The physics and understanding of low frequencies - Page 3

[/quote]I'm not sure what the measurable audible difference would be. But you could do some interesting things with an oscilloscope setup to measure sound (there probably is a more appropriate tool than an oscilloscope) waves and compare them. You would find, depending on the quality of your tool, slight or even large differences, probably dependent on speaker quality.[/quote]

Im saying if you play a 200hz sinewave on two different speakers the only difference possible would be volume. If you put them in one room or another or stand in different areas the only difference would volume what other diferences could there be the room. I get that the energy from the sound could be making other sounds from objects in the room or that the speaker cone itself from the vibration could be making its own natural sounds.

Also I would like to know if we agree on this all speakers do is vibrate back and forth. For example if you took a 20 second clip of a sound wave from a piece of music and flip it on its side and had it play the speaker would be moving back and forth according to the changes in the shape of the wave?
I dont see how it cant do this without serioulsy altering the sound and last time I checked if it moves any slower or faster you would be changing the frequency or in other words the key of the song but Ive never had to change the tuning of my guitar to play along with a recording because I was listeing on different speakers. That problem only existed with tapes right?

Can you also tell me what im doing wrong with the quote function?

Im saying if you play a 200hz sinewave on two different speakers the only difference possible would be volume. [/quote]

Wtong. The speaker will have intrinsic sound - - at least above very low volumes, you will get the speaker cone itself adding harmonics, and they will indeed sound different. Which is why I suggested you look at the guitar speakers at Eminence and listen to the clips to see for yourself instead of continuing to be stuck in your rut.

Depending on the frequency, you can with appropriate equipment see that no speaker just moves back and forth. The sound causes the cone itself to develop radiation patterns that can go from sort of four sections up to many many individual semiround sections that are vibrating themselves. Which I have said before. If you don't pay attention to anything anybody says, you will not advance. If you prefer to bask in your current state of knowledge assumption ant personal theory, there's no reason to continue to fish here for somebody to agree with you. Nobody will.[/quote]

Your claiming speakers have thier own you unique sound yet your tellling me to go to a website to listen to speakers using the speakers I already have. Whats the point of listening to other speakers if your speakers can already produce that intrinsic sound?

Also speakers dont function like drums they just move back and forth if they do anything else this would the material will of course probable behave in radical ways but this has nothing to do with the basic idea behind what a speaker does which is vibrate back and forth to the signal.This is all your eardrum does increase and decrease of pressure at different rates.

Im not trying to keep posting until people agree with me im trying to understand thats all no one is really explaining anythingin a way that I can understand besides you wouldnt want me to just take anybodys word for it I want to have accurate information based on reality. I know this stuff is easy to understand but everyone just keeps putting forth the same jargon I read on websites which isnt helpful I really want to understand whats going on. I dont care if you judge me because of my bad writing skills that has nothing to do with what im capable of understanding (not saying you were judging me just wanting to throw that out there.) . Im a fairly smart person and can pick up on things fast but reading stuff is difficult when I cant ask questions to details Im not grasping thats why I got on this forum It would probably be better if I could be on someone kind of back and forth chat would be more appropriate but I wouldnt know howor where to do.that.

Do you think that at sometime far in the future we can overcome these problems, surely?

Are you replying to me?

I want to know why on windows media player when you turn the bass frequencies up on the equilizer(or any frequency for that matter) if the sound file is loud enough it will start to clip even if you have the main volum turned down this doesnt make sense? It shouldnt clip cause its not like its its own amp its just an interface so this is really weird.

I am not saying they sound the same but the differences aren't the same as drinking a coke than trying a pepsi. Maybe you can help me out go on itunes and mess with the presets and listen to the changes in the music thats the same thing I hear when I listen to differnt speakers so if you just messed with an equilzer you could make one speaker sound like another. I am not saying thats true just seems to be the case.

I've listened to cheap headphones or a cars stock speakers of my favorite kind of music and get still get all emotion filled.

So if you could prove me wrong that there are some speakers out there that will blow me away that would be awesome?

Did he ever think to examine the speakers they use at concerts. See this is the stuff I don't get the only thing live means is happening now.

Unless you meant like an non amplified performance but when Im far away from a group of people listening to their sound system of any kind lilke my neighbors who are 200 feet away I thought they were having an actually band play but it was just a loud stereo system playing at a barbeque.

What do you mean live?

Ok I guess should just go to school and study this stuff. I thought if I asked questions to people who were familiar with this stuff it would be easier to understand..

I would like to ask a different question my room is 13x11x8with a closet that is 3x5x8 so how do i figure out the bass nodes and stuff like that basically where are certain notes stronger?

No I understand what you're saying clearly I dont have a grasp of the bascis to comprehend this stuff.

Also what about the room question though?

to someone who does not want to accept those things. This part right here sounds offensive I am not being stubborn or anything or saying you dont know what youre talking about. I dont even want to be an audiophile I just want to understand this stuff I am obessed with sound more than anything else in physics and I just want to understand whats going on with the sound around me since I cant see it. Like how a tweeter can produce a loud sound but its not moving at all but a woofer that is moving alot might not be as loud. It makes me wonder is the tweeter moving alot but so fast my eye doesnt register it or just not moving far at all and thats why I dont see it moving.

It doesnt tell me where the notes are stronger it just tells me the nodes. It doesnt tell me if I stand in postion x 20hz will be this much louder than postion y.

Also I am not going to just listen to other peoples ideas just because they have them and say they are fact the audio world seems to be one of great confusion because there is so much manipulation to trick people into buying there products. Like when I saw those bose 2 wy speakers infomercials before I really got into sound I thought they seemed cool but when I heard them It was underwhelming and then I listened to some defenitive speakers that were 2000 dollars and they were underwhelming as well so I told myself maybe they arent setup properly at the store so I went to an imax thinking as was in for a treat(I say this cause I was isolated from things like high fedelity speakers, chest pounding bass, aand concerts in fact it wasnt until I was 19 that I learned you could feel low frequencies when I got into blu ray and this guy wanted to show me waht a surround system sounded like, also the theater where I live sucks and has no bass.) and the experience was also underwhelming and the surround expeireince was no different than the regular viewing. So ive come to realize that given how the mind works most of this stuff is just placebo and depending on how your emotions are that day sometimes I can listen to a 20 dollar pair of headphones and get an amazing expeirence out of it and others days just have no interest.

I'll bring up the coke and pepsi difference no one had to tell me they were different, so I wanted to know what made them taste different first this would take an uinderstanding of how the tastes buds work and then what the products themselves are made of. So to compare that to sound is like this coke is made up similiar ingrediendts but a few differnt ones and different amounts of certain minerals, a guitar sounds fifferent than a flute for reasons of the build and function of how they vibrate. A speaker is not a function of a paticular design it only plays what is feed to it so any differences in the way it plays is its flaws not where its trying to be unique. Also its funny when you say that its up to the person to decide what they like best so when people go to concerts they have to get lucky if the sound matches what they like or say youre wife or girlfriend was a really good singer but you didnt like hear voive the way it was naturally so you always recorded her voice so you could play them back on your favorte speakers.

I cant believe that I brought up a girls vioce being different than males vioce yet individual males and females sound different than each other and no one adressed this. If you took an oscilloscope and measured the different persons voice and then compared them when they are played through speakers would could see what the differences is are I dont understand why you refuse to acknowledge thisif someone hums a note there are only so many frequencies present so get the speaker to match them and there you have it same exact sound and dont say the microphone changes the sound because thats already implied in what im saying all speakers play through a recording device.

Why? Are you assuming im young well im 22 and the only reason everything I write seems unstructured is because im not good at articulating my thoughts. I realize this forum probably isnt the right place to discuss this stuff but I couldnt think of anything else. I really want to understand how waves, light water, sound etc. I bought a book called physics of waves by william C. Elmore and Mark A. Heald and cant even get past the first page where it talks about transverse waves, so I was hoping to get some help with my questions. What math do I need to know to understand fluid dynamics,pressure, attenuation etc.

What kind of math do you have to know to understand this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wave_equation

Also I realize my grammar and writing sruture is horrible I am reading up on my english to fix this.