The official "Theta" thread - Page 130

Steve, in ref to your amp switching on and off issue. This is because you have the CB3 set to pulse output on that trigger output. The Cb3 will send both pulse and constant 12V depending on the settings. Just change it to constant 12V and you should be fine.

Thanks
Craig

YEs its on the Aux digi in card

Enjoy
Thanks
craig

JIM

I know its a bit of a job but trying another preamp for 30 minutes would really put this to bed. You can even use a Denon receiver if you want. Anything with HDMI in and Pre outs. Yes if it was a receiver you would need a few XLR-RCA adapters at guitar ship for a few bucks each but you could even just use maybe 3 channels and simply pop in another pre and see what you hear.

I know this is driving you crazy and we dont really have any other ideas at this point as there are so many units up and running with no issues like this.

If i thought exchanging the machine or boards would help , theta would do this in a minute trust me.

You could send the machine to me and I can A/B it in my place ?

I would love you to try another Pre/Receiver for just a few minutes to see if its the Pre or something else causing this weirdness you are having.

Let me know

Thanks
craig

That got it in one - thanks BD! (and Craig et al) One down....

On the player versus HD upgrade, I will do the upgrade to the CB first. I'm just planning ahead. I've a lot to do - I also want the Rosas brought up to current spec and I'm chatting with Eggworks on that. I've also been reading here (I'm on about page 105 so far) a lot about the Bryston BD1 which sounds like a nice way of tidying a pile of CDs. Living in London, 7.1 will have to wait. The geometry of my room is bad enough as it is which is why I was also interested in reading more about Dirac Live etc. I'll keep reading! (You guys clearly live for this stuff! I have trouble keeping up with all the technical stuff but I am learning.)

As I continue to read, one thing puzzles me a bit - and I apologise in advance for the ignorant question. You have a CB with great DACs. Why then do some of you also have a Gen VIII? If the GenVIII is doing the digital to analogue conversion all the CB is doing is simple switching?

Also just read Dirac Live is c$4k...? That may have to wait as well.

Questions like this are best answered with your own ears. Is there a local high-end dealer that sells both home theater electronics and high-end two channel gear? How about video? Is there a local dealer that sells Lumagen or similar video processors? You could ask the same question as to why outboard video processing is used with 10k plus projectors. Isn't the on-board processing good enough? For some the answer will be yes in both cases, on-board is good enough. For others, the external boxes are worth the extra premium.

I start work at 1am. My post count is 1/4 of the blands. With my mornings, usually I am going to be the early bird. I also have the luxury of a job where I do very very little. I spend about 3 hours a day on the phone with friends,the wife,and check on my elderly relatives. They are often glad to have a call, the relatives. I get to have a 6 figure salary, not a high one, doing this. Best job. I have ever had.

True. As to local guys I haven't really loooked around. I bought all my gear in NY when I lived there (94-98). Maybe a few more words about me as introduction would explain why I am dodging questions like Javry's and asking some basic questions even when some of my stuff is "nice". I would never call myself an audiophile (or videophile for that matter). I just bought a bunch of stuff awhile ago when I was younger and significantly more foolish. I'm invested and now want to maintain it - and enjoy it - as economically as I can. I have also tended to work too hard over the years and not really enjoy my kit as much as I would like. But I love the sound when I do get to use it.

My (American) wife hates the stuff! For example, she calls the Andra boxes that are sitting on the floor "baby coffins"! But mostly she hates all the wiring. I rent in London (ouch! opportunity cost of not owning property has been HUGE) and so don't have a huge amount of flexibility re hiding it all (plus I like the wires!)

I love the sound of the Eggworks speakers but I have owned them for 14-15 years and not owned anything else of note before these. (I am from NZ and did own some nice Lambert Audio speakers once but they were not even close to being in the same league). So I am not in a position to offer comparisons or deliver a verdict on the sound in such an eloquent fashion as some of you do. Even the Rosas running upfront as they are now while I had the Andras upgraded are rather nice. It's likely a crime to have those as rear speakers. (I've subsequently learnt through reading here that they shouldnt be to the rear but rather the side in my 5.1 setup! Unfortunately I have to contend withh an awkward space.) I've not heard the upgraded Andras yet as they came back bi-wired whereas they originally weren't and so I need to get new cables as my Synergistic cables are single run.

I actually have 2 CBs - the original CB1 I bought when I lived in NY and had converted to 230V when I moved to London and a CB III (120V) I purchased last year off Audiogon. The original is sitting in a box in a storage unit. Rather than taking the standard DAC CB1 and upgrading that, it appeared more cost effective to buy the CB III with the Xtreme DACs used and then upgrade that to CB III HD which is what I intend to do.

When I bought the latest Apple TV my wife thought that this was the end of my collecting disks. I have tried to explain that while they've moved to 1080p (she says she can't tell the picture difference between a DVD and a Bluray disk!) they aren't delivering the high-bit audio. She just grimaced! I countered with the point that I was looking at ways of putting the CDs on a server...

The room geometry I have to work with currently in London is awful. L-shaped living room with (unrailed) staircase through the middle. Picture setup through one length of the L (apex in front right) but the front left speaker is forced to the left because of the stair well in the middle. Hence the Dirac stuff piqued my interest.

So...just dropped close to $9k upgrading the Andras (almost $2k of shipping - the base drivers in these had simply disintegrated...really rather shocking... simply light damage), thinking of getting the Rosas upgraded although no rush (and also asking about the Andra centre). Want the CB III brought to HD so I can enjoy lossless DTS/DD. When I get this back I am sure I will be asking questions re setup etc. Would love a Compli Blu but need to make compromises hence the thinking re Oppo. I was reading the Mac Mini discussion with interest until I read about the Bryston BDP1.

Wow that was a ramble...

So back to CB onboard DACs versus Gen VIII. I can imagine that an external DAC might make sense when one finds the SSP lacking but here if we add the Gen VIII to the CB we are really saying that the quality Theta puts into the CB isn't the same as the GenVIII. Are the DACs different? Does Theta leave the CB short-changed?

By the way, have any of you used Crystalspeak speaker cables? I am still trying to figure out pricing here but they seem interesting as a replacement to the Synergistic cables I have. (At least my wife will find they're unobtrusive.) My presumption is that jumping the bi-wiring on the Andrads would be very suboptimal.

PS: my display is a simple 60in Pioneer Kuro

The outboard DAC is simply an upgrade option. At a multiple of the price it better beat the CBIII DACs. This does not mean the CBIII is "short changed" at all.

Why not offer better DAcs for the CB? Or is it something structural (non DAC card) in the CB that benefits from separation? If the latter then surely that suggests there's a need for a "simple CB" with no DACs. I'm missing something obviously...

You can buy the Casablanca with no dacs and a digital out card. Have you ever looked at the specs of the Gen 8, it weights 35 pounds. Even stripped of chassis and power supply, the parts would not fit inside of a Cssablanca. Then there is cost. Assuming that you built a footlocker or trunk sized processor, who would buy it? Gen 8 is about 7K a channel cost and Xtreme dac is 1.25K per channel cost. Even if you could get it to fit it would be mega expensive and you are complaining about cost now?

This is the most.basic reason for separates. You might as well be asking why they can't fit your amps inside the box. That's what a receiver does. Do you believe receivers offer the same kind of performance as your amps? Why not? Why can't they make them with the same performance? Can't these companies just make better internal amps?

ok I get it. I'll keep on reading! Thanks

Can I ask a few more questions?

1. Crossovers/bass management

The Andra IIIs are rated -3dB @ 18Hz, the Rosas (I only have the current version specs not the old) -3dB @ 21 Hz and the Andra centre is -3 dB @ 78 Hz

The Stentor II has a frequency response of +/- 6dB 15-120Hz

As a result of the above, I am currently running the Andras and Rosas full range and crossing the Andra centre to the Andra L/R (XOVRLR) with Phase Perfect. If I recall correctly I have the frequency set at 80 and the slope at 12dB. Does this make sense?

2. I have asked this question of Craig but I may as well ask here as well. I have read a lot from you guys about the new DSP associated with the new digital out card/DIRAC Live options. I wonder if the new DSP will be available as part of the CB III -> CB III HD upgrade I want to do but without the new digital out card? (I doubt I will buy a Gen8III anytime soon.)

3. What are you guys paying for the Bryston BDP-1? (PM if need be)

4. Is there an equivalent ability to rip DVDs to a drive unit like the Bryston without compressing them?

5. I read a number of comments that the Oppo 93 is a better buy than the 95 if one isn't going to use the analogue outs. Correct? (I may eventually get a Compli Blu but if this is true it's a cheap interim solution until newer models from Theta arrive.)

6. Sources of current release high rez audio? Or is it all relatively dated releases? (Probably not expressing myself well here so don't flame me)

TIA

Steve

Just FYI -

If you are installing the new Digi Out card in a CB3HD and installing the 416 software there are some changes that need to be noted.

The new 416 software will no longer support the legacy dacs cards at all. We knew this was going to come as the speeds increase in the CB3HD and here it is.

So to be clear, if you have the new Digi out and a Gen VIII S3 you can not have any of the old dacs. You must have an Xtreme or Premium or Superior II.

Thanks
Craig

Steve

We will have two options for the new PR3 card. You can buy it card only or you can buy it with Card and the Dirac Live hardware as well. If you buy the card alone you can then always upgrade to Dirac when you want.

We know the list price is going to be hopefully 4K for the PR3 and Dirac but no pricing yet on the PR3 alone.

Thanks
Craig

Steve not sure if you know but we are Bryston Dealers as well as Theta , Just FYI

Thanks
craig

I usually listen to Craig. But he listened to me on the Bryston. By the way, the brand new BDP-1 firmware is available today - email JimTanner at Bryston with your serial # and dealer and he'll email you the firmware. Mine should be here soon. YEA!!

Ok. Theta's moved to running at 24bits would be my guess? The old cards are 18bit and 20bit. When they both worked, it had to mean that Theta was running at the most 18bit but I suspected 48/16. Now with 24 bit operation, the old legacy cards can't handle that bit rate. Those old cards suck for audio anyway. Glad to see them retired.

Not Jim, but James Tanner: jamestanner bryston.com

You might want to cloak that email so he does not become a victim of some robo-troll.

Done

To build the absolute best sounding system, the optimal architecture is probably to have a separate digital processing box, connected to an external DAC. This is the reason this is the dominant architecture in 2 channel system. One of the main reasons (besides cost and practicality) you do not see this in MCH systems is the HDM I licensing restriction, which prevents the digital box from sending unencrypted high rez LPCM to the DACs at full resolution.

The CBIII + GenVIII architecture is a reasonable comprimise, giving you fulll acces to room correction (in the future), an excellent preamp and full resolution for 2 channel, and seamless integration in MCH.

All this nothwithstanding, Theta should clearly come out with a new DAC card to replace the Xreme, and are probably workign on one. It is conceivable the new card + DSP will be equivalent or better than the GenVIII for high rez MCH sources, because it will run at full resolution and the GenVIII will be downsampled. However, for 2 channel the GenVIII will always rule, as it should for the multiple of the pricepoint of the DAC cards in the CBIII.

I take it you're talking about a system where the SQ coming through the CBIII HD is equal to the SQ coming through the GenVIII? In essence, where all channels are GenVIII quality?

The Digi out card has to downsample HDCP material. For that material onboard dacs might sound better because they have access to the full bandwidth signal. The Gen 8 will not.

With unprotected material, the Gen 8 will win. It may still win with it only receiving 24/48 vs the new dacs running at 24/96. Resolution is just one factor. My guess is that the Gen 8 will still sound better but we will have to wait and see. The greet thing about downloading files is you can just convert a file to lower resolution and test the effect.

Most people named James are called Jim or Jimmy.

Thanks. HDtracks is offering some Motown. It's easier to complete my Classic Rock collection. Have to pick up Black Sabbath's "Paranoid," on SACDd however. I just got two Aretha Franklin album at 24:192 from HDtracks, lovely recordings. The first time my wife ever visited my house and saw my audio gear, I played,"Got to Find me an Angel." Wow, I am really enjoying the ability access music so quickly.

He was pointing out James because if you address the email to jimtanner it won't work, the amil is to jamestanner.

I know. But you didn't give an email. You just posted to email Jim Tannner at Bryston. Armand is not in the U.S. so I was not sure he knew you both were referring to the same person.

While I am sure there are many examples where this is true, for all sorts of good reasons, just wanted to comment that it is not because of some inherent technological limitation of putting all of it in the same box. The DAC hardware does not know in which metal box it lives.

1. I would cross the center over to the sub and not to the L/R. Hard to say about slopes without seeing how your speakers are measuring in room. Note that Dirac live figures this all out for you.

2. Craig answered.

3.Ask Craig.

5. Yes, it you don't need analog outs, makes no sense to chose the Oppo 95.

6. Yes, it's mostly dated material sourced from very old masters,50.60.70s. Though the Shelby Lynne SACD release is sourced from 2008 master. I think this one is going to be a must have just for the quality of the recording alone. "Just a little Lovin," early in the morning, beat a cup of coffee for starting out your day, well maybe tea for you.http://store.acousticsounds.com/d/80...id_Stereo_SACD