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post #121 of 840
6/8/11 at 8:26pm
Thread Starter 
I just finished watching the first 2-hour episode of Vegas Week (got a late start), and it seemed to be the best Vegas Week in memory -- at least to me.

I was happy to see Iveta (I didn't see her last name long enough to learn how to spell it... starts with an "I" -- she's originally from Russia or one of the other former Soviet Republics, such as Ukraine or Georgia, and this is her third time in Vegas -- last, too, since she's 30 this year). I remember her first season, she was sort of one of the "featured" dancers until she was cut. Then the second time she got to Vegas she was just barely visible in some of the video. This year, however, she's been more featured than even the first time, and is still in the running at the final stage, not that this means she'll make the Top 20. I'm not entirely sure she's suited to some of the non-ballroom styles on this show, but I still kinda like her (have a thing for Eastern-European blondes, I guess, lol).

I've seen MOST of my Top 20 predictions fall by the wayside, so far. I was really surprised Chyna, Chase and DC didn't make it -- not that Alexis Mason didn't, however. I agree she needs more time to practice and polish. I still think DC Chapman "can do anything," but it might take that extra help from Debbie Allen to get him there, and IF she was telling him the truth -- and IF he's willing and able to do the work -- I expect we'll see him back next year. Of course the very first audition in Atlanta who MOST of us expected to still be around IS, as well as the one who was the first audition in L.A. I'm surprised BOTH Mallory sisters are still around and DON'T expect that to last, although I think the older, thinner one MAY make the Top 20 and am THRILLED to see a large person even have the gumption to work hard enough and try out and LEARN to be as good as she is! I just think her weight limiits how good she can ultimately be -- especially with partners (this is coming from a guy who's over 300 pounds and KNOWS how much weight can limit activities). If they DO decide to put her through to the Top 20, more power to her! I love her attitude and work ethic.

I'm REALLY GLAD I'm not one of those six judges this year because I think I'd have a REALLY HARD TIME winnowing this group down to 20, there are just SO MANY great dancers in the top 40 or so. Tomorrow should be interesting, to say the least.
Jeff
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post #122 of 840
6/9/11 at 4:32am
A few complaints about vegas week (and this show in general).

- I hate that they make people dance styles they would never ever dance and will never do again after this show. For example, they make an Irish tap dancer do hip hop, which she will never do again, ever. It is not their style, but she is a world champion Irish dancer and she was cut. It is a shame they can't tweak the show to make it people dancing the style they want. Not sure how they would or could do it but it is a shame some talent gets cut because of this.

- I think it is insane that they give the dancers one hour to learn a new choreography (and sometimes a whole new dance style) and then make them dance and if they don't get it they are eliminated. Professionals practice more then an hour on something to get it write, sometimes days and weeks. Plus they cram in multiple dances in one day. No one does that. Seems very unfair to push them that hard instead of giving them time to practice and show what they can really do.

- End rant.
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post #123 of 840
6/9/11 at 5:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamR View Post
- I hate that they make people dance styles they would never ever dance and will never do again after this show. For example, they make an Irish tap dancer do hip hop, which she will never do again, ever. It is not their style, but she is a world champion Irish dancer and she was cut. It is a shame they can't tweak the show to make it people dancing the style they want. Not sure how they would or could do it but it is a shame some talent gets cut because of this.
Have you even seen this show before when it gets to the top 20? They do at least 10 different dancing styles in the competition. So if someone can't do hip hop now why put them thru to the top 20 when its possible they could do 2 or more hip hop routines? Plain and simple, she couldn't cut it in hip hop, there were many many people better than her. Everyone is out of their element during this show. She was a great dancer in her style and its s shame she was cut so early, but what are you gonna do?
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post #124 of 840
6/9/11 at 5:36am
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Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post
Have you even seen this show before when it gets to the top 20? They do at least 10 different dancing styles in the competition. So if someone can't do hip hop now why put them thru to the top 20 when its possible they could do 2 or more hip hop routines? Plain and simple, she couldn't cut it in hip hop, there were many many people better than her. Everyone is out of their element during this show. She was a great dancer in her style and its s shame she was cut so early, but what are you gonna do?
I agree, mx6. If she really want's dto do this show, she'll practice other styles and come back. If not, she'll focus on Irish dancing and continue to do well there.

Similarly, they don't get much practice time during the actual show so Vegas weeds out those who can't puck up choreography quickly. In spite of Travis' comment, most of the routines are easier and shorter than those on the show to compensate for less practice time.

Jeff - if the spoilery preview of tonight's show wasn't a misdirection, I think the Russian ballroom woman makes it.

All in all, I thought the vegas sshow was interesting, although with some surprising cuts. As all years, I wish they had a little less "story line" (the sisters this year) and instead showed a bit more of the dancers, since there are several of the top 31 that have had no screen time so far.
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post #125 of 840
6/9/11 at 7:25am
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Originally Posted by JeffAHayes View Post
I just finished watching the first 2-hour episode of Vegas Week (got a late start), and it seemed to be the best Vegas Week in memory -- at least to me.
I'm REALLY GLAD I'm not one of those six judges this year because I think I'd have a REALLY HARD TIME winnowing this group down to 20, there are just SO MANY great dancers in the top 40 or so. Tomorrow should be interesting, to say the least.
Jeff
Hey Jeff, how are you? I agree about last night's show being very good. There is a lot of talent out there this season. I am curious about the girl (Ariel I believe) who was taking yet another crack at the show and was cut again last night. You would think that, after being cut a few times a dancer would say "screw this show" and just get on with his/her career in dancing if that's in the cards. If you can't get work professionally by then, maybe it's time to consider other options? They really didn't show very much of of her but I think that the dancer to watch is Melanie Moore, the cute, perky Art Major. There was only a brief glance of her dancing last night but it showed her doing an excellent overhead leg extension. I suspect that she breezed through the Vegas rounds.
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post #126 of 840
6/9/11 at 8:11am
What do the experts look for?

A lot of time, the judges praise an audition to high hills ("one of the best I've seen" etc) when I only think it's pretty good. Then there are ones I think should go straight through but only get choreography, and these are not hip hop dancers either. I like personality, a unique, well thought out routine, and most importantly, technical ability -- so things like perfect pirouettes, high leaps, leg extension, flexibility, strong body control impress me. For hip hop dancers, it's a little more difficult for me to judge so I tend to look for creativity.

The judges seem to see other things, or they don't put as much weight on certain things like I do. I like to hear from people "in the know" what they look for.

I realize the judges are also casting for a show, but in the early audition I assume it's more a straight up evaluation.
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post #127 of 840
6/9/11 at 8:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post

Have you even seen this show before when it gets to the top 20? They do at least 10 different dancing styles in the competition. So if someone can't do hip hop now why put them thru to the top 20 when its possible they could do 2 or more hip hop routines? Plain and simple, she couldn't cut it in hip hop, there were many many people better than her. Everyone is out of their element during this show. She was a great dancer in her style and its s shame she was cut so early, but what are you gonna do?

Yes, watched every season, and that is my point, fixing the whole thing would probably be impossible, but even during the regular weeks, people loose because they can't dance a quick step but they may be the best thing to ever happen to hip hop or tap, etc. Seems unfair to force them to continually do styels they will never do again professionally.
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post #128 of 840
6/9/11 at 9:04am
I was going to ask when they were in Vegas, so I could start recording the show again, but my question has been answered.
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post #129 of 840
6/9/11 at 9:48am
The whole point of the show is to make them do other styles. It doesn't matter what they do professionally. If they aren't the best all around dancer there is no point in being on the show.
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post #130 of 840
6/9/11 at 10:20am
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Originally Posted by Savageone79 View Post

The whole point of the show is to make them do other styles. It doesn't matter what they do professionally. If they aren't the best all around dancer there is no point in being on the show.

Yup but it's amazing how well some of the Hip Hop and B boys and girls do in styles that shouldn't even be a remote thought for them.
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post #131 of 840
6/9/11 at 10:34am
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Originally Posted by barth2k View Post

What do the experts look for?

A lot of time, the judges praise an audition to high hills ("one of the best I've seen" etc) when I only think it's pretty good. Then there are ones I think should go straight through but only get choreography, and these are not hip hop dancers either. I like personality, a unique, well thought out routine, and most importantly, technical ability -- so things like perfect pirouettes, high leaps, leg extension, flexibility, strong body control impress me. For hip hop dancers, it's a little more difficult for me to judge so I tend to look for creativity.

The judges seem to see other things, or they don't put as much weight on certain things like I do. I like to hear from people "in the know" what they look for.

I realize the judges are also casting for a show, but in the early audition I assume it's more a straight up evaluation.

I'd say that the most important thing that the judges look for is whether or not they believe that people will call in and vote for the person. This very often doesn't mean that they are the best technically, but most Americans have little insight into what actually constitutes any "perfect" maneuver or routine anyway.

What qualities must a dancer possess that makes people call in and vote? Likability, personality, creativity, uniqueness, charm, charisma, physical appearance, grace, poise, a sense of humor, humility, confidence, adaptability, professionalism, passion, and/or a great many other things. Someone that is bubbly and cute with a good attitude but fumbles a few moves is much more likely to garner votes than a dancer that performs every step flawlessly but has an arrogance or poor work ethic that comes off as ugly.

That's why they say they are searching for "America's FAVORITE dancer." To put it in a real-world light, I ask; Who would you favor as a coworker? Is it the guy that motors through his tasks with ease yet grouses at every turn and acts as though he's better than everyone else...or would your prefer the girl that isn't quite as bright that takes more time to complete jobs but is always happy and is a joy to talk to?

You're also correct in that they are casting, and as such, they will be looking for X number of ballroom specialists, b-boys/girls, contemps, broadway dancers, etc. This does come at the expense of a few, but it's for the greater "good" of variety.
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post #132 of 840
6/9/11 at 2:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffAHayes View Post

... I'm not entirely sure [Iveta's] suited to some of the non-ballroom styles on this show, but I still kinda like her (have a thing for Eastern-European blondes, I guess, lol).
...
Jeff

I thought she looked pretty good in the tiny clip of her doing contemporary that they showed. But the clip was so short it was hard to really say for certain.
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post #133 of 840
6/9/11 at 2:24pm
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Originally Posted by WilliamR View Post

A few complaints about vegas week (and this show in general).

- I hate that they make people dance styles they would never ever dance and will never do again after this show. ....

- End rant.

What bothers me more than that is the heavy emphasis on choreography skills in some of the rounds which results in great "dancers" getting cut because they aren't also great choreographers.

For example, let's say there was a show called "So You Think You're a Classical Musician" and one of the rounds was a group round where they tossed you in with four other "musicians" none of whom have ever composed any music before and told you to compose a piece of chamber music and BTW one of your group members is a really fantastic harmonica player, but that's his only instrument.

That's the way the group round looks in my view. Take four contemporary dancers and a hip-hopper throw them together and then tell them how crappy their sleep-deprived choreography turned out. What the heck is the point of this round? They won't be doing any of their own choreograpy in the finals, so why do we care about it here?

I'd prefer to see a chorus line round since all the other stages are either solos or pas de deux rather than the group round.
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post #134 of 840
6/9/11 at 2:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamR View Post

A few complaints about vegas week (and this show in general).

- I hate that they make people dance styles they would never ever dance and will never do again after this show. For example, they make an Irish tap dancer do hip hop, which she will never do again, ever. It is not their style, but she is a world champion Irish dancer and she was cut. It is a shame they can't tweak the show to make it people dancing the style they want. Not sure how they would or could do it but it is a shame some talent gets cut because of this.

- I think it is insane that they give the dancers one hour to learn a new choreography (and sometimes a whole new dance style) and then make them dance and if they don't get it they are eliminated. Professionals practice more then an hour on something to get it write, sometimes days and weeks. Plus they cram in multiple dances in one day. No one does that. Seems very unfair to push them that hard instead of giving them time to practice and show what they can really do.

- End rant.

Sorry but I disagree heavily with both points. To the first: this show is about the favorite ALL AROUND dancer, not about someone who can just do one style good. Yes yes yes, make them do something they haven't before! Lets see what they are made of! How good ARE they at the art of dancing? To the second point: it is a fair way to eliminate people because there ARE those who get the choreography in one hour. It is a good way to separate out the weaker dancers. You push people past what they normally do to see what they are made of. Someone mentioned the group round: you know, some of these may be aimed at seeing how much these kids want to be a dancer and less about the actual technicalities. Although if the technicalities are terrible, then yah, they'll get cut. But group round is this: are you willing to do whatever it takes to get what you want? Can you work with people who may differ in opinion? Can you blend your style with others to make an entertaining performance?

I mean come on, by your argument, I shouldn't have sat through 3/4 of the college classes I did, nor endure all the hardships a degree comes with because I'll never have to do something like that again, or use the information taught in a particular class? This is a dramatic way of finding the differences in the dancers and making those who ARE the best stand out in a short amount of time. It works and is my favorite part of the season.

Most of my audition favorites to make it were cut too. Guess that's the way it goes. But it makes me very curious who WILL make it because it seems there are very few who've they showcased so far left. As long as they do a good job of catching the audience up on the ones we don't know with the ones they've shown us more extensively--and I think they do--it's all good though.

One thing I'm excited about is how much I've learned about what professionals--the judges--are looking for. A few times I remember thinking, "why is she squinting the whole time" then Nigel would comment about her expression, or "they didn't really get that leg extended" and sure enough, judges critiqued that. I'm still pretty shallow in this assessment but it's more than I was when I started watching in season 5.
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post #135 of 840
6/9/11 at 7:43pm
Top 20 revealed! By my recollection, we are familiar with 6-7 from spotlights in auditions and Vegas. I can't remember if that's typical, but right now I'm feeling a little disconnected from the top 20 so I'm uncertain about how this is going to go. Thoughts?

PS "Woo-man" is getting on my ever last nerve.
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post #136 of 840
6/9/11 at 8:36pm
I thought maybe half the top 20 were familiar, but agree that seems like a low percentage.

Woo-man hasn't started to completely bug me yet, but he might be getting there. The short broadway guy is the only one I don't care for at the moment in the top 20. I'm not quite sure what it is about him that bugs me. Also the sister that made it since I'm still suffering overload from how much we saw her last night.

I enjoyed all the dancing tonight and though interspersing it with the announcements was a nice idea to pace the show.
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post #137 of 840
6/9/11 at 9:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin_Wadsworth View Post

....

I enjoyed all the dancing tonight and though interspersing it with the announcements was a nice idea to pace the show.

Yeah I liked it a lot better than an entire show devoted to just naming the top twenty.
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post #138 of 840
6/9/11 at 9:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bpeacock22 View Post

Top 20 revealed! By my recollection, we are familiar with 6-7 from spotlights in auditions and Vegas. I can't remember if that's typical, but right now I'm feeling a little disconnected from the top 20 so I'm uncertain about how this is going to go. Thoughts?

....

I'd say it's a little worse than normal except for a couple of seasons ago when it was really bad. OTOH if it wasn't for Ryan and Iveta being familiar from previous seasons it would have really been really bad this season too.

And Iveta has to be wondering how terribly unlucky she was to finally get through and end up against such a strong group of girls. She's going to have to hope that some of the other girls seem so similar that they don't attract any votes.
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post #139 of 840
6/10/11 at 3:07am
Gotta say...I'm glad it's summer again, and that this show is back!

WOW! What fun. Great 2-hours.

Was happy to start DVHS recording (and eventual transfer to BluRay) for posterity of the dance routines again. There wasn't one of the nine numbers that I didn't enjoy.

What a great group of dancers. I had no idea there was a tapper among them until last night, because I don't remember seeing that "tall one" (don't recall his name right now) at all during the pre-season shows. He's a very talented dancer/actor, and not just in tap.

I also really enjoyed Cat imitating Mary's Americanisms and mannerisms and excitement. That was adorable! Still the best "presenter" around, for my money.

I especially liked bringing back 20 dancers to start with, as there's great fun in numbers. Plus, you get to really see a lot of competition and start rooting for some that will inevitably be eliminated. I love the huge whole-group routines, like this first one from Tyce.


Can this show be any more enjoyable???
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post #140 of 840
6/10/11 at 4:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bpeacock22 View Post

Sorry but I disagree heavily with both points. To the first: this show is about the favorite ALL AROUND dancer, not about someone who can just do one style good. Yes yes yes, make them do something they haven't before! Lets see what they are made of! How good ARE they at the art of dancing? To the second point: it is a fair way to eliminate people because there ARE those who get the choreography in one hour. It is a good way to separate out the weaker dancers. You push people past what they normally do to see what they are made of. Someone mentioned the group round: you know, some of these may be aimed at seeing how much these kids want to be a dancer and less about the actual technicalities. Although if the technicalities are terrible, then yah, they'll get cut. But group round is this: are you willing to do whatever it takes to get what you want? Can you work with people who may differ in opinion? Can you blend your style with others to make an entertaining performance?

I mean come on, by your argument, I shouldn't have sat through 3/4 of the college classes I did, nor endure all the hardships a degree comes with because I'll never have to do something like that again, or use the information taught in a particular class? This is a dramatic way of finding the differences in the dancers and making those who ARE the best stand out in a short amount of time. It works and is my favorite part of the season.

Most of my audition favorites to make it were cut too. Guess that's the way it goes. But it makes me very curious who WILL make it because it seems there are very few who've they showcased so far left. As long as they do a good job of catching the audience up on the ones we don't know with the ones they've shown us more extensively--and I think they do--it's all good though.

One thing I'm excited about is how much I've learned about what professionals--the judges--are looking for. A few times I remember thinking, "why is she squinting the whole time" then Nigel would comment about her expression, or "they didn't really get that leg extended" and sure enough, judges critiqued that. I'm still pretty shallow in this assessment but it's more than I was when I started watching in season 5.

Attending college classes is extremely different then doing something professionally for a living. If you worked in a factory on an assembly line, it would be impractical for you to also perform surgeries. Going to school to get an education is not the same as doing what you do best in a career.
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post #141 of 840
6/10/11 at 5:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

What a great group of dancers. I had no idea there was a tapper among them until last night, because I don't remember seeing that "tall one" (don't recall his name right now) at all during the pre-season shows. He's a very talented dancer/actor, and not just in tap.

I liked him a lot. I was also impressed that the show director finally learned how to properly do audio fo rthe tap dancers.
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post #142 of 840
6/10/11 at 5:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bpeacock22 View Post

Sorry but I disagree heavily with both points. To the first: this show is about the favorite ALL AROUND dancer, not about someone who can just do one style good. Yes yes yes, make them do something they haven't before! Lets see what they are made of! How good ARE they at the art of dancing?


Agree! What else does Iveta have to prove? She has been World Champion in 10 different Ballroom styles, yet she came back year after year to make the top 20 on this show. Perhaps she thinks this is her ticket to Dancing With The Stars, but I want to think that she enjoys the challenge as much as the exposure.
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post #143 of 840
6/10/11 at 5:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin_Wadsworth View Post

I liked him a lot. I was also impressed that the show director finally learned how to properly do audio fo rthe tap dancers.

I agree. I told my wife it was cool how we could hear them slide across the stage.

I just don't get the whole argument about dancing in other styles. If the contestants stayed only in their styles, this show would suck. Ya'll do realize that the contestants only get just a couple of hours each week to learn their routine.

I'm glad Mary is back.
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post #144 of 840
6/10/11 at 6:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

...I had no idea there was a tapper among them until last night, because I don't remember seeing that "tall one" (don't recall his name right now) at all during the pre-season shows. He's a very talented dancer/actor, and not just in tap...

The production only featured Chris with his tap dance, but I noted him flying around with his tall frame in the background several times. During the final dance with all hands on deck, I spotted him do a series of flips across the entire length of the stage. It is rare to have a long person be able to move as he does plus have the foot speed he has demonstrated. I equate the visuals of the rare tall dancers to rare taller gymnasts. It is much easier (and faster) from a physics standpoint to move a mass around a more compact center, but much less visually exciting, hence most dancers and gymnasts are shorter in stature. The Tommy Tunes of the world are almost non-existent and I look for them. Because there are so few of them, they are often "out of place" when they draw a particularly short partner, and suffer from that too. A Mutt & Jeff pairing loses in the visual department, and visual is the name of the game in dance.
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post #145 of 840
6/10/11 at 7:30am
This is shaping up to be a very good season. The girls look very strong. I liked the format last night. Showing a group getting the green light on tape (obviously yesterday morning or the night before) and then having that group perform live was great idea. Having Iveta dance with Pasha was ingenius. He is a wonderful and very generous dancer, who never fails to make his partner look her best. I loved the the Christopher Scott number with the doors that the 10 boys did and Sonya's twisted geisha routine by the 10 girls was stunning. These kids are already off and running at a high level. I'm not sure about the new format of the top 20 partnering until there are 10 and then the All-stars entering the picture. I do, however, give Nigel and his production staff credit for their willingness to tinker with the show based upon what happened in the previous season. Let the dancing games begin!
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post #146 of 840
6/10/11 at 8:43am
I feel that it's far too early for me or anyone else to be saying that "this is the strongest group of (insert favorite word here)" but I will say without a doubt:

This season's stage, sound, and lighting is by far THE best yet!
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post #147 of 840
6/10/11 at 9:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viventis View Post

Agree! What else does Iveta have to prove? She has been World Champion in 10 different Ballroom styles, yet she came back year after year to make the top 20 on this show. Perhaps she thinks this is her ticket to Dancing With The Stars, but I want to think that she enjoys the challenge as much as the exposure.

It didn't dawn on me until this last episode she won 10 wrold champions in 10 different dance styles. Wow, that is insanely impressive. Makes being on this show seem like a small achievement.
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post #148 of 840
6/10/11 at 10:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamR View Post

It didn't dawn on me until this last episode she won 10 wrold champions in 10 different dance styles. Wow, that is insanely impressive. Makes being on this show seem like a small achievement.

http://www.ivetagherman.com/
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post #149 of 840
6/10/11 at 11:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamR View Post

It didn't dawn on me until this last episode she won 10 wrold champions in 10 different dance styles. Wow, that is insanely impressive. Makes being on this show seem like a small achievement.

Not ten world championships--one "World Ten Dance" championship. It's a competition where the contestants have to perform and be judged on 10 different ballroom styles. She was champion two years running, though not last year.
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post #150 of 840
6/10/11 at 1:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cal1981 View Post

... Showing a group getting the green light on tape (obviously yesterday morning or the night before)...!

IIRC, Cat said that the dancers were told the results "several days ago" (not that it really matters).
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