually representative of the different information content in the different format choices -- i.e., the real value of 36 bits vs. 24 bits. Of course if you find a preferred format, then that's the one to use. But what's really important here is eliminating those format choices that trigger quirks (i.e., bugs) in the Display or AVR -- those more significant differences.
--Bob
post #8306 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by joel57 View Post

I own the BDP-83 SE Nuforce Edition. Is there anyone who's compared it with the BDP-95? Is there enough of an improvement to justify moving from the BDP-83 NE to the BDP-95?

They are both great players. I've owned both. I replaced my BDP-83 SE Nuforce Edition with my BDP-95. Unless you need balanced connections for analog audio or 3D, I personally don't think (or hear) there is enough of a significant improvement in sound or video quality to justify the purchase.
However, if you are like me, and you enjoy the AV hobby, then, you may want to purchase a 95 for the heck of it!

Mike
post #8307 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Many displays don't support Deep Color formatted input, which means the handshake will default to Deep Color OFF ( = 24 bits). Other Displays do "lip service" to Deep Color formatted data by accepting 30 or 36 bit input but immediately truncating that down to 24 bits on input as the first step!

If you CAN'T see a difference, the Deep Color OFF (or OFF (Dithered) if that looks better) is PREFERABLE as that is a lower bandwidth signal than 30 or 36 bit and thus is likely to be less problematic during handshakes.

Other Kuro owners have also reported that RGB Video Level with Deep Color OFF seems to be working best for them. I don't know if that's true across ALL Kuro models, but at least it seems consistent with what you are finding.

Keep in mind that the more significant differences you are looking for here mostly arise from BUGS in the display or AVR (if that's in the video path). If your Display has no bugs then you are less likely to see significant differences. Truly minor differences are probably actually representative of the different information content in the different format choices -- i.e., the real value of 36 bits vs. 24 bits. Of course if you find a preferred format, then that's the one to use. But what's really important here is eliminating those format choices that trigger quirks (i.e., bugs) in the Display or AVR -- those more significant differences.
--Bob

Many thanks Bob. I will try both again and see if I can see a difference. If not... I'll go with Deep Color OFF. Cheers again!
post #8308 of 11017
Quote:
Originally Posted by glangford View Post

I'm not sure the 3312ci accomplishes what he needs in pure direct. From my 3311 manual it says pure direct cuts off the display and video analog circuits, but only says audyssey cannot be adjusted. It doesn't declare it a pure analog path.

You may be right. They do list all the modes that cannot operate in Pure Direct mode, including bass management, but they never state it's analog bypass. If they were paying to support that, it would surely be mentioned!
post #8309 of 11017
About the Youtube app, for me it comes on really loud compared to things i play over my network or a disc. Is this normal? Is there anyway to set the sound level for Youtube?

Chris
post #8310 of 11017
^ There is not. YouTube apparently likes loud content.
--Bob
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