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how often can a dvd be rerecorded over

post #1 of 24
3/5/11 at 5:00am
Thread Starter 
I have only used 2 brands of +RW dvd (Fuji, Memerex) since 06. so I've only rerecorded a couple of times on each dvd.

1.how often can a dvd be rerecorded over?

2.what is a dvd cake box?

3.are these the preferred brand name of +rw dvds

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...ct_id=12321796

or should I try a -rw
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...ndingMethod=rr

edit never had a -rw ? I'm assumming it about the same as a +rw?

at first I was just deleteing titles then rerecording it has been suggested that if I decide to delete a intire dvd it's best to allways reformat because deleteing still leaves a tiny bit of the recording which will lower the rerecord quailty.
Thanks
STB
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post #2 of 24
3/5/11 at 8:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post

2.what is a dvd cake box?

There are two main DVD spindle designs.

There are the "protruding base" spindles that have an interlocking flange along the outside edge of the top portion. The interlocking flange fits into the locks atop the spindle base section. This type is usually just referred to as a DVD "spindle."

The DVD "cake box" refers specifically to those spindles that do not have a protruding base. The interlocking flange is along the inside edge of the top portion. The "cake box" flange fits along a channel running around the base section.

A "protruding base" spindle is seen at the left. Two examples of "cake box" spindles are seen at the center and right.
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post #3 of 24
3/5/11 at 9:08am
It seems the majority of mfgs. use the "protruding base" design and they work very well. The "cake box" can work quite well but in other cases(Ty DVDs are a prime example) the cake box design is really bad, leading to the base inadvertently disconnecting from the top which can lead to dire consequences. With Ty cake boxes I immediately switch them over to a used "protruding base" spindle, preferably a 50 count but a 100 spindle if I'm out of 50s.

AFA RW life, I believe the stated life is something like 1000 rewrites but <100 is more realistic before errors start showing up.
Both Verbatim and Sony are quality RW media, I'd use +RW if you've got a Funai based machine and -RW for others including Panasonic, Pioneer or the classic Toshibas, new Toshibas are Funai based.
AFA reformat vs erase, I generally use erase but if I notice the available space is starting to get smaller I do a reformat which brings it back to the max. If you can't display available space then I'd just do a reformat every 5 or so rewrites. The recording quality will be the same either way, digital is digital, you'll just lose a little space if you haven't formatted in a while.
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post #4 of 24
3/5/11 at 9:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post

I have only used 2 brands of +RW dvd (Fuji, Memerex) since 06. so I've only rerecorded a couple of times on each dvd.

1.how often can a dvd be rerecorded over?

"They" say about 1000 times, but prob. much less than that in actual use?

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post

2.what is a dvd cake box?

DigaDo answered this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post

3. are these the preferred brand name of +rw dvds

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...ct_id=12321796

or should I try a -rw
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...ndingMethod=rr

edit never had a -rw ? I'm assumming it about the same as a +rw?

The 1st link are the preferred Vebatim RW's with "SERL" on pkg, the 2nd one (Sony) are prob. OK too.

The preferred Verbatim +/-R should have "AZO" on pkg.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post

at first I was just deleteing titles then rerecording it has been suggested that if I decide to delete a intire dvd it's best to allways reformat because deleteing still leaves a tiny bit of the recording which will lower the rerecord quailty.

I'd continue deleting titles, which just deletes their addressing info so the disc looks "clean" to the recording system next time.

Here's a help file on DVDs.
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post #5 of 24
3/5/11 at 10:18am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigaDo View Post

There are two main DVD spindle designs.

There are the "protruding base" spindles that have an interlocking flange along the outside edge of the top portion. The interlocking flange fits into the locks atop the spindle base section. This type is usually just referred to as a DVD "spindle."

The DVD "cake box" refers specifically to those spindles that do not have a protruding base. The interlocking flange is along the inside edge of the top portion. The "cake box" flange fits along a channel running around the base section.

A "protruding base" spindle is seen at the left. Two examples of "cake box" spindles are seen at the center and right.

I haven't put much if any thought into the container I have both so I check out which I prefer.
Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

It seems the majority of mfgs. use the "protruding base" design and they work very well. The "cake box" can work quite well but in other cases(Ty DVDs are a prime example) the cake box design is really bad, leading to the base inadvertently disconnecting from the top which can lead to dire consequences. With Ty cake boxes I immediately switch them over to a used "protruding base" spindle, preferably a 50 count but a 100 spindle if I'm out of 50s.

AFA RW life, I believe the stated life is something like 1000 rewrites but <100 is more realistic before errors start showing up.
Both Verbatim and Sony are quality RW media, I'd use +RW if you've got a Funai based machine and -RW for others including Panasonic, Pioneer or the classic Toshibas, new Toshibas are Funai based.
AFA reformat vs erase, I generally use erase but if I notice the available space is starting to get smaller I do a reformat which brings it back to the max. If you can't display available space then I'd just do a reformat every 5 or so rewrites. The recording quality will be the same either way, digital is digital, you'll just lose a little space if you haven't formatted in a while.

what is AFA?
also doe'snt deleteing each title compared to a complete reformate put extra wear and tear on the recorder?
Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

"They" say about 1000 times, but prob. much less than that in actual use?


DigaDo answered this.


The 1st link are the preferred Vebatim RW's with "SERL" on pkg, the 2nd one (Sony) are prob. OK too.

The preferred Verbatim +/-R should have "AZO" on pkg.


I'd continue deleting titles, which just deletes their addressing info so the disc looks "clean" to the recording system next time.

Here's a help file on DVDs.

looks like I'll read up on DVDs.

I use expensive 3M white tape (telecom quaility) on the top of my DVDs to write on.
my observations on this method are that I get a tiny bit of glue residue on the DVD that is stacked ontop of the 3M taped one. which stinks a tiny bit.

?will this tiny bit of glue tape residue ruin my DVD?

I prefer not to use a paper type of lable because I had a paper lable dry up peal of and clog up a DVD drive.

I have been purchasing the Memerex DVD+rws at best buy 50 pack for $12.99 on Holiday sales however I have'nt sean this deal in over 2 years I think since unrewriteables are so cheap now it's drove the price of +RW up

I still prefer a choice to delete and rerecord.

Wajo I've been looking over you'r stickie on the 515 ect.
apparnetly I've been putting extra wear and tear on my recorder by recording directly to the DVD (only w/ the Panasonic because it dos'nt have a quick dub. like my new 515) so looks like I'll be on alert an be more concious to record to HDD tthen do a quick DVD copy on the 515.


Thanks Guys for helpfull adice and links for me to read
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post #6 of 24
3/5/11 at 11:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post


what is AFA?

As Far As...

Abbreviations are fun...
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post #7 of 24
3/5/11 at 1:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post


what is AFA?
also doe'snt deleteing each title compared to a complete reformate put extra wear and tear on the recorder?
Thanks

As Westly-C said and AFA reformatting vs delete all, on my Panasonics it takes basically the same amount of time doing one or the other so I don't think one way will wear anything out faster. I always did a reformat on my -RW DVDs prior to coming to AVS(and never really had disc issues) but some people here indicate a reformat may be harder on the DVD. I'm not sure if that's the case but now I generally do a erase all and save the reformat for times when my DVDs show less than the normal 4415MB open(for -RWs). Note this format does take a bit longer than normal because I believe it's somehow rearranging things on the disc from the previous deletes only.
Basically all my experience is with Panasonics, other brands may?? act differently.
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post #8 of 24
3/5/11 at 2:04pm
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post

    ...2.what is a dvd cake box?
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DigaDo View Post

    There are two main DVD spindle designs...

    ...A "protruding base" spindle is seen at the left. Two examples of "cake box" spindles are seen at the center and right.

    Since I recall the days when CDs and DVDs were sold in INDIVIDUAL cases, I call ALL examples a "Cake Box". (I also call the cover I used to put over PDP-11 HDD platters when removing them a "Cake Box", since all are reminiscent of the Rubbermaid / Tupperware container used to transport cakes from house-to-house.)
    .
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post

    ...at first I was just deleteing titles then rerecording it has been suggested that if I decide to delete a intire dvd it's best to allways reformat because deleteing still leaves a tiny bit of the recording which will lower the rerecord quailty.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wajo View Post

    ...I'd continue deleting titles, which just deletes their addressing info so the disc looks "clean" to the recording system next time...

    No one mentioned "Quick Format" - Deletes ALL the "Table of Contents" titles / pointers to the files but not the actual data itself (vs "Full Format" that re-writes zeroes, IIRC, to the entire disc).
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post #9 of 24
3/5/11 at 2:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClearToLand View Post

No one mentioned "Quick Format" - Deletes ALL the "Table of Contents" titles / pointers to the files but not the actual data itself (vs "Full Format" that re-writes zeroes, IIRC, to the entire disc).[/list]

It's because AFAIK the only DVDR to have such a feature was the famed(and often mentioned for quirky features) Toshiba XS DVDRs. Those machines have a low level DVD format that takes in excess of 30 minutes to preform. Panasonics format(both HDD and DVD) really doesn't do such a low level format and generally only takes 10-20 seconds, similar to an erase all function. Other DVDRs I've used are similar to the Panasonic.
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post #10 of 24
3/5/11 at 4:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post
It's because AFAIK the only DVDR to have such a feature was the famed(and often mentioned for quirky features) Toshiba XS DVDRs...
I guess I've been spending more time on the PC with ImgBurn and EAC (and testing ideas on CD / DVD R/W's) than on a DVDR.

I avoid using my (4) DVDR's laser as much as possible.
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post #11 of 24
3/5/11 at 5:15pm
  1. Quote:
    Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post
    ...what is AFA?
    GOOGLE: Internet Slang

    and you'll get plenty of examples, such as:
    WordIQ: Internet Slang Dictionary

    Internet Slang Dictionary & Translator
  2. Quote:
    Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post
    ...
    also doe'snt deleteing each title compared to a complete reformate put extra wear and tear on the recorder?
    Deleting a title, or a filename, on a CD and/or DVD (and/or HDD) really just changes the first byte in the VTOC "Volume Table of Contents" entry to, IIRC, E5 on a HDD, which tells the OS that it can re-use the sectors previously allocated to that file.
    - 5 titles; 5 bytes re-written.

    Formatting / re-formatting a CD / DVD / HDD actually WRITES zeroes to EVERY LOCATION - 700-800MB on a CD; 4.7GB on a DVD. *MUCH* more work (and stress on the laser). That's why I mentioned recently in another post that I'll do WHATEVER functions I can on a PC and minimize my use of my (4) DVDR's laser.
    .
  3. Quote:
    Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post
    ...I use expensive 3M white tape (telecom quaility) on the top of my DVDs to write on...

    ?will this tiny bit of glue tape residue ruin my DVD?
    No, but the addition of the label, UNBALANCING the DVD, will!

    IMHO, *NEVER* add a label that doesn't evenly cover the ENTIRE disc. It's the same deal as when they add weights to the rim of the wheel on your car to balance out the imperfections in the rubber tire. CDs and DVDs spin up to pretty darn high RPMs. Did you happen to catch the Mythbusters episode where they spun a CD up past its limits with an air tool?

    AFAICT, most folks use Sharpies to label their discs.
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post #12 of 24
3/5/11 at 5:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClearToLand View Post
I guess I've been spending more time on the PC with ImgBurn and EAC (and testing ideas on CD / DVD R/W's) than on a DVDR.

I avoid using my (4) DVDR's laser as much as possible.
+1

I only use my stand-alone DVD burner for high speed dubbing of my tapes off the HDD and for high speed dubbing of any broadcasts from the HDD. Anything else I do including any disc copying is done with my PC's LG burner. It costs under $20 to replace the LG burner and it only takes a few minutes to install. Most likely the PC burner will do better burns than a stand alone, especially using 16x azo media.

As to re-using -RW media, I haven't popped one into my stand-alone since I first bought it and experimented with very few RW discs. I do burn many RWs using my PC and I agree with ClearToLand's explanation regarding re-formatting / erasing. I'd add that the only reason to do a full re-format / erase is if you have sensitive stuff recorded that you don't want to fall into someone else's hands or if you start having trouble with the disc or as jjeff mentioned, if the disc is not showing all the available blank space.
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post #13 of 24
3/6/11 at 1:31am
Don't forget DVD-RAM which I've read is good for 100,000 rewrite cycles. My oldest ones are probably 6 years old & keep on working, but I doubt they have even 1,000 rewrites on them.
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post #14 of 24
3/7/11 at 8:32pm
Steve, NEVER, EVER use any kind of sticky label on a DVD. You're just asking for trouble. I use a sharpie, or a Casio labeler for permanent DVDs. For RW DVDs, I keep a 3x5 card with the disc, listing its contents. This is easily changed, when the contents are changed. You can also number your RW discs, and put matching numbers on the 3x5 cards.
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post #15 of 24
3/14/11 at 1:41pm
I record movies on my Magnavox MDR513H HDD then high speed dub on DVD so I can copy them to my computer. After copying the DVD I use the "Erase Disc" option in the Mag "Disc Edit" menu. I've used the same Memorex 4X DVD-RW disc for 89 movies so far without any issues.
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post #16 of 24
3/14/11 at 5:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken.F View Post

I record movies on my Magnavox MDR513H HDD then high speed dub on DVD so I can copy them to my computer. After copying the DVD I use the "Erase Disc" option in the Mag "Disc Edit" menu. I've used the same Memorex 4X DVD-RW disc for 89 movies so far without any issues.

That may be a record for Memorex!!!!!
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post #17 of 24
3/15/11 at 3:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevethebrain View Post

I have only used 2 brands of +RW dvd (Fuji, Memerex) since 06. so I've only rerecorded a couple of times on each dvd...

...never had a -rw ? I'm assumming it about the same as a +rw?

at first I was just deleteing titles then rerecording it has been suggested that if I decide to delete a intire dvd it's best to allways reformat because deleteing still leaves a tiny bit of the recording which will lower the rerecord quailty.
Thanks
STB

The two formats are the same, except...-R/W discs are more compatible with older DVD players. My DMR-EH55 does all the recordings to its internal 200GB HDD, but in the past I've used Sony Accucore +R DL 8.4GB and they performed flawlessly on every single DVD player under the roof, even on the ones that states "DVD+R discs are not compatible". I still have a good bundle of TY -R 4.7's for permanent back-ups.

Lately, I've been using a whole bunch of Memorex -RW/10x to back-up movies for the road. I've must of recorded/erased those suckers for no more than 30 times per disc and it is starting to act up. The players are having a hard time initiating them and sometimes the materials would break-up or pixelate once or twice throughout the movie. The regular -R 4.7GB 16x aren't so bad, but anything -R or +R is better than RW. It also depends on the quality of the discs too. I'm thinking of getting some JVC DVD-RW but they are extremely hard to find.

As far as labels, I write the titles on a small sized yellow 'post-it' on the back right under the adhesive, crossed out the old title and write the next one below it after I re-record and stick them inside the jewel case window, when the post it gets full (usually a good 10 titles down the line) I just replace it with another one.
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post #18 of 24
3/15/11 at 8:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken.F View Post

I record movies on my Magnavox MDR513H HDD then high speed dub on DVD so I can copy them to my computer. After copying the DVD I use the "Erase Disc" option in the Mag "Disc Edit" menu. I've used the same Memorex 4X DVD-RW disc for 89 movies so far without any issues.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crabboy View Post

That may be a record for Memorex!!!!!

Actually that is probably a record for DVD-RW in general. I've used Ritek DVD-RW for temporary recordings in the past before switching to HDD storage. I never got more than about 20 full-disk burns per disk before it wouldn't pass a verify test. Once it failed a verify, there was no turning back and I just threw it out. Re-recording just got worse and the disk was eventually trashed.

RAM disks, on the other hand, seem to last forever. I have RAMs dating back to early 2005 that are still in use. Late last year I had problems with about 6 of them and thought they were finally at the end of their life. Tuned out it was my 5 yr old burner that was giving up the ghost. $25 and a new LG burner later and those RAMs are back in service again.
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post #19 of 24
3/15/11 at 4:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Actually that is probably a record for DVD-RW in general.

It's up to 91 recordings now.

Is there a simple (free) diagnostic test that I can run on it to see how worn out the disc is?
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post #20 of 24
3/16/11 at 7:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken.F View Post

It's up to 91 recordings now.

Is there a simple (free) diagnostic test that I can run on it to see how worn out the disc is?

IMHO the best way is to do a PC based burn with something like ImgBurn or DVD Decrypter that has a verify cycle after the burn. I never had a failed burn onto a DVD-RW. It was always in the verify cycle where the problems surfaced. So unless you are doing a verify of the burn, your disk may already be bad without you knowing it. Once a DVD-RW failed a verify cycle the first time it was gone for good. I would repeatedly reburn the disks (each time, no error in the burn operation) to see if it was transient, but after the first verify failure, it would fail all subsequent verifies. At that point I would just toss the DVD-RW.
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post #21 of 24
3/16/11 at 9:34am
^^Sometimes with bad discs (in the case with Memorex) even having IMG verified and after numerous writes/rewrites, the sectors can be hard to read -- rendering picture breaking or pixel-blocks due to poor dye layers. It can showed as a good burn, but the disc can still be bad.
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post #22 of 24
3/16/11 at 10:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80sGuy View Post

^^Sometimes with bad discs (in the case with Memorex) even having IMG verified and after numerous writes/rewrites, the sectors can be hard to read -- rendering picture breaking or pixel-blocks due to poor dye layers. It can showed as a good burn, but the disc can still be bad.

The picture still looks good so I'll keep using it for now.
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post #23 of 24
3/17/11 at 7:27pm
About 4 or 5 times on an LG 787. Then it will refuse to recognize the disc and spit it back out! Memorex RW discs.
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post #24 of 24
7/2/11 at 11:44am
Q: How often can a DVD be re-recorded over?
A: 167 times
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