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BrolicBeast's Living Room Theater - Page 30

post #871 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIkeDuke View Post

Let's not take up Brolic's thread with how awesome my choice was to move to the 1027's smile.gif. I found that last video very interesting. Whether it's a lens thing, projector thing screen thing or a combo of all of them, if I could do a front projector setup, I think it would it would cool to have a setup that no matter what aspect ratio the movie is in, it will fill the entire screen with no black bars. You still digging the F2's? As if I need an answer to that one tongue.gif.

Lol man I love discussions about great gear, whether on my thread or any other! Yeah man its a great feature of the Lumagen Processors. Its the only reason I was able to pursue. 2.35 screen! No black bars no matter what im watching! Im definity still lovinv these F2 subs a heck of a lot, and actually just contacted seaton sound go discuss my next steps for getting Rosenut 12-C's for my fron soundstage. They are a long way off, but we've all got to start somewhere.
post #872 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIkeDuke View Post

Let's not take up Brolic's thread with how awesome my choice was to move to the 1027's smile.gif. I found that last video very interesting. Whether it's a lens thing, projector thing screen thing or a combo of all of them, if I could do a front projector setup, I think it would it would cool to have a setup that no matter what aspect ratio the movie is in, it will fill the entire screen with no black bars. You still digging the F2's? As if I need an answer to that one tongue.gif.
agree but a pair of Utopia Maestro or Scala would also look good in Brolics room as he's looking for speakers upgrade!!biggrin.gif

Now talking about that video it's making my hand itchy to sell my plasma screen and go an take the credit card and go buy a projector and screen !eek.gif
Edited by aldiallo - 10/16/12 at 6:49am
post #873 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by aldiallo View Post

agree but a pair of Utopia Maestro or Scala would also look good in Brolics room as he's looking for speakers upgrade!!biggrin.gif
Now talking about that video it's making my hand itchy to sell my plasma screen and go an take the credit card and go buy a projector and screen !eek.gif

Yessss!!! That's the spirit! biggrin.gif. I see a projector in your future!! (The wife may see things a little differently though.) I,ve always admired Focal's design characteristics....ive also considered the Gradient Helsinki in the past (love the design) but there's no matching center. I think im going to stick with my heart's desire and shoot for the catalyst 12-C speakers in the rosenut finish eventually. I know if I got any other speaker, I'd stillwish I had the Cats.
post #874 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Yessss!!! That's the spirit! biggrin.gif. I see a projector in your future!! (The wife may see things a little differently though.) I,ve always admired Focal's design characteristics....ive also considered the Gradient Helsinki in the past (love the design) but there's no matching center. I think im going to stick with my heart's desire and shoot for the catalyst 12-C speakers in the rosenut finish eventually. I know if I got any other speaker, I'd stillwish I had the Cats.
A defining principle I have had is the "no regret" clause. Get what you can that fits you needs and wants, and you will always be happy. I can say that I have no regrets in my purchases for my system. If your heart is stuck on the Cats, then that's that what you should get. Regret is not a nice feeling at all.
BTW, I heard the Scala's and Stella Utopia one time. The Scala's sure are sweet. But not for me. Truthfully, once I am done with my room(I still have some odds and ends) and once I finalize another major purchase, I may start and try and save for the Viva Utopia. They are expensive so it will take a long time, but I may try anyway. Enjoy that system and I hope you can get the Cats at some point.
post #875 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIkeDuke View Post

I had the 927's also. I traded them in for the 1027's. I liked them very much but when the deal came up for the 1027's, I could not turn them down.

Ever thought about giving the 1038's a try?
post #876 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIkeDuke View Post

A defining principle I have had is the "no regret" clause. Get what you can that fits you needs and wants, and you will always be happy. I can say that I have no regrets in my purchases for my system. If your heart is stuck on the Cats, then that's that what you should get. Regret is not a nice feeling at all.
BTW, I heard the Scala's and Stella Utopia one time. The Scala's sure are sweet. But not for me. Truthfully, once I am done with my room(I still have some odds and ends) and once I finalize another major purchase, I may start and try and save for the Viva Utopia. They are expensive so it will take a long time, but I may try anyway. Enjoy that system and I hope you can get the Cats at some point.

 You know, one thing that I haven’t done?  High-End Listening at multiple dealers.  I think I owe it to myself to go around and listen to many speakers in the $3-4k each price range.  The last time I went on a listening binge,  it was to speakers in the 41k-1.5k each range.  The game has changed.  Focal, B&W, Triad, and a number of other great speakers are available to listen to.  I’ll also have to drive/fly somewhere to listen to the Cats as well.  Perhaps it’s time I widened my field of vision a bit.  I just checked out the viva Utopia….there are extremely expensive, but my gosh—they are beautiful to look at (and I’m sure, beautiful to listen to as well.) 

 
post #877 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by ejusted View Post

Ever thought about giving the 1038's a try?
I heard the 1028's at the same place I heard the Utopia speakers. They are really good. I think the 1038's really need a very big room to sound their best. The Viva's would be a better fit because I don't they would overload the room like the 1038's would. This is of course all just fun and games because I am not even in the mind set of changing speakers yet. The 1027's sound very good in my room. The price I paid for the 1027's makes them almost impossible to give up when I think about how much I would have to spend to meet or beat them. Plus, even though I say I want the Viva's, it doesn't mean it will happen. But back to your original question, I am sure the 1038's are fantastic but they are probably too much for my room. The 1028 is also fine speaker. I can say without any issue, they out perform my 1027's. I know I said I wanted the Viva's, but truthfully, I would be dishonest if I said that I would also not look at the 1028's as an option as well.
post #878 of 3167
I know the Viva's are expensive. Many people will dismiss them just because of that fact. But I have been following Focal, and I have been a Focal fan and supporter for a long time. One thing I do know is that when you get to the Utopia range, the gloves are off. They take price out of the equation and simple try and build the best speakers they can. Focal knows that they will never be their bread and butter but that does not mean that they should not be made. Also, the Viva's are on the low end of the price scale in the Utopia range. The Diablo is lower but it only goes up after the Viva. Stores are always tough. You have to hope that they have everything setup right. That being said, I do think it is a good thing to get out and try and listen to all you can. That doesn't mean you will change your mind. It just means you are more informed, I have heard a lot of speakers in my time. That was the only way I could figure out what I liked and what I did not. It is a good exercise and recommend that people do it with an open mind. Just because something is expensive does not mean it is not worth the money. If I had the space and the money, who knows what I would do tongue.gif.
post #879 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wkingincharge View Post

I picked up my 93 right at the end of production so there is curiosity if I am missing anything with the introduction of the 103.
We watched Prometheus this weekend and its a pretty good movie for all the reasons you mentioned and is a keeper in my library.

Not much different, actually. I only did the upgrade for the new HDMI and USB input options. You are all set with the 93! I missed the delivery, but when I do get the 103 tomorrow, I'll be sure to "make sure" (turn blu rays up to reference and grin at the picture for hours) the a/v quality has been maintained between models.
post #880 of 3167
Brolic.. Why did you waste your time and money getting the 103 when we all know that in less in about 3 months you'll upgrade to the 105?
post #881 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevon27 View Post

Brolic.. Why did you waste your time and money getting the 103 when we all know that in less in about 3 months you'll upgrade to the 105?

lol but alas, 'twas no waste....if I upgrade, then the 103 goes in the upstairs media room! It's very likely that I will upgrade eventually--but I'm in no rush.
post #882 of 3167
If your primary interest is HT, don't bother auditioning other speakers. I have owned Wilsons and a lot of other mega expensive speakers (then you get to buy amps), and nothing comes close to Cats at even 2 to 3 to 4 to 5 times the price. Not even close !!!!!

i have a good buddy with $65,000 Magicos along with $33,000 amps/preamps (and two SubMersives) and he will tell you my HT kills his ( NOT for 2 channel however).

Get 3 Catalysts!!!
post #883 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post

If your primary interest is HT, don't bother auditioning other speakers. I have owned Wilsons and a lot of other mega expensive speakers (then you get to buy amps), and nothing comes close to Cats at even 2 to 3 to 4 to 5 times the price. Not even close !!!!!
i have a good buddy with $65,000 Magicos along with $33,000 amps/preamps (and two SubMersives) and he will tell you my HT kills his ( NOT for 2 channel however).
Get 3 Catalysts!!!
I would agree but from the Brolic's video you can see on youtube you can tell that Brolic also loves music, you should listen to him singing!!smile.gif

so 3 Catalyst for the HT room and Scala for the Media room ; I think we got a good deal!! biggrin.gif
post #884 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by aldiallo View Post

I would agree but from the Brolic's video you can see on youtube you can tell that Brolic also loves music, you should listen to him singing!!smile.gif
so 3 Catalyst for the HT room and Scala Utopia for the Media room ; I think we got a good deal!! biggrin.gif
post #885 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Yessss!!! That's the spirit! biggrin.gif. I see a projector in your future!! (The wife may see things a little differently though.) I,ve always admired Focal's design characteristics....ive also considered the Gradient Helsinki in the past (love the design) but there's no matching center. I think im going to stick with my heart's desire and shoot for the catalyst 12-C speakers in the rosenut finish eventually. I know if I got any other speaker, I'd stillwish I had the Cats.
I see that we're looking into the same direction, I also see a projector in my future, the question is how long would I resist before cracking up!! biggrin.gif
post #886 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by aldiallo View Post

I would agree but from the Brolic's video you can see on youtube you can tell that Brolic also loves music, you should listen to him singing!!smile.gif
so 3 Catalyst for the HT room and Scala for the Media room ; I think we got a good deal!! biggrin.gif

My previous stereo (amp and speaker combination) had an MSRP of about $35,000. Two Cats and two SubMersives about $11,000. I'd still take my Cats/SubMersives at 1/3rd the price for just stereo. I did not mean to downplay the Cats for music. They are INCREDIBLE !!!

Just sayin'
post #887 of 3167
Hi Matt,

Is the 103 in yet??tongue.gif

I'll be out this saturday on a projectors' hunt!! cool.gif

Do you guys think I should be choosing the screen prior to choosing the projector or should I proceed the other way around? the plan is to buy the gear beginning of next year.
Edited by aldiallo - 10/18/12 at 7:15am
post #888 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post

If your primary interest is HT, don't bother auditioning other speakers. I have owned Wilsons and a lot of other mega expensive speakers (then you get to buy amps), and nothing comes close to Cats at even 2 to 3 to 4 to 5 times the price. Not even close !!!!!
i have a good buddy with $65,000 Magicos along with $33,000 amps/preamps (and two SubMersives) and he will tell you my HT kills his ( NOT for 2 channel however).
Get 3 Catalysts!!!

Wow, I definitely appreciate the insight.....out performing brands like Wilson and Magico is no small feat! My inspiration grows!
Quote:
Originally Posted by aldiallo View Post

I see that we're looking into the same direction, I also see a projector in my future, the question is how long would I resist before cracking up!! biggrin.gif

Lol...how long can you resist?......in the words of Locutus, 7 of 9, and other members of The Borg: Resistance is Futile.
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post

My previous stereo (amp and speaker combination) had an MSRP of about $35,000. Two Cats and two SubMersives about $11,000. I'd still take my Cats/SubMersives at 1/3rd the price for just stereo. I did not mean to downplay the Cats for music. They are INCREDIBLE !!!
Just sayin'

In terms of my love of movies v. Music, the pendelum has certainly been swinging toward the middle, where it once swayed (and stayed) on the movie side. Jeff had remarkable things to sayabout your catalyst system...I'm in the process of searching for a local audition (with a flash drive full of flac files, no doubt.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by aldiallo View Post

Hi Matt,
Is the 103 in yet??tongue.gif
I'll be out this saturday on a projectors' hunt!! cool.gif
Do you guys think I should be choosing the screen prior to choosing the projector or should I proceed the other way around? the plan is to buy the gear beginning of next year.

Hey Al, yup the103 did indeed arrive yesterday. I broke it in with Prometheus 3D. Mygoodness, what an amazing a/v experience! Best 3D that i've ever witnessed. Mannnnn, I'm happy tohear that you're embarking knthe wonderful journeyof "the projector search." Getting the projector first is agood idea, since you're better able to determine the size you want for your screen once you seethe image on a wall in your space!

Forgive any typos guys.....this kindle fire keyboard is...less than adequate.
post #889 of 3167
Thread Starter 
An audiophile at work was nice enough to lend me his XTZ package today! I will measuring all weekend. My strategy will be to disable Audyssey and emove all treatments, measure, then re-insert the treatments one-by-one, with a measurement inbetween. Is this a good way to go about it? Any suggestions?
post #890 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

An audiophile at work was nice enough to lend me his XTZ package today! I will measuring all weekend. My strategy will be to disable Audyssey and emove all treatments, measure, then re-insert the treatments one-by-one, with a measurement inbetween. Is this a good way to go about it? Any suggestions?
That's a good program. It's what Craig used to measure my room. It was very helpful in seeing what my system was doing after making changes with the EQ. First, you should get a bass line measurement of your room with no treatments at all. That program has a lot things it can measure but I might just focus on the RTA one an the RT-60 chart. The first one is a full range chart of your system and the second one is the response time of your system(i.E how long the sound reverberates in the room). If you want, you could do one treatment at a time and measure. It would take time but it would also be interesting to see the progress. I am sure it would be visible on the charts, Is it needed? Probably not. I did not do it that way. I guess you could say I was lucky with the amount of treatments I bought and where I placed them. I put up all of my treatments and then Craig measured my room. But, I have yet to measure my room with an RTA chart and a RT-60 chart since I got the Audyessy in my system. I am interested to see what those charts look like, Anyway, this is the fun part now, Looking forward to seeing your progress on this. Make sure you post the charts as well. That way we can see the progress and maybe others can offer their input as well.
Edited by MIkeDuke - 10/19/12 at 7:47am
post #891 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

An audiophile at work was nice enough to lend me his XTZ package today! I will measuring all weekend. My strategy will be to disable Audyssey and emove all treatments, measure, then re-insert the treatments one-by-one, with a measurement inbetween. Is this a good way to go about it? Any suggestions?
Is it the "Pro" xtz? "Pro has a better mic and higher resolution measurements.

I would focus on the FR measurements and the 2D Waterfalls. They are the screen that xtz opens up to. You can switch back and forth between them by clicking the small graph in the upper right corner:



If you need any help understanding the graphs or using the program, PM me and I'll try to help. Good luck and have fun! smile.gif

Craig
post #892 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post

I


Craig

Can we say "incredible lack of bass ringing" WOW!!
post #893 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post

Can we say "incredible lack of bass ringing" WOW!!

Thanks Chuck! Fortunately, it sounds the way it measures. smile.gif

Craig
post #894 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

An audiophile at work was nice enough to lend me his XTZ package today! I will measuring all weekend. My strategy will be to disable Audyssey and emove all treatments, measure, then re-insert the treatments one-by-one, with a measurement inbetween. Is this a good way to go about it? Any suggestions?

Sounds like fun this weekend!!!!
post #895 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the input guys. I couldn't get any sound Through my RCA splitter for full system measurement (very frustrating) and my subwoofer cables are run through the wall into the equipment closet in such a way that I'd have to undo the rack just to untangle them enough to give them the flexibility to re-nter the room through the projector hole. In sum--I have to purchase new subwoofer cable to do the sub measurements, as there's no way I'm disassembling my entire rack to untangle the subwoofer cables, as I wouldn't have it and the gear back together in time for Monday (when I return the XTZ). Unless I can figure out why I'm not getting any sound through my RCA splitter to RCA inputs on my Integra processor, I shan't be measuring this go round.

Craig, if I get sound, I'll definitely be PM-ing you, as I don't know what the graph you posted indicates (outside of the minimal "decay?" that audioguy referred to).
post #896 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Thanks for the input guys. I couldn't get any sound Through my RCA splitter for full system measurement (very frustrating) and my subwoofer cables are run through the wall into the equipment closet in such a way that I'd have to undo the rack just to untangle them enough to give them the flexibility to re-nter the room through the projector hole. In sum--I have to purchase new subwoofer cable to do the sub measurements, as there's no way I'm disassembling my entire rack to untangle the subwoofer cables, as I wouldn't have it and the gear back together in time for Monday (when I return the XTZ). Unless I can figure out why I'm not getting any sound through my RCA splitter to RCA inputs on my Integra processor, I shan't be measuring this go round.
Craig, if I get sound, I'll definitely be PM-ing you, as I don't know what the graph you posted indicates (outside of the minimal "decay?" that audioguy referred to).
Just get a new splitter. They're $10 at Radio Shack. Plug the split outputs into the L/R Aux inputs, (or any unused input), put that input in "Stereo" mode and you should be good to go.

What OS is your computer running? You might need to use this: xtz_room_analyzer_vista.pdf 20k .pdf file
post #897 of 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post


Craig

This is a 2D waterfall that shows the "time" response of the bass, or the amount of time it takes for the bass to "decay" in the room. Time "0" starts on the left. The right side is is 250 milliseconds later. The left axis is frequency, from 8 Hz to 300 Hz. The "scale" on the right side displays SPL by color. Purple is equal to the initial SPL at time "0". Red is 10 dB lower SPL than the initial signal. Yellow is 20 dB below the initial signal. Cyan is 30 dB down, and dark blue is the signal passing into the background noise. The further to the left these colors extend, the more ringing you have in your room and system.

Here is a system that has very uneven frequency response and massive ringing:



You can see the huge humps in the FR. They are associated with lots of purple, red and yellow in the waterfall. You don't want that. smile.gif It means the bass is ringing in the room at the frequencies of the peaks. In fact, it is the ringing that causes the peaks in the FR. When the bass "rings" or resonates in the room, it make the bass muddy and boomy. If you want "tight" "articulate" and "fast" bass, you want to eliminate the ringing as much as possible.

The sealed Submersives have very well behaved transient response. They don't ring by themselves, so any ringing you find in your room is related to the room. Audyssey can do a very good job reducing ringing. Its' time domain filters work very well in this regard. Nonetheless, anything you can do to improve your room before Audyssey, the better the result you'll get with Audyssey.

Craig
post #898 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Well, after an entire weekend of tweaking and measuring (I can't remember the last time I spent so much time on a single action), and with the thorough explanations of the mighty craig john, I've completed my measurement & tweaking journey for now. I actually ended up moving the subwoofers to face the rear of the room (as opposed to being angled toward the listening position for "stylistic purposes" They simply measured better straight ahead. I measured with and without the corner traps (corner traps make a difference), and put the subwoofers in about 8 different positions in the room before settling on their current position. What a fun journey this has been. I will post the graphs shortly.
post #899 of 3167
Thread Starter 
Final Measurements:

Room Analysis:


Time Domain:
post #900 of 3167
Thread Starter 
I can honestly say that there is a noticeable improvement In sound quality after using room measurements and subwoofer placement shifts to even out pre-audyssey response. What a difference! biggrin.gif
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