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The Official Silver Fire V.2 Thread. - Page 38

post #1111 of 1462
MM , glad to hear things are improving for your family , hope you have gotten some rest .
Wanted to thank you and PB for helping me figure out the best setup for me with SF , but I have to put things on hold . Had some unexpected medical expenses( minor but expensive as hell) for my dog that used up the discretionary fund , so my PJ and screen plans are on hold for a while. I didn't want you to think I picked your brains and ran without giving feedback on my progress . I'll be back as soon as I can wrangle up the PJ fund again.
post #1112 of 1462
MM - I am really glad to hear that your niece is getting better.

I also really appreciate all of the messages giving individual advice etc. My home theater project has just been moved up. Instead of having a directive to have the room completed by the end of the year, that is now to have it completed by the end of June or early July. I am so looking forward to the challenge of building this media room and finally having this bonus room completed, especially since we started on it 5 or 6 years ago.

Thanks - John Z
post #1113 of 1462
MM,

Wanted to update you. I've completed everything. Just put on the last coat about 2 hours ago. I'm actually writing this on the new projector. Everything looks great. I have a very slight run(almost not even noticeable) though. I am going to take pictures of my setup for all to see tomorrow.

Thanks to MM everything went really smooth. I really appreciate the help you gave me and everyone else on this board. Sorry to hear about your niece.

Edit: On a side note, I keep having to reset my projector settings because windows starts with a green tint to it? The windows boot, bios, etc... colors are fine but once it logs into windows my benq w1070 has this green tint to it. I'm going to check out the message boards over there but figured I'd try my luck here first.
post #1114 of 1462
Hi Guys, couple questions....

I have a dedicated media room, total ambient light control and I just bought the Epson 8350. It is mounted 13' back from the wall I am projecting on and I am shooting for a 120" screen. We will be watching movies, tv, and a little video gaming.

Question 1: Which Silver Fire should I go with 2.0, 2.5???

Question 2: My wall is textured with orange peel, should I float this out to be smooth and just spray the silver fire directly to the wall? Or should I be using some sort of substrate?

Question 3: I have read a ton of this forum and didn't see the instructions for actually spraying it.....?

I think I have a handle on the supplies needed and how to mix them... I think.... Haha

Thanks for your help in advance!

Lane
post #1115 of 1462
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lhard77 View Post

Hi Guys, couple questions....

I have a dedicated media room, total ambient light control and I just bought the Epson 8350. It is mounted 13' back from the wall I am projecting on and I am shooting for a 120" screen. We will be watching movies, tv, and a little video gaming.

Question 1: Which Silver Fire should I go with 2.0, 2.5???

Silver Fire v2.5 2.0
Quote:
Question 2: My wall is textured with orange peel, should I float this out to be smooth and just spray the silver fire directly to the wall? Or should I be using some sort of substrate?

If you feel comfortable with floating the wall surface out and sanding it to a ultra smooth surface, well get'ter dun! That's how I "roll" every time I can....if I could not catch the finish before texture was applied. I use Sintra when I have'ta....I'll use the Wall anytime I can.
Quote:
Question 3: I have read a ton of this forum and didn't see the instructions for actually spraying it.....?

Do a AVS Advanced Search within DIY Screens "Posts Only" for the keywords "Duster Coats" and / or "Painting Videos". And of course you can always ask.....it's not like I don't get asked that same question 2-3 times a week, and post a response that includes directions. Be it SF - RS-MaxxMudd - S-I-L-V-E-R I think you'll find posts in all such related threads. Check from most recent back as well as from the start.

http://www.avsforum.com/newsearch?advanced=1&action=disp&search=Duster+Coats&titleonly=0&byuser=&output=posts&containingforum[]=110&replycompare=gt&numupdates=&sdate=0&newer=1&sort=relevance&order=descending&Search=SEARCH
Quote:
I think I have a handle on the supplies needed and how to mix them... I think.... Haha

That's not funny. mad.gif Your bluff is called. wink.gif
Quote:
Thanks for your help in advance!

Lane

Standing behind you every step of the way.........which is always wise if one doesn't want to get paint sprayed on them.

Haha! Now THAT's funny. cool.gif
post #1116 of 1462
That is funny! Thanks for the reply MM!

I have never done drywall before. I just read your post on how to "fix" an orange peel texture wall. I was gonna follow that.. But, I'm wondering if it would be better time-wise to just find a piece of the sintra...?? Instead of using my home theater room wall as an experiment.. Haha eek.gif

You recommended some sprayers in one of the threads... Do you mind if I ask you which one(s) you recommend currently?

I know you have replied to hundreds of these same questions, but I truly appreciate you taking the time to reply. Thank You!!

Edit: After reading a ton of the posts from the search... I'm more confused. I just see a bunch of posts talking about duster coats. But, none of them that explain what that is..... I might just be in over my head! re-finishing drywall, mixing a crazy amount of ingredients, buying a sprayer and using said sprayer for the first time! This is terrifying! eek.gif
Edited by lhard77 - 5/5/13 at 6:05pm
post #1117 of 1462
Thread Starter 
Yes? But think of all the other members who have overcome the terror, faced their fear of the unknown, and who have boldly gone where they have never gone before?

Well, maybe it's best to forget about the "terror" part.

In many respects, it's been necessary to cast a more intensive light on the methods and materials than is really required, if only to make people pause and consider that doing a truly advanced, high performance Screen is not like grabbing a roller and putting up some quick strokes. Shoot, effective rolling requires you take the time to do it right.

No doubt, there is more involved to mixing up Silver Fire. However the spraying is the easiest part of all. It is the advent and availability of affordable spray gun equipment that has made applications like Silver Fire far more wide ranging in their potential to service a wider range of needs and end users.

Dusters.

They are simply very light coats of paint applied by using the technique of holding the Gun at a distance of 14" from the surface of the paint-able area, and moving parallel to the surface at a brisk pace while keeping the gun level. At the end of each row, the gun is lowered about 4 inches and another row is applied going back the other way.....and so on until the entire surface is coated.

Each duster coat amounts to being a coating of sparsely applied dots of paint. Multiple coats allow the dots to come together. The almost water-like thinness of Silver Fire requires that it be applied gradually.

Pretty simple really, and intended to take the guesswork out of how much paint one can apply before getting runs or unwanted texture.

And this is the inexpensive Gun most are opting to use these days: http://www.gleempaint.com/noname.html
...along with this needle: http://www.checkoutsupply.com/earlex-hvacv15-1-5mm-needle-brass-tip-hv3500/
post #1118 of 1462
That is the gun I remember seeing in one of your earlier posts. I will order that this week and get started...

The duster coat makes sense. I think I can handle that.....

I am more concerned about floating a smooth surface on the textured drywall, I've never done that either! But now is the time to learn. If I screw it up too bad I will just build a screen out of BOC and "hide" my mess!!

Lane
post #1119 of 1462
Quote:
Originally Posted by lhard77 View Post

That is the gun I remember seeing in one of your earlier posts. I will order that this week and get started...

The duster coat makes sense. I think I can handle that.....

I am more concerned about floating a smooth surface on the textured drywall, I've never done that either! But now is the time to learn. If I screw it up too bad I will just build a screen out of BOC and "hide" my mess!!

Lane

While is not totally diy, an option for floating your wall would be if there's a construction project in your area, preferably high end house, find one of the drywallers (they will be the really dusty ones) and tell him what your looking for, depending on your area of the county, you might get him to do a great job for material and a 12 pack. Don't try to hire through the company though, that'll cost bucks. I've hired guys under the table like that to patch holes for me after running electrical and for the about the same time they would take to float your wall I've paid $75
post #1120 of 1462
Just wondering if anyone knows of anywhere online that has the Behr 1850 in a smaller quantity than this, and will ship to Oklahoma?

http://www.homedepot.com/p/BEHR-Premium-Plus-1-Gal-Ultra-Pure-White-Flat-Enamel-Zero-VOC-Interior-Paint-185001/202761515#.UZQymbUweCk

[EDIT]
Answered my own question - there's a dropdown box on that page letting you select the size you want - 1 quart is perfect smile.gif
Edited by Spirit2 - 5/15/13 at 6:37pm
post #1121 of 1462
It seems the white pearl rustoleum can't be exported by USPS - it's a flammable liquid with an export restriction.

It's not available from the Australian arm of Rustoleum.

Any suggestions?


On another note - will black velvet make an appropriate material for side wall curtains?
Edited by Spirit2 - 5/17/13 at 3:52pm
post #1122 of 1462
Thread Starter 
Why that's strange. I've sent that (RMA-Pearl), and every other component via USPS to a number of far off locals......and some that have Draconian Customs. Been doing so for a good long while.

As far as OZ, I've been there, done that personally. I rocked Perth 3yrs ago with 3 Silver Fire Light Fusions (...got the Thread to prove it. wink.gif ). I shipped my SF mixes in a combined state, 4 quarts x 2 ....in 2 Large Flat Rate Boxes.

And how can this be....?eek.gif

The Product (Pearl) is NOT Flammable. The Silver is not Flammable. The Polyurethane is not Flammable. None of the Liquitex paints are Flammable, ALL of them are Water Based, and last time I checked water was still difficult to ignite. They all are considered Non-Toxic...primarily because none contain Petroleum Distillates. Every product concerned have VOC levels so under "our" limits, the Mfg do not have to list any Info / Warnings specific to such on their labels . The RMA Pearl Jar does state " if spraying you need to use a certified Respirator". It also says "Don't get into eyes"....and "Do not ingest.". It says to "Wash your hands after using". There is NO OTHER warnings on the Labels at all.

I have seen how whenever anyone hears "Rustoleum" they think Spray Cans...and that graduates into "Flammable".

But every Silver Fire component is Water Based. Something is amiss because I have to fill out Custom Forms and give descriptions, and so far there has never been an issue.

What it sounds like to me is that a Vendor doesn't want to use USPS....or somebody has a misconception out of hand. No matter what, where there is a will, there's a way.....if one is but willing.
post #1123 of 1462
We'll have another go when my black velvet arrives.

As for sprayers...
None of the recommended ones are readily available in Australia.
The nearest thing I can find is a Wagner W550 Fine Spray, which has a 2.5mm nozzle. It does have a 1.8mm nozzled front end accessory, which I'll get if the sprayer itself is suitable.

Does this look like the business?
http://www.bunnings.com.au/products_product_power-sprayer-wagner-w550-fine-spray_P1560216.aspx?filter=categoryname--Power+Painting&page=2
post #1124 of 1462
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spirit2 View Post

We'll have another go when my black velvet arrives.

As for sprayers...
None of the recommended ones are readily available in Australia.
The nearest thing I can find is a Wagner W550 Fine Spray, which has a 2.5mm nozzle. It does have a 1.8mm nozzled front end accessory, which I'll get if the sprayer itself is suitable.

Does this look like the business?
http://www.bunnings.com.au/products_product_power-sprayer-wagner-w550-fine-spray_P1560216.aspx?filter=categoryname--Power+Painting&page=2

That Wagner will work, very well in fact using the smaller Front End.

I've used it before in the UK
post #1125 of 1462
Hi MississippiMan, I PM'd you but you probably are bogged down with PMs.

I've been reading through the SF v2.5 thread and decided to use that for my screen.
I have a 96" sintra board, Epson 8700 mounted at 14 ft. I have a light controlled room, however i would like to keep the back pot lights on sometimes, so I think a SF 3oz would be the way to go? My goal is to have deep blacks but not to lose contrast. I have a screen goo painted wall currently that I find the dark portions of the image all get blended in together.

I also thought that I could do a double sided screen, one side v3 and the other v5 for when i want to let the window light come in during the daytime. (I haven't yet figured out how to mount the sintra in the frame so that I could flip it over easily, but im sure it can be done)

It seems that there would be enough paint materials to do 2 batches if ultimately I'm only using 3oz out of the 56oz used in the reflective mix.. my question is do you think it would be possible to make a SF 3oz mix, paint, and add to it to create a SF 5oz mix? If so, how would you recommend doing that?
post #1126 of 1462
I think you may have misunderstood. It is three oz of the colorant blend that you would use in the reflective mix. You would need to make enough colorant blend in order to add three oz to the reflective mix and you would get Silver Fire 3.0. You could spray that and then measure how much you have left and add proportionately the amount of additional colorant to the remaining to get the Silver Fire 5.0. for example if you used half of the Silver Fire 3.0 you would add an additional 1 oz ( half of the 2 oz in the full formula) to get your Silver Fire 5.0.

As for the two sided screen in the frame, if you have a router you could build the frame oversized and rout the inside like a picture frame to hold the Sintra either by a "friction fit" or a few small pieces of velcro tap on the portion of the Sintra that is hidden by the frame. You would hang the frame via a french cleat so you could remove from the wall easily to flip the screen. Sound like a lot more trouble than its worth, though. Silver Fire handles ambient light pretty well. That is part of what makes it so attractive.
post #1127 of 1462
Thread Starter 
ahajr143,

Once again your answer (1 oz Colorant added to the remaining mix) was right on the money.

Thank you for responding...I'm trying my best, but I have to resort to using "speech to Text" on my phone as typing with my right arm / shoulder out of action is really not possible.

Thank goodness my Galaxy 2 has an excellent track record of not horribly skewing my input!

Max49,

Most folks don't have to resort to a dual screen approach. a 4.0 would be a "best" balance for you, losing nothing as far as quality either way.
post #1128 of 1462
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahajr143 View Post

I think you may have misunderstood. It is three oz of the colorant blend that you would use in the reflective mix. You would need to make enough colorant blend in order to add three oz to the reflective mix and you would get Silver Fire 3.0.

I think i did misunderstand! I thought that you prepare the full amounts of each the color components(100ml), viscosity components, (40-52oz) and reflective components (56oz)
and would only use 3oz of the reflective mix, however as you say it is 3oz of the color mix that is used. What i don't understand is if you were to do a SF 5.0 mix, you wouldn't have enough color mix (5 fluid oz = 145ml)

Am I missing something? Is the 100ml of water used for cleaning also used in the mix? I didn't see that in the instructions on the first page but maybe its buried somewhere in the threads.

MississippiMan, you say that 4.0 would be a best balance without losing any quality, surely there must be some tradeoff as you move up in the darker mixes?

Thanks again for the clarifications guys, I don't want to screw this up!
post #1129 of 1462
Yes the water is a part of the total amount of colorant mix wink.gif
post #1130 of 1462
Hello!

I'm about to start the painting of my first DIY screen, a 120" diagonal Sintra board with Silver Fire 3.0 paint based on MM's "Zero Edge" LED wrapped design. After reading through all the different "noob" forums and trying to decipher the original instructions I am unfortunately still lost about how much of each ingredient to mix in to achieve the "3.0" darkness.

So far I understand that I need to mix together these color components:

100ml - filtered/distilled water for rinsing color components from utensils
50ml - Liquitex Basics - Napthol Crimson Red
25ml - Liquitex Basics - Phthalocyanine Green
16ml - Liquitex Basics - UltraMarine Blue
9ml - Liquitex Basics - Cadmium Yellow - Deep Hue

Then I need to have the viscosity components ( water and the Minwax Polycrylic).

Now where I get confused is the part about the reflective base. If I'm reading that table correctly, it says that for the 3.0 mix, I need to add 3oz of the color mixture above to 22oz of Rustoleum Metallic and Liquitex Basics Silver along with 10oz Behr 1850 UPW Flat, and 2 oz of Liquitex Gold. That seems like a LOT of some of those ingredients. Are those instructions missing a decimal somewhere? Should that be 2.2oz of Rustoleum etc?

If someone can please confirm the paint amounts for this mix I'd really appreciate it. I've just purchased the refurb'd sprayer and nozzle and am about to hit "purchase" on my Amazon cart full of paint and want to make sure I have the proper amounts.

Thanks!

Dave

P.S. Was the decision to provide some measurements in oz and some in ml made because someone felt this process just wasn't complex enough? ;-)

Edited: After reading through the ingredients again, I guess it just uses a LOT of silver. If someone can confirm that those measurements are indeed correct I'll be ready to order!
Edited by davemex - 7/1/13 at 7:59am
post #1131 of 1462
Thread Starter 
Everything is right.....you add 3 oz colorant for a 3.0 version.

The total of all components is just 59 oz (under 2 quarts) before you add in the 22 oz Water AND 16 oz water-based Polyurethane

That brings the total mix amount up to 97 oz. Just over 3 quarts.

Use about 12 oz to practice spraying and your down to 85 oz. After you spray on 4-5 coats that should leave you with about 10 oz left for any needed touch up / repairs should anything unexpected happen.

The use of "milliliters" in measuring the Colorant Tints was / is necessary because the amounts are small enough that accurately measuring them in fractions of ounces would be almost impossible.

Myself, I always make up Colorant in 1 gallon batches, so I do in fact use "ounces".
post #1132 of 1462
Thanks man! I'll get my stuff ordered. Look for a build thread in the near future :-)
post #1133 of 1462
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by davemex View Post

Thanks man! I'll get my stuff ordered. Look for a build thread in the near future :-)

Great! I'm glad you were monitoring the Thread and got the word in time.

Nail it to the wall !cool.gif
post #1134 of 1462
Hi all,

I have painted two walls with SF2.5 with 2.0 gain. I am using an Optoma HD20 and HD 25 projectors for those. The picture quality is quite good but could use some improvement.

I would greatly appreciate if someone could point me to the calibration settings for these projector/screen combinations.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks
post #1135 of 1462
Get yourself one of the commercially available video calibration discs (Digital Video Essentials, Spears & Munsil HD Benchmark) and use it. I personally am partial to the Spears and Munsil disc.

Short of hiring a professional, this is the best you can do to maximize the quality of your projected image.
post #1136 of 1462
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by raksun9 View Post

Hi all,

I have painted two walls with SF2.5 with 2.0 gain. I am using an Optoma HD20 and HD 25 projectors for those. The picture quality is quite good but could use some improvement.

I would greatly appreciate if someone could point me to the calibration settings for these projector/screen combinations.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks

Pretty sure you mean SFv2.5 2.0 which means 2 oz of colorant was used to produce the level of Gray shade in the paint.

Gain should be more in the range of 1.2, although to many it certainly seems to perform more like 1.4+ due to the dynamic color and contrast.
post #1137 of 1462
Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

Pretty sure you mean SFv2.5 2.0 which means 2 oz of colorant was used to produce the level of Gray shade in the paint.

Gain should be more in the range of 1.2, although to many it certainly seems to perform more like 1.4+ due to the dynamic color and contrast.

Thanks for the reply.

I have made the mistake of doubling all the components and adding them all together. I am not sure what the gain is anymore. The screen does look darker.

How do I repair this mixture?

Thanks
post #1138 of 1462
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewGate88 View Post

Get yourself one of the commercially available video calibration discs (Digital Video Essentials, Spears & Munsil HD Benchmark) and use it. I personally am partial to the Spears and Munsil disc.

Short of hiring a professional, this is the best you can do to maximize the quality of your projected image.

Thanks Newgate88 - I have ordered the disk.
post #1139 of 1462
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by raksun9 View Post

Thanks for the reply.

I have made the mistake of doubling all the components and adding them all together. I am not sure what the gain is anymore. The screen does look darker.

How do I repair this mixture?

Thanks

Add an additional 10 ounces of UPW and re-thin mixture with a bit of additional water.
post #1140 of 1462
Can you recommend a mixure for these conditions...

Screen
Size: 130" x 74" (16:9 150" Diagonal)
Material: Matte White Canvas on Frame

Projector

Model: Infocus SP8602
Brightness: 1160 Lumen
Native Contrast: 5000:1
Distance: 17.5'

Room
Fully darkened with dark walls, floor, and ceiling
Seating Distance: 12'
Seating Width: 14'

Goals
Primary: Increase contrast and brightness
Secondary: Improve black levels slightly
Secondary: Reduce reflection glow of walls, floor, and ceiling near the screen
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